(12-02-2014 10:09 PM)midtowncowboy Wrote:  

(12-02-2014 10:08 PM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(12-02-2014 09:49 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  Last year he promises the entire summer was spent of uptempo offense and pressing. That lasted two games.

This season, it was "defense and conditioning." The defense is awful again this year. Back door cuts, no help etc.

It seems to fall on the differences between what he promises and what he delivers.

Clearly JP doesn't know how to teach the fundamentals of any facet of the game. I think JP might know it when he sees it but doesn't have a clue on how to teach it. I always thought JP was a weak coach but could keep up with his high level recruiting but this group is lacking in so many essentials to be successful, I have no idea how JP would think this group could be successful. We just don't have the right pieces to be successful.

Constructively speaking, JP should seek out a BB guru, pay him out of his salary to come in & teach fundamentals of team defense, install a disciplined offense that can be run by players who lack quickness, that focuses on getting the ball to the few players who seem to have some offense. Find 7 guys to develop & hang with, good or bad through the pre-conference play. Forget desperate substitutions, pulling players for every mistake or to trying to get wins now, rather work on developing a team concept that can salvage something in-conference. Even so we are looking at a .500 season ( I had us losing to SFA in the season prediction thread & still has us going 18-13).

Agreed with the teaching assistant. Been my hope for 3 years. Have to ask what the other assistants do. JP should play to his strengths and let others cover his weaknesses and learn from them.

He hasn't done this and I dont think he will. I sometimes wonder if the "youngest coach in America" talk in the media got to him.

(12-03-2014 12:03 AM)80sTiger Wrote:  On Kedren ... "I knew when Pastner took him that he’d not played college basketball for a year and that he’d let himself go a bit, but I had no idea until about two weeks ago that, in that year he was suspended from Vandy, he had not so much as picked up a basketball or worked out. That was stunning to hear."

... the coaching staff must've known their desperation. Had to reach hoping for just something.

Says a lot about our staff


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

(12-02-2014 11:32 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(12-02-2014 11:22 PM)Malachi Wrote:  He's a gimmick. The luke walton hire early on told you where his head was at.

Those are issues, too.

First he was going to be the HC and the 3rd assistant. Then he got Walton. Then the Frank hire.

You had the corny "dap" nonsense. The "energy bus" and other gimmicky motivational book excerpts. The ridiculous "good player, well coached" responses. The "winning is hard" "everyone is good" "CUSA is the best conference."

All of this before we even begin to dissect his strategy, schemes or in game work.

Oh, and then to deal with player relations/retention etc.

Not defending Pastner at all, but Cal had the same type of nonsensical quips also.

People talk about Pastner's teams not having fundamentals. I agree wholeheartedly. But I would think by the time that players get offered a scholarship to college they could do basic basketball things.

Like:

1) running to the corner to receive an inbounds pass and get double teamed (basically 4 people guarding you). Who does that? and why doesn't Pastner coach against doing that in practice?

2) Dribbling across halfcourt and picking up your dribble. Who does that? (I'll tell you... 2nd grade boys) and why doesn't Pastner not teach not to do that in practice? (Kedren doesn't do it, which is probably why he will be the starting point guard soon)

3) Losing your man while watching someone dribble the basketball 25 feet away from you and allowing your guy to back door cut to the basket for a layup. Who does that? Well apparently about five of our guys. It's like they get lulled into a false sense of "time to rest because my guy doesn't have the ball". How can Pastner not see this after this long and specifically coach not allowing it?

4) Not providing defensive help on screens. When the offensive screener screens a guard, our big defender just stands there and actually HELPS to screen OUR guy. Who does that? The screener's defender HAS to step over to not allow the offense guard a clear path. This should be taught the first day, but it isn't because all our guys do this on defense.

5) Bad passes into the post that get intercepted. Who does that? This is a two-fold problem. a)If their big is fronting our guy, the pass has to go over the top and our big has to seal and pivot. b)Passes have to get to the bigs MUCH faster to not allow the defender to get there to hedge.

