Well guys I am glad to see you all here. Steve, Trip, Paul, I've been studying some of the legal web sites, reading pleadings and getting familiar with the lingo. Whereas Republicans in office are almost 90% businessmen, Democrats are overwhelmingly Lawyers. Does this indicate where we are headed today.

On a personal note, the twins are in their 24th week of development. So far so good. It’s cost about 30 large so far. One boy, one girl, hopefully sometime late Jan. or Feb. Both Families are all excited and ecstatic over the progress. Mother is a real trooper and doing well also. She is being well taken care of, if she sneezes, there is someone there to hand her a hankie. Her 2 sisters, who only have 1 grown child between then, are very involved.

The question here, to try to distill this to those who did not read or understand the original post, Steve you do such a better job of that than me, is Obama’s Natural Born Status. You must understand that the immigration laws have changes slightly from when Obama was born in 1961. Today, thanks to Regan, If you are born in the US, you are a citizen. Anchor Baby Policy. In 1961, being Obama’s father was not a citizen; it fell on the 18 Year old mother to pass American Citizenship to her son. In short, she is not able to pass citizenship to Obama because she did not meet the requirements.

Next, why won’t Obama just come forth with the original Certificate of Live Birth? (COL) The document he has posted is not a COL, instead a forged summary probably his sisters. No Doctors, No witness, No dates or times, No footprint, No Hospital, Nothing to verify where and if he was born in Hawaii. Instead he has filed in court, Motion to Dismiss after Motion to Dismiss to delay the access to his documents. WHY? Why won’t he just come forward and end the controversy. It doesn’t pass the smell test.

Next, Obama’s grandmother says she witnessed Obama’s birth in Kenya. His mother arrived in Hawaii a few days later with Obama in tow.
Next, Later Obama went to Indonesia when his mother remarried. IF, a big IF, he was a citizen of the US he surrendered it to become an Indonesian citizen to go to school there, an Indonesian requirement. He could come back to the US and reapply for citizenship, but he would become a naturalized citizen, and does not meet the Constitutional requirement of a Natural Born Citizen. But he did not do that either. Dual Citizenship disqualifies him from being president.

Yes, questioning if Obama meets the Constitutional requirement to be president is patriotic, just as those who think "America is a downright mean country” or "NO, no, no, Not G_d Bless America, G_d D@mn America" , even whose love affair of all things democratic and all things Obama are patriotic as well. Misplaced as they maybe.





Why does this YouTube Insert not work?

firmbizzle Wrote:Why are you trying to tear down our president? We are in the middle of an economic crisis, and this is what you are worried about?

Here's a tip. Bush is the president.

I thought Obama's mother was an U.S. citizen. If so, why does it matter where he was born? I thought you had to be an U.S. Citizen, not that you have to be born on U.S. soil. What am I missing here?

uhmump95 Wrote:I thought Obama's mother was an U.S. citizen. If so, why does it matter where he was born? I thought you had to be an U.S. Citizen, not that you have to be born on U.S. soil. What am I missing here?

As I said above, The laws changed during the Regan Administration about 1984.

According to U.S. law pertaining to births from “Dec. 24, 1952, to Nov.13, 1986,” in order to register the child’s birth as a U.S. natural-born citizen at the time of Obama’s birth, he or she must be: 1. Born to two U.S. citizen parents; OR 2. If only one parent was a U.S. citizen at the time of the birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least 10 years, at least five of which must be after the age of 14.

uhmump95 Wrote:I thought Obama's mother was an U.S. citizen. If so, why does it matter where he was born? I thought you had to be an U.S. Citizen, not that you have to be born on U.S. soil. What am I missing here?

I think it goes like this....1) born on US soil regardless of your parents status...2) born to US citizens(both) even abroad..(dual citizenship)

McCain was born on a Military base abroad(US territory) to US citizens. He qualifies both ways.

Obama seems to have been born on US soil in Hawaii...qualifies on that count. If he was not born on US soil...he would not be eligible since his father was not a US citizen.

