They didn’t get outcoached. The had opportunities, missed a few open layups, and muffed the second to last possession. Great season. They should have beaten WSU. One the great UT women classes.

Outcoached as 6 pt dogs to be leading most game, have a foul called that wasn't called all game to give them an out of bounds play, then see a zone and draw up a look that didn't fall to lose by 2...

(03-28-2024 10:29 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Outcoached as 6 pt dogs to be leading most game, have a foul called that wasn't called all game to give them an out of bounds play, then see a zone and draw up a look that didn't fall to lose by 2...

Indeed! Add in the inbounds play to Sammi for a bucket with two seconds on the shot clock. Well designed and executed play . . . just like the Coach drew up.

This team had the same players as two years ago and basically had the same season as two years ago: one loss in conference play, lost in the conference tournament semifinals, and lost a heartbreaker in the WNIT/WBIT quarterfinals. On the one hand, this was an extremely successful season. On the other hand, given where we were two years ago, you could reasonably have hoped for more.

Now that there is finally some roster turnover, we will see how the Rockets can recruit without Mark Stephens. I am looking forward to seeing some new players step up next year. We have a solid core coming back. Sammi, Goss, and our centers bring a whole lot to the table.

The make-up of the WBIT final four (Washington State, Penn State, Illinois, Villanova) is a pretty strong rebuttal to anyone saying the mid-majors got screwed by the NCAA selection committee. Sure, we can speculate that the Rockets would have beaten Washington State on a neutral court, but St. John's can just as legitimately say the same about their one-point loss to us.

I'll put it this way: If four mid-majors were left in the WBIT, we would put a whole lot of weight on that fact.

(03-28-2024 09:59 PM)falconplucker Wrote:  They didn’t get outcoached. The had opportunities, missed a few open layups, and muffed the second to last possession. Great season. They should have beaten WSU. One the great UT women classes.

Noveroske scored 10 points in 5 minutes of play in the first half. It was obvious during that time that Washington State had no answer for her defensively. I would have expected her to have more of a role in the second half but she only played 8 more minutes. I know she needs rest periods but she wasn't in foul trouble and certainly could have and should have played more. She made 7 of 10 shots in her limited role. Seems like we left some opportunities on the bench.

With 3:27 left after Noveroske scored her 14th point and the score 61-57 in our favor the Washington State coach called a timeout and instructed her team to double team Noveroske in the post. We continued attempt to force the ball into her and subsequently turned the ball over three times getting only two shots the remainder of the game and not scoring any additional points. From that I conclude the time out and defensive change by WSU was key to winning the game.

(03-29-2024 05:03 AM)Lester Wrote:  This team had the same players as two years ago and basically had the same season as two years ago: one loss in conference play, lost in the conference tournament semifinals, and lost a heartbreaker in the WNIT/WBIT quarterfinals. On the one hand, this was an extremely successful season. On the other hand, given where we were two years ago, you could reasonably have hoped for more.

Now that there is finally some roster turnover, we will see how the Rockets can recruit without Mark Stephens. I am looking forward to seeing some new players step up next year. We have a solid core coming back. Sammi, Goss, and our centers bring a whole lot to the table.

I am hopeful that all of the centers are coming back.

(03-29-2024 07:49 AM)kazoorocket43 Wrote:  

(03-28-2024 09:59 PM)falconplucker Wrote:  They didn’t get outcoached. The had opportunities, missed a few open layups, and muffed the second to last possession. Great season. They should have beaten WSU. One the great UT women classes.

Noveroske scored 10 points in 5 minutes of play in the first half. It was obvious during that time that Washington State had no answer for her defensively. I would have expected her to have more of a role in the second half but she only played 8 more minutes. I know she needs rest periods but she wasn't in foul trouble and certainly could have and should have played more. She made 7 of 10 shots in her limited role. Seems like we left some opportunities on the bench.

With 3:27 left after Noveroske scored her 14th point and the score 61-57 in our favor the Washington State coach called a timeout and instructed her team to double team Noveroske in the post. We continued attempt to force the ball into her and subsequently turned the ball over three times getting only two shots the remainder of the game and not scoring any additional points. From that I conclude the time out and defensive change by WSU was key to winning the game.

