(07-13-2023 02:39 PM)OldGoldnBlue Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:52 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:50 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  I'm starting to think it's going to be Colorado and UConn. Utah is stubborn, and the Arizona schools decide that if they stick together in the Pac-12, they will be ok.

The interview with the deputy big 12 commissioner makes it clear that UConn would only be considered as basketball-only, at least for right now. That may or may not be the Conference Office's preference, but they don't have the Presidential votes to get UConn in the big 12 for football.

That's correct, they do not have the votes as of a couple weeks ago. BY is pushing hard though. UConn admins promised massive commitments to football, including a new stadium closer to campus, and MSG as part of the Big 12 basketball tourney rotation. BY wants the Garden bad. I also have very serious doubts that UConn could get that football stadium funded, but they are making these types of promises.

MSG Tourney rotation???? Big East has that wrapped up. Ask the B1G. You'd need to alter your schedule and tournament dates - and trust me, if UCONN ever left the Big East, they would cut them no slack with access to the Garden - you'd be playing your games in Hartford.

(07-13-2023 02:43 PM)jacksfan29! Wrote:  Sorry, but I cannot fathom why they would want UCONN.

Perhaps you will when the ACC unravels and Yormark (or his successor) brings in Boston College and Syracuse to join their geographic neighbor and former Big East rival

(07-13-2023 03:44 PM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 02:43 PM)jacksfan29! Wrote:  Sorry, but I cannot fathom why they would want UCONN.

Perhaps you will when the ACC unravels and Yormark (or his successor) brings in Boston College and Syracuse to join their geographic neighbor and former Big East rival

Looks good on paper, but culturally the fanbases don't mix. If there are other Eastern seaboard options, schools looking to the Midwest will be passed over by recruits, students, and fans.

(07-13-2023 03:44 PM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 02:43 PM)jacksfan29! Wrote:  Sorry, but I cannot fathom why they would want UCONN.

Perhaps you will when the ACC unravels and Yormark (or his successor) brings in Boston College and Syracuse to join their geographic neighbor and former Big East rival

But wouldn't BC fit so well as another NE-based indy program with olympic sports in the BE?

(07-13-2023 01:09 PM)TeamRamRod1 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:23 PM)Glenn360 Wrote:  I disagree on his explanation for Texas/OU leaving being "good" it was just a personal swipe, Doesn't really explain why the most successful program is leaving for another conference.

texass leaving is the best thing to happen to the Big 12. They ran schools off and then wonder why the Big 12 isn't getting sec money.

Texas made you guys (and us) a whole lot of money over the decades. This opinion isn't popular with my friends on TexAgs, but I think that their problem is that they were just too big for all the little fish in a Conference like the SWC or even the big 12. If everyone was like KU or A&M then it would have worked, but there too many smaller programs. The good news for the big 12 is that after all that instability in 2010/11, the smaller programs (and added programs) invested aggressively in their Athletic Departments. They couldn't invest enough to keep OUT from leaving, but they probably invested enough to ensure a seat at the Big Table long term. As opposed to the Pac, which has spent decades allowing their great money programs to atrophy, with disastrous results.

(07-13-2023 01:29 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:17 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:01 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:52 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:50 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  I'm starting to think it's going to be Colorado and UConn. Utah is stubborn, and the Arizona schools decide that if they stick together in the Pac-12, they will be ok.

The interview with the deputy big 12 commissioner makes it clear that UConn would only be considered as basketball-only, at least for right now. That may or may not be the Conference Office's preference, but they don't have the Presidential votes to get UConn in the big 12 for football.

I listened to the interview and didn't get that at all. It sounded more like there would be no basketball-only invites. Yormark is the one pushing UConn. He's not alone: I believe a few schools are rowing in the direction- Kansas, WVU, and possibly a few others.

I agree with you that Yormark is pushing UConn and that he's not alone. However, he just doesn't have enough votes today to get them in today. Is it possible that they'll circle back if they only get 1 or 3 of the 4c? Yes, it might even get to a coin flip at that point to add a 4th from the g5 ranks. However, if they're going for a 4th that they know isn't additive today but they hope will be additive in 8 years...why UConn? Memphis has pretty decent basketball, far better football, and they're closer to the geographic center of the big 12 than any current big 12 team. SDSU has excellent basketball, far better football, and a far more-desirable market from a football perspective. The only reason UConn is coming up at all is their recent basketball title, but they won ONE NCAAT game in the previous 8 years COMBINED. Which version of UConn basketball would they be getting? It had better be the National Champs version because their football is significantly worse than an average g5 program, and it might be worse than ANY current AAC, MWC or SBC program.