I'm afraid that regardless of the technicality....Barack Obama is not going to be denied the Presidency on this issue.

So the Constitution is just a technicality?

SumOfAllFears Wrote:So the Constitution is just a technicality?

Well where have you been? As if these tyrants give a $hit about a piece of paper!!

Hey....I'm the most pro constitution person you will ever encounter...but...I know damn well the thugs in power dont care about it one bit. It has been stomped on and disregarded so many times by both the red and blue gangs that they should just go ahead and wipe their asses with it.

Im with you....That why I said let the SCOTUS sort this out..I just have not reason to believe anything will come of it all.

SumOfAllFears Wrote:Well guys I am glad to see you all here. Steve, Trip, Paul, I've been studying some of the legal web sites, reading pleadings and getting familiar with the lingo. Whereas Republicans in office are almost 90% businessmen, Democrats are overwhelmingly Lawyers. Does this indicate where we are headed today.

On a personal note, the twins are in their 24th week of development. So far so good. It’s cost about 30 large so far. One boy, one girl, hopefully sometime late Jan. or Feb. Both Families are all excited and ecstatic over the progress. Mother is a real trooper and doing well also. She is being well taken care of, if she sneezes, there is someone there to hand her a hankie. Her 2 sisters, who only have 1 grown child between then, are very involved.

The question here, to try to distill this to those who did not read or understand the original post, Steve you do such a better job of that than me, is Obama’s Natural Born Status. You must understand that the immigration laws have changes slightly from when Obama was born in 1961. Today, thanks to Regan, If you are born in the US, you are a citizen. Anchor Baby Policy. In 1961, being Obama’s father was not a citizen; it fell on the 18 Year old mother to pass American Citizenship to her son. In short, she is not able to pass citizenship to Obama because she did not meet the requirements.

Next, why won’t Obama just come forth with the original Certificate of Live Birth? (COL) The document he has posted is not a COL, instead a forged summary probably his sisters. No Doctors, No witness, No dates or times, No footprint, No Hospital, Nothing to verify where and if he was born in Hawaii. Instead he has filed in court, Motion to Dismiss after Motion to Dismiss to delay the access to his documents. WHY? Why won’t he just come forward and end the controversy. It doesn’t pass the smell test.

Next, Obama’s grandmother says she witnessed Obama’s birth in Kenya. His mother arrived in Hawaii a few days later with Obama in tow.
Next, Later Obama went to Indonesia when his mother remarried. IF, a big IF, he was a citizen of the US he surrendered it to become an Indonesian citizen to go to school there, an Indonesian requirement. He could come back to the US and reapply for citizenship, but he would become a naturalized citizen, and does not meet the Constitutional requirement of a Natural Born Citizen. But he did not do that either. Dual Citizenship disqualifies him from being president.

Yes, questioning if Obama meets the Constitutional requirement to be president is patriotic, just as those who think "America is a downright mean country” or "NO, no, no, Not G_d Bless America, G_d D@mn America" , even whose love affair of all things democratic and all things Obama are patriotic as well. Misplaced as they maybe.

Code:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDIVEfVGLBQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03_ZHGAJxSQ&feature=related

Why does this YouTube Insert not work?

Fixed it for ya.

Fo Shizzle Wrote:I'm afraid that regardless of the technicality....Barack Obama is not going to be denied the Presidency on this issue.

The Secret Service will take care of these clowns.

Fo Shizzle:ncaabbs: Wrote:

SumOfAllFears Wrote:So the Constitution is just a technicality?

Well where have you been? As if these tyrants give a $hit about a piece of paper!!

Hey....I'm the most pro constitution person you will ever encounter...but...I know damn well the thugs in power dont care about it one bit. It has been stomped on and disregarded so many times by both the red and blue gangs that they should just go ahead and wipe their asses with it.

What is the constitution?

