(01-19-2014 01:53 PM)Willie Becton Wrote:  Been to oak court lately? Ugh

One of the nicest areas in Memphis with a mall that is not so nice.

(01-19-2014 06:52 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 01:53 PM)Willie Becton Wrote:  Been to oak court lately? Ugh

One of the nicest areas in Memphis with a mall that is not so nice.

True. When the mall starts catering to a certain clientele with its products, then that clientele is what the mall gets, and the former clientele goes other places.

And that comment is not meant to refer to any certain race; rather, people who shop but have friends who loiter rather than shop, and people who shoplift and steal.

(01-19-2014 09:31 PM)21-17 Best Time I Ever Ha Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 06:52 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 01:53 PM)Willie Becton Wrote:  Been to oak court lately? Ugh

One of the nicest areas in Memphis with a mall that is not so nice.

True. When the mall starts catering to a certain clientele with its products, then that clientele is what the mall gets, and the former clientele goes other places.

And that comment is not meant to refer to any certain race; rather, people who shop but have friends who loiter rather than shop, and people who shoplift and steal.

Weak

(01-19-2014 09:43 PM)dan o Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 09:31 PM)21-17 Best Time I Ever Ha Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 06:52 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 01:53 PM)Willie Becton Wrote:  Been to oak court lately? Ugh

One of the nicest areas in Memphis with a mall that is not so nice.

True. When the mall starts catering to a certain clientele with its products, then that clientele is what the mall gets, and the former clientele goes other places.

And that comment is not meant to refer to any certain race; rather, people who shop but have friends who loiter rather than shop, and people who shoplift and steal.

Weak

Not weak at all. Very true observation. My family had a small business at Oak Court last year. I knew it was risky but the mall office was very flexible with the lease. It was an offshoot of our place at Wolfchase that is very successful. Same products, cheaper prices at Oak Court and it was a bust. Lots of traffic but very few customers. Plenty of people walking around doing nothing, buying nothing and just hanging out. Very reminiscent of the beginning of the end at the Mall of Memphis.

The Mall of Memphis and Hickory Ridge Mall were essentially ruined by white flight. You had various crime incidents that changed the image of the areas. Large groups of residents left Parkway Village and Hickory Hill for places like Cordova and Desoto County. That flight lowered foot traffic, forced better stores to close and be replaced by lesser stores that further lowered foot traffic. It's a tale as old as Memphis itself.

Wolfchase and the Cordova area have always been pegged as the "next Hickory Hill". It will be interesting to see what happens in the next decade or so. There's no doubt that the area isn't as strong in 2014 as it was in 2004. What does it look like in 2024? The problem (which is actually a good thing) is that there is nowhere for the development to go. Wolfchase is surrounded by incorporated muncipalties like Bartlett, Lakeland, and Arlington that will never approve the kind of retail explosion that has been the downfall of so many former unincorporated areas of Memphis (Whitehaven, Parkway Village, HH, now sections of Cordova). There is a similar situation on Winchester near Southwind. That retail has just progressively moved down Winchester for a couple decades. It has now hit the city limits of Germantown and Collierville. Neither city will allow such development to take place within its borders.

Oak Court is more of a result of the national trend of people preferring lifestyle centers over indoor malls. Macy's and Dillard's do great business at Oak Court. The mall itself is a joke. Unlike Mall of Memphis or Hickory Hill, it is located in one of the most established and vibrant areas of the city. It's literally across the street from the most expensive neighborhood in the Memphis metro area. It's not an area primed for a mass exodus or flight. I would think the increasingly diminished rents will force to mall to close and be redeveloped as some sort of mixed use center. Probably condos and office space above ground level retail.

(01-19-2014 02:54 AM)Tigerbert Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 02:18 AM)transitt Wrote:  Remember when Wolfchase was considered the 'good' mall? Before that, Hickory Ridge, Mall of Memphis......

Just curious but what's the "good" mall these days ?

I was a Raleigh-Springs patron back in high school...good mall in its day

Sultan's Castle and a few quarters made a good Saturday.