The one thing that UConn brings that nobody else can is a very strong Northeast Presence. There are a whole lot of people in that region of the country, and Rutgers/Buffalo/BC aren't exactly locking it down. It won't be enough while their football is still so weak, but that does look to be changing, and I can absolutely see them getting the votes in the leadup to the new contract in 2031. But not today. If anything, UConn's rising status is a big reason to pass on other g5s that might look more appealing today, any spot that they give to a weaker program is one spot that can't go to one that is predicted to be more desirable down the road.

I need to speak on this. 1) Memphis football is NOT historically stronger than UConn football. Up until about 8 years, no one would in their right mind would have said this. UConn's significant dip between 2013-2021 (8 seasons) is the only reason you are saying this. Memphis was more known for bad football than UConn. Speaking of which, which version of Memphis football are we going to get: the one with a couple solid years in the AAC or the one with two decades of futility in CUSA?

On the San Diego market thing: SDSU owns two counties with less than 2 million people. People outside of those counties root for USC. UConn owns eight counties with over 3.6 million people.

It is obvious based on comments and official visits (multiple) that if a G5 program is selected, it will be UConn.

Valid points, and I'll admit that I haven't studied any of the top g5's extensively. You also left out UConn's quality academics. The big 12 told Memphis that they didn't add them in 2021 b/c of their academics fyi. UConn would immediately be at or near the top of the big 12 Academically, and they'd be only the 3rd full Flagship. However, they're also very distant from not only the center of mass of the big 12, but also from any potential new Pac adds (which seems like a prerequisite to get the big 12 to look at even 1 g5 until 2031). Any g5 add might serve to scare off Pac schools that are already leery of the big 12's truck stop reputation and 4 recent g5 adds, or if not then might take a spot that could have gone to an ACC school down the road.

(07-13-2023 12:23 PM)Glenn360 Wrote:  I disagree on his explanation for Texas/OU leaving being "good" it was just a personal swipe, Doesn't really explain why the most successful program is leaving for another conference.

But, as the "kids" would say, where's the lie? Neither OU nor UT have been in the Big XII title game in football since the COVID-affected 2020 season. So...?

(07-13-2023 01:31 PM)PlayBall! Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:09 PM)TeamRamRod1 Wrote:  [Texas] leaving is the best thing to happen to the Big 12. They ran schools off and then wonder why the Big 12 isn't getting sec money.

UT in the SEC will be interesting to watch. Not the games, but their fans' faces and chatter. How long until their boosters, after getting repeatedly stomped in the big conference games + not having outsized influence on SEC business matters, start publicly saying "I think we made a mistake in leaving our Big XII; at least we ran things there and had a clear path to NCs"?

As much as I want them to just get run over for the first 1/2 decade, especially by my Aggies, I also recall that everyone said that about us. Yet, we've done much better in our first SEC decade than we did in our last big 12 decade. Missouri didn't do better, but they started off just fine, too. They won the SEC East in 2 of their first 3 years. On the field, top to bottom, the SEC is certainly the best Football Conference, but I think that the big 12 is #2, and that jump in level of competition isn't insurmountable for a well-run big 12 program.

(07-13-2023 02:19 PM)Titans3775 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:29 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:17 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:01 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:52 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  The interview with the deputy big 12 commissioner makes it clear that UConn would only be considered as basketball-only, at least for right now. That may or may not be the Conference Office's preference, but they don't have the Presidential votes to get UConn in the big 12 for football.

I listened to the interview and didn't get that at all. It sounded more like there would be no basketball-only invites. Yormark is the one pushing UConn. He's not alone: I believe a few schools are rowing in the direction- Kansas, WVU, and possibly a few others.

