With rumors circling that the Big 12 may take Cincinnati and UCF, I think it's interesting to look at the difference between USF and UCF.

Attendance - 2012
Central - FB 35k BB 4523
Southern - FB 44k BB 5389

Director's Cup 2011-12 / 2012-13
Central - 55 / 67
Southern - 76 / 84

Football record in D-1A thru 2013
Central - 117-100 (.539)
Southern - 86-71 (.547)

Student Body / Living Alumni
Central - 60k
Southern - 47k /

Endowment
Central - $123 million
Southern - $335 million

Research Funding & Rank
Central - $109 million (141st)
Southern - $394 million (53rd in USA, and 2nd in Florida)

Academic Ranking - Leiden ranking (P-ranking) & rank in 14-team Big 12 with UC & BYU
Central - 101 (7th)
Southern - 74 (5th)

Founding Date
Central - 1963, playing D1A since 1996
Southern - 1956, playing D1A since 2001

To me, there's not much difference. USF has more fan support and is better academically, but UCF has better athletic facilities and is slightly bigger. My guess is that the Big 12 sees the choice as a tossup, with maybe an edge to UCF to get the media to praise the pick (aka the What Have You Done For Me Lately crowd).

And here's the important thing to remember: If the Big 12 sees it as a tossup, this doesn't mean that they'll take both. The Big 12 will add based on what is good for them, not on what is "fair" to whoever gets left behind. If they want 12 and BYU says no, they'll take Cincinnati and do a coin flip between UCF/USF.

NOt even a close call in my opinion. UCF is the team of the future. They have the resources and the "it" factor to drive them to a very successful future. USF? Hey, I like the school, it's my home town school, but I've never been able to warm up to them. Yeah, they win an occasional marquee game, but they have consistently underperformed against expectations since they "arrived in the Big East/AAC."

(12-12-2013 01:12 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  With rumors circling that the Big 12 may take Cincinnati and UCF, I think it's interesting to look at the difference between USF and UCF.

Attendance - 2012
Central - FB 35k BB 4523
Southern - FB 44k BB 5389

Director's Cup 2011-12 / 2012-13
Central - 55 / 67
Southern - 76 / 84

Football record in D-1A thru 2013
Central - 117-100 (.539)
Southern - 86-71 (.547)

Student Body / Living Alumni
Central - 60k
Southern - 47k /

Endowment
Central - $123 million
Southern - $335 million

Research Funding & Rank
Central - $109 million (141st)
Southern - $394 million (53rd in USA, and 2nd in Florida)

Academic Ranking - Leiden ranking (P-ranking) & rank in 14-team Big 12 with UC & BYU
Central - 101 (7th)
Southern - 74 (5th)

Founding Date
Central - 1963, playing D1A since 1996
Southern - 1956, playing D1A since 2001

To me, there's not much difference. USF has more fan support and is better academically, but UCF has better athletic facilities and is slightly bigger. My guess is that the Big 12 sees the choice as a tossup, with maybe an edge to UCF to get the media to praise the pick (aka the What Have You Done For Me Lately crowd).

And here's the important thing to remember: If the Big 12 sees it as a tossup, this doesn't mean that they'll take both. The Big 12 will add based on what is good for them, not on what is "fair" to whoever gets left behind. If they want 12 and BYU says no, they'll take Cincinnati and do a coin flip between UCF/USF.

What rumors? I have not heard any of that where I live......in the heart of Big12 country. I know Cincy fans are desperate to get in the Big12, but don't think posting on a message board will change anything.

(12-12-2013 01:23 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  What rumors? I have not heard any of that where I live......in the heart of Big12 country. I know Cincy fans are desperate to get in the Big12, but don't think posting on a message board will change anything.

^ This.

Who is Southern? I know a South Florida, but no Southern Florida.

(12-12-2013 01:23 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  What rumors? I have not heard any of that where I live......in the heart of Big12 country. I know Cincy fans are desperate to get in the Big12, but don't think posting on a message board will change anything.

Dude, the PURPOSE of this board is as a place for desperate fans from left-out schools to air baseless, speculative rumors about some Power conference looking to expand and Hey, Here's Why it Will Be My School that gets The Call.

(12-12-2013 01:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-12-2013 01:23 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  What rumors? I have not heard any of that where I live......in the heart of Big12 country. I know Cincy fans are desperate to get in the Big12, but don't think posting on a message board will change anything.

Dude, the PURPOSE of this board is as a place for desperate fans from left-out schools to air baseless, speculative rumors about some Power conference looking to expand and Hey, Here's Why it Will Be My School that gets The Call.

That's not the purpose of this board at all. Although that's what many seem to think. But the real purpose of this board is to speculate about what possible moves there might be in any expansion scenarios, or to discussion the implications of moves that have already been made.