This is exactly why I don't want Lakeland going thru with the plan to tear down Factory Outlet and build a new open air mall like Collierville. Lakeland is 1 exit from Wolfchase and all the thugs will just come right on out. None of Lakeland's mayoral candidates could give me a straight answer when I asked them "how do you plan to keep the riff raff out if this mall is built"

(01-19-2014 06:02 AM)umbluegray Wrote:  Whether or not shots were fired, the reports are that the suspect were armed.

Even though Simon explicitly posts signs saying weapons are not permitted in the mall.

Can't they freakin' read?

Armed with hammers. No guns, though.

(01-20-2014 09:56 AM)TigerNK Wrote:  The Mall of Memphis and Hickory Ridge Mall were essentially ruined by white flight. You had various crime incidents that changed the image of the areas. Large groups of residents left Parkway Village and Hickory Hill for places like Cordova and Desoto County. That flight lowered foot traffic, forced better stores to close and be replaced by lesser stores that further lowered foot traffic. It's a tale as old as Memphis itself.

Wolfchase and the Cordova area have always been pegged as the "next Hickory Hill". It will be interesting to see what happens in the next decade or so. There's no doubt that the area isn't as strong in 2014 as it was in 2004. What does it look like in 2024? The problem (which is actually a good thing) is that there is nowhere for the development to go. Wolfchase is surrounded by incorporated muncipalties like Bartlett, Lakeland, and Arlington that will never approve the kind of retail explosion that has been the downfall of so many former unincorporated areas of Memphis (Whitehaven, Parkway Village, HH, now sections of Cordova). There is a similar situation on Winchester near Southwind. That retail has just progressively moved down Winchester for a couple decades. It has now hit the city limits of Germantown and Collierville. Neither city will allow such development to take place within its borders.

Oak Court is more of a result of the national trend of people preferring lifestyle centers over indoor malls. Macy's and Dillard's do great business at Oak Court. The mall itself is a joke. Unlike Mall of Memphis or Hickory Hill, it is located in one of the most established and vibrant areas of the city. It's literally across the street from the most expensive neighborhood in the Memphis metro area. It's not an area primed for a mass exodus or flight. I would think the increasingly diminished rents will force to mall to close and be redeveloped as some sort of mixed use center. Probably condos and office space above ground level retail.

Memphis is a victim of its own inept and corrupt government.

(01-20-2014 10:34 AM)TiggerFan Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 02:54 AM)Tigerbert Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 02:18 AM)transitt Wrote:  Remember when Wolfchase was considered the 'good' mall? Before that, Hickory Ridge, Mall of Memphis......

Just curious but what's the "good" mall these days ?

I was a Raleigh-Springs patron back in high school...good mall in its day

Sultan's Castle and a few quarters made a good Saturday.

Man, that takes me back...haha

(01-20-2014 11:23 AM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  This is exactly why I don't want Lakeland going thru with the plan to tear down Factory Outlet and build a new open air mall like Collierville. Lakeland is 1 exit from Wolfchase and all the thugs will just come right on out. None of Lakeland's mayoral candidates could give me a straight answer when I asked them "how do you plan to keep the riff raff out if this mall is built"

If you don't get some retail sales tax going, Lakeland is either gonna have to raise the new property tax or get left behind because its lack of amenities. No city law enforcement, no city fire dept., new school system that needs to be paid for. You can't rely on the county forever to provide needed services. Shelby County tried to put the Sheriff Sub Station in Lakeland but the city leaders wanted no part of it. Multiple squad cars in the area at all times seems like a good idea. You have an awesome mayor and city manager now and they will make some tough choices to undo what the previous leaders did.

(01-20-2014 07:36 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 11:23 AM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  This is exactly why I don't want Lakeland going thru with the plan to tear down Factory Outlet and build a new open air mall like Collierville. Lakeland is 1 exit from Wolfchase and all the thugs will just come right on out. None of Lakeland's mayoral candidates could give me a straight answer when I asked them "how do you plan to keep the riff raff out if this mall is built"

If you don't get some retail sales tax going, Lakeland is either gonna have to raise the new property tax or get left behind because its lack of amenities. No city law enforcement, no city fire dept., new school system that needs to be paid for. You can't rely on the county forever to provide needed services. Shelby County tried to put the Sheriff Sub Station in Lakeland but the city leaders wanted no part of it. Multiple squad cars in the area at all times seems like a good idea. You have an awesome mayor and city manager now and they will make some tough choices to undo what the previous leaders did.

