I have had many a baby boomer tell me that things have significantly changed since when they were young. As a member of Generation X, I would agree. Things have changed!!! And not for the better! We wonder why Taiwan really didn't want our military help, but two things had to stand out in the Taiwan's president's mind:

1. Why is this country divided?? There was no possible way that she couldn't have noticed the division, IMHO. The President and the Secretary of State are saying one thing, the party in control of House of Representatives is saying something else, and the President's party in Congress has yet a third message. It then becmes clear that she just wanted to get what her country had already purchased and just leave the confusing mess in Washington behind!!

2. Taiwan's president was no doubt mindful that the US tends to meddle in the politics of other countries after a war has been won. We (the US) actually started meddling in the affairs of other countries. I love my dad who served in Vietnam and I am glad that the former Fort Rucker chose to rename itself after a Vietnam hero, Cmdr. Novosel, but even though I love & admire those people, I believe that we had no business getting into Vietnam. For crying out loud, Ho Chi Minh was viewed as the Vietnamese equivalent of President George Washington!!! How are we supposed to compete against that?? And we as a nation didn't agree with political ideology of Ngo Dien Diem, his opponent either, which was an oppresive dictatorship!! So what was the rationale for going into Vietnam again??

It seemed like losing in Vietnam helped us achieve victory in Desert Storm. President H.W. Bush outlined the objective for our troops, and we had no problems with our ally, Kuwait.

But then fast-forward to the War on Terror. We once again took up our meddling ways with Afghanistan & Iraq!! We did not meddle with Japan or West Germany, to the best of my knowledge, and they did well for themselves after we left. So, why didn't that happen in Afghanistan & Iraq??

We need to turn back to God, and be a good ally to Israel, no matter what.Israel has been a very good ally to us; why can't we be a good ally to them??
One more thought on my post: part of the reason why BRICS is succeeding, (the main reason is that God is letting it succeed) IMO is that we try to intimidate developing countries with weapons; China uses economic power more, IMO, although I'm sure and very confident that PRC uses weapons too, just not as often.
Another thing: we need less government, not more. Our Covid response was horrible, IMO, and former President Trump had very little to do with it Covid response joins Biden's growing list of failures, IMHO.

One point, we did meddle in Japan and Germany. hell, we basically rebuilt them both. The difference is those two were receptive to our aid. Afghanistan and to a lesser degree Iraq were, and mostly remain, shitehole countries who absolutely hate America and did everything they could to turn our largess into wasteful spending on unwilling recipients.

We never left Japan & Germany.

(07-05-2023 02:40 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  US tends to meddle in the politics of other countries after a war has been won.

My objective would be to have the strongest military force in the world (JFK's "2-1/2 wars" or ADM Jackie Fisher's "two power standard"), but never use it, because nobody dares pick a fight with us and we don't go around picking on them.

Quote:It seemed like losing in Vietnam helped us achieve victory in Desert Storm. President H.W. Bush outlined the objective for our troops, and we had no problems with our ally, Kuwait.

A Naval Reserve buddy of mine was activated for Desert Storm and served on the planning staff in Bahrain. He said that when Schwartzkopf gave them planning guidance, he told them, "If you can't work out how to handle a particular situation, decide how we would have handled it in Vietnam and do something different."

(07-05-2023 02:40 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  I have had many a baby boomer tell me that things have significantly changed since when they were young. As a member of Generation X, I would agree. Things have changed!!! And not for the better! We wonder why Taiwan really didn't want our military help, but two things had to stand out in the Taiwan's president's mind:

1. Why is this country divided?? There was no possible way that she couldn't have noticed the division, IMHO. The President and the Secretary of State are saying one thing, the party in control of House of Representatives is saying something else, and the President's party in Congress has yet a third message. It then becmes clear that she just wanted to get what her country had already purchased and just leave the confusing mess in Washington behind!!

2. Taiwan's president was no doubt mindful that the US tends to meddle in the politics of other countries after a war has been won. We (the US) actually started meddling in the affairs of other countries. I love my dad who served in Vietnam and I am glad that the former Fort Rucker chose to rename itself after a Vietnam hero, Cmdr. Novosel, but even though I love & admire those people, I believe that we had no business getting into Vietnam. For crying out loud, Ho Chi Minh was viewed as the Vietnamese equivalent of President George Washington!!! How are we supposed to compete against that?? And we as a nation didn't agree with political ideology of Ngo Dien Diem, his opponent either, which was an oppresive dictatorship!! So what was the rationale for going into Vietnam again??

It seemed like losing in Vietnam helped us achieve victory in Desert Storm. President H.W. Bush outlined the objective for our troops, and we had no problems with our ally, Kuwait.

