We've had every kind of speculative thread you can imagine about the Playoff Committee. At 12:30 tomorrow (well now today) there will be six qualified schools who each have a deserving argument as to why they should be included in the 4 team college football playoff. Everyone thought that going to 4 would change things. Did it? Or do we still just have a glorified beauty pageant controlled by corporate interests and which still fails to give us an on field champion?

So, should we boot out Florida State as the only undefeated team in the nation simply because they continued to win ugly?

Should we boot out a 1 loss Alabama who won what was arguably the toughest division in college football?

Should we boot out a 1 loss Oregon who humiliated the only team to give them a loss this year in a rematch Conference Championship game?

Should we curb kick T.C.U. for a having a stellar year when their only loss came to another top 6 school on the road and following arguably a tough call by the officials?

Should we exclude a resurgent Ohio State because their only loss to Virginia Tech now seems to be the worst loss among the top 6 and simply ignore their total destruction of what was a good Wisconsin team that had a proven defense prior to being run over ruff shod by the Buckeyes third string quarterback?

If we consider 1 loss teams with a non quality loss like Ohio State how can we kick out Baylor when they lost to what would likely be a superior team to Virginia Tech and actually won their head to head game with T.C.U.?

Or do we finally admit that 5 power conferences is one too many, push to condense to 4 and resolve this B.S. with a champions only model? Hmmm?

It is the only way to resolve this crap on the field, rid ourselves of the polls and committees, recognize that in any given year it is difficult at best to determine the relative strengths of the conferences, and give the fans a system that produces their own champions, as decided by the kids themselves, and places 4 champions into a truly national playoff where after having won their conferences they decide it on the field instead of behind closed doors and on behalf of the bowls and corporate interests.

For all of the rationalizations I've seen posted around here for a few years I ask you do you really want this stuff to continue as is, or do you want a structure that is fair that yields results that are fair? I'm not talking about whether we have 64, 72, or even 80 schools in those four conferences. I'm simply talking about a structure that gives us the 4 schools that will play it off and decide it on the field. IMO all arguments to the contrary equal support of the status quo which later today will snub two schools whose futures should be decided on the field.

And please don't give me the "expand the playoffs" argument because I dare you to come up with one that doesn't include at large teams which means back to the smoke filled rooms we go! Put your collective brains to coming up with a structure that decides it on the field. That is the only worthwhile change that can be made.

(12-07-2014 01:56 AM)JRsec Wrote:  We've had every kind of speculative thread you can imagine about the Playoff Committee. At 12:30 tomorrow (well now today) there will be six qualified schools who each have a deserving argument as to why they should be included in the 4 team college football playoff. Everyone thought that going to 4 would change things. Did it? Or do we still just have a glorified beauty pageant controlled by corporate interests and which still fails to give us an on field champion?

So, should we boot out Florida State as the only undefeated team in the nation simply because they continued to win ugly?

Should we boot out a 1 loss Alabama who won what was arguably the toughest division in college football?

Should we boot out a 1 loss Oregon who humiliated the only team to give them a loss this year in a rematch Conference Championship game?

Should we curb kick T.C.U. for a having a stellar year when their only loss came to another top 6 school on the road and following arguably a tough call by the officials?

Should we exclude a resurgent Ohio State because their only loss to Virginia Tech now seems to be the worst loss among the top 6 and simply ignore their total destruction of what was a good Wisconsin team that had a proven defense prior to being run over ruff shod by the Buckeyes third string quarterback?

If we consider 1 loss teams with a non quality loss like Ohio State how can we kick out Baylor when they lost to what would likely be a superior team to Virginia Tech and actually won their head to head game with T.C.U.?

Or do we finally admit that 5 power conferences is one too many, push to condense to 4 and resolve this B.S. with a champions only model? Hmmm?

It is the only way to resolve this crap on the field, rid ourselves of the polls and committees, recognize that in any given year it is difficult at best to determine the relative strengths of the conferences, and give the fans a system that produces their own champions, as decided by the kids themselves, and places 4 champions into a truly national playoff where after having won their conferences they decide it on the field instead of behind closed doors and on behalf of the bowls and corporate interests?

For all the rationalizations I've seen posted around here for a few years I ask you do you really want this stuff to continue as is, or do you want a structure that is fair that yields results that are fair? I'm not talking about whether we have 64, 72, or even 80 schools in those four conferences. I'm simply talking about a structure that gives us the 4 schools that will play it off and decide it on the field. IMO all arguments to the contrary equal support of the status quo which later today will snub two schools whose futures should be decided on the field.

