(05-09-2023 12:16 PM)Big Red Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 11:23 AM)chihuskie Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 09:00 AM)Big Red Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 08:23 AM)chihuskie Wrote:  

(05-08-2023 08:12 PM)HuskieDave Wrote:  You could make the exact same argument against any sport other than football and basketball, and, we lose money on both of those sports. Why is baseball any worse than softball, wrestling, or any of the other “Olympic” sports. Does womens track & field makes sense? Or gymnastics?

Would you have us completely eliminating athletics, as we don’t have a single program that is financially self-sustaining.

Numerous northern mid-major schools have been very successful in baseball. Kent State and Wright State would be just two examples.

I believe it is worse than softball because baseball is a men's sport. So having baseball RAISES Title IX requirements and causes Athletics to maintain other women's sports to balance out all the scholarship and other resources that go into baseball. SO it is a double whammy on budgets.
(Feel free to correct me if I am incorrect.)

It is worse than wrestling because wrestling actually has been successful at NIU (and uses les resources-- all you need is a mat and a gym-- and we already have both. Travel costs are less.)

Women's track and field... I don't know. If it is not resource intensive it can make sense. But again, it is probably not a great fit for NIU's climate. Unless it is required because of Title IX issues, that is not a clearly necessary program to maintain.

"Gymnastics" - I assume you mean women's gymnastics. I believe women's gymnastics has had success. I see no climatic or other reason why not to have such a program.

Note: I didn't say get rid of baseball because it is not financially self-sustaining. I just asked, can the resources used on baseball be better spent elsewhere?
I seriously would love to hear STF address that question.

I had to take classes on this stuff back in my major although my memory could be fuzzy, but I always understood it that you can't comply with Title IX by eliminating a men's sport. Ie., if you are out of compliance, simply cutting baseball(or any men's sport) to gain compliance is actually a violation of the law as it is written.

Now...how it is written and how it is applied (or allowed to exist) are two separate things. I fully understand that.

And I could be wrong, but that is how my old memory is recalling the verbiage of the law.

See-- that's why I said "feel free to correct me." I do think Title IX specifies that you can't get there by cutting men's programs. (Though NIU did cut baseball in the mid 80's (post Title IX) and then brought it back. So, they could have not brought it back.) Thanks for pointing that out, though.

Yeah, I'm not sure the impetus for bringing it back. Maybe times were better back then. We clearly weren't in a financial hole like we are now and I'm sure most of today's issues couldn't have been foreseen.

Probably adding women's field hockey or something would be better but obvioulsy, it's an added cost. Maybe adding field hockey while simultaneously eliminating baseball satisfies the law?

I don't know. The law is hard to manage for any school with football and they make if hard for financially strapped schools to comply if they aren't already in compliance.

Baseball was brought back because the MAC made it a requirement for our re-admission to the conference. At the time, baseball was a required sport in the MAC. Obviously, that is no longer a requirement.

(05-09-2023 12:31 PM)HuskieDave Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 12:16 PM)Big Red Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 11:23 AM)chihuskie Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 09:00 AM)Big Red Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 08:23 AM)chihuskie Wrote:  I believe it is worse than softball because baseball is a men's sport. So having baseball RAISES Title IX requirements and causes Athletics to maintain other women's sports to balance out all the scholarship and other resources that go into baseball. SO it is a double whammy on budgets.
(Feel free to correct me if I am incorrect.)

It is worse than wrestling because wrestling actually has been successful at NIU (and uses les resources-- all you need is a mat and a gym-- and we already have both. Travel costs are less.)

Women's track and field... I don't know. If it is not resource intensive it can make sense. But again, it is probably not a great fit for NIU's climate. Unless it is required because of Title IX issues, that is not a clearly necessary program to maintain.

"Gymnastics" - I assume you mean women's gymnastics. I believe women's gymnastics has had success. I see no climatic or other reason why not to have such a program.

Note: I didn't say get rid of baseball because it is not financially self-sustaining. I just asked, can the resources used on baseball be better spent elsewhere?
I seriously would love to hear STF address that question.

I had to take classes on this stuff back in my major although my memory could be fuzzy, but I always understood it that you can't comply with Title IX by eliminating a men's sport. Ie., if you are out of compliance, simply cutting baseball(or any men's sport) to gain compliance is actually a violation of the law as it is written.

Now...how it is written and how it is applied (or allowed to exist) are two separate things. I fully understand that.

And I could be wrong, but that is how my old memory is recalling the verbiage of the law.

See-- that's why I said "feel free to correct me." I do think Title IX specifies that you can't get there by cutting men's programs. (Though NIU did cut baseball in the mid 80's (post Title IX) and then brought it back. So, they could have not brought it back.) Thanks for pointing that out, though.

Yeah, I'm not sure the impetus for bringing it back. Maybe times were better back then. We clearly weren't in a financial hole like we are now and I'm sure most of today's issues couldn't have been foreseen.

Probably adding women's field hockey or something would be better but obvioulsy, it's an added cost. Maybe adding field hockey while simultaneously eliminating baseball satisfies the law?

I don't know. The law is hard to manage for any school with football and they make if hard for financially strapped schools to comply if they aren't already in compliance.

Baseball was brought back because the MAC made it a requirement for our re-admission to the conference. At the time, baseball was a required sport in the MAC. Obviously, that is no longer a requirement.

That's right. I do remember that being a thing.

Thanks for the reminder.

(05-08-2023 08:25 PM)7 Wrote:  Huskiedave is right, but I think coaching moves should be expected to be a little slower than they are for the revenue generating ones.

That’s excludes NIU sports as a whole.

(05-10-2023 10:13 PM)randyfensfanclub1 Wrote:  

(05-08-2023 08:25 PM)7 Wrote:  Huskiedave is right, but I think coaching moves should be expected to be a little slower than they are for the revenue generating ones.

That’s excludes NIU sports as a whole.

lmao ****