But then fast-forward to the War on Terror. We once again took up our meddling ways with Afghanistan & Iraq!! We did not meddle with Japan or West Germany, to the best of my knowledge, and they did well for themselves after we left. So, why didn't that happen in Afghanistan & Iraq??

We need to turn back to God, and be a good ally to Israel, no matter what.Israel has been a very good ally to us; why can't we be a good ally to them??
One more thought on my post: part of the reason why BRICS is succeeding, (the main reason is that God is letting it succeed) IMO is that we try to intimidate developing countries with weapons; China uses economic power more, IMO, although I'm sure and very confident that PRC uses weapons too, just not as often.
Another thing: we need less government, not more. Our Covid response was horrible, IMO, and former President Trump had very little to do with it Covid response joins Biden's growing list of failures, IMHO.

I agree with you on the first bolded part. I disagree with you on the second. Israel is not a saintly ally. They blew up the USS Liberty back in the 70's (which the survivors of the attack claim), and they constantly spy on us. They spied on us alot during Trump's administration. We need to stop giving them, as well as all other countries foreign aid. We are in debt that we'll never pay back. Plus, some of these countries that we're giving aid to don't like us. Why in the world would you give aid to a country that doesn't like you? Also, Israel has been around for 80 years. If they haven't learned how to defend themselves from being Islamified, that's on them.

(07-05-2023 06:48 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  We never left Japan & Germany.

I think it's high time that our military leave those countries. They're more than capable of defending themselves. They don't need us to do their dirty work. If they can't defend themselves, that's on them.

(07-05-2023 07:56 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 06:48 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  We never left Japan & Germany.

I think it's high time that our military leave those countries. They're more than capable of defending themselves. They don't need us to do their dirty work. If they can't defend themselves, that's on them.

Naive much? The US Gov is all about power even over us and they don't care how intrusive they are over us much less some other country.

Vietnam was a money maker period. Ukraine today is a money maker for those in power. The politicians don't care about winning wars and they especially don't care who gets killed as long as its not theirs.

Seriously if the US was about winning a war they would send everything we had a said enemy and reload as fast as we could. No, as my brother in law who has worked at the Pentagon says over and over just follow the money and it will explain why the US Gov is doing what it is doing.

Politicians will NEVER win a war especially using soldiers as police. I can't think of anything more ignorant. Soldiers are trained to kill NOT keep the peace in a hostile environment.

He tells me this transgender is also going to be a huge money maker. Go figure. We all need more freaks in this country.

If you don't believe me just SEE JOE BIDEN checking the time on his watch at a serviceman's funeral.

(07-05-2023 06:15 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  One point, we did meddle in Japan and Germany. hell, we basically rebuilt them both. The difference is those two were receptive to our aid. Afghanistan and to a lesser degree Iraq were, and mostly remain, shitehole countries who absolutely hate America and did everything they could to turn our largess into wasteful spending on unwilling recipients.

Yes. We completely took over Japan and Germany. General MacArthur ran Japan. My grandfather served in the occupation. Perhaps our hubris from the success of rebuilding a western country, Germany, and an eastern country, Japan, in our image lead us to believe we could rebuild 3rd world countries as Vietnam and Iraq and Afghanistan were. We were successful in South Korea, but it wasn't as tribal as Iraq and Afghanistan and not as divided as Vietnam.

(07-05-2023 07:42 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 02:40 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  I have had many a baby boomer tell me that things have significantly changed since when they were young. As a member of Generation X, I would agree. Things have changed!!! And not for the better! We wonder why Taiwan really didn't want our military help, but two things had to stand out in the Taiwan's president's mind:

1. Why is this country divided?? There was no possible way that she couldn't have noticed the division, IMHO. The President and the Secretary of State are saying one thing, the party in control of House of Representatives is saying something else, and the President's party in Congress has yet a third message. It then becmes clear that she just wanted to get what her country had already purchased and just leave the confusing mess in Washington behind!!

2. Taiwan's president was no doubt mindful that the US tends to meddle in the politics of other countries after a war has been won. We (the US) actually started meddling in the affairs of other countries. I love my dad who served in Vietnam and I am glad that the former Fort Rucker chose to rename itself after a Vietnam hero, Cmdr. Novosel, but even though I love & admire those people, I believe that we had no business getting into Vietnam. For crying out loud, Ho Chi Minh was viewed as the Vietnamese equivalent of President George Washington!!! How are we supposed to compete against that?? And we as a nation didn't agree with political ideology of Ngo Dien Diem, his opponent either, which was an oppresive dictatorship!! So what was the rationale for going into Vietnam again??

