What if:
G5 conferences said enough is enough.
G5 conferences meet to consider breaking away: not just from P5, but also from NCAA who is capitulating to P5 on all fronts. And selling out G5 programs / conferences.

Upon end of said TV contracts, G5 -united in their resolve, stop scheduling P5.
P5 schools struggle to schedule without teams taking more non conference losses. Lower-end P5 schools become the new whipping boys and become less relevant.

G5, upon completion of all current TV contract obligations, package their wares and shop their own TV contract.

G5 re writes their recruiting rules, game rules, and re- positions itself as a more fun, legitimate, exciting, open offense, and creative model of truly amateur college football that is based on meritocracy rather than the golden rule. And paints the P5 as the money driven semi pro feeder system of the NFL that it has become.

Recall the maverick AFL's genesis in the 1960's challenging the NFL's arrogance and exclusionary approach head on... And bringing the NFL to the table humbly submitting to full recognition and ultimately a merger of equals.
Then Broadway Joe beats the Colts in Super Bowl 3 and proved the AFL's point on the field.

This thing is headed towards more disparity and rich getting richer, unless something is done to challenge it. I'm not advocating above scenario yet by any means. I'm only asking to consider options other than standing idly by as victims.

As Mike Myers would say on "Coffee Talk"- "talk among yourselves".

If the G5 did this, the vast majority of college fans and tv execs wouldn't give a crap...they still have the P5 and the blue bloods. Do you think they care of a bunch of schools with mostly 30k stadiums and under leave???? LOL come on...We would leave and the P5 would still be on tv and sold out 75k strong per week across the nation.

Not so sure about that...There are a dozen teams in G5 that can play with most if not all P5 moguls.

And negotiating as 64 G5 schools may put another network besides ESPN in position to promote us.

You're drunk, go home.

(06-20-2014 07:52 PM)CougarTruth Wrote:  Not so sure about that...There are a dozen teams in G5 that can play with most if not all P5 moguls.

And negotiating as 64 G5 schools may put another network besides ESPN in position to promote us.

you are mixing up topics...the topic isn't "are there G5 teams that can play with P5 teams". Of course the answer to that is yes.

the topic is, "what if the G5 left the ncaa"...the answer to that is, the nation (P5 fans, espn, etc) wouldn't care.

(06-20-2014 08:53 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(06-20-2014 07:52 PM)CougarTruth Wrote:  Not so sure about that...There are a dozen teams in G5 that can play with most if not all P5 moguls.

And negotiating as 64 G5 schools may put another network besides ESPN in position to promote us.

you are mixing up topics...the topic isn't "are there G5 teams that can play with P5 teams". Of course the answer to that is yes.

the topic is, "what I've the G5 left the ncaa"...the answer to that is, the nation (P5 fans, espn, etc) wouldn't care.

If the P5 leaves Emmert and the NCAA, which Slive and the SEC, the PAC12, and the B1G have all threatened, you can be assured Emmert would want to listen to the G5 and hope we would stay. We need to remind that spineless moron he can't have it both ways.

(06-20-2014 06:14 PM)CougarTruth Wrote:  What if:
G5 conferences said enough is enough.
G5 conferences meet to consider breaking away: not just from P5, but also from NCAA who is capitulating to P5 on all fronts. And selling out G5 programs / conferences.

Upon end of said TV contracts, G5 -united in their resolve, stop scheduling P5.
P5 schools struggle to schedule without teams taking more non conference losses. Lower-end P5 schools become the new whipping boys and become less relevant.

G5, upon completion of all current TV contract obligations, package their wares and shop their own TV contract.

G5 re writes their recruiting rules, game rules, and re- positions itself as a more fun, legitimate, exciting, open offense, and creative model of truly amateur college football that is based on meritocracy rather than the golden rule. And paints the P5 as the money driven semi pro feeder system of the NFL that it has become.

Recall the maverick AFL's genesis in the 1960's challenging the NFL's arrogance and exclusionary approach head on... And bringing the NFL to the table humbly submitting to full recognition and ultimately a merger of equals.
Then Broadway Joe beats the Colts in Super Bowl 3 and proved the AFL's point on the field.

