(10-27-2023 06:39 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 08:03 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 05:05 PM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 04:42 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 11:47 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  Notre Dame is basically an auxiliary member of the ACC now. They are serving their purpose. I really don't understand why the B1G is so infatuated with them. Their brand has been diminishing steadily compared to what it used to be back in the day. I suspect eventually the luster will continue to fade and the B1G will lose interest.

ND's last four football games were all placed in prime time by the OTA networks, NBC and ABC.

Why would they do that?

ND's last four games drew 10 million, 5 million, 5 million and 7 million viewers, respectively.

ND's record the past ten years:

2014--9-4
2015-10-3
2016- 4-8
2017-10-3
2018-12-1
2019-11-2
2020-10-2
2021-11-2
2022- 9-4
2023- 6-2 (to date)
________________

Total---92-30

ND made the four team playoff in 2018 and 2020.

ND won 30 ACC regular season games in a row until Louisville recently beat them.

ND fills its stadium every home game. ND brings lots of fans to away games, it even brought over 30,000 to Dublin, Ireland to start this season.

If that is fading away or a brand diminishing rapidly, then there are only five or six programs in America worth anything at all, then.

The rest are flotsam and should disband their programs, by your reasoning.

I respect the homerism. However, ND is not ever going back to its glory days. It is what it is.

Facts (such as television audience, won/lost records, playoff appearances and attendance) do not constitute "homerism

Kyle Kuric dunked all over ND's brand. It just hasn't been the same ever since.

Sorry, I have no idea who that is. Take care.

The portal is going to help ND get some southern players because they won't have to live up there but for 6mos to a year. Gone are the days of asking kids from Georgia and Texas to live in South Bend, IN for 4 years.

(10-27-2023 08:04 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-27-2023 06:39 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 08:03 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 05:05 PM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 04:42 PM)TerryD Wrote:  ND's last four football games were all placed in prime time by the OTA networks, NBC and ABC.

Why would they do that?

ND's last four games drew 10 million, 5 million, 5 million and 7 million viewers, respectively.

ND's record the past ten years:

2014--9-4
2015-10-3
2016- 4-8
2017-10-3
2018-12-1
2019-11-2
2020-10-2
2021-11-2
2022- 9-4
2023- 6-2 (to date)
________________

Total---92-30

ND made the four team playoff in 2018 and 2020.

ND won 30 ACC regular season games in a row until Louisville recently beat them.

ND fills its stadium every home game. ND brings lots of fans to away games, it even brought over 30,000 to Dublin, Ireland to start this season.

If that is fading away or a brand diminishing rapidly, then there are only five or six programs in America worth anything at all, then.

The rest are flotsam and should disband their programs, by your reasoning.

I respect the homerism. However, ND is not ever going back to its glory days. It is what it is.

Facts (such as television audience, won/lost records, playoff appearances and attendance) do not constitute "homerism

Kyle Kuric dunked all over ND's brand. It just hasn't been the same ever since.

Sorry, I have no idea who that is. Take care.

This guy:

(10-27-2023 11:04 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-27-2023 08:04 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-27-2023 06:39 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 08:03 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 05:05 PM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  I respect the homerism. However, ND is not ever going back to its glory days. It is what it is.

Facts (such as television audience, won/lost records, playoff appearances and attendance) do not constitute "homerism

Kyle Kuric dunked all over ND's brand. It just hasn't been the same ever since.

Sorry, I have no idea who that is. Take care.

This guy:

I don’t think Terry follows BB !
We need more Kyle Kuric type guys that take it to the opposition with heart

(10-27-2023 12:13 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  

(10-27-2023 11:04 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-27-2023 08:04 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-27-2023 06:39 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 08:03 PM)TerryD Wrote:  Facts (such as television audience, won/lost records, playoff appearances and attendance) do not constitute "homerism

Kyle Kuric dunked all over ND's brand. It just hasn't been the same ever since.

Sorry, I have no idea who that is. Take care.

This guy:

I don’t think Terry follows BB !
We need more Kyle Kuric type guys that take it to the opposition with heart

Yes we do. Hopefully Kenny Payne can find them and coach them up....

(10-27-2023 11:04 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-27-2023 08:04 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-27-2023 06:39 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 08:03 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-26-2023 05:05 PM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  I respect the homerism. However, ND is not ever going back to its glory days. It is what it is.

Facts (such as television audience, won/lost records, playoff appearances and attendance) do not constitute "homerism

Kyle Kuric dunked all over ND's brand. It just hasn't been the same ever since.

Sorry, I have no idea who that is. Take care.

This guy:

Still...no...idea.

A basketball player of some sort?

Okay.......

It will come down to $$$. Regardless of having an opportunity to play in the playoffs, if the P2 manage to absurdly increase $ per school and ND is unable to be in the ball park during their own TV deal - I could see them joining the B1G. Otherwise, maintain status quo.

I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

(10-29-2023 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

When the time is right, or the Irish have no other option, they will have to make a move. At that time the ACC won't need the pope's help.