I agree with you that Yormark is pushing UConn and that he's not alone. However, he just doesn't have enough votes today to get them in today. Is it possible that they'll circle back if they only get 1 or 3 of the 4c? Yes, it might even get to a coin flip at that point to add a 4th from the g5 ranks. However, if they're going for a 4th that they know isn't additive today but they hope will be additive in 8 years...why UConn? Memphis has pretty decent basketball, far better football, and they're closer to the geographic center of the big 12 than any current big 12 team. SDSU has excellent basketball, far better football, and a far more-desirable market from a football perspective. The only reason UConn is coming up at all is their recent basketball title, but they won ONE NCAAT game in the previous 8 years COMBINED. Which version of UConn basketball would they be getting? It had better be the National Champs version because their football is significantly worse than an average g5 program, and it might be worse than ANY current AAC, MWC or SBC program.

The one thing that UConn brings that nobody else can is a very strong Northeast Presence. There are a whole lot of people in that region of the country, and Rutgers/Buffalo/BC aren't exactly locking it down. It won't be enough while their football is still so weak, but that does look to be changing, and I can absolutely see them getting the votes in the leadup to the new contract in 2031. But not today. If anything, UConn's rising status is a big reason to pass on other g5s that might look more appealing today, any spot that they give to a weaker program is one spot that can't go to one that is predicted to be more desirable down the road.

I need to speak on this. 1) Memphis football is NOT historically stronger than UConn football. Up until about 8 years, no one would in their right mind would have said this. UConn's significant dip between 2013-2021 (8 seasons) is the only reason you are saying this. Memphis was more known for bad football than UConn. Speaking of which, which version of Memphis football are we going to get: the one with a couple solid years in the AAC or the one with two decades of futility in CUSA?

On the San Diego market thing: SDSU owns two counties with less than 2 million people. People outside of those counties root for USC. UConn owns eight counties with over 3.6 million people.

It is obvious based on comments and official visits (multiple) that if a G5 program is selected, it will be UConn.

Lol that is some interesting revisionist history you have going on there. Memphis football blows UConn away in nearly every category historical or not.

Memphis: .632 win percentage since joining the American
UConn: .235 win percentage during stint in the American

Memphis: .500 all time win percentage
UConn: .390 all time win percentage

Memphis: 9 bowls in the last 10 years
UConn: 2 bowls in the last 10 years

Memphis: 34,787 5Yr attendance average
UConn: 20,191 5Yr attendance average

Memphis: 60k seat stadium 2 miles from Campus
UConn: 40k seat stadium 23.3 miles from Campus

UConn is a program that needs to be killed, not promoted.

They're an academically strong flagship from a wealthy state, nobody is killing off their football unless the legislature decides to do so. UConn is still far behind other football programs, but they took about 5 steps forward last year in football, and they did their thing in basketball while they were at it. It remains to be seen if 2022/23 was the peak of their money sport success, or a new normal.

As for Memphis, it doesn't take much imagination to see them in any of the M3 down the road, but it will probably be as backfill for an M3 that's lost some schools in Realignment rather than as a 2nd or 4th to even out the numbers on a big move.

(07-13-2023 02:39 PM)OldGoldnBlue Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:52 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:50 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  I'm starting to think it's going to be Colorado and UConn. Utah is stubborn, and the Arizona schools decide that if they stick together in the Pac-12, they will be ok.

The interview with the deputy big 12 commissioner makes it clear that UConn would only be considered as basketball-only, at least for right now. That may or may not be the Conference Office's preference, but they don't have the Presidential votes to get UConn in the big 12 for football.

That's correct, they do not have the votes as of a couple weeks ago. BY is pushing hard though. UConn admins promised massive commitments to football, including a new stadium closer to campus, and MSG as part of the Big 12 basketball tourney rotation. BY wants the Garden bad. I also have very serious doubts that UConn could get that football stadium funded, but they are making these types of promises.

The problem on the stadium front is that it's much easier to get it funded if they're in the big 12, and it's much easier to get into the big 12 if the stadium is funded.

(07-13-2023 12:40 PM)Claw Wrote:  Best data I could find shows you why the PAC can't compete.

% of Population
Eastern 47.6
Central 29.1
Mountain 6.7
Pacific 16.6

This is why the B12 should be adding schools to the East rather than the West. TV money is based on numbers. The PAC has a numbers problem that it can't overcome.