Good point about the WSU defensive adjustment, kazoo. We should have made them pay for the double-team by taking what was available.

Hannah's ceiling is 20 mins a game because she gets gassed... you can call that a conditioning problem, but for women sometimes that's just the build. Toledo was expected to be about this good and did it with Q out for 7 games. So no this wasn't a standard season. We were very good. If you repeat as a top 35 rpi team you are overachieving everyone giving their best shot at you. Our ceiling ad a midmajor landscape in WBB is a lucky draw to the sweet 16, or round of 32. We just are so behind the talent level we will never pass that. We could have gotten there this year with a few better bounces. If people are apathetic go root for another team. You don't make 50% of your threes and lock down all Power conference players every time out.

(03-29-2024 12:05 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Hannah's ceiling is 20 mins a game because she gets gassed... you can call that a conditioning problem, but for women sometimes that's just the build. Toledo was expected to be about this good and did it with Q out for 7 games. So no this wasn't a standard season. We were very good. If you repeat as a top 35 rpi team you are overachieving everyone giving their best shot at you. Our ceiling ad a midmajor landscape in WBB is a lucky draw to the sweet 16, or round of 32. We just are so behind the talent level we will never pass that. We could have gotten there this year with a few better bounces. If people are apathetic go root for another team. You don't make 50% of your threes and lock down all Power conference players every time out.

I don't think anyone on this board is apathetic. If your invitation to root for another team was at all directed at me, I will decline. I love rooting for this team and will continue to do so. It's been three amazing years.

Whether a season is deemed successful or not depends completely on expectations. I try not to be unrealistic in that regard. I still say, though, that when the team in 2022 does what that team did, it is not out of line to hope for improvement when those five starters and two top subs return for not just one but two more years. In 2022, I was disappointed by the close loss to Middle Tennessee but overall thrilled about the season. Last year, I was equally thrilled to see us make the NCAA tournament and win a first-round game. This year, I am less satisified than either of the past two years. I think you are right, though, as it turns out, that these players hit their ceiling.

Some interesting MAC stats on post-season tournament play, assuming my records are accurate...

- Coach Cullop has won more post-season games (21) than any other MAC school (school, not coach). BG, as a whole, has won 17. Cullop's record is 21-10.
- The rest of the present MAC coaches have won a combined 13 games, with a combined record of 13-28.
- She has won more of those games than Kent, Miami, Buffalo, CMU, WMU, NIU and Akron combined, who together have won a total of 10. (I think many people may think CMU and Buffalo have won many, but they have not.)

Overall post-season records by school:
Toledo 31-22
BG 17-22
Ball State 8-13
Ohio 6-9
EMU 6-9
Kent 3-13
WMU 2-6
Buffalo 2-7
CMU 2-11
Miami 1-7
NIU 0-4
Akron 0-8

So, Toledo is the only school with a winning record in post-season play.

Also of note, is this team record for the past three seasons is 86-17 (0.835) overall and 52-4 (.929) in MAC play.

The 86 and 52 win marks are both records for the MAC. BG's Miller teams won 85 overall from 2005-08. No school has won 50+ MAC games in three consecutive seasons. 48 is the most, I believe, by a few teams.

(03-29-2024 01:02 PM)northcoastRocket Wrote:  Also of note, is this team record for the past three seasons is 86-17 (0.835) overall and 52-4 (.929) in MAC play.

The 86 and 52 win marks are both records for the MAC. BG's Miller teams won 85 overall from 2005-08. No school has won 50+ MAC games in three consecutive seasons. 48 is the most, I believe, by a few teams.

Final Four or Bust. We pay her a million dollars to compete with the B1G, not the MAC.


sorry, had a bit of a stroke.


Amazing stats per usual.