(10-29-2023 10:57 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

When the time is right, or the Irish have no other option, they will have to make a move. At that time the ACC won't need the pope's help.

Aw, can't we just use part of the money from the 3 new schools to buy an indulgence?

(10-29-2023 04:30 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:57 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

When the time is right, or the Irish have no other option, they will have to make a move. At that time the ACC won't need the pope's help.

Aw, can't we just use part of the money from the 3 new schools to buy an indulgence?

(10-29-2023 04:30 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:57 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

When the time is right, or the Irish have no other option, they will have to make a move. At that time the ACC won't need the pope's help.

Aw, can't we just use part of the money from the 3 new schools to buy an indulgence?

I think that 'ND join the ACC for football' indulgence would be too pricey.

(10-29-2023 10:57 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

When the time is right, or the Irish have no other option, they will have to make a move. At that time the ACC won't need the pope's help.

I think Notre Dame will want to be a part of the conference that has bent over backwards to assist them; not try to bully and outmaneuver them. The ACC has accommodated the Irish wherever possible and Notre Dame has reciprocated as much as they could just short of joining. Both sides have benefited and will continue to do so. The ACC has positioned itself to be Notre Dame's first choice as a conference just on this goodwill relationship alone. Other considerations:

• Notre Dame doesn't care about making the most money.
• They have peer institutions academically they prefer to associate with.
• The ACC geographic footprint seems to benefit Notre Dame recruiting.
• Notre Dame has a bigger influence on conference politics in the ACC than they would in the B1G.
• ESPN would rather have Notre Dame Olympic sports than allow Fox to grab them up knowing it would hurt the ACC overall brand if lost.
  

(10-30-2023 04:57 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:57 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

When the time is right, or the Irish have no other option, they will have to make a move. At that time the ACC won't need the pope's help.

I think Notre Dame will want to be a part of the conference that has bent over backwards to assist them; not try to bully and outmaneuver them. The ACC has accommodated the Irish wherever possible and Notre Dame has reciprocated as much as they could just short of joining. Both sides have benefited and will continue to do so. The ACC has positioned itself to be Notre Dame's first choice as a conference just on this goodwill relationship alone. Other considerations:

• Notre Dame doesn't care about making the most money.
• They have peer institutions academically they prefer to associate with.
• The ACC geographic footprint seems to benefit Notre Dame recruiting.
• Notre Dame has a bigger influence on conference politics in the ACC than they would in the B1G.
• ESPN would rather have Notre Dame Olympic sports than allow Fox to grab them up knowing it would hurt the ACC overall brand if lost.
  

Good points!

Now that ESPN has lost the Big Ten, Notre Dame is their outpost in the Midwest - but what an outpost! Likewise, people forget that ESPN has literally invested billions of dollars in the ACC. I think they like having a piece of Notre Dame, and they like having the ACC as-is. ESPN doesn't want to let either go, IMO.

(10-30-2023 04:57 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:57 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

When the time is right, or the Irish have no other option, they will have to make a move. At that time the ACC won't need the pope's help.

I think Notre Dame will want to be a part of the conference that has bent over backwards to assist them; not try to bully and outmaneuver them. The ACC has accommodated the Irish wherever possible and Notre Dame has reciprocated as much as they could just short of joining. Both sides have benefited and will continue to do so. The ACC has positioned itself to be Notre Dame's first choice as a conference just on this goodwill relationship alone. Other considerations:

• Notre Dame doesn't care about making the most money.
• They have peer institutions academically they prefer to associate with.
• The ACC geographic footprint seems to benefit Notre Dame recruiting.
• Notre Dame has a bigger influence on conference politics in the ACC than they would in the B1G.
• ESPN would rather have Notre Dame Olympic sports than allow Fox to grab them up knowing it would hurt the ACC overall brand if lost.
  

"Their brand has been diminishing steadily compared to what it used to be back in the day. I suspect eventually the luster will continue to fade and the B1G will lose interest."

---LabradfordsTWill


Why in the world would the ACC even consider adding such a lackluster football program?

Seems like it wouldn't be worth the ACC's effort in adding it.

Why hasn't the ACC (along with the Big Ten) lost interest in such a moribund program by now?

Seems like the ACC has plenty of those already, no ??


P.S. Why would losing ND's other sports "hurt the ACC's brand"?

I thought I read on this board years ago that those sports "added nothing" ??

(10-30-2023 08:23 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(10-30-2023 04:57 AM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:57 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(10-29-2023 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'm not sure the Pope could help the ACC land Notre Dame!
(but it might be worth a shot)

When the time is right, or the Irish have no other option, they will have to make a move. At that time the ACC won't need the pope's help.

