(01-18-2024 11:52 PM)OhioBobcatJohn Wrote:  Ohio and Toledo lost their best players to Alabama and Baylor. Both players are starters in the Big 12 and SEC. NIL had destroyed the MAC in basketball. MAC lost its entire all-conference team to NIL portal last year. They are like a class A baseball team. They get the high school kids for a couple years then off they go to the next level.

Yep. They let the mid majors do the scouting and recruiting, take the risk, filter through the players that get hurt or don’t pan out, let them waste their time coaching and developing guys, let them sift through the players they get to see which ones develop the best, and then take them.

(01-18-2024 11:52 PM)OhioBobcatJohn Wrote:  Ohio and Toledo lost their best players to Alabama and Baylor. Both players are starters in the Big 12 and SEC. NIL had destroyed the MAC in basketball. MAC lost its entire all-conference team to NIL portal last year.

Agree, but to be fair Toledo are playing pretty well to start conference play. They look like the 2nd best team in the MAC at the moment.

I'm late to the party here. I hate the AAC for Temple and for UConn when they were there mainly for the geography. You may not think geography should be an excuse for a team's struggles but all of the travel to away games does put a toll on a team after a while. UConn's travel in the Big East outside of Creighton is way more friendly. I don't know why Memphis struggled in the AAC, the conference is fairly geographically friendly to them and I don't know if there is a more geographically friendly conference to them now.

There's no replacing Houston in terms of men's basketball strength for the AAC but hopefully Florida Atlantic came at the right time and hopefully they stay good after this class leaves and Dusty May (assuming he does) as well. Unfortunately it is a conference where practically everyone would rather be in a higher conference.

This is great. The ACC is 9-3 against the "best" conference. I'll take it.

(01-18-2024 04:19 PM)JSchmack Wrote:  Not to mention that everyone always points to conference travel and ignores non-conference travel. My go to example is Pacific, which switched from Big West to West Coast Conference, and have played 20-24 of their basketball games against the same 22 teams every season regardless.

It's six of one, half a dozen of the others. If all your local opponents are conference opponents, you have to go further away in non-conference.

Not necessarily. If you're in a part of the country with a lot of schools you could do both. When the SB, AAC, and CUSA all basically overlapped - the conference play was reasonable (on the whole, and certainly in sports using divisions) but you could play each other or Southland/SWAC/SEC/ACC/Big12/OVC/WAC for OOC.

(01-18-2024 11:52 PM)OhioBobcatJohn Wrote:  Ohio and Toledo lost their best players to Alabama and Baylor. Both players are starters in the Big 12 and SEC. NIL had destroyed the MAC in basketball. MAC lost its entire all-conference team to NIL portal last year. They are like a class A baseball team. They get the high school kids for a couple years then off they go to the next level.

Destroyed what was left of the MAC in basketball.

Coaching money, expansion of D1 to 370+ teams killed 2/3rds of the league, except the best 4 or 5 jobs since the 90's.

(01-18-2024 07:58 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(01-17-2024 01:40 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(01-17-2024 10:50 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(01-16-2024 04:44 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(01-16-2024 03:42 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  I agree with all this. I just remember that, 10 - 11 years ago when the split happened, many AAC fans around here (I'm not referring to you, btw) thought that the AAC had gotten at least as much of the hoops power as had the new Big East, and there were predictions from some that the AAC would be the stronger hoops conference.

I recall those posts, too (I started reading this board in about 2011 or so). That mindset was likely spurred by many pro-AAC posters thinking that the "upper half" of the then-new AAC (lets say, Cincinnati, UConn, Houston, Memphis and Temple) would be as strong as the upper half of the then-newly-constituted Big East (say, Marquette, St. John's, Georgetown, Villanova and Creighton). And though not a bad prediction (and even understandable), the posters with that mindset failed to take into account the advantages the reinvented Big East would have in relation to the AAC: 1. "institutional chemistry/fit/cohesion"; 2. a much stronger bottom half; 3. not having to worry about football.