And please don't give me the "expand the playoffs" argument because I dare you to come up with one that doesn't include at large teams which means back to the smoke filled rooms we go! Put your collective brains to coming up with a structure that decides it on the field. That is the only worthwhile change that can be made.[/b]

An eight team, four New Years Day Bowls playoff would have solved this mess. It proves that four is not enough. I agree that only a P4 model championship would work, but when does that happen. A complete split from the NCAA would have to take place, and we are not there yet. The same conspiracy theories and accusations will blow up tomorrow at 1130 CST. By the way... when has a 13-0 P5 conference champion ever been ranked #4?

Six team playoff, enough spots for the P5 conference champs if all are worthy. Gives the top two teams byes, always a big advantage having to play one less game. No worries about diminishing the regular season, in fact I think it would add to it since more teams would have a shot and the top teams would have something extra to play for.

If you aren't in the top six you probably don't deserve to be in anyway, so less controversy.

(12-07-2014 02:13 AM)FargoBison Wrote:  Six team playoff, enough spots for the P5 conference champs if all are worthy. Gives the top two teams byes, always a big advantage having to play one less game. No worries about diminishing the regular season, in fact I think it would add to it since more teams would have a shot and the top teams would have something extra to play for.

If you aren't in the top six you probably don't deserve to be in anyway, so less controversy.

It works well for the NFL too. I would just like to see the four New Years Day bowls all relevant. That is why I favor eight.

(12-07-2014 02:13 AM)FargoBison Wrote:  Six team playoff, enough spots for the P5 conference champs if all are worthy. Gives the top two teams byes, always a big advantage having to play one less game. No worries about diminishing the regular season, in fact I think it would add to it since more teams would have a shot and the top teams would have something extra to play for.

If you aren't in the top six you probably don't deserve to be in anyway, so less controversy.

It still leaves arbitrary decisions in the process. Structure is what is needed. If you want six teams then think about redividing the best of the G5 into two conferences and the consolidating the P5 into a P4. Then take the six champions and give the top two seeds a bye and play it off. But even that stinks you see because somebody has to determine the seeds. What people don't get is that as long as there is a committee deciding matters the largest schools with the most money will continue to garner favors from those who profit off of them.

An expansion to 8 teams works if you divide the G5 into 3 conferences, keep the present P5 and set up a formula for determining the first round games and second round games. But now we have another problem. Big money schools in the P5 want to exclude the G5 so that they have a better chance of getting in and the networks want that as well because of the advertising draws of those top brand name schools. So what started as determining the top football team in the nation, on the field, gets sidetracked as the P5 fans start talking about how their conferences deserve teams in the mix that lost their conference championship. The second you want do overs for those who failed to attain the moniker of champion in their required conference championship then you've ceased being a process that determines an ultimate champion and have become again a process that favors the business of college football over the product of college football.

The only solutions we come up with that will work are those that are determined structurally prior to the involvement of the personalities of the institutions in any given year. Let's say that the G5 becomes a regionally based G4 and the P5 does the same. Then in any given year the champions of let's say (hypothetical only here) the PAC would play the champion of the MWC in the opening round of the playoffs, the SEC champ would play the Sunbelt champ, the Big 10 champ would play the MAC champ, and the ACC or Big 12 (depending on which one survives) champ would play the champ of CUSA or AAC (depending on which one survives). Then the West Regional Champ (PAC & MWC) plays the Midwestern Champ (Big 10 & MAC). The Southeastern Regional Camp (SEC & SBC) plays the either (depending upon which survives (the Big 12 & CUSA champ / or the ACC & AAC champ).

Now you have a structure that is inclusive of all of the FBS essentially and there is no need of any damned committee anywhere getting to decide who plays. It is prescribed every year and determined on the field. That is how structure solves a lot of corruption.

Here is what that structure does:
1. It keeps the meaning of every single game during the season because nobody can really become their conference champion without keeping that focus.
2. It upholds the meaning of conference championships as you aren't getting in without one.
3. It guarantees for those in the sports business (networks) that all 4 regions stay involved until the finals are played.
4. It doesn't exclude the FBS through segregation and gives the new G4 a reason to get better TV contracts.
5. It preserves the interest of millions of more college football fans who have been disenfranchised by many of the recent moves in realignment and politically within the NCAA.
6. The top bowls can be utilized (if necessary as I would rather the schools play most of the playoff games for the regions at campus sites so they can keep more of the profits and more of the fans can attend.)
7. It still gives the new P4 the separation they are looking for for marketing purposes and their contracts would be their own.
8. It eliminates the polls, the computers, and the committees and gives all fans what they want most before the opening kick every year, a fair chance that should lightening strike and their school have a great year (like Marshall or Tulane or Boise in the past) they will not be cursed to follow their schools all year long only to get hosed as Baylor and someone else will be tomorrow.