This thing is headed towards more disparity and rich getting richer, unless something is done to challenge it. I'm not advocating above scenario yet by any means. I'm only asking to consider options other than standing idly by as victims.

As Mike Myers would say on "Coffee Talk"- "talk among yourselves".

good idea, maybe houston should go ahead and drop down to FCS status to prepare. please send a letter to your president and ad.

Slitting throat to spite face.

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

(06-20-2014 09:35 PM)shere khan Wrote:  

(06-20-2014 06:14 PM)CougarTruth Wrote:  What if:
G5 conferences said enough is enough.
G5 conferences meet to consider breaking away: not just from P5, but also from NCAA who is capitulating to P5 on all fronts. And selling out G5 programs / conferences.

Upon end of said TV contracts, G5 -united in their resolve, stop scheduling P5.
P5 schools struggle to schedule without teams taking more non conference losses. Lower-end P5 schools become the new whipping boys and become less relevant.

G5, upon completion of all current TV contract obligations, package their wares and shop their own TV contract.

G5 re writes their recruiting rules, game rules, and re- positions itself as a more fun, legitimate, exciting, open offense, and creative model of truly amateur college football that is based on meritocracy rather than the golden rule. And paints the P5 as the money driven semi pro feeder system of the NFL that it has become.

Recall the maverick AFL's genesis in the 1960's challenging the NFL's arrogance and exclusionary approach head on... And bringing the NFL to the table humbly submitting to full recognition and ultimately a merger of equals.
Then Broadway Joe beats the Colts in Super Bowl 3 and proved the AFL's point on the field.

This thing is headed towards more disparity and rich getting richer, unless something is done to challenge it. I'm not advocating above scenario yet by any means. I'm only asking to consider options other than standing idly by as victims.

As Mike Myers would say on "Coffee Talk"- "talk among yourselves".

good idea, maybe houston should go ahead and drop down to FCS status to prepare. please send a letter to your president and ad.

As Memphis' invite to SEC is imminent, I can understand that attitude.

(06-20-2014 06:14 PM)CougarTruth Wrote:  What if:
G5 conferences said enough is enough.
G5 conferences meet to consider breaking away: not just from P5, but also from NCAA who is capitulating to P5 on all fronts. And selling out G5 programs / conferences.

Upon end of said TV contracts, G5 -united in their resolve, stop scheduling P5.
P5 schools struggle to schedule without teams taking more non conference losses. Lower-end P5 schools become the new whipping boys and become less relevant.

G5, upon completion of all current TV contract obligations, package their wares and shop their own TV contract.

G5 re writes their recruiting rules, game rules, and re- positions itself as a more fun, legitimate, exciting, open offense, and creative model of truly amateur college football that is based on meritocracy rather than the golden rule. And paints the P5 as the money driven semi pro feeder system of the NFL that it has become.

Recall the maverick AFL's genesis in the 1960's challenging the NFL's arrogance and exclusionary approach head on... And bringing the NFL to the table humbly submitting to full recognition and ultimately a merger of equals.
Then Broadway Joe beats the Colts in Super Bowl 3 and proved the AFL's point on the field.

This thing is headed towards more disparity and rich getting richer, unless something is done to challenge it. I'm not advocating above scenario yet by any means. I'm only asking to consider options other than standing idly by as victims.

As Mike Myers would say on "Coffee Talk"- "talk among yourselves".

Can the players also put things like "He Hate Me" on the back of their jerseys? If you're going to be as relevant as the XFL, you might as well go all the way.

(06-20-2014 07:52 PM)CougarTruth Wrote:  Not so sure about that...There are a dozen teams in G5 that can play with most if not all P5 moguls.

And negotiating as 64 G5 schools may put another network besides ESPN in position to promote us.

Totally agree.

In the 80's the outsiders were the MAC/Big West. Didn't have enough power to make a squawk about it. 20 programs on the outside.