Awesome mayor? If people only knew

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Tapatalk

(01-20-2014 07:36 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  If you don't get some retail sales tax going, Lakeland is either gonna have to raise the new property tax or get left behind because its lack of amenities. No city law enforcement, no city fire dept., new school system that needs to be paid for. You can't rely on the county forever to provide needed services. Shelby County tried to put the Sheriff Sub Station in Lakeland but the city leaders wanted no part of it. Multiple squad cars in the area at all times seems like a good idea. You have an awesome mayor and city manager now and they will make some tough choices to undo what the previous leaders did.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind paying a tad more in property taxes to insulate us from the thugs coming from Memphis and ruining the town. Lakeland taxes would still be much lower than Memphis.

I'm only in Lakeland short term anyway. Both vehicles and student loans paid off. We put everything possible on the AMEX and pay it off every month to recoup the travel miles so no credit card debt. House note, utilities, insurance, cable and cell phones- that's it as far as bills go. Saving as much as I can to move to Fayette County, but I want to be able to buy enough land that I have no neighbors and never have to worry about having any.

(01-21-2014 12:06 PM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 07:36 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  If you don't get some retail sales tax going, Lakeland is either gonna have to raise the new property tax or get left behind because its lack of amenities. No city law enforcement, no city fire dept., new school system that needs to be paid for. You can't rely on the county forever to provide needed services. Shelby County tried to put the Sheriff Sub Station in Lakeland but the city leaders wanted no part of it. Multiple squad cars in the area at all times seems like a good idea. You have an awesome mayor and city manager now and they will make some tough choices to undo what the previous leaders did.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind paying a tad more in property taxes to insulate us from the thugs coming from Memphis and ruining the town. Lakeland taxes would still be much lower than Memphis.

I'm only in Lakeland short term anyway. Both vehicles and student loans paid off. We put everything possible on the AMEX and pay it off every month to recoup the travel miles so no credit card debt. House note, utilities, insurance, cable and cell phones- that's it as far as bills go. Saving as much as I can to move to Fayette County, but I want to be able to buy enough land that I have no neighbors and never have to worry about having any.

You sound like us; this was our plan, too. As it turned out, we have 4 acres in an established subdivision, neighbors 130-150 yards away, which is plenty far enough. About an acre fenced for the dogs, it's pretty awesome, frankly.

(01-21-2014 12:40 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(01-21-2014 12:06 PM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 07:36 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  If you don't get some retail sales tax going, Lakeland is either gonna have to raise the new property tax or get left behind because its lack of amenities. No city law enforcement, no city fire dept., new school system that needs to be paid for. You can't rely on the county forever to provide needed services. Shelby County tried to put the Sheriff Sub Station in Lakeland but the city leaders wanted no part of it. Multiple squad cars in the area at all times seems like a good idea. You have an awesome mayor and city manager now and they will make some tough choices to undo what the previous leaders did.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind paying a tad more in property taxes to insulate us from the thugs coming from Memphis and ruining the town. Lakeland taxes would still be much lower than Memphis.

I'm only in Lakeland short term anyway. Both vehicles and student loans paid off. We put everything possible on the AMEX and pay it off every month to recoup the travel miles so no credit card debt. House note, utilities, insurance, cable and cell phones- that's it as far as bills go. Saving as much as I can to move to Fayette County, but I want to be able to buy enough land that I have no neighbors and never have to worry about having any.

You sound like us; this was our plan, too. As it turned out, we have 4 acres in an established subdivision, neighbors 130-150 yards away, which is plenty far enough. About an acre fenced for the dogs, it's pretty awesome, frankly.

That sounds like my cup of tea

(01-21-2014 01:13 PM)Tigerbert Wrote:  

(01-21-2014 12:40 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(01-21-2014 12:06 PM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 07:36 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  If you don't get some retail sales tax going, Lakeland is either gonna have to raise the new property tax or get left behind because its lack of amenities. No city law enforcement, no city fire dept., new school system that needs to be paid for. You can't rely on the county forever to provide needed services. Shelby County tried to put the Sheriff Sub Station in Lakeland but the city leaders wanted no part of it. Multiple squad cars in the area at all times seems like a good idea. You have an awesome mayor and city manager now and they will make some tough choices to undo what the previous leaders did.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind paying a tad more in property taxes to insulate us from the thugs coming from Memphis and ruining the town. Lakeland taxes would still be much lower than Memphis.