(12-07-2014 02:32 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(12-07-2014 02:13 AM)FargoBison Wrote:  Six team playoff, enough spots for the P5 conference champs if all are worthy. Gives the top two teams byes, always a big advantage having to play one less game. No worries about diminishing the regular season, in fact I think it would add to it since more teams would have a shot and the top teams would have something extra to play for.

If you aren't in the top six you probably don't deserve to be in anyway, so less controversy.

It still leaves arbitrary decisions in the process. Structure is what is needed. If you want six teams then think about redividing the best of the G5 into two conferences and the consolidating the P5 into a P4. Then take the six champions and give the top two seeds a bye and play it off. But even that stinks you see because somebody has to determine the seeds. What people don't get is that as long as there is a committee deciding matters the largest schools with the most money will continue to garner favors from those who profit off of them.

An expansion to 8 teams works if you divide the G5 into 3 conferences, keep the present P5 and set up a formula for determining the first round games and second round games. But now we have another problem. Big money schools in the P5 want to exclude the G5 so that they have a better chance of getting in and the networks want that as well because of the advertising draws of those top brand name schools. So what started as determining the top football team in the nation, on the field, gets sidetracked as the P5 fans start talking about how their conferences deserve teams in the mix that lost their conference championship. The second you want do overs for those who failed to attain the moniker of champion in their required conference championship then you've ceased being a process that determines an ultimate champion and have become again a process that favors the business of college football over the product of college football.

The only solutions we come up with that will work are those that are determined structurally prior to the involvement of the personalities of the institutions in any given year. Let's say that the G5 becomes a regionally based G4 and the P5 does the same. Then in any given year the champions of let's say (hypothetical only here) the PAC would play the champion of the MWC in the opening round of the playoffs, the SEC champ would play the Sunbelt champ, the Big 10 champ would play the MAC champ, and the ACC or Big 12 (depending on which one survives) champ would play the champ of CUSA or AAC (depending on which one survives). Then the West Regional Champ (PAC & MWC) plays the Midwestern Champ (Big 10 & MAC). The Southeastern Regional Camp (SEC & SBC) plays the either (depending upon which survives (the Big 12 & CUSA champ / or the ACC & AAC champ).

Now you have a structure that is inclusive of all of the FBS essentially and there is no need of any damned committee anywhere getting to decide who plays. It is prescribed every year and determined on the field. That is how structure solves a lot of corruption.

Yep, because this new system is turning out to be a goat rope.

People are watching games they wouldn't otherwise watch to try to work out who is going to go, and the top two are going to be included in the four, no matter whether you figure "top two" by "undefeated, then best of one loss" or "teams that look like the two best right now".

So it makes the media money people happy.

Gosh, its like having an election every four years, and every four years for over two centuries electing the Presidential candidate with the most money. In other words, its the American Way.

(PS. WOOT! Go Pokes!)

(12-07-2014 03:16 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  People are watching games they wouldn't otherwise watch to try to work out who is going to go, and the top two are going to be included in the four, no matter whether you figure "top two" by "undefeated, then best of one loss" or "teams that look like the two best right now".

So it makes the media money people happy.

Gosh, its like having an election every four years, and every four years for over two centuries electing the Presidential candidate with the most money. In other words, its the American Way.

(PS. WOOT! Go Pokes!)

It's not grass roots America's way, it is the Wall Street way. The two are diverging. Real Americans like fair play and an opportunity to decide their own fate. Corporate America likes the hedge that money buys and the need to control. It's a question of character Bruce.