6) Stepping toward the passer to receive the pass. Who does that? NOBODY. None of our guards come TOWARD the ball. Usually they are standing still with their hands out. Sometimes they actually break AWAY from the ball toward the basket before they have even received the ball which always leads to a steal by the other team. Pastner MUST teach this fundamental.

7) Offensive sets look like streetball. Plays are being called, but once the point guard starts it, nobody does what they are supposed to do. Who does that? It is incredible how we look so disorganized. Our plays are not coordinated and are slow to develop. You have to believe they run them in practice, but it sure doesn't look like it. Interesting that Pastner draws up plays after timeouts that make him look like a genius, but evidently the "gameplan" for offensive sets either isn't understood, to complicated, miscommunicated or ignored. Pastner either has to teach them better or have 2 plays. (In his defense, at the beginning of the year he said that he may have one play ready for Canada. Looks like he wasn't kidding.)

8) Not defending the 3pt. line. Who does that? In the Baylor game, on an out of bounds play our guy left their guy wide open at the arc. I heard Pastner through the TV calling out a specific player to cover his man before the shot. Not 30 seconds later, they ran the EXACT SAME out of bounds play and the same player allowed another 3 pointer. How do you coach that? Take the player out. Then in practice the next day make him practice it over and over until he can't stand up.

9) Mental awareness. This is and has always been a problem with Pastner's teams. Some people may call it Basketball I.Q. There is no way to "teach" this, but there is a way to instill it in a player. It's called "The Army Way". Drill it, drill it, drill it. Over and over again. If they fail, they run (like doing push-ups in the Army). Eventually they won't have to think what to do, they will do it instinctively.

This is my constructive criticism.

I'm not going to pile on Pastner. There's enough of that here already. And no, he's not perfect, and yes, there's room for improvement in the head coach and assistant coaches.

But basketball fundamentals.... these players should KNOW this stuff already. Makes me wonder what high school/AAU "coaches" are actually teaching them...or are they?? The true naturals come in with an instinct for the game and high basketball IQ already. The rest just look like they're trying out for the varsity squad, having been told how terrific they are at parking lot hot-dog basketball.

We see highlight vids of highly ranked players and wonder why they aren't producing like that once they get to D1 play. Happens all the time. Yeah, they might have been the best player at their entire school, maybe their AAU team too, but they've never played a minute of high-pressure D1 basketball. And it shows.

Too many new players. They haven't bought into the team concept yet. They still play as individuals. A couple of the veterans at least have enough experience to try to feed the open man. The rest are just looking for a way to score and get their names in the stats.

It's disappointing to say the least. Which I guess is why all the importance put on veteran players to show them the way. This team -- with the exception of a handful of veterans -- looks like they've never played team basketball in their lives. No D1 coach should have to start with the fundamentals. A head coach should use the fundamentals already there and work them into his own (hopefully) winning system. Whether that's on Pastner for not being able to inspire or discipline them, or it's on them for not having even the fundamentals to work with, well I guess the jury's still out on that...

But it can't be ALL coach. You can't put together a winning team every season if your players are starting from scratch with basic basketball. He shouldn't have to teach fundamentals. All the athleticism in the world won't save you if you don't know jack about how the game is played as a team. Just my two cents.

(12-03-2014 12:26 AM)Hoopla Wrote:  I'm not going to pile on Pastner. There's enough of that here already. And no, he's not perfect, and yes, there's room for improvement in the head coach and assistant coaches.

But basketball fundamentals.... these players should KNOW this stuff already. Makes me wonder what high school/AAU "coaches" are actually teaching them...or are they?? The true naturals come in with an instinct for the game and high basketball IQ already. The rest just look like they're trying out for the varsity squad, having been told how terrific they are at parking lot hot-dog basketball.

We see highlight vids of highly ranked players and wonder why they aren't producing like that once they get to D1 play. Happens all the time. Yeah, they might have been the best player at their entire school, maybe their AAU team too, but they've never played a minute of high-pressure D1 basketball. And it shows.