I'm only in Lakeland short term anyway. Both vehicles and student loans paid off. We put everything possible on the AMEX and pay it off every month to recoup the travel miles so no credit card debt. House note, utilities, insurance, cable and cell phones- that's it as far as bills go. Saving as much as I can to move to Fayette County, but I want to be able to buy enough land that I have no neighbors and never have to worry about having any.

You sound like us; this was our plan, too. As it turned out, we have 4 acres in an established subdivision, neighbors 130-150 yards away, which is plenty far enough. About an acre fenced for the dogs, it's pretty awesome, frankly.

That sounds like my cup of tea

Took the dogs for a final outing last night about 11:30...could see every star in the sky perfectly. The Big Dipper is bright in the northeast sky, it's amazing.

a far cry from the wolfchase ghetto

(01-19-2014 11:22 AM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 10:38 AM)72Tiger Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 10:28 AM)dan o Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 02:54 AM)Tigerbert Wrote:  

(01-19-2014 02:18 AM)transitt Wrote:  Remember when Wolfchase was considered the 'good' mall? Before that, Hickory Ridge, Mall of Memphis......

Just curious but what's the "good" mall these days ?

I was a Raleigh-Springs patron back in high school...good mall in its day

Malls are neighborhood wreckers

Malls and apartment complexes.

The people are what kill neighborhoods. If people in general would have some self control and respect for others, things would be way different. It is the low life selfish people that kill society and neighborhoods. As in most instances, the few mess it up for the rest of us.

That is a good analogy for this message board.

(01-21-2014 12:06 PM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 07:36 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  If you don't get some retail sales tax going, Lakeland is either gonna have to raise the new property tax or get left behind because its lack of amenities. No city law enforcement, no city fire dept., new school system that needs to be paid for. You can't rely on the county forever to provide needed services. Shelby County tried to put the Sheriff Sub Station in Lakeland but the city leaders wanted no part of it. Multiple squad cars in the area at all times seems like a good idea. You have an awesome mayor and city manager now and they will make some tough choices to undo what the previous leaders did.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind paying a tad more in property taxes to insulate us from the thugs coming from Memphis and ruining the town. Lakeland taxes would still be much lower than Memphis.

I'm only in Lakeland short term anyway. Both vehicles and student loans paid off. We put everything possible on the AMEX and pay it off every month to recoup the travel miles so no credit card debt. House note, utilities, insurance, cable and cell phones- that's it as far as bills go. Saving as much as I can to move to Fayette County, but I want to be able to buy enough land that I have no neighbors and never have to worry about having any.

It's nice. I grew up like that (not Fayette County). What's funny is that both my brother and I now don't want anything to do with living in the country, especially him since he's currently in Seattle and in the past Houston and LA.

(01-21-2014 12:06 PM)MemphisTiger15 Wrote:  

(01-20-2014 07:36 PM)Sheldon Cooper Wrote:  If you don't get some retail sales tax going, Lakeland is either gonna have to raise the new property tax or get left behind because its lack of amenities. No city law enforcement, no city fire dept., new school system that needs to be paid for. You can't rely on the county forever to provide needed services. Shelby County tried to put the Sheriff Sub Station in Lakeland but the city leaders wanted no part of it. Multiple squad cars in the area at all times seems like a good idea. You have an awesome mayor and city manager now and they will make some tough choices to undo what the previous leaders did.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind paying a tad more in property taxes to insulate us from the thugs coming from Memphis and ruining the town. Lakeland taxes would still be much lower than Memphis.

I'm only in Lakeland short term anyway. Both vehicles and student loans paid off. We put everything possible on the AMEX and pay it off every month to recoup the travel miles so no credit card debt. House note, utilities, insurance, cable and cell phones- that's it as far as bills go. Saving as much as I can to move to Fayette County, but I want to be able to buy enough land that I have no neighbors and never have to worry about having any.

I don't get people like you. To each his own, I guess.