But this board was not created to give those who feel left out a place to advertise for their chosen school. But there are a bunch of people, yourself included it seems, that feel that that is the sole purpose of this board. It isn't.

(12-12-2013 01:12 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  With rumors circling that the Big 12 may take Cincinnati and UCF, I think it's interesting to look at the difference between USF and UCF.

Attendance - 2012
Central - FB 35k BB 4523
Southern - FB 44k BB 5389

Director's Cup 2011-12 / 2012-13
Central - 55 / 67
Southern - 76 / 84

Football record in D-1A thru 2013
Central - 117-100 (.539)
Southern - 86-71 (.547)

Student Body / Living Alumni
Central - 60k
Southern - 47k /

Endowment
Central - $123 million
Southern - $335 million

Research Funding & Rank
Central - $109 million (141st)
Southern - $394 million (53rd in USA, and 2nd in Florida)

Academic Ranking - Leiden ranking (P-ranking) & rank in 14-team Big 12 with UC & BYU
Central - 101 (7th)
Southern - 74 (5th)

Founding Date
Central - 1963, playing D1A since 1996
Southern - 1956, playing D1A since 2001

To me, there's not much difference. USF has more fan support and is better academically, but UCF has better athletic facilities and is slightly bigger. My guess is that the Big 12 sees the choice as a tossup, with maybe an edge to UCF to get the media to praise the pick (aka the What Have You Done For Me Lately crowd).

And here's the important thing to remember: If the Big 12 sees it as a tossup, this doesn't mean that they'll take both. The Big 12 will add based on what is good for them, not on what is "fair" to whoever gets left behind. If they want 12 and BYU says no, they'll take Cincinnati and do a coin flip between UCF/USF.

Dude, what about more important criterion such as TV ratings, OCS, and on the field performance. TV ratings UCF hands down, OCS UCF hands down, on the field performance UCF hands down. Surely the B12 would overlook these non-important elements. Head to Head between USF and UCF it's UCF hands down. In fact the only thing worthy of mention that USF formally had was inclusion in a AQ conference, now that's gone. UCF wins this "toss-up" hands down. Further UCF is situated in Orlando, and USF in Tampa. UCF has no pro-team to compete with in the city in which the University is located, USF competes with the Tampa Bay Bucs (hell they play in their stadium as USF has no OCS). 2013 attendance is just over 42K for UCF, might also want to use current figures when available. I still don't see why it's interesting to compare the two, the rumors don't even involve USF, but rather UC and UCF.

I would take UCF and that was even before their dream season. I'm strongly against teams that play their home games in off campus rented NFL stadiums.

I think the conclusion to draw from this:

if the b12 wants to do this right.......take both schools

I am a huge proponent of these 2 schools to the b12 because WVU needs a florida school much more than it needs an ohio school

UCF. I have been to three Tulsa/UCF games. Orlando, a big city in my books, has a small college town atmosphere surrounding and supporting UCF. UCF is "their" (Orlando's) university. This is what I saw and felt while attending those three games, as I mingled and encountered UCF fans.

IF B12 is to add two schools, I would go UCF and USF.

Actually, the rumor I read and hear the most is still BYU and Cincinnati.

(12-12-2013 02:23 PM)Tallgrass Wrote:  UCF. I have been to three Tulsa/UCF games. Orlando, a big city in my books, has a small college town atmosphere surrounding and supporting UCF. UCF is "their" (Orlando's) university.

There is more interest in the Gators, and even more interest in the Seminoles, in Orlando than there is in UCF. UCF "owns" Orlando like Temple owns Philly.

I think UCF has way more upside than USF because the Knights don't have a pro football team to compete with. The Bulls will always be second fiddle to the Bucs but Central Florida will eventually be top dog in Orlando if they keep winning.

(12-12-2013 01:34 PM)CoogNellie Wrote:  Who is Southern? I know a South Florida, but no Southern Florida.

(12-12-2013 02:51 PM)Bull Wrote:  

(12-12-2013 01:34 PM)CoogNellie Wrote:  Who is Southern? I know a South Florida, but no Southern Florida.

looks like the ECU debate all over again

Yeah, literally nobody is talking about adding either directional Florida school down here.

(12-12-2013 03:08 PM)10thMountain Wrote:  Yeah, literally nobody is talking about adding either directional Florida school down here.

as an aggie fan you must love this

(12-12-2013 02:13 PM)john01992 Wrote:  I think the conclusion to draw from this:

if the b12 wants to do this right.......take both schools

I am a huge proponent of these 2 schools to the b12 because WVU needs a florida school much more than it needs an ohio school

I do not think the Big12 cares much what WVU needs. WVU knew coming in they would be on an island.

If I were UCF I would immediately change my name to the University of Orlando. I truly think that would be a smart move for that university as it would greatly differentiate them from USF from a branding perspective.