I think we'll be at eight teams by the 2017 season. For entertainment purposes only, here's how I see an 8 team playoff for this season:

(1) Alabama vs (8) Kansas State, Sugar Bowl
(2) Oregon vs (7) Michigan State, Rose Bowl
(3) TCU vs (6) Baylor, Cotton Bowl
(4) Florida State vs (5) Ohio State, Orange Bowl

And for the 2 remaining NY6 bowls, with no other changes, you have this:

(11) Mississippi vs (20) Boise State, Fiesta Bowl
(10) Arizona vs (9) Mississippi State, Peach Bowl

In reality another bowl would be elevated to cover the disaster scenario of all 6 champions being ranked outside the Top 8 and missing the playoffs. I'd expect the Outback Bowl or TaxSlayer (Gator) Bowl to be elevated, which this year would likely put Georgia Tech and Georgia in a NY7 bowl, and result in some trading to avoid rematches.

Nothing has changed about the CFB post season.. it's the same old whores in the same old whorehouse. Being run by the same pimps in fine suits, smoking their cigars and raking in the cash. Those assclowns truly believe they've invented a playoff system, even though the current CFP model is horrible. "Screw the fans, It's about our cash". CFB needs an aenima.

(12-07-2014 03:16 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  People are watching games they wouldn't otherwise watch to try to work out who is going to go, and the top two are going to be included in the four, no matter whether you figure "top two" by "undefeated, then best of one loss" or "teams that look like the two best right now".

So it makes the media money people happy.

Gosh, its like having an election every four years, and every four years for over two centuries electing the Presidential candidate with the most money. In other words, its the American Way.

(PS. WOOT! Go Pokes!)

This!!!!

(12-07-2014 06:37 AM)chargeradio Wrote:  I think we'll be at eight teams by the 2017 season. For entertainment purposes only, here's how I see an 8 team playoff for this season:

(1) Alabama vs (8) Kansas State, Sugar Bowl
(2) Oregon vs (7) Michigan State, Rose Bowl
(3) TCU vs (6) Baylor, Cotton Bowl
(4) Florida State vs (5) Ohio State, Orange Bowl

And for the 2 remaining NY6 bowls, with no other changes, you have this:

(11) Mississippi vs (20) Boise State, Fiesta Bowl
(10) Arizona vs (9) Mississippi State, Peach Bowl

In reality another bowl would be elevated to cover the disaster scenario of all 6 champions being ranked outside the Top 8 and missing the playoffs. I'd expect the Outback Bowl or TaxSlayer (Gator) Bowl to be elevated, which this year would likely put Georgia Tech and Georgia in a NY7 bowl, and result in some trading to avoid rematches.

You miss the point. The issue is the elimination of selection committees. It is about finding a structure that yields the final number of teams and is not expanding the playoff so at large schools get in by some extraneous committee's decision. And oh by the way, Kansas State finished with 3 losses.

Before we move to 4 conferences, and a champions only 4 team playoff, we must allow each conference to decide how to choose their champion.
That, then puts the onus on each of the P4, instead of some committee. It's likely that those 4 leagues won't look the same, that is they might not have equal numbers of members, or each conference won't have the same number of teams. This is why the conferences must be allowed to structure themselves and decide how they decide to select a champion.
Once that rule is changed, then and only then, will we see what is now the P5 morph into a P4. Once we have P4, everything else is now already in place.
Things are progressing in an orderly fashion, at an appropriate pace.

(12-07-2014 07:09 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(12-07-2014 03:16 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  People are watching games they wouldn't otherwise watch to try to work out who is going to go, and the top two are going to be included in the four, no matter whether you figure "top two" by "undefeated, then best of one loss" or "teams that look like the two best right now".

So it makes the media money people happy.

Gosh, its like having an election every four years, and every four years for over two centuries electing the Presidential candidate with the most money. In other words, its the American Way.

(PS. WOOT! Go Pokes!)

This!!!!

And it is precisely this kind of thinking that keeps us in a quagmire of corruption. Oh gee if it makes us money it is just fine to continue with things which are patently unfair at best and abusively corrupt at worst. "Evil exists where good people do nothing" and "nobody dares call it tyranny when it profits them". No Maize, we will never progress as a society as long as we cite status quo as the excuse to continue the status quo. Sports should teach teamwork, perseverance, instill courage, and teach all to trust in fair play. Do this well and everyone still profits just in ways that exceed the cash that will be there anyway. You might just raise another generation in this country that actually believes in something besides what money can buy them.

It is at best moral laziness to accept corruption and it is at worst a tacit admission that one participates in it. If we don't have the guts to address issues in our leisure activities we will never find the courage to change the things that affect our daily lives.