By the mid 90's it was the WAC, CUSA, MAC, Big West. The ramifications of the new system were unclear and the WAC/CUSA were more focused on joining the club than anything else. About 40 programs outside.

Today its the AAC, MWC, CUSA, MAC, SBC. 64 programs sitting on the outside, many of which are playing in stadiums 35,000 plus. With everyone locked out of full voting representation regardless of what happens to them on the field.

The potential is there today that wasn't there before, IMO.

(06-20-2014 09:39 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Slitting throat to spite face.

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

this

(06-21-2014 07:09 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(06-20-2014 09:39 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Slitting throat to spite face.

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

this

Action versus inaction. It may not have been truly thought out, but he bases his argument on truth. I see a lot of beaten wife syndrome in these posts. Most of you don't suggest anything new, rather sit back and attack someone else's suggestion, how difficult is that? I got some bad news for you folks,most of your noses will be cut off anyway, it just a matter of who does the cutting. Now it's just a matter of going down while giving up a good fight, or going quietly into that good night.

Two things on the P5 split. As quoted from here --" http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_2595...-athletics

Quote:As for the threat of leaving the NCAA, it's a ruse, Lopiano said.

"What's bad is that the other thousand NCAA institutions don't recognize that it's a nonexistent threat," she said. "Big-time schools can't leave; Congress would take away tax preferences and remove federal assistance. If they leave, now they're not a nonprofit. They're hiding behind the skirts of the rest of the NCAA institutions."

Second point, the NCAA March Madness tournament is a huge money maker. Would CBS and ESPN be willing to pay as much money of teams like UCONN, Memphis, etc. are not going to be included in the tournament? Next round of negotiations probably would not go very well.

(06-21-2014 07:33 AM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  

(06-21-2014 07:09 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(06-20-2014 09:39 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Slitting throat to spite face.

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

this

Action versus inaction. It may not have been truly thought out, but he bases his argument on truth. I see a lot of beaten wife syndrome in these posts. Most of you don't suggest anything new, rather sit back and attack someone else's suggestion, how difficult is that? I got some bad news for you folks,most of your noses will be cut off anyway, it just a matter of who does the cutting. Now it's just a matter of going down while giving up a good fight, or going quietly into that good night.

100% I'd rather die trying.

(06-21-2014 07:58 AM)sfink16 Wrote:  Two things on the P5 split. As quoted from here --" http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_2595...-athletics

Quote:As for the threat of leaving the NCAA, it's a ruse, Lopiano said.

"What's bad is that the other thousand NCAA institutions don't recognize that it's a nonexistent threat," she said. "Big-time schools can't leave; Congress would take away tax preferences and remove federal assistance. If they leave, now they're not a nonprofit. They're hiding behind the skirts of the rest of the NCAA institutions."

Second point, the NCAA March Madness tournament is a huge money maker. Would CBS and ESPN be willing to pay as much money of teams like UCONN, Memphis, etc. are not going to be included in the tournament? Next round of negotiations probably would not go very well.

I think the P5 definitely do not want to split. Not because of fear of congressional action, that's wishful thinking, as these P5 schools probably have more people in congress than anyone but the Ivies, and the Ivies couldn't care less one way or the other.

But, the basketball tournament is indeed a massive consideration, as the P5 know that the public wants a tournament that includes all of current Division I, not just a P5 tournament, which would be worth significantly less.

That said, it is not a sure thing they won't split. What they want is all of this autonomy but within the structure of the NCAA. And if they can't get that a split may indeed be a better option for them than remaining in the NCAA. So I am not convinced the thread is idle.

(06-21-2014 07:33 AM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  

(06-21-2014 07:09 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(06-20-2014 09:39 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Slitting throat to spite face.

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

this

Action versus inaction. It may not have been truly thought out, but he bases his argument on truth. I see a lot of beaten wife syndrome in these posts. Most of you don't suggest anything new, rather sit back and attack someone else's suggestion, how difficult is that? I got some bad news for you folks,most of your noses will be cut off anyway, it just a matter of who does the cutting. Now it's just a matter of going down while giving up a good fight, or going quietly into that good night.

