(02-11-2024 10:56 AM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

(02-11-2024 10:47 AM)greyowl72 Wrote:  It seems like a staggering amount, doesn’t it. Especially, when us old grads reminisce about the “good ‘ol days” of $1500 tuition and $1200 room and board. Even with the Rice Investment positively benefiting a very large number of students, it still seems like a lot. Really a lot.
I recently had the opportunity to have lunch with a couple of Rice administrators/ deans and the increase in tuition does not seem to have made a dent in undergraduate applications, which are at record levels. Nor has it negatively impacted the University’s plans for increasing enrollment. I got the impression that the target for enrollment in the next 5 years, or so, is in the area of 12,000. Divided equally between undergraduates and graduate students.

I think the stated goal articulated in Reggie's 5-year plan is closer to 10,000 total enrollment, with a 55-45 split in undergraduate to graduate enrollment. Clearly, there is a big push university-wide to increase research dollars.

I got that impression, also, Walt. There was a comment that the university is seeing a big uptick in interest in the biosciences among entering freshman. Bioengineering. Development of pharmaceuticals related to oncology and vaccines/antibiotics. Pre- med. and all of those students want experience in the medical center labs. So, the university is making a big effort to increase collaboration with the hospitals, labs, etc across the street.
I was not aware that we are also undergoing a significant expansion of faculty across the board. And in order to attract high quality faculty there’s been an effort to increase the university’s visibility and profile in the lay press as well as having the faculty engage in on line presentations, etc And making an effort to increase national profile in…athletics. Apparently a push coming from President DesRoches.
I was pleased to hear all of this.

(02-11-2024 01:03 PM)greyowl72 Wrote:  

(02-11-2024 10:56 AM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

(02-11-2024 10:47 AM)greyowl72 Wrote:  It seems like a staggering amount, doesn’t it. Especially, when us old grads reminisce about the “good ‘ol days” of $1500 tuition and $1200 room and board. Even with the Rice Investment positively benefiting a very large number of students, it still seems like a lot. Really a lot.
I recently had the opportunity to have lunch with a couple of Rice administrators/ deans and the increase in tuition does not seem to have made a dent in undergraduate applications, which are at record levels. Nor has it negatively impacted the University’s plans for increasing enrollment. I got the impression that the target for enrollment in the next 5 years, or so, is in the area of 12,000. Divided equally between undergraduates and graduate students.

I think the stated goal articulated in Reggie's 5-year plan is closer to 10,000 total enrollment, with a 55-45 split in undergraduate to graduate enrollment. Clearly, there is a big push university-wide to increase research dollars.

I got that impression, also, Walt. There was a comment that the university is seeing a big uptick in interest in the biosciences among entering freshman. Bioengineering. Development of pharmaceuticals related to oncology and vaccines/antibiotics. Pre- med. and all of those students want experience in the medical center labs. So, the university is making a big effort to increase collaboration with the hospitals, labs, etc across the street.
I was not aware that we are also undergoing a significant expansion of faculty across the board. And in order to attract high quality faculty there’s been an effort to increase the university’s visibility and profile in the lay press as well as having the faculty engage in on line presentations, etc And making an effort to increase national profile in…athletics. Apparently a push coming from President DesRoches.
I was pleased to hear all of this.

Yes. The BRC is playing a very prominent role in this regard.

(02-11-2024 01:24 AM)ausowl Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 10:33 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 09:15 PM)Tiki Owl Wrote:  Washington University Tuition 2024-2025 $64,500
Room and Board $21,854
Student Activity fee $644
Student Health and Wellness fee $646

Freshman year 1968 tuition was $1900 per semester and room/board $1250 per year.

Present value of $1900 is $16,747.63

Present value of $1250 is $11,018.18

So a full year would be $33,495.26 (tuition) and $22,036.36 (ro noom and board)

So an extra 26K above the '68 in present value?

$81,893 all in v. UT McCombs or Engineering close or equivalent in selectivity,$30k all in,:Trinity, Southwestern, Rhodes, $35K with merit aid, not as selective but very good undergrad.

Maybe the value is there? If you have multiple kids and/or kids wth grad school aspirations, tough.

In order to save four years' worth of those current Rice figures, one would have had to have had the foresight to save $1,000/month and earn a 5% annual rate of return from the birth of their child until their 18th birthday.

(02-10-2024 11:10 AM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  Anyone have a source showing historical tuition since Rice began charging tuition?

Tuition was $4,500 per year my first three years at Rice (1980-1983) and went up to $5,000 in my senior year (that would be almost $15,000 today).

Tuition increases in universities have been outpacing inflation for a number of years now. Perhaps the biggest driver has been increases in the number of administrators and support staff, which in some schools is rivaling the number of faculty.

