(12-25-2023 02:14 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  Would be awesome if FSU and Memphis joined the Big 12 and Fox gives them Even more money with the adds... WHAT if Big 12 added FSU Clemson Virginia and Memphis..And Fox added even more money for the new adds...

Starting a new conference from scratch would be my preference if we are dreaming big. We already know that FSU and their closest allies will get split up if we leave the ACC, something I really don't want. I might hash out this idea later, but Memphis would not be ruled out, their athletics would make a solid addition to most any conference. The most important thing is a constitution that allows for flexibility in changing landscapes and does not hold members hostage if the relationship between the conference and members start to sour.

(12-25-2023 10:19 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(12-23-2023 11:41 AM)Shannon Panther Wrote:  

(12-22-2023 03:09 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  Is challenging the GoRs the same as withdrawing from the ACC?

It will be interesting to see if the ACC treats this as notice of withdrawl. If so. No more voting rights for FSU.

If they try that, then we'll see you in court on that issue as well.

You'd lose

(12-25-2023 02:14 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  Would be awesome if FSU and Memphis joined the Big 12 and Fox gives them Even more money with the adds... WHAT if Big 12 added FSU Clemson Virginia and Memphis..And Fox added even more money for the new adds...

LOL. No one from the ACC is volunteering to go to Big Conference USA.

my ? is, media rights stop at '26 at this point.
would ACCN would calculate to '36 at 15M yr

If FSU doesn't get into the Big Ten or SEC then its would be BIg 12..Now If FSU wins or settles a out, if anyone else were to want out they too would have to file a law suit just like FSU is doing..Once FSU is out would they go and be accepted to SEC or Big Ten..Industry sources say they aren't bring enough to warrant BIg Ten who likes AAU state schools, which FSU isn't, And SEC is controlled by ESPN...But Brett mcurphy also said if No from Big Ten and SEC then it would be Big 12...Memphis is being looked at by BIg 12, just took over ownership of the Libertybowl, with major 250 million Renovations coming, and Basketball is rocking right now, and football is solid...if Big 12 were to add FSU they would need one more and are looking at Memphis and If they added both Fox could add some more money to Big 12 Deal, plus its up again in 2030 and much shorter, for a bigger one the go around after that...Of course FSU is looking at Big Ten or SEC first but if not Big 12 is on the table....So if that third option becomes the route, then maybe FSU/ Memphis to Big 12 for 17 and 18 isn't so crazy or bad...Just some thoughts....

(12-25-2023 04:39 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  If FSU doesn't get into the Big Ten or SEC then its would be BIg 12..Now If FSU wins or settles a out, if anyone else were to want out they too would have to file a law suit just like FSU is doing..Once FSU is out would they go and be accepted to SEC or Big Ten..Industry sources say they aren't bring enough to warrant BIg Ten who likes AAU state schools, which FSU isn't, And SEC is controlled by ESPN...But Brett mcurphy also said if No from Big Ten and SEC then it would be Big 12...Memphis is being looked at by BIg 12, just took over ownership of the Libertybowl, with major 250 million Renovations coming, and Basketball is rocking right now, and football is solid...if Big 12 were to add FSU they would need one more and are looking at Memphis and If they added both Fox could add some more money to Big 12 Deal, plus its up again in 2030 and much shorter, for a bigger one the go around after that...Of course FSU is looking at Big Ten or SEC first but if not Big 12 is on the table....So if that third option becomes the route, then maybe FSU/ Memphis to Big 12 for 17 and 18 isn't so crazy or bad...Just some thoughts....

Don't think FSU is making a lateral move. If it's Big12 then it's for an unequal revenue share or a ND type of set up. The ACC should do this, but they won't, there is a "too familiar" component between FSU and the ACC and pride will get in the way.

(12-25-2023 03:07 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 02:14 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  Would be awesome if FSU and Memphis joined the Big 12 and Fox gives them Even more money with the adds... WHAT if Big 12 added FSU Clemson Virginia and Memphis..And Fox added even more money for the new adds...

LOL. No one from the ACC is volunteering to go to Big Conference USA.

In Dallas it is referred to as the Truckstop Conference.

(12-25-2023 02:34 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 02:14 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  Would be awesome if FSU and Memphis joined the Big 12 and Fox gives them Even more money with the adds... WHAT if Big 12 added FSU Clemson Virginia and Memphis..And Fox added even more money for the new adds...

