With all the realignment and additions, conferences are getting bigger, not smaller.

Should schedules expand beyond 12 games outside the playoffs etc.?

What are your thoughts?



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An extra game is needed, to offset all the new/extra time per game lost to increased commercials. :-{

No but out of conference games need to increase.
Gives the conferences bottom-feeders opportunities to get wins
Gives the conferences top teams opportunities to play harder games (play them near the end of the season if you don’t want to destroy your season week 1)

11 conference games is just boring

13 game regular season. 10 game conference season.

No more conference championship games. Participation in those will be determined more and more by tiebreakers.

(10-18-2023 08:38 AM)Bronco14 Wrote:  No but out of conference games need to increase.
Gives the conferences bottom-feeders opportunities to get wins
Gives the conferences top teams opportunities to play harder games (play them near the end of the season if you don’t want to destroy your season week 1)

11 conference games is just boring

The world is going the opposite direction at least at the top level.

The most valuable games for the Big Ten and SEC are their own conference games. Outside of playing a handful of elite brands like Notre Dame, why should the Big Ten and SEC be subsidizing other leagues more than they are already doing? This is even more of an issue as leagues get larger.

(10-18-2023 08:43 AM)tf8693 Wrote:  13 game regular season. 10 game conference season.

No more conference championship games. Participation in those will be determined more and more by tiebreakers.

You lost me at getting rid of CCGs. Those are getting close to being worth $100 million per year each for the Big Ten and SEC.

If you want changes to the current system, it needs to be 100% pure additive to the current system. Not a single cent of the current system will be given up (and nor should it if you’re looking at this from the P2 perspective that actually matters for change).

It seems like a reasonable trade-off. Get rid of the CCG exception and let everybody play 13 regular season games if they want.

Then expand the CFP to 16 teams with first round games on campus.

Conferences could still have a CCG if they want, but it would count as one of the 13 regular season games. Conferences may choose to make the last week a flex schedule. They still could schedule games conditionally in advance but conferences would have an option to flex teams to play other conference teams instead. [/align]

They already expanded the Playoff to 12 teams. Is there a breaking point where it's too many games, injuries become more of a factor, increased travel and missed class time?

Calendar feels pretty maxed out. I guess if everybody gave up bye weeks it might be feasible.

(10-18-2023 08:38 AM)Bronco14 Wrote:  No but out of conference games need to increase.
Gives the conferences bottom-feeders opportunities to get wins
Gives the conferences top teams opportunities to play harder games (play them near the end of the season if you don’t want to destroy your season week 1)

11 conference games is just boring

Hard disagree. Thesis:
1) More conference games = ability to maintain rivalries that can't be made permanent.
2) These conference games present more interest to fans who want to play their peers
3) OOC games in football outside of rivalry games are mainly pointless. They are too few to create valid data points to the strength of each individual conference
4) Under the current format, it doesn't make sense to play tough OOC games since they will only hinder playoff chances. Under the new system, each conf will be represented and it will be the determinant of the best team/conf.

(10-18-2023 08:50 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 08:38 AM)Bronco14 Wrote:  No but out of conference games need to increase.
Gives the conferences bottom-feeders opportunities to get wins
Gives the conferences top teams opportunities to play harder games (play them near the end of the season if you don’t want to destroy your season week 1)

11 conference games is just boring

The world is going the opposite direction at least at the top level.

The most valuable games for the Big Ten and SEC are their own conference games. Outside of playing a handful of elite brands like Notre Dame, why should the Big Ten and SEC be subsidizing other leagues more than they are already doing? This is even more of an issue as leagues get larger.

The same reason they always have: wins. But yes, it is the way it is going & a lot of people don't like it including their own teams fans. Might as well watch the NFL.

(10-18-2023 09:25 AM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote:  Calendar feels pretty maxed out. I guess if everybody gave up bye weeks it might be feasible.

Yes, byes weeks need to be removed with what the players are getting paid. There are 14 weeks between 8/27-11/25 and they should play each one or further expand into the 4 weeks of December. 18 weeks, 2 byes, 16 games. This will make it easier to create a schedule where each team plays it's conf opps every year.

