Non-answer.

Memphis is the exception, not the rule, or maybe you would like to list all of the schools and administrators who will OPENLY TELL YOU that football drives the train, and without it they don't have what they have.
Also the bottom line is Memphis is still playing in the Pyramid if not for the Grizzlies. The fact is Tiger High doesn't have a prayer at getting out of C-USA until their football is better. The Big East needs solid football playing schools who have more than 4500 fans in attendance, and while it's real nice that your basketball is good right now, what happens when Pastner leaves for more money and a BCS conference school? Comparing Memphis and ETSU is a laugh, it's two COMPLETELY different situations right now. Oh, and what happens when C-USA splits up? Memphis is one bad hire away from being Jacksonville.

(12-18-2009 12:03 PM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  Memphis is the exception, not the rule, or maybe you would like to list all of the schools and administrators who will OPENLY TELL YOU that football drives the train, and without it they don't have what they have.

I guess you would have to clarify the statement "football drives the train". Since very few football programs make money, it can't be the profit motive. I agree that the 20, 30, or 40 college football programs that make money, are in a great position. The biggest one being their football programs don't send them to the poor house. Sadly ETSU will never be one of those.

So yes I would like a list of athletic departments that make money and football programs that do so. In a recent print USA Today, it stated in the athletic section that only like 25 (don't remember the exact number) college athletic programs make money. Since football is by far the most expensive it would generally follow that the problem is those schools execessive spending on said sport.

Your fantasy that just because football stadiums hold a lot of people, so they must make bunches of money, is just wrong.

(12-18-2009 12:03 PM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  Also the bottom line is Memphis is still playing in the Pyramid if not for the Grizzlies.

The Pyramid only opened in 91, it's not that old, and is a great arena. I was there for the first game in the Pyramid, I think it was the one where the brought Tom II out on the court for his first appearance. He was a kitten and Cybil Shepard brought him out on a leash. Penny was playing then so it was pretty exciting. Some people thought that it was a bad idea not to play there. The deal was in order to get the Forum built the tigers had to play there. The grizzlies made it a financial wash to do it. While the Pyramid holds more people (20K vs 18K), and I think has better sight lines for more people, the Forum is MUCH nicer. While I liked the school atmosphere of the Pyramid, the seats didn't have much leg room, the seats in the Forum have more, so that was a big plus for me. While I thought it was too soon to move to the Forum, it still had that new arena smell, I understand the move. My biggest issue with the Pyramid was where it was built, they built it "down town" next to the river, and that is terrible for many people to go to a game. It should have been built near the Liberty Bowl, which is close to dead center of Memphis.

Interesting story: Penny was a student and on campus when I was going to school in Memphis. I can remember seeing him walk around on campus, etc. One day I was at the HYPER, similar to ETSU's CPA, and in the basketball gym an intramural game was going on. This gym had pull out bleachers like a HS, and usually maybe 10 people watching the games. When I walked in it was PACKED, standing room only. I asked someone what was going on they pointed to the court and said Hardaway was playing. Since Penny was a prop 48 he couldn't play or practice his freshman year, but could play intramural. So, his team was playing Sigma Chi. Talk about fun, it was like watching the globetrotters play a Jr. High team.

I don't know what you are trying to say, but I would gladly go back to playing games in the Pyramid.

(12-18-2009 12:03 PM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  The fact is Tiger High doesn't have a prayer at getting out of C-USA until their football is better. The Big East needs solid football playing schools who have more than 4500 fans in attendance, and while it's real nice that your basketball is good right now, what happens when Pastner leaves for more money and a BCS conference school? Comparing Memphis and ETSU is a laugh, it's two COMPLETELY different situations right now. Oh, and what happens when C-USA splits up? Memphis is one bad hire away from being Jacksonville.

I agree that until Memphis' football is better they will have trouble getting out of CUSA. CUSA sucks for basketball. The last thing the big east needs is another good basketball school, so they don't need Memphis. Memphis lost their two historic basketball rivials Louisivlle, Cincy which sucks. They still have UAB which would be, I guess, next unless you put UT in front of UAB?

I don't know where you get your attendance information but U of M normally has 25-30K for football games, which looks really pitiful in the 65K seat Liberty Bowl. With that attendance the football program still loses 2 mil a year.

The basketball program normally makes about 2 mil a year so it washes with football. The program is going to experience a down year, no doubt, they only have 7-8 scholarship players, but help is on the way, since they currently have the number 1 recruiting class coming in. So they will be OK.

Yes the football program would be in trouble if the basketball "cash cow" stops giving milk, but it is OK right now.

I'm not sure how old you are, but it seems you aren't very old? Memphis has had, will always have good basketball. You just don't understand, it goes all the way back to at least the early 70s and the final four with Walton's UCLA. You have no idea of the money that is available for basketball there. Calapari left because of sanctions and the lure of KY, not because of money. Cal was already making around 3 mil a year (I think) and from what I have read Memphis actually topped what KY offered, but he turned it down. So if Pastner leaves, they will replace him with a good coach. They had 14-15K for Memphis Madness, so really you have NO idea.

Uh, Northeast, we had posted totals that Memphis football draws the second most fans in C-USA. And it's in the mid-30s, not the mid to low 20s.

The thing is, a crowd of 35,000 isn't bad for a college football game, and I somehow am scratching my head as to why people on here think it is.

The Big East, if a space opened up, would be interested in another strong basketball program. What's your logic here? Any conference would like to get bigger and better.

Of course, there is the mindset that Memphis wouldn't be invited because of their propensity to cheat, but regardless.

(12-19-2009 07:44 AM)PittsburghBucs Wrote:  Uh, Northeast, we had posted totals that Memphis football draws the second most fans in C-USA. And it's in the mid-30s, not the mid to low 20s.

The thing is, a crowd of 35,000 isn't bad for a college football game, and I somehow am scratching my head as to why people on here think it is.

I was understating the attendance figures on purpose, because I know that the numbers have really went down this year, but I didn't want to take the time to look up how much. You are right, until this year, and for the last 5-6 years attendance for football has been around 35K. That is a little misleading because the UTK and Ole Miss games push up the average.

(12-19-2009 07:44 AM)PittsburghBucs Wrote:  The Big East, if a space opened up, would be interested in another strong basketball program. What's your logic here? Any conference would like to get bigger and better.

I'm not saying they wouldn't pick Memphis, only if I were them, I would pick someone with a better football program. They already have the strongest basketball league. I actually think the basketball competition is too strong, their teams are getting their heads beat in, in conference play and by the end of the season they have nothing left for the NCAA tournament. The last three seasons Memphis has had great teams, but they still won a lot of those games because of weak conference play. Calapari, didn't start to do well in CUSA until Louisville, Cincinnati, DePaul and Marquette were gone. The weak conference play, made Memphis as fresh as daisy's going into the tournament.

Memphis' football is weak, and attendance would be near the bottom of the conference. I think football attendance would go up if they were in the big east, some, but because the team wouldn't be able to win, it wouldn't go real high.

Like I said, maybe Memphis is it, but I wouldn't pick them, they don't need another strong basketball program, and they don't need a weak football program. IMHO of course.