Starting a new conference from scratch would be my preference if we are dreaming big. We already know that FSU and their closest allies will get split up if we leave the ACC, something I really don't want. I might hash out this idea later, but Memphis would not be ruled out, their athletics would make a solid addition to most any conference. The most important thing is a constitution that allows for flexibility in changing landscapes and does not hold members hostage if the relationship between the conference and members start to sour.

If FSU and Clemson decided to build a conferencne from scratch, I'd love to see VT join that league.

(12-25-2023 04:49 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 04:39 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  If FSU doesn't get into the Big Ten or SEC then its would be BIg 12..Now If FSU wins or settles a out, if anyone else were to want out they too would have to file a law suit just like FSU is doing..Once FSU is out would they go and be accepted to SEC or Big Ten..Industry sources say they aren't bring enough to warrant BIg Ten who likes AAU state schools, which FSU isn't, And SEC is controlled by ESPN...But Brett mcurphy also said if No from Big Ten and SEC then it would be Big 12...Memphis is being looked at by BIg 12, just took over ownership of the Libertybowl, with major 250 million Renovations coming, and Basketball is rocking right now, and football is solid...if Big 12 were to add FSU they would need one more and are looking at Memphis and If they added both Fox could add some more money to Big 12 Deal, plus its up again in 2030 and much shorter, for a bigger one the go around after that...Of course FSU is looking at Big Ten or SEC first but if not Big 12 is on the table....So if that third option becomes the route, then maybe FSU/ Memphis to Big 12 for 17 and 18 isn't so crazy or bad...Just some thoughts....

Don't think FSU is making a lateral move. If it's Big12 then it's for an unequal revenue share or a ND type of set up. The ACC should do this, but they won't, there is a "too familiar" component between FSU and the ACC and pride will get in the way.

I think FSU is really pissed about the ACC's new “success incentive initiative” for postseason competition. (https://sports.yahoo.com/acc-to-implemen...42960.html)

I believe what FSU wanted was an unequal revenue model based on "eye Balls" or Tv Viewership. Since that didn't happen and the CFP Snub, FSU is ready to be gone. There is nothing the ACC can do to make FSU happy at this point.

Since the ACC sued FSU first it tells us that there as been some talks between FSU/ACC already, they just couldn't agree to the terms.


What is going to be interesting is what the number actually is. I got to believe if FSU can leave for 250M or less that will be a win in their eyes.

(12-25-2023 06:44 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 04:49 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 04:39 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  If FSU doesn't get into the Big Ten or SEC then its would be BIg 12..Now If FSU wins or settles a out, if anyone else were to want out they too would have to file a law suit just like FSU is doing..Once FSU is out would they go and be accepted to SEC or Big Ten..Industry sources say they aren't bring enough to warrant BIg Ten who likes AAU state schools, which FSU isn't, And SEC is controlled by ESPN...But Brett mcurphy also said if No from Big Ten and SEC then it would be Big 12...Memphis is being looked at by BIg 12, just took over ownership of the Libertybowl, with major 250 million Renovations coming, and Basketball is rocking right now, and football is solid...if Big 12 were to add FSU they would need one more and are looking at Memphis and If they added both Fox could add some more money to Big 12 Deal, plus its up again in 2030 and much shorter, for a bigger one the go around after that...Of course FSU is looking at Big Ten or SEC first but if not Big 12 is on the table....So if that third option becomes the route, then maybe FSU/ Memphis to Big 12 for 17 and 18 isn't so crazy or bad...Just some thoughts....

Don't think FSU is making a lateral move. If it's Big12 then it's for an unequal revenue share or a ND type of set up. The ACC should do this, but they won't, there is a "too familiar" component between FSU and the ACC and pride will get in the way.

I think FSU is really pissed about the ACC's new “success incentive initiative” for postseason competition. (https://sports.yahoo.com/acc-to-implemen...42960.html)

I believe what FSU wanted was an unequal revenue model based on "eye Balls" or Tv Viewership. Since that didn't happen and the CFP Snub, FSU is ready to be gone. There is nothing the ACC can do to make FSU happy at this point.

Since the ACC sued FSU first it tells us that there as been some talks between FSU/ACC already, they just couldn't agree to the terms.


What is going to be interesting is what the number actually is. I got to believe if FSU can leave for 250M or less that will be a win in their eyes.

Uh no...FSU was the main driver behind getting this done.