SumOfAllFears Wrote:On a personal note, the twins are in their 24th week of development. So far so good. It’s cost about 30 large so far. One boy, one girl, hopefully sometime late Jan. or Feb. Both Families are all excited and ecstatic over the progress. Mother is a real trooper and doing well also. She is being well taken care of, if she sneezes, there is someone there to hand her a hankie. Her 2 sisters, who only have 1 grown child between then, are very involved.

Dang, it's been a long time since I've talked to you but yes, that's what I was refering to when I asked about your family. Great news, Grandpa.

These are the same loons who think Bush was smart enough to plan 9-11 all by himself.

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Didn't any of you guys ever watch the X-Files ???

The "Lone Gun Men" did 9/11 after getting the Idea from one of their Episodes !!!!!!!

Some people !!!!!!!!

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SumOfAllFears Wrote:The question here, to try to distill this to those who did not read or understand the original post, Steve you do such a better job of that than me, is Obama’s Natural Born Status. You must understand that the immigration laws have changes slightly from when Obama was born in 1961. Today, thanks to Regan, If you are born in the US, you are a citizen. Anchor Baby Policy. In 1961, being Obama’s father was not a citizen; it fell on the 18 Year old mother to pass American Citizenship to her son. In short, she is not able to pass citizenship to Obama because she did not meet the requirements.

I really don't think this is correct.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode...-000-.html

Quote:A person born in Hawaii on or after August 12, 1898, and before April 30, 1900, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900. A person born in Hawaii on or after April 30, 1900, is a citizen of the United States at birth. A person who was a citizen of the Republic of Hawaii on August 12, 1898, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900.

Or this.

Quote:Next, Later Obama went to Indonesia when his mother remarried. IF, a big IF, he was a citizen of the US he surrendered it to become an Indonesian citizen to go to school there, an Indonesian requirement. He could come back to the US and reapply for citizenship, but he would become a naturalized citizen, and does not meet the Constitutional requirement of a Natural Born Citizen. But he did not do that either. Dual Citizenship disqualifies him from being president.

It appears impossible that Obama could have renounced his citizenship when he was in Indonesia because he was a minor.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode...-000-.html

Quote:(a) A person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by voluntarily performing any of the following acts with the intention of relinquishing United States nationality—
(1) obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application or upon an application filed by a duly authorized agent, after having attained the age of eighteen years

Like it matters. The citizens of this country have long since given up on adherence to the Constitution.

If we suddenly penalized breaching the Constitution by death .... there would be less than a dozen members of Congress left, and the federal government would completely shut down overnight.

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:Like it matters. The citizens of this country have long since given up on adherence to the Constitution.

If we suddenly penalized breaching the Constitution by death .... there would be less than a dozen members of Congress left, and the federal government would completely shut down overnight.

And that would be .... BAD ???

Surely you jest !

TO HELL WITH GEORGIA ! ! !

tigertom Wrote:TO HELL WITH GEORGIA ! ! !

THE CESSPOOL OF THE SOUTH!!

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:

tigertom Wrote:TO HELL WITH GEORGIA ! ! !

THE CESSPOOL OF THE SOUTH!!

Go Yellowjackets ! !

JH, Check out the 14th Amendment

cb4029, Thanks for fixing the link

Quote:Fourteenth Amendment

The adoption of the Fourteenth Amendment obviously affects how we view natural-born citizens because for the first time there is a national rule of who may by birth is a citizen of the United States. Who may be born citizens of the States is conditional upon being born “subject to the jurisdiction” of the United States. The legislative definition of “subject to the jurisdiction thereof” was defined as “Not owing allegiance to anybody else.”

The primary author of the citizenship clause, Sen. Jacob M. Howard, said the “word jurisdiction, as here employed, ought to be construed so as to imply a full and complete jurisdiction on the part of the United States, whether exercised by Congress, by the executive, or by the judicial department; that is to say, the same jurisdiction in extent and quality as applies to every citizen of the United States now.”