I was in the second class to pay tuition (matriculate fall 1966 - graduate spring 1970).

Tuition was $1,200 per year ... constant through the four years.

I believe the class entering after us (fall 1967 - spring 1971) paid $1,500 tuition per year ... also constant for their four years.

(02-12-2024 03:34 AM)Almadenmike Wrote:  I was in the second class to pay tuition (matriculate fall 1966 - graduate spring 1970).
Tuition was $1,200 per year ... constant through the four years.
I believe the class entering after us (fall 1967 - spring 1971) paid $1,500 tuition per year ... also constant for their four years.

I started in fall 1965, and it the stated policy back then that your first-year price would hold for all undergraduate years.

(02-12-2024 06:23 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 03:34 AM)Almadenmike Wrote:  I was in the second class to pay tuition (matriculate fall 1966 - graduate spring 1970).
Tuition was $1,200 per year ... constant through the four years.
I believe the class entering after us (fall 1967 - spring 1971) paid $1,500 tuition per year ... also constant for their four years.

I started in fall 1965, and it the stated policy back then that your first-year price would hold for all undergraduate years.

This was also true for all classes throughout the 1970s.

Buncha old coots on here.

I entered in '63 - tuition free.

I dropped out for a semester in '66.

In my last year, it was ruled that I was entitled to 8 free semesters, and since it was taking me 9, I should pay for the last semester - spring 1968. $600.

(02-11-2024 01:24 AM)ausowl Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 10:33 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 09:15 PM)Tiki Owl Wrote:  Washington University Tuition 2024-2025 $64,500
Room and Board $21,854
Student Activity fee $644
Student Health and Wellness fee $646

Freshman year 1968 tuition was $1900 per semester and room/board $1250 per year.

Present value of $1900 is $16,747.63

Present value of $1250 is $11,018.18

So a full year would be $33,495.26 (tuition) and $22,036.36 (ro noom and board)

So an extra 26K above the '68 in present value?

$81,893 all in v. UT McCombs or Engineering close or equivalent in selectivity,$30k all in,:Trinity, Southwestern, Rhodes, $35K with merit aid, not as selective but very good undergrad.

Maybe the value is there? If you have multiple kids and/or kids wth grad school aspirations, tough.

The Rice Investment can't be ignored though...

Back in the 90's I think it was, schools began being judged by how much aid they gave more than how cheap they were.... meaning that a school that cost 70k/yr but gave 100% scholarships to students with need was ranked higher than a school that cost 20k but gave no scholarships.... So having the endowment subsidize everyone who got admitted the same (through lower tuition) vs having the endowment subsidize families with greater need more and families with lesser need less (or none) gave you a higher ranking.

We charge more because our 'peer' schools generally charge more... We subsidize the less wealthy more because the rankings prefer that over lower tuition for everyone.

Arguably, this pushes schools like Rice to attract the less wealthy and the very wealthy... and the middle ground (which is WAY above the average I might add) goes to UT or Southwestern

(02-11-2024 01:51 PM)westsidewolf1989 Wrote:  In order to save four years' worth of those current Rice figures, one would have had to have had the foresight to save $1,000/month and earn a 5% annual rate of return from the birth of their child until their 18th birthday.

If you are making $300K/year and don't have to foresight or discipline to save $350K over 18 years for your kid's college then I don't feel bad for you.

As discussed above, Rice was not cheap 30-50 years ago. With the tuition promise, it is likely more affordable for more people than it was. Maybe more affordable for everyone if you consider that the top 5% are making far more than they were 30-50 years ago.

(02-12-2024 10:05 AM)temchugh Wrote:  As discussed above, Rice was not cheap 30-50 years ago. With the tuition promise, it is likely more affordable for more people than it was. Maybe more affordable for everyone if you consider that the top 5% are making far more than they were 30-50 years ago.

Before 1965, Rice was VERY cheap. That tended to skew the student body slightly toward the wealthier, who could not qualify for need-based scholarship money, so Rice was very much the cheapest option for them.

This will skew the student body clearly toward lower incomes. I'm not sure whether that is right or wrong.

(02-10-2024 08:34 PM)WRC1975 Wrote:  So, let me see if I am reading this correctly, 2024-2025 first year students who want to live on campus may have to pay a total of $81,893 ($62,874+$18,094+925) if their family income exceeds $300,000. Does anyone know if those income levels shown in the press release are before or after federal and state income taxes are taken out? If it is before taxes, which is probably the case, then at least 35% of family's after-tax income would go to paying the total cost of attending and rooming at Rice if the family income was $301,000. Also, what justifies a 9.9% increase in tuition from 2023-2024 to 2024-2025?! Are RU's costs increasing at that rate and why?