(12-25-2023 04:49 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 04:39 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  If FSU doesn't get into the Big Ten or SEC then its would be BIg 12..Now If FSU wins or settles a out, if anyone else were to want out they too would have to file a law suit just like FSU is doing..Once FSU is out would they go and be accepted to SEC or Big Ten..Industry sources say they aren't bring enough to warrant BIg Ten who likes AAU state schools, which FSU isn't, And SEC is controlled by ESPN...But Brett mcurphy also said if No from Big Ten and SEC then it would be Big 12...Memphis is being looked at by BIg 12, just took over ownership of the Libertybowl, with major 250 million Renovations coming, and Basketball is rocking right now, and football is solid...if Big 12 were to add FSU they would need one more and are looking at Memphis and If they added both Fox could add some more money to Big 12 Deal, plus its up again in 2030 and much shorter, for a bigger one the go around after that...Of course FSU is looking at Big Ten or SEC first but if not Big 12 is on the table....So if that third option becomes the route, then maybe FSU/ Memphis to Big 12 for 17 and 18 isn't so crazy or bad...Just some thoughts....

Don't think FSU is making a lateral move. If it's Big12 then it's for an unequal revenue share or a ND type of set up. The ACC should do this, but they won't, there is a "too familiar" component between FSU and the ACC and pride will get in the way.

LMFAO! If FSU doesn't get into the SEC or B10, it isn't lateral, it is a big step DOWN. Delusional.

The only way FSU ever somehow ends up in the Big 12 is if nobody wants them.

If they wiggle their way out before 2036, another conference will want them, and the conference that acquires them isn't going to be the Big 12.

(12-25-2023 06:13 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 02:34 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 02:14 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  Would be awesome if FSU and Memphis joined the Big 12 and Fox gives them Even more money with the adds... WHAT if Big 12 added FSU Clemson Virginia and Memphis..And Fox added even more money for the new adds...

Starting a new conference from scratch would be my preference if we are dreaming big. We already know that FSU and their closest allies will get split up if we leave the ACC, something I really don't want. I might hash out this idea later, but Memphis would not be ruled out, their athletics would make a solid addition to most any conference. The most important thing is a constitution that allows for flexibility in changing landscapes and does not hold members hostage if the relationship between the conference and members start to sour.

If FSU and Clemson decided to build a conferencne from scratch, I'd love to see VT join that league.

VT is tied up with UVa.

And while FSU and Clemson are football power, I don’t think they are attractive enough to start a new conference.

On the other hand, UNC and UVa can probably build a conference from scratch. NC State and VT will have to follow. And these four would be able to attract other programs.

(12-26-2023 12:51 AM)random asian guy Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 06:13 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 02:34 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(12-25-2023 02:14 PM)tigerscane Wrote:  Would be awesome if FSU and Memphis joined the Big 12 and Fox gives them Even more money with the adds... WHAT if Big 12 added FSU Clemson Virginia and Memphis..And Fox added even more money for the new adds...

Starting a new conference from scratch would be my preference if we are dreaming big. We already know that FSU and their closest allies will get split up if we leave the ACC, something I really don't want. I might hash out this idea later, but Memphis would not be ruled out, their athletics would make a solid addition to most any conference. The most important thing is a constitution that allows for flexibility in changing landscapes and does not hold members hostage if the relationship between the conference and members start to sour.

If FSU and Clemson decided to build a conferencne from scratch, I'd love to see VT join that league.

VT is tied up with UVa.

And while FSU and Clemson are football power, I don’t think they are attractive enough to start a new conference.

On the other hand, UNC and UVa can probably build a conference from scratch. NC State and VT will have to follow. And these four would be able to attract other programs.

You may be right. In that case, may as well stay where they are.

The $429m is based on 13 years at $33m per year. Isn't the contract weighted to pay more towards the end of the deal? If the contract increases by $2m per year the 13 year total would be $585 million. I can feel HokieMark digging through his spreadsheets now.

(12-27-2023 11:31 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  The $429m is based on 13 years at $33m per year. Isn't the contract weighted to pay more towards the end of the deal? If the contract increases by $2m per year the 13 year total would be $585 million. I can feel HokieMark digging through his spreadsheets now.

No need for spreadsheets. I've read that the average TV payout between 2023 and 2036 is (allegedly) $36M/year. Since Fiscal 2023 will almost certainly be over before this case is resolved, we'd be looking at just 12 years X $36M = $432M... so the $429M number is actually pretty close.

(12-27-2023 12:21 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(12-27-2023 11:31 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  The $429m is based on 13 years at $33m per year. Isn't the contract weighted to pay more towards the end of the deal? If the contract increases by $2m per year the 13 year total would be $585 million. I can feel HokieMark digging through his spreadsheets now.