Give this to Larry Scott the much despiséd: He recognised early the benefit in building the PAC as a Grand Western conference stretching from California to Texas.

(07-13-2023 12:25 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  He talked a bit about how he thinks "Texas would rather lose to Alabama than lose to KST", while "OU was more reluctant but worried about what their program and rivalries would look like long term if UT was gone". I don't see that at all, as much as I like to pile on them when they're weak, he's wrong in this instance. I think that, for both UT and OU, the desire to move was spurred by the significantly-higher expected media payouts, and that the specific choice of the SEC over the B1G was for competitive reasons. This time, the Pac had fallen too far behind and weren't even in the mix, same for the ACC once ND made it clear they weren't interested.

- also, his expectation of adding somebody out west is based upon "what schools are available", aka code for "P5 schools that are available".

- his comment about how football provides "75 cents on the dollar" and basketball "25 cents on the dollar" looks like moving the goalposts just a little bit. Generally it's considered as 80% or even more on football. If basketball gets to 75%, 70% or even more, then that's clearly a boon for his conference.

The Texas AD admitted they would rather lose to Alabama than TCU.

(07-13-2023 05:04 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:29 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:17 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 01:01 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:52 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  The interview with the deputy big 12 commissioner makes it clear that UConn would only be considered as basketball-only, at least for right now. That may or may not be the Conference Office's preference, but they don't have the Presidential votes to get UConn in the big 12 for football.

I listened to the interview and didn't get that at all. It sounded more like there would be no basketball-only invites. Yormark is the one pushing UConn. He's not alone: I believe a few schools are rowing in the direction- Kansas, WVU, and possibly a few others.

I agree with you that Yormark is pushing UConn and that he's not alone. However, he just doesn't have enough votes today to get them in today. Is it possible that they'll circle back if they only get 1 or 3 of the 4c? Yes, it might even get to a coin flip at that point to add a 4th from the g5 ranks. However, if they're going for a 4th that they know isn't additive today but they hope will be additive in 8 years...why UConn? Memphis has pretty decent basketball, far better football, and they're closer to the geographic center of the big 12 than any current big 12 team. SDSU has excellent basketball, far better football, and a far more-desirable market from a football perspective. The only reason UConn is coming up at all is their recent basketball title, but they won ONE NCAAT game in the previous 8 years COMBINED. Which version of UConn basketball would they be getting? It had better be the National Champs version because their football is significantly worse than an average g5 program, and it might be worse than ANY current AAC, MWC or SBC program.

The one thing that UConn brings that nobody else can is a very strong Northeast Presence. There are a whole lot of people in that region of the country, and Rutgers/Buffalo/BC aren't exactly locking it down. It won't be enough while their football is still so weak, but that does look to be changing, and I can absolutely see them getting the votes in the leadup to the new contract in 2031. But not today. If anything, UConn's rising status is a big reason to pass on other g5s that might look more appealing today, any spot that they give to a weaker program is one spot that can't go to one that is predicted to be more desirable down the road.

I need to speak on this. 1) Memphis football is NOT historically stronger than UConn football. Up until about 8 years, no one would in their right mind would have said this. UConn's significant dip between 2013-2021 (8 seasons) is the only reason you are saying this. Memphis was more known for bad football than UConn. Speaking of which, which version of Memphis football are we going to get: the one with a couple solid years in the AAC or the one with two decades of futility in CUSA?

On the San Diego market thing: SDSU owns two counties with less than 2 million people. People outside of those counties root for USC. UConn owns eight counties with over 3.6 million people.

It is obvious based on comments and official visits (multiple) that if a G5 program is selected, it will be UConn.

Valid points, and I'll admit that I haven't studied any of the top g5's extensively. You also left out UConn's quality academics. The big 12 told Memphis that they didn't add them in 2021 b/c of their academics fyi. UConn would immediately be at or near the top of the big 12 Academically, and they'd be only the 3rd full Flagship. However, they're also very distant from not only the center of mass of the big 12, but also from any potential new Pac adds (which seems like a prerequisite to get the big 12 to look at even 1 g5 until 2031). Any g5 add might serve to scare off Pac schools that are already leery of the big 12's truck stop reputation and 4 recent g5 adds, or if not then might take a spot that could have gone to an ACC school down the road.