It is not based on my experience. As I've stated before, this is untenable going forward for middle class families. Not worth the cost. On a side note, might as well start accepting mediocrity in all partial scholarship costs as well.

(02-10-2024 10:33 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  

(02-10-2024 09:15 PM)Tiki Owl Wrote:  Washington University Tuition 2024-2025 $64,500
Room and Board $21,854
Student Activity fee $644
Student Health and Wellness fee $646

Freshman year 1968 tuition was $1900 per semester and room/board $1250 per year.

Present value of $1900 is $16,747.63

Present value of $1250 is $11,018.18

So a full year would be $33,495.26 (tuition) and $22,036.36 (room and board)

Nailed it!!! Exponential increase in tuition & R&B. As others stated the R&B is criminal compared to what you can get for the same cost. I also beg to differ with the servery food. Better than in the past but still on the "poor" side. I recognize that is an opinion.

(02-12-2024 10:05 AM)temchugh Wrote:  

(02-11-2024 01:51 PM)westsidewolf1989 Wrote:  In order to save four years' worth of those current Rice figures, one would have had to have had the foresight to save $1,000/month and earn a 5% annual rate of return from the birth of their child until their 18th birthday.

If you are making $300K/year and don't have to foresight or discipline to save $350K over 18 years for your kid's college then I don't feel bad for you.

As discussed above, Rice was not cheap 30-50 years ago. With the tuition promise, it is likely more affordable for more people than it was. Maybe more affordable for everyone if you consider that the top 5% are making far more than they were 30-50 years ago.

For one kid, sure. If you have three kids, that's tough. No wonder we have a birth rate crisis.

(02-12-2024 10:05 AM)temchugh Wrote:  If you are making $300K/year and don't have to foresight or discipline to save $350K over 18 years for your kid's college then I don't feel bad for you.

The reality is more likely that for the first few years of your child's birth, you made a whole lot less than 300k.... especially if one of you stayed home while the kids were very small.... and only started making that 300k perhaps later in their lives... so I get your point, but it's not as easy/clear as you suggest. I don't remember what Rice grads made coming out of school 20 years ago, but many people have kids in their mid 20's after college and maybe after grad school.... and if they made 50-75k 20 years ago, they might be making 300 now... but probably didn't make that for their first 5-10 years with (multiple?) kids.... and now you're having to save not 360k, but closer to a million?

(02-12-2024 12:00 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(02-12-2024 10:05 AM)temchugh Wrote:  If you are making $300K/year and don't have to foresight or discipline to save $350K over 18 years for your kid's college then I don't feel bad for you.

The reality is more likely that for the first few years of your child's birth, you made a whole lot less than 300k.... especially if one of you stayed home while the kids were very small.... and only started making that 300k perhaps later in their lives... so I get your point, but it's not as easy/clear as you suggest. I don't remember what Rice grads made coming out of school 20 years ago, but many people have kids in their mid 20's after college and maybe after grad school.... and if they made 50-75k 20 years ago, they might be making 300 now... but probably didn't make that for their first 5-10 years with (multiple?) kids.... and now you're having to save not 360k, but closer to a million?

Exactly. If someone actually knew what their kid's college would cost in 20 years, it would make this easier. The problem is that college costs have gone up 2.7x in 40 years (https://www.forbes.com/advisor/student-l...flation/), so I'm not sure how anyone, regardless of income, was suppose to anticipate that.

The income brackets need to be an X-year lookback (I think it's just the previous year before application) to account for the issue Hambone noted above.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are linkages between the rampant college tuition increase and the current retirement crisis.

(02-12-2024 10:05 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  Arguably, this pushes schools like Rice to attract the less wealthy and the very wealthy... and the middle ground (which is WAY above the average I might add) goes to UT or Southwestern

This.
To maintain true diversity, I think Rice needs more of the students who currently ALL go to UT, A&M, Southwestern, Austin College, Univ of Colorado, etc. (middle to upper middle income families).

Doctoral stipends are increasing to $34,000 ($2,000 increase from this year).

https://graduate.rice.edu/news/current-n...d-increase

(02-17-2024 09:51 AM)dragon2owl Wrote:  Doctoral stipends are increasing to $34,000 ($2,000 increase from this year).

https://graduate.rice.edu/news/current-n...d-increase

Which is somewhat below our peer institutions, at least judging by PhD (Computer Science) offers my sister has received.

(02-17-2024 01:15 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  

(02-17-2024 09:51 AM)dragon2owl Wrote:  Doctoral stipends are increasing to $34,000 ($2,000 increase from this year).

https://graduate.rice.edu/news/current-n...d-increase

Which is somewhat below our peer institutions, at least judging by PhD (Computer Science) offers my sister has received.

It's just the minimum requirement. Departments can offer more.