It seemed like losing in Vietnam helped us achieve victory in Desert Storm. President H.W. Bush outlined the objective for our troops, and we had no problems with our ally, Kuwait.

But then fast-forward to the War on Terror. We once again took up our meddling ways with Afghanistan & Iraq!! We did not meddle with Japan or West Germany, to the best of my knowledge, and they did well for themselves after we left. So, why didn't that happen in Afghanistan & Iraq??

We need to turn back to God, and be a good ally to Israel, no matter what.Israel has been a very good ally to us; why can't we be a good ally to them??
One more thought on my post: part of the reason why BRICS is succeeding, (the main reason is that God is letting it succeed) IMO is that we try to intimidate developing countries with weapons; China uses economic power more, IMO, although I'm sure and very confident that PRC uses weapons too, just not as often.
Another thing: we need less government, not more. Our Covid response was horrible, IMO, and former President Trump had very little to do with it Covid response joins Biden's growing list of failures, IMHO.

I agree with you on the first bolded part. I disagree with you on the second. Israel is not a saintly ally. They blew up the USS Liberty back in the 70's (which the survivors of the attack claim), and they constantly spy on us. They spied on us alot during Trump's administration. We need to stop giving them, as well as all other countries foreign aid. We are in debt that we'll never pay back. Plus, some of these countries that we're giving aid to don't like us. Why in the world would you give aid to a country that doesn't like you? Also, Israel has been around for 80 years. If they haven't learned how to defend themselves from being Islamified, that's on them.

I think we need to help Israel because its the right thing to do. But Andy is right that Israel will do its own thing. Its someone who sees things much like we do and will work with us, but is NOT an ally.

1. We didn't lose in Vietnam. We could have rolled through that place in a month had we chosen to. None of the idiots (i.e. democrats) in charge back then played to win. Then we just basically quit.

2. Had we not "meddled" in Japan and Germany we'd have had to fight two WWII's. Malice towards none almost led to two civil wars.

3. Our country is so divided today because democrats are trying to stomp out opposition and there are people who will actually fight back. Most countries just roll over and let dictators have power.

(07-05-2023 07:56 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 06:48 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  We never left Japan & Germany.

I think it's high time that our military leave those countries. They're more than capable of defending themselves. They don't need us to do their dirty work. If they can't defend themselves, that's on them.

So, at a time when Russia is invading its neighbors & China is looking to exert dominance in the Pacific, you’re advocating the US leave Europe & Asia? Bizarre.

(07-05-2023 09:44 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 07:56 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 06:48 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  We never left Japan & Germany.

I think it's high time that our military leave those countries. They're more than capable of defending themselves. They don't need us to do their dirty work. If they can't defend themselves, that's on them.

So, at a time when Russia is invading its neighbors & China is looking to exert dominance in the Pacific, you’re advocating the US leave Europe & Asia? Bizarre.

Yes. Why is that complicated

(07-05-2023 09:50 AM)shere khan Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 09:44 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 07:56 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 06:48 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  We never left Japan & Germany.

I think it's high time that our military leave those countries. They're more than capable of defending themselves. They don't need us to do their dirty work. If they can't defend themselves, that's on them.

So, at a time when Russia is invading its neighbors & China is looking to exert dominance in the Pacific, you’re advocating the US leave Europe & Asia? Bizarre.

Yes. Why is that complicated

They don't understand that none of those countries belong to us.

(07-05-2023 10:00 AM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 09:50 AM)shere khan Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 09:44 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 07:56 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(07-05-2023 06:48 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  We never left Japan & Germany.

I think it's high time that our military leave those countries. They're more than capable of defending themselves. They don't need us to do their dirty work. If they can't defend themselves, that's on them.

So, at a time when Russia is invading its neighbors & China is looking to exert dominance in the Pacific, you’re advocating the US leave Europe & Asia? Bizarre.

Yes. Why is that complicated

They don't understand that none of those countries belong to us.

What you fail to understand is where democracy & free trade flourish so do peace & prosperity; and that stability is 100% in our national security interests. Sure, sometimes we miss, like in Iraq; but there is no question American influence in S.Korea kept the country from mirroring the North. Same for US influence in Japan & Germany. Compare the East & West, and there is no comparison in the standard of living. I’m sorry, but abandoning democratic allies & leaving them to fend off imperialistic autocratic dictators is not who we are, and not in our national security interests.

You could put a dome over this country and we'd all be fine. We have all the natural resources we could possibly need and we're basically uninvadable. Cootchie Cootchie Coo ma'am.

So build the strongest military force in the world, bar none, and never have to use it, because nobody dares pick a fight with us, and we don't go around picking on them.