(10-18-2023 09:25 AM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote:  Calendar feels pretty maxed out. I guess if everybody gave up bye weeks it might be feasible.

I don’t think the regular season will move up to 13 games. No one is giving up byes due to the safety reasons, too.

Having said that, turning the current Week 0 into the new Week 1 for everyone allows for a lot more flexibility (whether it’s a 2nd bye week during the season or the potential of adding another regular season game).

(10-18-2023 09:01 AM)goofus Wrote:  It seems like a reasonable trade-off. Get rid of the CCG exception and let everybody play 13 regular season games if they want.

Then expand the CFP to 16 teams with first round games on campus.

Conferences could still have a CCG if they want, but it would count as one of the 13 regular season games. Conferences may choose to make the last week a flex schedule. They still could schedule games conditionally in advance but conferences would have an option to flex teams to play other conference teams instead. [/align]

Everyone: getting rid of CCGs as an additional game beyond the regular season is a complete 100% non-starter. These are massive money-makers for the Big Ten and SEC in particular and its revenue where they get 100% (unlike the CFP). Making it into a 13th regular season game defeats so much of the value - leagues want their CCGs in time slots with as little competition as possible as opposed to competing with yet another full slate of regular season games.

We should all know this by now: if you are taking a financial advantage away (a CCG that is purely additive to the current regular season), then it’s DOA.

(10-18-2023 08:52 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 08:43 AM)tf8693 Wrote:  13 game regular season. 10 game conference season.

No more conference championship games. Participation in those will be determined more and more by tiebreakers.

You lost me at getting rid of CCGs. Those are getting close to being worth $100 million per year each for the Big Ten and SEC.

If you want changes to the current system, it needs to be 100% pure additive to the current system. Not a single cent of the current system will be given up (and nor should it if you’re looking at this from the P2 perspective that actually matters for change).

I think it's more of a best practice move than a monetary move. Conference Champ games ruin the regular season under the one division formats. Unless the teams didn't play each other there's no need to play again. Clemson lost to ND in 2020 but then beat them in December because apparently it counts more the 2nd time. This is an overall criticism of playoffs in general.

But of course they aren't going to remove them if the make money. The games make cents not sense.

(10-18-2023 09:42 AM)Bronco14 Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 08:50 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 08:38 AM)Bronco14 Wrote:  No but out of conference games need to increase.
Gives the conferences bottom-feeders opportunities to get wins
Gives the conferences top teams opportunities to play harder games (play them near the end of the season if you don’t want to destroy your season week 1)

11 conference games is just boring

The world is going the opposite direction at least at the top level.

The most valuable games for the Big Ten and SEC are their own conference games. Outside of playing a handful of elite brands like Notre Dame, why should the Big Ten and SEC be subsidizing other leagues more than they are already doing? This is even more of an issue as leagues get larger.

The same reason they always have: wins. But yes, it is the way it is going & a lot of people don't like it including their own teams fans. Might as well watch the NFL.

People here keep saying this as a criticism. When TV networks see college football looking more like the NFL, they get dollar signs in their eyes. The NFL is the most popular sport in America by several factors and the largest single potential source of new college football viewers is NFL fans. The TV networks are making a bet that a college football world that’s easier to follow for casual fans and being more NFL-like (e.g. the Big Ten and SEC being the equivalent of the NFC and AFC) will drive up viewership for top level college football games… and they’re probably going to be right. Everyone just needs to hope and pray that their own teams can be or stay in that top level.

(10-18-2023 09:50 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 09:01 AM)goofus Wrote:  It seems like a reasonable trade-off. Get rid of the CCG exception and let everybody play 13 regular season games if they want.

Then expand the CFP to 16 teams with first round games on campus.