Since then Memphis has earned R1 status as a University. FWIW,,,,

https://post.futurimedia.com/kfaqam/play...13075.html

Last few minutes, Dusty Dvoracek hints there's rumors that something may be coming.

(07-13-2023 05:15 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 02:39 PM)OldGoldnBlue Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:52 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:50 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  I'm starting to think it's going to be Colorado and UConn. Utah is stubborn, and the Arizona schools decide that if they stick together in the Pac-12, they will be ok.

The interview with the deputy big 12 commissioner makes it clear that UConn would only be considered as basketball-only, at least for right now. That may or may not be the Conference Office's preference, but they don't have the Presidential votes to get UConn in the big 12 for football.

That's correct, they do not have the votes as of a couple weeks ago. BY is pushing hard though. UConn admins promised massive commitments to football, including a new stadium closer to campus, and MSG as part of the Big 12 basketball tourney rotation. BY wants the Garden bad. I also have very serious doubts that UConn could get that football stadium funded, but they are making these types of promises.

The problem on the stadium front is that it's much easier to get it funded if they're in the big 12, and it's much easier to get into the big 12 if the stadium is funded.

I'm curious about why is it that every other program had to prove their commitment to becoming P5 ready but it's just assumed that UConn will,,,,only if they can get in first. That excuse was never good for anyone else, so what makes a quitter of big time football the exception?

(07-13-2023 07:44 PM)cc22 Wrote:  

Like I said earlier, it’s starting to look like Colorado and UConn.

(07-13-2023 07:43 PM)cc22 Wrote:  https://post.futurimedia.com/kfaqam/play...13075.html

Last few minutes, Dusty Dvoracek hints there's rumors that something may be coming.

Wow!! Now that is very intriguing.

(07-13-2023 07:43 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 05:15 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 02:39 PM)OldGoldnBlue Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:52 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:50 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  I'm starting to think it's going to be Colorado and UConn. Utah is stubborn, and the Arizona schools decide that if they stick together in the Pac-12, they will be ok.

The interview with the deputy big 12 commissioner makes it clear that UConn would only be considered as basketball-only, at least for right now. That may or may not be the Conference Office's preference, but they don't have the Presidential votes to get UConn in the big 12 for football.

That's correct, they do not have the votes as of a couple weeks ago. BY is pushing hard though. UConn admins promised massive commitments to football, including a new stadium closer to campus, and MSG as part of the Big 12 basketball tourney rotation. BY wants the Garden bad. I also have very serious doubts that UConn could get that football stadium funded, but they are making these types of promises.

The problem on the stadium front is that it's much easier to get it funded if they're in the big 12, and it's much easier to get into the big 12 if the stadium is funded.

I'm curious about why is it that every other program had to prove their commitment to becoming P5 ready but it's just assumed that UConn will,,,,only if they can get in first. That excuse was never good for anyone else, so what makes a quitter of big time football the exception?

UConn upgraded their football program by going independent. Independent schedule with 4 P5 opponents yearly > AAC schedule

(07-13-2023 08:00 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 07:43 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 05:15 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 02:39 PM)OldGoldnBlue Wrote:  

(07-13-2023 12:52 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  The interview with the deputy big 12 commissioner makes it clear that UConn would only be considered as basketball-only, at least for right now. That may or may not be the Conference Office's preference, but they don't have the Presidential votes to get UConn in the big 12 for football.

That's correct, they do not have the votes as of a couple weeks ago. BY is pushing hard though. UConn admins promised massive commitments to football, including a new stadium closer to campus, and MSG as part of the Big 12 basketball tourney rotation. BY wants the Garden bad. I also have very serious doubts that UConn could get that football stadium funded, but they are making these types of promises.

The problem on the stadium front is that it's much easier to get it funded if they're in the big 12, and it's much easier to get into the big 12 if the stadium is funded.

I'm curious about why is it that every other program had to prove their commitment to becoming P5 ready but it's just assumed that UConn will,,,,only if they can get in first. That excuse was never good for anyone else, so what makes a quitter of big time football the exception?

UConn upgraded their football program by going independent. Independent schedule with 4 P5 opponents yearly > AAC schedule

4 losses = 4 losses