(11-10-2011 04:58 AM)etsubuc Wrote:  For the way they treated that man, I hope they never win another bowl game. And they need to fire that former GA also.

If I were a student at Penn St., I would likely transfer. If I were a faculty member under any school which that Board of Trustees is over, I would without a doubt switch jobs. And If I am a college president over a school that currently does not have football- the prospect of being good at academics but get fired because of something that an assistant football coach did, I would never bring football to that institution.

In all of this- none of the attention has been on the actual child rapist or the victims.

How THEY treated the man? get real he knew about a child molester, if his bosses didn't do anything he should have went to the police himself, not shrugging it off saying I did my job. No you didn't. The President of the Unversity lost his job, I am sure if that GA still has anything to do with Penn St he won't last either.

BTW if you are going to make such stupid posts like this PLEASE change you name to something else, you are embarrassing the hell out of me and I am sure all the ETSU alumni on this board with you comments and to have you screenname etsubuc makes me cringe.

Sorry, I simply have a minority opinion on this issue.

I never said that he didnt have a moral responsibility to do something more than he did- and I think that Paterno clearly realizes that after knowing what he does now. I just didnt see the harm in letting him finish this season. He has been a great ambassador for that university for decades, he is not a current danger to anyone, and I think he had earned the ability to coach 3 more games and retire.

But people are getting carried away with his moral responsibility also- if it is that great of a moral responsibility then make it a legal responsibility. Change the law. The fact is that he heard hearsay evidence. The bigger moral responsibility is with the GA who actually saw it.

(11-10-2011 07:31 AM)etsubuc Wrote:  Sorry, I simply have a minority opinion on this issue.

I never said that he didnt have a moral responsibility to do something more than he did- and I think that Paterno clearly realizes that after knowing what he does now. I just didnt see the harm in letting him finish this season. He has been a great ambassador for that university for decades, he is not a current danger to anyone, and I think he had earned the ability to coach 3 more games and retire.

But people are getting carried away with his moral responsibility also- if it is that great of a moral responsibility then make it a legal responsibility. Change the law. The fact is that he heard hearsay evidence. The bigger moral responsibility is with the GA who actually saw it.

you are wrong...on many levels.

(11-10-2011 07:31 AM)etsubuc Wrote:  Sorry, I simply have a minority opinion on this issue.

I never said that he didnt have a moral responsibility to do something more than he did- and I think that Paterno clearly realizes that after knowing what he does now. I just didnt see the harm in letting him finish this season. He has been a great ambassador for that university for decades, he is not a current danger to anyone, and I think he had earned the ability to coach 3 more games and retire.

But people are getting carried away with his moral responsibility also- if it is that great of a moral responsibility then make it a legal responsibility. Change the law. The fact is that he heard hearsay evidence. The bigger moral responsibility is with the GA who actually saw it.

I can understand how you are so upset by all this, I know too many Penn State people who actually KNOW Coach Paterno and Coach Sandusky and Tim Curley who are devastated. These are men who knew and trusted these men to do the right things and one of those things would be to PROTECT CHILDREN and not destroy them. I am just full of RAGE because these are men that we look to to guide and set examples.

If we intend to hold the Athletes to a "higher standard" then how do we not hold those who educate, guide, and support those Athletes to an even higher standard?? I've felt in my gut all along that Paterno knew more than he was saying. He may not have had a LEGAL obligation beyond reporting by state law, but under federal law (Cleary Act) he is directly reponsible for reporting the alleged crime straight to the Campus Police. He has 48 hours to do so. The Federal Investigation could cost Penn State MILLIONS. The institution will pay the price because the people who had a fidicuary responsibility to run the University were more worried about the image of the BRAND and protecting Joe Pa's legacy than the children who were being raped.

Joe Paterno, who has been one of my hero's for demanding that his players are good students and good people, is treated like a God on that campus. I hate to see the old man go down in flames but honestly, this is so far beyond booster's influencing recruits or a tutor helping to write papers or getting a free tat. We are talking about a massive cover-up of CHILD RAPE. ON-GOING Child RAPE!

I have no doubt the 1999 retirement was the beginning of the cover-up after the 1998 allegations. Then to allow this animal to continue having access to the University and Athletics is just beyond reason. Jo Pa was having his picture made with someone that he KNEW was raping children. You can't blame his age (would Paterno have been 70-something??) these were GROWN MEN who allowed a known child molester to hang around.

CRAP, I'd rather have 100 NCAA violations to deal with than to have to live with knowing that I'd allowed a rapist to continue to roam the hallways.

And now, we'll be finding out how deep this thing ran, more people will be implicated. If I were associated with The Second Mile, I'd hire a lawyer now.

As far as a President not bringing back football because of THIS?? Is that even logical?? The President lost his job because HE HELPED COVER IT UP or ignored it all together. There is no correlation between having a football program and a President's hesitancy because of the Penn State Child Rape situation. None. If you run a clean program and demand that people follow the law and hold them accountable for doing their jobs and ELIMINATE THEM WHEN THEY DON'T DO THEIR JOBS, you get to keep yours.

It's like saying that if ETSU's AD covered up a criminal act, acted on his own to permit the cover-up, was invovled in the cover up, BUT never informed his boss that the President would be held accountable. I'd stand behind that President in that case, BUT if he knew and he just told the AD to "make it go away" then it's a whole new ballgame.