Problem is, leaving to form our own G5 association is not putting up any kind of "fight". It is fleeing the scene of battle to die alone in a faraway land.

1. there is some to gain by following the P5 and breaking away. the same divide in total revenue that is hurting the P5 is hurting the G5 as well to a much smaller extent.

2. any talk of of a P5 embargo is silly talk. it would hurt the G5 20x worse than the P5.

(06-21-2014 08:29 AM)john01992 Wrote:  2. any talk of of a P5 embargo is silly talk. it would hurt the G5 20x worse than the P5.

Yes, would be like Jonah Hill threatening to boycott having sex with Angelina Jolie.

(06-21-2014 08:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-21-2014 07:58 AM)sfink16 Wrote:  Two things on the P5 split. As quoted from here --" http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_2595...-athletics

Quote:As for the threat of leaving the NCAA, it's a ruse, Lopiano said.

"What's bad is that the other thousand NCAA institutions don't recognize that it's a nonexistent threat," she said. "Big-time schools can't leave; Congress would take away tax preferences and remove federal assistance. If they leave, now they're not a nonprofit. They're hiding behind the skirts of the rest of the NCAA institutions."

Second point, the NCAA March Madness tournament is a huge money maker. Would CBS and ESPN be willing to pay as much money of teams like UCONN, Memphis, etc. are not going to be included in the tournament? Next round of negotiations probably would not go very well.

I think the P5 definitely do not want to split. Not because of fear of congressional action, that's wishful thinking, as these P5 schools probably have more people in congress than anyone but the Ivies, and the Ivies couldn't care less one way or the other.

But, the basketball tournament is indeed a massive consideration, as the P5 know that the public wants a tournament that includes all of current Division I, not just a P5 tournament, which would be worth significantly less.

That said, it is not a sure thing they won't split. What they want is all of this autonomy but within the structure of the NCAA. And if they can't get that a split may indeed be a better option for them than remaining in the NCAA. So I am not convinced the thread is idle.

Yoir assumption is the P5 will fight legislation. What if they dont? What if its in thier best interests? What if they actually support governmental intervention? I think this may end up being the end game. I think that governmental intervention may be the only way to save the current NCAA model. Autonomy as proposed certainly will not do it.

If your paying close attention to he tweets coming from the courtroom of the actual testimony as well as the articles being written, the P5 and the NCAA are in trouble. The case is not going well for the NCAA. The NCAA and the P5 are being accused of colluding together to limit the compensation to players by fixing the value of a scholarship. I think there is little doubt thats true and they are having a lot of difficulty proving that thier system creates a competetive balance (especially since every P5 commissioner has been saying the exact opposite for a year in the run up to the autonomy vote--oops).

The funny thing is that the big fix for all this, autonomy, is the EXACT same thing. It will STILL be the P5 (along with the NCAA) colluding together to fix the value of a scholarship. They will just be colluding to bump the value up a bit. Another case coming on the same courts docket, the Kessler case, accuses FBS and the NCAA of colluding to limit both the value of a scholarship AND the number of scholarships. The autonomy proposal doesn't help here either.

I think the final solution is going to have to be legislative if the NCAA and P5 are going to preserve any semblance of its current model that attempts to cross amateurism with some elements of professional sports. What I see coming is a future anti-trust exemption for the NCAA in exchange for a level of governmental regulation designed to protect student athletes, provide a level playing field, and likely will result in much more fair and open playoff access for everyone. It doesn't make sense for public institutions designed to provide higher education to spend millions of dollars for a football player. So, it can be easily argued that the antitrust exemption is in the public good. This is the only way I can see something that looks like the current model surviving. My guess is once regulatory legislation is crafted, the G5 concerns will be addressed along with issues of athletes health, athletic time demands, scholarship values, playoff access, and other issues within college athletics. I think you end up with a system where money continues to be eat-what-you-kill, but access is more open and inclusive for the playoff. Athletes will get a scholarship, better protection and research on concussions, a stipend, probably some sharing of likeness income, long term medical, and better enforced limits on sports activity designed to make them STUDENT athletes again.