We don't have what smaller divisions have (a clear and legitimate playoff) because of those who profit off of maintaining an image and who leverage that for favors. As long as schools think they have, or can create, an easier path for themselves and rely upon their connections and clout to get themselves into the limelight then this kind of a sham of a system will continue. As long as we have corporate apologists who speak, write, and blog from the very media outlets (and at their own personal profit by association with them) that thrive upon the ambiguity of the present system we will have those who continue to shrug and eventually lose interest.

(12-07-2014 07:51 AM)XLance Wrote:  Before we move to 4 conferences, and a champions only 4 team playoff, we must allow each conference to decide how to choose their champion.
That, then puts the onus on each of the P4, instead of some committee. It's likely that those 4 leagues won't look the same, that is they might not have equal numbers of members, or each conference won't have the same number of teams. This is why the conferences must be allowed to structure themselves and decide how they decide to select a champion.
Once that rule is changed, then and only then, will we see what is now the P5 morph into a P4. Once we have P4, everything else is now already in place.
Things are progressing in an orderly fashion, at an appropriate pace.

That's optimistic, but I hope you prove to be correct in your assessment.

If you keep keep a 4 team playoff, you restrict it to P5 champs only and reinstitute a BCS type of algorithm that takes into account the top rankings based on a basket of factors. Honestly, it will always be subjective until polls are removed entirely from the equation. I don't see that happening - ever. I also don't see anyone forcing conferences to combine simply to make a playoff scenario "cleaner" than it currently is. In the end, no one cares so long as the majority of the CFB fans see the majority of the most popular schools going far. That means bowls will never leave the equation because people still want to know who the 5th best team was as well as the 6th, 7th, etc. Too many fans who want to know how "their team" stacks up against all the other schools. Everyone loves a ranking system. Because of that, you will never see a true blue playoff in CFB.

(12-07-2014 07:53 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(12-07-2014 07:09 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(12-07-2014 03:16 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  People are watching games they wouldn't otherwise watch to try to work out who is going to go, and the top two are going to be included in the four, no matter whether you figure "top two" by "undefeated, then best of one loss" or "teams that look like the two best right now".

So it makes the media money people happy.

Gosh, its like having an election every four years, and every four years for over two centuries electing the Presidential candidate with the most money. In other words, its the American Way.

(PS. WOOT! Go Pokes!)

This!!!!

And it is precisely this kind of thinking that keeps us in a quagmire of corruption. Oh gee if it makes us money it is just fine to continue with things which are patently unfair at best and abusively corrupt at worst. "Evil exists where good people do nothing" and "nobody dares call it tyranny when it profits them". No Maize, we will never progress as a society as long as we cite status quo as the excuse to continue the status quo. Sports should teach teamwork, perseverance, instill courage, and teach all to trust in fair play. Do this well and everyone still profits just in ways that exceed the cash that will be there anyway. You might just raise another generation in this country that actually believes in something besides what money can buy them.

It is at best moral laziness to accept corruption and it is at worst a tacit admission that one participates in it. If we don't have the guts to address issues in our leisure activities we will never find the courage to change the things that affect our daily lives.

We don't have what smaller divisions have (a clear and legitimate playoff) because of those who profit off of maintaining an image and who leverage that for favors. As long as schools think they have, or can create, an easier path for themselves and rely upon their connections and clout to get themselves into the limelight then this kind of a sham of a system will continue. As long as we have corporate apologists who speak, write, and blog from the very media outlets (and at their own personal profit by association with them) that thrive upon the ambiguity of the present system we will have those who continue to shrug and eventually lose interest.

So, unless I misunderstood, you're saying that CFB should only be for the "P4", but then bash the system for being corrupt and exclusionary? You can't have it both ways. The CFP can only be fairf if it's more inclusive. I'm talking about being fair, not profit, which is what you were saying is the root of the problem.

Till the CFP includes ALL conference champs, and not just "P4" conferences, your scenario will continue to play itself out. Fair means fair FOR ALL.

Happens every year in the basketball tourney. There are years when a 10-6 nfl team misses the playoffs and you have a 8-8 or 9-7 team win their conference and make the playoffs.

(12-07-2014 03:23 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(12-07-2014 03:16 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  People are watching games they wouldn't otherwise watch to try to work out who is going to go, and the top two are going to be included in the four, no matter whether you figure "top two" by "undefeated, then best of one loss" or "teams that look like the two best right now".

So it makes the media money people happy.

Gosh, its like having an election every four years, and every four years for over two centuries electing the Presidential candidate with the most money. In other words, its the American Way.

(PS. WOOT! Go Pokes!)