Too many new players. They haven't bought into the team concept yet. They still play as individuals. A couple of the veterans at least have enough experience to try to feed the open man. The rest are just looking for a way to score and get their names in the stats.

It's disappointing to say the least. Which I guess is why all the importance put on veteran players to show them the way. This team -- with the exception of a handful of veterans -- looks like they've never played team basketball in their lives. No D1 coach should have to start with the fundamentals. A head coach should use the fundamentals already there and work them into his own (hopefully) winning system. Whether that's on Pastner for not being able to inspire or discipline them, or it's on them for not having even the fundamentals to work with, well I guess the jury's still out on that...

But it can't be ALL coach. You can't put together a winning team every season if your players are starting from scratch with basic basketball. He shouldn't have to teach fundamentals. All the athleticism in the world won't save you if you don't know jack about how the game is played as a team. Just my two cents.

Sorry, but this sounds like more apologist BS. When was the last time Pastner took a player and made him better than he was when he came into the program? Who? There isn't...a...single...name. None. That's the mark of a bad coach. Period.

"Basketball fundamentals?" Are you seriously going to blame this on the players? Would you blame a chess match on a pawn, rook or queen? You are right in one thing, it's not ALL the coach. But in sure as hell is 95% his fault. I've seen many MANY other coaches take teams of 2 and 3 star players and turn them into winning, deep tournament teams. Isn't that kind of what we look for and revere as appealing in a coach? How often is calipari denigrated for his ones-and-dones approach and coaches like Shaka Smart revered for his winning without superstar talent approach?

For years i've sat on opinions great coaches have had on Pastner. He is laughed at by the elites. He is mocked by other programs. Why do we do SO poorly against teams in the second half? It's the same word you hear over and over again at Memphis, because Pastner is out-coached.

Give me a good coach and those 3 and a sprinkling of 4 star athletes. I want to see good efforts and well coached teams. I want to see heart and soul again in Memphis basketball. I don't even care if we win. I don't care! I just want to see some good basketball again. It's something we haven't had at our university in years.

(12-03-2014 12:20 AM)Tgrrfan Wrote:  

(12-02-2014 11:32 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(12-02-2014 11:22 PM)Malachi Wrote:  He's a gimmick. The luke walton hire early on told you where his head was at.

Those are issues, too.

First he was going to be the HC and the 3rd assistant. Then he got Walton. Then the Frank hire.

You had the corny "dap" nonsense. The "energy bus" and other gimmicky motivational book excerpts. The ridiculous "good player, well coached" responses. The "winning is hard" "everyone is good" "CUSA is the best conference."

All of this before we even begin to dissect his strategy, schemes or in game work.

Oh, and then to deal with player relations/retention etc.

Not defending Pastner at all, but Cal had the same type of nonsensical quips also.

People talk about Pastner's teams not having fundamentals. I agree wholeheartedly. But I would think by the time that players get offered a scholarship to college they could do basic basketball things.

Like:

1) running to the corner to receive an inbounds pass and get double teamed (basically 4 people guarding you). Who does that? and why doesn't Pastner coach against doing that in practice?

2) Dribbling across halfcourt and picking up your dribble. Who does that? (I'll tell you... 2nd grade boys) and why doesn't Pastner not teach not to do that in practice? (Kedren doesn't do it, which is probably why he will be the starting point guard soon)

3) Losing your man while watching someone dribble the basketball 25 feet away from you and allowing your guy to back door cut to the basket for a layup. Who does that? Well apparently about five of our guys. It's like they get lulled into a false sense of "time to rest because my guy doesn't have the ball". How can Pastner not see this after this long and specifically coach not allowing it?

4) Not providing defensive help on screens. When the offensive screener screens a guard, our big defender just stands there and actually HELPS to screen OUR guy. Who does that? The screener's defender HAS to step over to not allow the offense guard a clear path. This should be taught the first day, but it isn't because all our guys do this on defense.

