(06-21-2014 08:54 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(06-21-2014 08:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-21-2014 07:58 AM)sfink16 Wrote:  Two things on the P5 split. As quoted from here --" http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_2595...-athletics

Quote:As for the threat of leaving the NCAA, it's a ruse, Lopiano said.

"What's bad is that the other thousand NCAA institutions don't recognize that it's a nonexistent threat," she said. "Big-time schools can't leave; Congress would take away tax preferences and remove federal assistance. If they leave, now they're not a nonprofit. They're hiding behind the skirts of the rest of the NCAA institutions."

Second point, the NCAA March Madness tournament is a huge money maker. Would CBS and ESPN be willing to pay as much money of teams like UCONN, Memphis, etc. are not going to be included in the tournament? Next round of negotiations probably would not go very well.

I think the P5 definitely do not want to split. Not because of fear of congressional action, that's wishful thinking, as these P5 schools probably have more people in congress than anyone but the Ivies, and the Ivies couldn't care less one way or the other.

But, the basketball tournament is indeed a massive consideration, as the P5 know that the public wants a tournament that includes all of current Division I, not just a P5 tournament, which would be worth significantly less.

That said, it is not a sure thing they won't split. What they want is all of this autonomy but within the structure of the NCAA. And if they can't get that a split may indeed be a better option for them than remaining in the NCAA. So I am not convinced the thread is idle.

Yoir assumption is the P5 will fight legislation. What if they dont? What if its in thier best interests? What if they actually support governmental intervention? I think this may end up being the end game. I think that governmental intervention may be the only way to save the current NCAA model. Autonomy as proposed certainly will not do it.

If your paying close attention to he tweets coming from the courtroom of the actual testimony as well as the articles being written, the P5 and the NCAA are in trouble. The case is not going well for the NCAA. The NCAA and the P5 are being accused of colluding together to limit the compensation to players by fixing the value of a scholarship. I think there is little doubt thats true and they are having a lot of difficulty proving that thier system creates a competetive balance (especially since every P5 commissioner has been saying the exact opposite for a year in the run up to the autonomy vote--oops).

The funny thing is that the big fix for all this, autonomy, is the EXACT same thing. It will STILL be the P5 (along with the NCAA) colluding together to fix the value of a scholarship. They will just be colluding to bump the value up a bit. Another case coming on the same courts docket, the Kessler case, accuses FBS and the NCAA of colluding to limit both the value of a scholarship AND the number of scholarships. The autonomy proposal doesn't help here either.

I think the final solution is going to have to be legislative if the NCAA and P5 are going to preserve any semblance of its current model that attempts to cross amateurism with some elements of professional sports. What I see coming is a future anti-trust exemption for the NCAA in exchange for a level of governmental regulation designed to protect student athletes, provide a level playing field, and likely will result in much more fair and open playoff access for everyone. It doesn't make sense for public institutions designed to provide higher education to spend millions of dollars for a football player. So, it can be easily argued that the antitrust exemption is in the public good. This is the only way I can see something that looks like the current model surviving. My guess is once regulatory legislation is crafted, the G5 concerns will be addressed along with issues of athletes health, athletic time demands, scholarship values, playoff access, and other issues within college athletics. I think you end up with a system where money continues to be eat-what-you-kill, but access is more open and inclusive for the playoff. Athletes will get a scholarship, better protection and research on concussions, a stipend, probably some sharing of likeness income, long term medical, and better enforced limits on sports activity designed to make them STUDENT athletes again.

I applaud you for a very well thought out and comprehensive post.

I disagree with two things. I do not think it can be rationally argued that it is in the 'public interest' to allow schools to collude to not pay players, as schools have nobody else to blame but themselves if that collusion is disallowed by antitrust laws and they choose to pay big dollars anyway. Absent NCAA/P5 collusion, nobody can force Alabama to bid on a player and it is absurd for them to ask congress to 'save them from themselves' by allowing collusive caps on schollies, pay, etc.

Second, even if congress does pass antitrust exemption, i see no reason to think anything that is pro-G5 will be folded in to that legislation. The G5 concerns have neither moral superiority nor a compelling political basis.

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(06-21-2014 08:18 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-21-2014 07:58 AM)sfink16 Wrote:  Two things on the P5 split. As quoted from here --" http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_2595...-athletics

Quote:As for the threat of leaving the NCAA, it's a ruse, Lopiano said.

"What's bad is that the other thousand NCAA institutions don't recognize that it's a nonexistent threat," she said. "Big-time schools can't leave; Congress would take away tax preferences and remove federal assistance. If they leave, now they're not a nonprofit. They're hiding behind the skirts of the rest of the NCAA institutions."

Second point, the NCAA March Madness tournament is a huge money maker. Would CBS and ESPN be willing to pay as much money of teams like UCONN, Memphis, etc. are not going to be included in the tournament? Next round of negotiations probably would not go very well.

I think the P5 definitely do not want to split. Not because of fear of congressional action, that's wishful thinking, as these P5 schools probably have more people in congress than anyone but the Ivies, and the Ivies couldn't care less one way or the other.

But, the basketball tournament is indeed a massive consideration, as the P5 know that the public wants a tournament that includes all of current Division I, not just a P5 tournament, which would be worth significantly less.

That said, it is not a sure thing they won't split. What they want is all of this autonomy but within the structure of the NCAA. And if they can't get that a split may indeed be a better option for them than remaining in the NCAA. So I am not convinced the thread is idle.

The P5 may have more people in congress then the Ivies but the problem is that congress has such a low approval rating that the perception of doing something may help their low ratings in their narrow minds.

Case in point, take a look at the congressional push against the Redskins name. Many of those same congressional members sit and watch the Redskins play every Sunday yet do not care if they are called hypocritical, which they are indeed.