No need for spreadsheets. I've read that the average TV payout between 2023 and 2036 is (allegedly) $36M/year. Since Fiscal 2023 will almost certainly be over before this case is resolved, we'd be looking at just 12 years X $36M = $432M... so the $429M number is actually pretty close.

If each team is making $36 million per year now (roughly)

and makes $36 million per year after FSU leaves.

Where are the damages?

(12-27-2023 04:23 PM)nole Wrote:  

(12-27-2023 12:21 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(12-27-2023 11:31 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  The $429m is based on 13 years at $33m per year. Isn't the contract weighted to pay more towards the end of the deal? If the contract increases by $2m per year the 13 year total would be $585 million. I can feel HokieMark digging through his spreadsheets now.

No need for spreadsheets. I've read that the average TV payout between 2023 and 2036 is (allegedly) $36M/year. Since Fiscal 2023 will almost certainly be over before this case is resolved, we'd be looking at just 12 years X $36M = $432M... so the $429M number is actually pretty close.

If each team is making $36 million per year now (roughly)

and makes $36 million per year after FSU leaves.

Where are the damages?

GoR is NOT about damages. It's about buying back something that FSU sold (their media rights). They could pay the exit fee and leave w/o paying anything for the GoR in theory -- they just wouldn't own the rights to show their sports on tv until July 2036.

I suppose FSU could try to get by on ticket sales alone, but that would seem like "cutting off your nose (the ACC TV revenue) to spite your face (the ACC)". But FSU is not being "held hostage" by any means.

(12-27-2023 05:11 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(12-27-2023 04:23 PM)nole Wrote:  

(12-27-2023 12:21 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(12-27-2023 11:31 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  The $429m is based on 13 years at $33m per year. Isn't the contract weighted to pay more towards the end of the deal? If the contract increases by $2m per year the 13 year total would be $585 million. I can feel HokieMark digging through his spreadsheets now.

No need for spreadsheets. I've read that the average TV payout between 2023 and 2036 is (allegedly) $36M/year. Since Fiscal 2023 will almost certainly be over before this case is resolved, we'd be looking at just 12 years X $36M = $432M... so the $429M number is actually pretty close.

If each team is making $36 million per year now (roughly)

and makes $36 million per year after FSU leaves.

Where are the damages?

GoR is NOT about damages. It's about buying back something that FSU sold (their media rights). They could pay the exit fee and leave w/o paying anything for the GoR in theory -- they just wouldn't own the rights to show their sports on tv until July 2036.

I suppose FSU could try to get by on ticket sales alone, but that would seem like "cutting off your nose (the ACC TV revenue) to spite your face (the ACC)". But FSU is not being "held hostage" by any means.

That is the theory. FSU's argument was that the amount can only be for 'damages' and anything beyond that is intended to penalize which would send to $0 (by FL law)

ACC rolling the dice it is accurate, FSU rolling the dice that it's not. If not, $0 GOR.

Will be very interesting to see.

An FSU fan forwarded a link to me that I find very interesting. It tells what actually happened with OUT.

If I'm reading it correctly, Texas and Oklahoma didn't actually buy back their media rights to get out of the GoR, they simply did what the document says: their SEC tV revenue next year will be forwarded to the Big XII. Of course, it's just for one year, which they can afford. The key statements are:

Quote:In other words, if a school changed conferences before June 30, 2025, the Big 12 – rather than the new conference – would be entitled to the TV rights fees for the school’s home games... Texas and Oklahoma will begin receiving full shares from the SEC in 2025-26, their “new member” agreements with the conference say.

For 2024-25, the agreements say, they [Texas and OU] won’t get any money from the SEC’s primary revenue-sharing pool...

In addition, Texas and OU (a) do not get any tv money or NCAA tournament money from the Big XII after this season:

Quote:By leaving a year early both institutions forego (fiscal year 2024-25) distributions from the Big 12. The ($100 million) also includes (the schools’) shares of the reduced payouts this (fiscal year) that all 10 continuing members will forego as a result of expansion.”

Texas and Oklahoma also will leave behind a total of at least $13 million in NCAA basketball tournament money over a six-year span...

link: https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nc...910157007/

This deal was possible in part because ESPN owns part of the Big XII's TV rights and all of the SEC's rights, so they could facilitate this transfer of money internally... but it doesn't rule out using a 3rd party to handle the same thing.

Of course, this doesn't help FSU at all. What this tells me is if they leave early, (a) they won't get any more ACC money, and (b) the TV money from the new conference would go to the ACC until 2036. They would have to survive on ticket sales and other conference revenues besides TV. Buying out the ACC might actually be better for FSU.