5) Bad passes into the post that get intercepted. Who does that? This is a two-fold problem. a)If their big is fronting our guy, the pass has to go over the top and our big has to seal and pivot. b)Passes have to get to the bigs MUCH faster to not allow the defender to get there to hedge.

6) Stepping toward the passer to receive the pass. Who does that? NOBODY. None of our guards come TOWARD the ball. Usually they are standing still with their hands out. Sometimes they actually break AWAY from the ball toward the basket before they have even received the ball which always leads to a steal by the other team. Pastner MUST teach this fundamental.

7) Offensive sets look like streetball. Plays are being called, but once the point guard starts it, nobody does what they are supposed to do. Who does that? It is incredible how we look so disorganized. Our plays are not coordinated and are slow to develop. You have to believe they run them in practice, but it sure doesn't look like it. Interesting that Pastner draws up plays after timeouts that make him look like a genius, but evidently the "gameplan" for offensive sets either isn't understood, to complicated, miscommunicated or ignored. Pastner either has to teach them better or have 2 plays. (In his defense, at the beginning of the year he said that he may have one play ready for Canada. Looks like he wasn't kidding.)

8) Not defending the 3pt. line. Who does that? In the Baylor game, on an out of bounds play our guy left their guy wide open at the arc. I heard Pastner through the TV calling out a specific player to cover his man before the shot. Not 30 seconds later, they ran the EXACT SAME out of bounds play and the same player allowed another 3 pointer. How do you coach that? Take the player out. Then in practice the next day make him practice it over and over until he can't stand up.

9) Mental awareness. This is and has always been a problem with Pastner's teams. Some people may call it Basketball I.Q. There is no way to "teach" this, but there is a way to instill it in a player. It's called "The Army Way". Drill it, drill it, drill it. Over and over again. If they fail, they run (like doing push-ups in the Army). Eventually they won't have to think what to do, they will do it instinctively.

This is my constructive criticism.

Problem is we have had 6 years of this crap. Time to call it what it is, either he recruits players who can't play or he can't coach or both. I'm in the camp its both. I just posted an article from last year that shows what a crappy coach he is and his big claim to fame as a recruiter shows all he can get is players who want to come here anyway. Other than Barton, he hasn't recruited a top player outside of the region.

(12-03-2014 12:26 AM)Hoopla Wrote:  I'm not going to pile on Pastner. There's enough of that here already. And no, he's not perfect, and yes, there's room for improvement in the head coach and assistant coaches.

But basketball fundamentals.... these players should KNOW this stuff already. Makes me wonder what high school/AAU "coaches" are actually teaching them...or are they?? The true naturals come in with an instinct for the game and high basketball IQ already. The rest just look like they're trying out for the varsity squad, having been told how terrific they are at parking lot hot-dog basketball.

We see highlight vids of highly ranked players and wonder why they aren't producing like that once they get to D1 play. Happens all the time. Yeah, they might have been the best player at their entire school, maybe their AAU team too, but they've never played a minute of high-pressure D1 basketball. And it shows.

Too many new players. They haven't bought into the team concept yet. They still play as individuals. A couple of the veterans at least have enough experience to try to feed the open man. The rest are just looking for a way to score and get their names in the stats.

It's disappointing to say the least. Which I guess is why all the importance put on veteran players to show them the way. This team -- with the exception of a handful of veterans -- looks like they've never played team basketball in their lives. No D1 coach should have to start with the fundamentals. A head coach should use the fundamentals already there and work them into his own (hopefully) winning system. Whether that's on Pastner for not being able to inspire or discipline them, or it's on them for not having even the fundamentals to work with, well I guess the jury's still out on that...

But it can't be ALL coach. You can't put together a winning team every season if your players are starting from scratch with basic basketball. He shouldn't have to teach fundamentals. All the athleticism in the world won't save you if you don't know jack about how the game is played as a team. Just my two cents.

Who recruited the players who should know? I guess the players at Nebraska and Michigan football should know how to play right? Didn't save their coaches. Shouldn't save ours. I'm beginning to think why prolong the inevitable, fire JP now and at least start working on next year's hire.