In addition, many of those posters failed to consider the potential for UConn to falter due to a loss of its long-time rivals and a bad geographic fit. They simply, and wrongly, assumed UConn would stay powerful.

Lastly, that pro-AAC mindset also was likely the result of some insecurity, particularly from some posters who are fans of AAC programs that have not had lots of national success in men's hoops. In short, those fans contended on this board that the AAC would be as good, if not better, than the BE because they wanted that to be the case rather than because (had that actually given it unbiased and reasonable consideration) they sincerely thought that would be the case.

On this theme, I continue to take note (10 years into this) of the following:

1. How strong the Big East has remained despite long-standing problems with St. John's and your Hoya program (problems that are now both seemingly fixed with strong coaching hires).

2. How Temple, Wichita and Tulsa men's hoops have been harmed — seemingly due, in large part, to AAC membership.

3. How some posters (and clearly not you, QV) either fail to recognize or choose not to acknowledge the long-times ties and similarities with the AAC and the Big East (i.e., some programs in both leagues having previously shared conference homes, both leagues offering universities locate primarily in large cities and neither conference being considered a true "big boy" by the all-sports P4 types while, still, commanding a solid level of all-round respect). There truly is some overlap between the two leagues.

4. (and related to Point No. 2) How Memphis hoops could be hurt (and I fear possible gravely so) by AAC affiliation (though the league is great, in many respects, for Tiger football).

FWIW, I don't think conferences hurt hoops very much. E.g., in the 1970s and 1980s, UNLV was in a minor conference but was a major power. Memphis has themselves been in relatively weak leagues in the past (2000s, I believe) but has had significant hoops success. Gonzaga has had major success the past 20 years despite being in a weak league.

IMO Memphis will remain fine hoops-wise. The AAC though seems to be going from mediocre to just plain bad.

My concern is that, five to seven years from now, AAC men's basketball has transitioned from mediocre to downright bad. If that happens, Memphis hoops could easily be harmed — whether by a negative perception driven by the school's association with the league or self-inflicted wounds stemming from, in part, having to overcompensate for a bad AAC. Or both.

If, hypothetically, Memphis joined the Big East and simultaneously either dropped football or deemphasized it ala UConn, the Tiger hoops program would face a much more stable (and exciting) future.

So many folks on this board often praise Gonzaga for its great hoops program, noting the Zags have done well despite not being in a "power men's basketball league." And I give props. But Memphis (and San Diego State, for that matter) is trying to be "nationally relevant" (and I use that term loosely) in both football and men's basketball. That is extremely difficult to do when you are not a member of one of the four all-sports power leagues (though Louisville did it back during its C-USA days). Gonzaga has it easy compared to Memphis and SDSU (at least in some respects as, I admit, Gonzaga also has its challenges).

As to UNLV , when that school was nationally powerful in men's hoops, it put essentially nothing into football.

What Memphis is attempting to do now in both sports (i.e., trying to be "nationally relevant" with the hiring of Penny Hardaway and the $220 million football stadium upgrade) is a tough task. And very risky in that it might never yield a power league invite.

But at least my Tigers are associated with your fighting Bulls, QV. I like that.

SDSU has played Gonzaga 4 times in its history, all since 2010. Our record is 2-1 at their place and 1-0 at Viejas.

In football I think SDSU made a tremendous hire in Sean Lewis who has hired an excellent staff while so far bringing in the top recruiting class in the MWC along with CSU. The energy he brings is light years ahead of what we have had going back to Coryell and Claude Gilbert. Will likely struggle next year as we have no QBs with much experience on the roster, an O-line that is missing some parts currently, and a very young secondary, but Lewis has been out promoting the program every chance he gets. SDSU has made football a priority with a new stadium and the highest football budget in the MWC.

I hugely respect San Diego State. Your school, Memphis and a handful of other G5 members are trying to be "nationally competitive" in both major sports. And that is a daunting task.