United States Attorney General, George Williams, whom was a U.S. Senator aligned with Radical Republicans during the drafting of the Fourteenth Amendment in 1866, ruled in 1873 the word “jurisdiction” under the Fourteenth Amendment “must be understood to mean absolute and complete jurisdiction, such as the United States had over its citizens before the adoption of this amendment.” He added, “Political and military rights and duties” do not pertain to anyone else.

Essentially then, “subject to the jurisdiction thereof” means the same jurisdiction the United States exercises over its own citizens, i.e., only citizens of the United States come within its operation since citizens of the United States do not owe allegiance to some other nation at the same time they do the United States. This makes a great deal of sense for the time because there was a great deal of controversy over conflicts arising from double allegiances. In fact, Congress passed a joint congressional report on June 22, 1874 that said the “United States have not recognized a double allegiance.”

Fourteenth Amendment framer, Rep. John A. Bingham, argued before the House in 1871 that Dr. John Emilio Houard was a natural-born citizen of the United States. According to Bingham he was a natural-born citizen because he was “born of naturalized parents within the jurisdiction of the United States” by the “express words of the Constitution, as amended today.” A naturalized male (women became naturalized through their husbands) were required to “absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity” to other nations, and thus, could no longer be said to owe allegiance to anyone but the United States.

Because “subject to the jurisdiction thereof” requires not owing allegiance to any other nation, and because the nation does not recognize double allegiances that can be created at common law, narrows the possibilities to what “natural-born citizen” can mean.

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Quote:Natural-Born Citizen Defined

One universal point most all early publicists agreed on was natural-born citizen must mean one who is a citizen by no act of law. If a person owes their citizenship to some act of law (naturalization for example), they cannot be considered a natural-born citizen. This leads us to defining natural-born citizen under the laws of nature - laws the founders recognized and embraced.

Under the laws of nature, every child born requires no act of law to establish the fact the child inherits through nature his/her father’s citizenship as well as his name (or even his property) through birth. This law of nature is also recognized by law of nations. Sen. Howard said the citizenship clause under the Fourteenth Amendment was by virtue of “natural law and national law.” The first Naturalization Act passed by Congress recognized “natural-born citizens” to be those born beyond the States to resident fathers who were already established citizens of the United States.

The advantages of Natural Law is competing allegiances between nations are avoided, or at least with those nations whose custom is to not make citizens of other countries citizens without their consent. Additional alternations or conflicts due to a child’s natural citizenship are strictly a creature of local municipal law. In the year 1866, the United States for the first time adopted a local municipal law under Sec. 1992 of U.S. Revised Statutes that read: “All persons born in the United States and not subject to any foreign power, excluding Indians not taxed, are declared to be citizens of the United States.”

Rep. Bingham commenting on section 1992 said it means “every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen.” This national law does not endow upon any person allegiance through birth alone as was the custom under the old English common law practice but only recognizes citizenship of those born to parents who do not owe allegiance to another nation. In other words, national law prevented the creation of conflicting dual citizenships between other nation’s citizens.

The constitutional requirement for the President of the United States to be a natural-born citizen had one purpose according to St. George Tucker:

That provision in the constitution which requires that the president shall be a native-born citizen (unless he were a citizen of the United States when the constitution was adopted,) is a happy means of security against foreign influence, which, wherever it is capable of being exerted, is to he dreaded more than the plague. The admission of foreigners into our councils, consequently, cannot be too much guarded against; their total exclusion from a station to which foreign nations have been accustomed to, attach ideas of sovereign power, sacredness of character, and hereditary right, is a measure of the most consummate policy and wisdom. … The title of king, prince, emperor, or czar, without the smallest addition to his powers, would have rendered him a member of the fraternity of crowned heads: their common cause has more than once threatened the desolation of Europe. To have added a member to this sacred family in America, would have invited and perpetuated among us all the evils of Pandora’s Box.

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HECK NO !!!!!!

If Obama is not a U.S. Citizen and is Legally the President of the United States .......

Then it is "Arnie 'The Govenator' in 2012" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

AND HE'LL BE BACH !!!!!!!!!! In 2016 ......

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