(03-29-2024 12:05 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Hannah's ceiling is 20 mins a game because she gets gassed... you can call that a conditioning problem, but for women sometimes that's just the build. Toledo was expected to be about this good and did it with Q out for 7 games. So no this wasn't a standard season. We were very good. If you repeat as a top 35 rpi team you are overachieving everyone giving their best shot at you. Our ceiling ad a midmajor landscape in WBB is a lucky draw to the sweet 16, or round of 32. We just are so behind the talent level we will never pass that. We could have gotten there this year with a few better bounces. If people are apathetic go root for another team. You don't make 50% of your threes and lock down all Power conference players every time out.

Hannah's ceiling is 20 minutes in a game because she is usually a fouling machine.

Other MAC schools would kill to have the following, success, and coaching Toledo has.

(03-29-2024 10:42 AM)Lester Wrote:  

(03-29-2024 07:49 AM)kazoorocket43 Wrote:  

(03-28-2024 09:59 PM)falconplucker Wrote:  They didn’t get outcoached. The had opportunities, missed a few open layups, and muffed the second to last possession. Great season. They should have beaten WSU. One the great UT women classes.

Noveroske scored 10 points in 5 minutes of play in the first half. It was obvious during that time that Washington State had no answer for her defensively. I would have expected her to have more of a role in the second half but she only played 8 more minutes. I know she needs rest periods but she wasn't in foul trouble and certainly could have and should have played more. She made 7 of 10 shots in her limited role. Seems like we left some opportunities on the bench.

With 3:27 left after Noveroske scored her 14th point and the score 61-57 in our favor the Washington State coach called a timeout and instructed her team to double team Noveroske in the post. We continued attempt to force the ball into her and subsequently turned the ball over three times getting only two shots the remainder of the game and not scoring any additional points. From that I conclude the time out and defensive change by WSU was key to winning the game.

Good point about the WSU defensive adjustment, kazoo. We should have made them pay for the double-team by taking what was available.

I would have liked for them to look for the open 3. We have the second or third most accurate 3 point shooter in the league and she didn't take one 3 in the entire game.

(03-29-2024 01:37 PM)falconplucker Wrote:  Other MAC schools would kill to have the following, success, and coaching Toledo has.

Agree. And Cullop is a fine coach and we are fortunate to have her. But that certainly doesn't mean she can't make or fail to make critical game decisions. IMO this time the decision to change her defense by the WSU coach stopped UTs easy baskets and generated 3 critical turnovers by a Toledo team which had only turned it over 5 times in the preceding 57 minutes. My main point is that Toledo marginally outplayed a much bigger Washington State team which was killing us on the boards and we were positioned to win the game, should have won the game. IMO we lost the game on coaching strategy and execution off that. These comments have nothing to do with our overall success and the record these players achieved over the past three years. It just could have been even better.

I sort of got use to having Q & Sophie around all these years. WHAT A RUN IT'S BEEN!!!!!!! UT fans have been so lucky!

We may lose TK but I hope we retain TC.

It must have been so emotional in the locker room. Many tears I'm sure.

UT played so well on the road. They played tough.

A wonderful 4+ years

(03-29-2024 07:49 AM)kazoorocket43 Wrote:  

(03-28-2024 09:59 PM)falconplucker Wrote:  They didn’t get outcoached. The had opportunities, missed a few open layups, and muffed the second to last possession. Great season. They should have beaten WSU. One the great UT women classes.

Noveroske scored 10 points in 5 minutes of play in the first half. It was obvious during that time that Washington State had no answer for her defensively. I would have expected her to have more of a role in the second half but she only played 8 more minutes. I know she needs rest periods but she wasn't in foul trouble and certainly could have and should have played more. She made 7 of 10 shots in her limited role. Seems like we left some opportunities on the bench.

With 3:27 left after Noveroske scored her 14th point and the score 61-57 in our favor the Washington State coach called a timeout and instructed her team to double team Noveroske in the post. We continued attempt to force the ball into her and subsequently turned the ball over three times getting only two shots the remainder of the game and not scoring any additional points. From that I conclude the time out and defensive change by WSU was key to winning the game.

I agree. I thought the move by WSU to switch to a zone was a great one and Toledo had no answer. That decision and their height were the keys to their victory. It is a shame, because I didn’t feel like WSU was more talented, just taller. But…