I think Notre Dame will want to be a part of the conference that has bent over backwards to assist them; not try to bully and outmaneuver them. The ACC has accommodated the Irish wherever possible and Notre Dame has reciprocated as much as they could just short of joining. Both sides have benefited and will continue to do so. The ACC has positioned itself to be Notre Dame's first choice as a conference just on this goodwill relationship alone. Other considerations:

• Notre Dame doesn't care about making the most money.
• They have peer institutions academically they prefer to associate with.
• The ACC geographic footprint seems to benefit Notre Dame recruiting.
• Notre Dame has a bigger influence on conference politics in the ACC than they would in the B1G.
• ESPN would rather have Notre Dame Olympic sports than allow Fox to grab them up knowing it would hurt the ACC overall brand if lost.
  

"Their brand has been diminishing steadily compared to what it used to be back in the day. I suspect eventually the luster will continue to fade and the B1G will lose interest."

---LabradfordsTWill


Why in the world would the ACC even consider adding such a lackluster football program?

Seems like it wouldn't be worth the ACC's effort in adding it.

Why hasn't the ACC (along with the Big Ten) lost interest in such a moribund program by now?

Seems like the ACC has plenty of those already, no ??


P.S. Why would losing ND's other sports "hurt the ACC's brand"?

I thought I read on this board years ago that those sports "added nothing" ??

Because to the ACC Notre Dame is still a big brand. To the B1G and SEC...not so much.

ND is still a huge brand. Are they as big as they were 30 years ago? I dont know. But I know the BIG still covets ND. I would not be shocked if the SEC would also covet ND, but I think the ACC has a better shot at getting ND football to join than the SEC and I dont think the ACC's chances of getting ND to join full time is very good.

(10-30-2023 11:35 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  ND is still a huge brand. Are they as big as they were 30 years ago? I dont know. But I know the BIG still covets ND. I would not be shocked if the SEC would also covet ND, but I think the ACC has a better shot at getting ND football to join than the SEC and I dont think the ACC's chances of getting ND to join full time is very good.

There is more value in destroying the ACC as competition to the SEC and the B1G than the added value of Notre Dame's brand. Yes Notre Dame is still a huge brand that the P2 could leverage for a few more dollars, but that brand is slowly diluting over time and the longer Notre Dame waits to join a conference, the harder it will be to enter a conference on its own terms. Today, Notre Dame can basically dictate what it wants to any conference they seek to join and can expect to get it. However, if the NCAA and the conferences ever decide to require a conference affiliation to qualify for the playoffs, or if the P4 break away from the NCAA, Notre Dame immediately enters an existential crisis where it will have to choose between independence with football mediocrity, or sign a contract with the devil to remain relevant.

(10-30-2023 12:04 PM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-30-2023 11:35 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  ND is still a huge brand. Are they as big as they were 30 years ago? I dont know. But I know the BIG still covets ND. I would not be shocked if the SEC would also covet ND, but I think the ACC has a better shot at getting ND football to join than the SEC and I dont think the ACC's chances of getting ND to join full time is very good.

There is more value in destroying the ACC as competition to the SEC and the B1G than the added value of Notre Dame's brand. Yes Notre Dame is still a huge brand that the P2 could leverage for a few more dollars, but that brand is slowly diluting over time and the longer Notre Dame waits to join a conference, the harder it will be to enter a conference on its own terms. Today, Notre Dame can basically dictate what it wants to any conference they seek to join and can expect to get it. However, if the NCAA and the conferences ever decide to require a conference affiliation to qualify for the playoffs, or if the P4 break away from the NCAA, Notre Dame immediately enters an existential crisis where it will have to choose between independence with football mediocrity, or sign a contract with the devil to remain relevant.

I've been saying that for years - holding on to independence will eventually cost ND their self-determination, which, I would think, is more valuable... but it's not my call.

As for value in destroying the ACC: value to whom? Certainly not ESPN!

(10-30-2023 12:04 PM)LaBradfordsTWill Wrote:  

(10-30-2023 11:35 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  ND is still a huge brand. Are they as big as they were 30 years ago? I dont know. But I know the BIG still covets ND. I would not be shocked if the SEC would also covet ND, but I think the ACC has a better shot at getting ND football to join than the SEC and I dont think the ACC's chances of getting ND to join full time is very good.

There is more value in destroying the ACC as competition to the SEC and the B1G than the added value of Notre Dame's brand. Yes Notre Dame is still a huge brand that the P2 could leverage for a few more dollars, but that brand is slowly diluting over time and the longer Notre Dame waits to join a conference, the harder it will be to enter a conference on its own terms. Today, Notre Dame can basically dictate what it wants to any conference they seek to join and can expect to get it. However, if the NCAA and the conferences ever decide to require a conference affiliation to qualify for the playoffs, or if the P4 break away from the NCAA, Notre Dame immediately enters an existential crisis where it will have to choose between independence with football mediocrity, or sign a contract with the devil to remain relevant.

But this all misses one salient point.

ND people still, today, overwhelmingly do not want the football program to ever join a conference, any conference, on any terms, at any time.

ND is not "waiting" to join a conference. It is resisting the idea completely.

There are no terms to be dictated that makes conference membership desirable to ND.

It doesn't want to enter one on its own terms.

It doesn't want to enter one, any one, at all, ever.

It just wants to stay independent, as is.