Although I'm SURE nothing like that has ever happened at ETSU.

Surely this can't be true, can it?

Sandusky Rumor

Penn State is in the the middle of a PR blitz, this is the first thing the University has done that has actually scored them points in the mind of the public. That it came at the expense of Paterno is unfortunate but necessary.

I agree with Mommybear, if you are going to hold others to a high standard you damn well better hold yourself to one as well.

I may have my facts wrong- and if so please tell me. Do we know (not just assume) that the President knew about this. If he covered it up, he should have been fired. IF he did not know, he should not be held responsible simply because he is the President of the University as a way for the Board of Trustees to appear that they are being tough on the crime.

And make no mistake- If Paterno knew the details about the child rape I would be in favor of him being fired immediately. The news report that I heard (I have not been spending hours looking up every news report) was that he was told of improper sexual conduct but not details. I dont make an immediate assumption that that is not correct unless it comes out otherwise. Details matter in this case- and 10 years later everyone know the details.

I would like to see Paterno speak (more than soundbites in front of his house) and take questions. He was prevented from doing so by the University- but he is no longer an employee and if I were him I would go public and tell his side.

Do I have any of the above facts wrong about Paterno's and the PResidents knowledge? I may indeed because it has not consumed my last couple days, but I would look for evidence and not just speculation that "how did the president not know?", etc.

(11-10-2011 11:09 AM)etsubuc Wrote:  I may have my facts wrong- and if so please tell me. Do we know (not just assume) that the President knew about this. If he covered it up, he should have been fired. IF he did not know, he should not be held responsible simply because he is the President of the University as a way for the Board of Trustees to appear that they are being tough on the crime.

And make no mistake- If Paterno knew the details about the child rape I would be in favor of him being fired immediately. The news report that I heard (I have not been spending hours looking up every news report) was that he was told of improper sexual conduct but not details. I dont make an immediate assumption that that is not correct unless it comes out otherwise. Details matter in this case- and 10 years later everyone know the details.

I would like to see Paterno speak (more than soundbites in front of his house) and take questions. He was prevented from doing so by the University- but he is no longer an employee and if I were him I would go public and tell his side.

Do I have any of the above facts wrong about Paterno's and the PResidents knowledge? I may indeed because it has not consumed my last couple days, but I would look for evidence and not just speculation that "how did the president not know?", etc.

Let me ask you this, why do you think Sandusky retired in 1998 at the age of 55?

(11-10-2011 10:58 AM)etsuBucsFan1988 Wrote:  Surely this can't be true, can it?

Sandusky Rumor

this is just my opinion, but it seems to me that the repeated brazen acts in the wide open, suggests to me that sandusky knew he had cover from somewhere higher than Joe Pa and the football program at PSU. I know child predators can be this way, but sandusky had no regard for being caught, even after being caught multiple times. not saying the rumor is true, but one has to think. How about the DA that chose not to charge sandusky after the first incident, then disappears some years later never to be found. Gricar is his name, look him up. All they found was his car and a computer that had the hard drive removed. Joe Pa is powerful, but not that powerful. This thing has the ability to not just be a bombshell, but go nuclear. I would not be suprised if sandusky winds up dead, one way or the other.

(11-10-2011 10:58 AM)etsuBucsFan1988 Wrote:  Surely this can't be true, can it?

Sandusky Rumor

One of my Penn State friends called me this morning, he said this was coming. We've discussed the missing DA on the AppState board also. It's all VERY fishy. I think we've just seen the tip of the iceberg, I agree that Sandusky continued to walk around in a blatant display after he was 'retired' because he thought he was untouchable ... PROBABLY because he knew they'd covered him before and PROBABLY because he had more dirt.

Child trafficking shouldn't surprise anyone who works around pedifiles. Most of these sick bastards are part of very elaborate, very organized, very well funded systems. The LAMBDA Man-Boy Love group will tell you it's not a crime. People who are involved in investigating these crimes will tell you how hard it is to crack the seal on these "rings"...

We may be in for more of a shock than we've already had.

And yes, etsubuc, sometimes everyone's heads have to roll when YOU and others were directly or indirectly involved in the cover up. The Buck stops HERE. JoPaterno is probably much more powerful than most people in political office in Pennsylvania, if he'd snapped his fingers in 1998 or in 2002, it would have ended, but for whatever reason, he didn't. They might have "insulated" him for whatever reason *much the same way Bowden was protected and insulated* but he had an obligation to know why he reported something this awful and still sees the guy walking around his building and taking showers in the lockerroom.

I too, want to hear what he has to say but my support of his termination stands, as much as I hate it, he failed.

From what I keep hearing, things like ongoing cover up, child prostitution, child pornography, etc... are all involved in this, and it's more than just Sandusky.
Hell is not hot enough for the people involved in this, the ones who committed the acts and the ones who did NOTHING because he was their friend.
Read the report etsubuc and that should clear up a few things. McQueary should be fired, but Penn State is so afraid of what he could say and possible civil litigation it's ridiculous. I say have his ass arrested for obstructing justice and some sort of conspiracy charge. It's hard to coach a football game from the graybar hotel, and prison is where he belongs.