It's not grass roots America's way, it is the Wall Street way. The two are diverging. Real Americans like fair play and an opportunity to decide their own fate. Corporate America likes the hedge that money buys and the need to control. It's a question of character Bruce.

I tend to agree that this is a question of character. We - that is, a large segment of the American public - believes the system we have now is flawed. I agree with that. But not for the reasons you might think. We are a major part of that system, not just spectators on the outside looking in. And the biggest flaw in the system is in our character. We Americans have an obsessive/compulsive need to rank things - even things (like college football) that are inherently unrankable.

We don't value excellence as much as we value winning. We have an almost pathological need in sports to identify a single team as the WINNER, and require that every other team must be LOSERS to satisfy that need. Somebody has to be declared "BEST" at the end of the day. Nothing else will do.

Then, on top of that, we want to superimpose our American notion of "fairness" on the process, losing sight of the fact that college football is part of the entertainment industry, in which fairness has nothing to do with what amuses us.

So my answer to what the solution to the problem of identifying the teams to participate in a playoff is not to have a playoff at all. Go back to the days before the Bowl Alliance and just let everybody enjoy a holiday bowl trip in which the season ends with 38 winners instead of just one. We will still have our need to rank teams after the last game is over - that's a character quirk I doubt we'll ever fix. And we'll still argue about why this ranking or that is wrong, or unfair, or the result of some conspiracy against dear old State U.

In short, this isn't fixable, at least not in the way many of us would like it to be.

(12-07-2014 08:26 AM)Knightsweat Wrote:  

(12-07-2014 07:53 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(12-07-2014 07:09 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(12-07-2014 03:16 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  People are watching games they wouldn't otherwise watch to try to work out who is going to go, and the top two are going to be included in the four, no matter whether you figure "top two" by "undefeated, then best of one loss" or "teams that look like the two best right now".

So it makes the media money people happy.

Gosh, its like having an election every four years, and every four years for over two centuries electing the Presidential candidate with the most money. In other words, its the American Way.

(PS. WOOT! Go Pokes!)

This!!!!

And it is precisely this kind of thinking that keeps us in a quagmire of corruption. Oh gee if it makes us money it is just fine to continue with things which are patently unfair at best and abusively corrupt at worst. "Evil exists where good people do nothing" and "nobody dares call it tyranny when it profits them". No Maize, we will never progress as a society as long as we cite status quo as the excuse to continue the status quo. Sports should teach teamwork, perseverance, instill courage, and teach all to trust in fair play. Do this well and everyone still profits just in ways that exceed the cash that will be there anyway. You might just raise another generation in this country that actually believes in something besides what money can buy them.

It is at best moral laziness to accept corruption and it is at worst a tacit admission that one participates in it. If we don't have the guts to address issues in our leisure activities we will never find the courage to change the things that affect our daily lives.

We don't have what smaller divisions have (a clear and legitimate playoff) because of those who profit off of maintaining an image and who leverage that for favors. As long as schools think they have, or can create, an easier path for themselves and rely upon their connections and clout to get themselves into the limelight then this kind of a sham of a system will continue. As long as we have corporate apologists who speak, write, and blog from the very media outlets (and at their own personal profit by association with them) that thrive upon the ambiguity of the present system we will have those who continue to shrug and eventually lose interest.

So, unless I misunderstood, you're saying that CFB should only be for the "P4", but then bash the system for being corrupt and exclusionary? You can't have it both ways. The CFP can only be fairf if it's more inclusive. I'm talking about being fair, not profit, which is what you were saying is the root of the problem.

Till the CFP includes ALL conference champs, and not just "P4" conferences, your scenario will continue to play itself out. Fair means fair FOR ALL.

You didn't read enough of the thread. I suggested a consolidation of P5 to P4 and G5 to G4 with corresponding regions having the first round. PAC/MWC, SEC/Sunbelt, Big 10/MAC, and the survivors of the Big 12 & ACC against the survivors of CUSA and the AAC. Then every year the PAC/MWC winner faces the Big 10/MAC winner while the SEC/Sunbelt winner faces the Big 12/ACC // CUSA/AAC winner. Then the final two play. That way everyone stays engaged but each will have the motivation of having their champion in at least the first round with a chance to go all the way. No at larges, conference champs only. My first post was just about the present P5 situation my subsequent post, since I knew everyone's solution would be expand the playoffs, was about how to do that while preserving the importance of the regular season and by including all of the FBS.