Conferences could still have a CCG if they want, but it would count as one of the 13 regular season games. Conferences may choose to make the last week a flex schedule. They still could schedule games conditionally in advance but conferences would have an option to flex teams to play other conference teams instead. [/align]

Everyone: getting rid of CCGs as an additional game beyond the regular season is a complete 100% non-starter. These are massive money-makers for the Big Ten and SEC in particular and its revenue where they get 100% (unlike the CFP). Making it into a 13th regular season game defeats so much of the value - leagues want their CCGs in time slots with as little competition as possible as opposed to competing with yet another full slate of regular season games.

We should all know this by now: if you are taking a financial advantage away (a CCG that is purely additive to the current regular season), then it’s DOA.

Yeah, and even the Big 12 CCG draws huge ratings, I'm sure that ESPN/Fox want to keep that one.

Your idea of changing week 0 to week 1 has merit. 2 byes? Extra game per team? I think the extra game idea makes the most sense due to the likely increase in number of Conference games, but it would be nice if we could also fit in a 2nd bye for everyone.

(10-18-2023 09:50 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 09:01 AM)goofus Wrote:  It seems like a reasonable trade-off. Get rid of the CCG exception and let everybody play 13 regular season games if they want.

Then expand the CFP to 16 teams with first round games on campus.

Conferences could still have a CCG if they want, but it would count as one of the 13 regular season games. Conferences may choose to make the last week a flex schedule. They still could schedule games conditionally in advance but conferences would have an option to flex teams to play other conference teams instead. [/align]

Everyone: getting rid of CCGs as an additional game beyond the regular season is a complete 100% non-starter. These are massive money-makers for the Big Ten and SEC in particular and its revenue where they get 100% (unlike the CFP). Making it into a 13th regular season game defeats so much of the value - leagues want their CCGs in time slots with as little competition as possible as opposed to competing with yet another full slate of regular season games.

We should all know this by now: if you are taking a financial advantage away (a CCG that is purely additive to the current regular season), then it’s DOA.

Well, you never know. Nothing stays the same forever. Once the 12-team CFP starts, the debate is going to start if CCG are really necessary, but will probably stay as long as conference champions get a bye. But once the discussion starts to expand the CFP to 16, then the discussion becomes more serious about getting rid of the CCG. After all, once you expand to 16 and have no more byes, what do P4 teams gain by playing in the CCG? At the same time, if both teams end up in the playoffs anyway, will TV still be willing to pay enough for the game to be worth it? Try to keep an open mind. At some point, CCG may not be worth it anymore for P4 conferences.

(10-18-2023 09:25 AM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote:  Calendar feels pretty maxed out. I guess if everybody gave up bye weeks it might be feasible.

Right. They've got enough games. And look at who the P5 play ooc.

Do they really need another game against FCS Southwestern Northeast South Carolina St.?
Or against Kennesaw St. or Eastern Michigan or Sam Houston St.?

(10-18-2023 09:55 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 09:42 AM)Bronco14 Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 08:50 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-18-2023 08:38 AM)Bronco14 Wrote:  No but out of conference games need to increase.
Gives the conferences bottom-feeders opportunities to get wins
Gives the conferences top teams opportunities to play harder games (play them near the end of the season if you don’t want to destroy your season week 1)

11 conference games is just boring

The world is going the opposite direction at least at the top level.

The most valuable games for the Big Ten and SEC are their own conference games. Outside of playing a handful of elite brands like Notre Dame, why should the Big Ten and SEC be subsidizing other leagues more than they are already doing? This is even more of an issue as leagues get larger.

The same reason they always have: wins. But yes, it is the way it is going & a lot of people don't like it including their own teams fans. Might as well watch the NFL.

People here keep saying this as a criticism. When TV networks see college football looking more like the NFL, they get dollar signs in their eyes. The NFL is the most popular sport in America by several factors and the largest single potential source of new college football viewers is NFL fans. The TV networks are making a bet that a college football world that’s easier to follow for casual fans and being more NFL-like (e.g. the Big Ten and SEC being the equivalent of the NFC and AFC) will drive up viewership for top level college football games… and they’re probably going to be right. Everyone just needs to hope and pray that their own teams can be or stay in that top level.

You're not wrong. It's always been the vast vast majority of college football fans only care about the Top 10 teams.