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When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024
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GreenBison Offline
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Post: #101
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-25-2023 09:47 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  
(01-25-2023 08:13 AM)GreenBison Wrote:  
(01-24-2023 06:27 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  
(01-24-2023 05:46 PM)TOPSTRAIGHT Wrote:  Where are all the Austin Peay fan posters??? Crickets.03-shhhh

There is one posting on this board? Not that I can recall.

Austin Peay is what would happen if Austin Powers and Olive Oyl had a baby.

Well play with the Popeye reference.

I try.

[Image: 6000aa47fa808f001df0474f.jpg]
(This post was last modified: 01-25-2023 11:20 AM by GreenBison.)
01-25-2023 11:19 AM
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GTFletch Offline
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Post: #102
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-22-2023 02:11 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Will the Sunbelt take them and EKU as the 15th and 16th members? I doubt MTSU is going to allow another school close to Nashville to be in the same conference as them, but I could be wrong. They may have a better relationship with each other than WKU has with EKU.

I think it may be CUSA that invites Austin Peay
01-25-2023 08:52 PM
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TOPSTRAIGHT Offline
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Post: #103
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-25-2023 08:52 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-22-2023 02:11 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Will the Sunbelt take them and EKU as the 15th and 16th members? I doubt MTSU is going to allow another school close to Nashville to be in the same conference as them, but I could be wrong. They may have a better relationship with each other than WKU has with EKU.

I think it may be CUSA that invites Austin Peay

Trolling or just lack of knowledge?
01-25-2023 10:26 PM
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andybible1995 Offline
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Post: #104
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-25-2023 08:52 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-22-2023 02:11 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Will the Sunbelt take them and EKU as the 15th and 16th members? I doubt MTSU is going to allow another school close to Nashville to be in the same conference as them, but I could be wrong. They may have a better relationship with each other than WKU has with EKU.

I think it may be CUSA that invites Austin Peay

The only way Austin Peay and or Eastern Kentucky would join the Conference USA is if Middle Tennessee and Western Kentucky left. The latter is going to block the former from joining while they're in the conference.
01-26-2023 04:40 AM
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GTFletch Offline
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Post: #105
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-25-2023 10:26 PM)TOPSTRAIGHT Wrote:  
(01-25-2023 08:52 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-22-2023 02:11 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Will the Sunbelt take them and EKU as the 15th and 16th members? I doubt MTSU is going to allow another school close to Nashville to be in the same conference as them, but I could be wrong. They may have a better relationship with each other than WKU has with EKU.

I think it may be CUSA that invites Austin Peay

Trolling or just lack of knowledge?
From the Article: Now the conference is on the offensive and trying to be optimistic about the future. It plans to expand, with Kennesaw State a top target and more potential additions to come down the road.

Tarleton State (Stephenville, Texas) and Eastern Kentucky are contenders to join Conference USA as well, sources said. Tarleton State is midway through its four-year reclassification from Division II to Division I, but it has a stadium, resources and an aggressive administration. EKU was a finalist to join the Sun Belt in 2015, but the spot went to Coastal Carolina. WKU president and C-USA board chair Tim Caboni said any notion or rumor that WKU would block EKU from joining the conference is “nonsense.”

Stephen F. Austin and McNeese State have also been in the mix for C-USA, but it’s not believed they have the resources to match the others as serious candidates, according to league sources. Missouri State has not been discussed as much, either.


“I think we get to 10 for sure and then the discussions are about 12,” WKU’s Stewart said.




Link
https://theathletic.com/3682027/2022/10/...-football/
(This post was last modified: 01-27-2023 07:55 AM by GTFletch.)
01-27-2023 07:51 AM
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GTFletch Offline
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Post: #106
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
FWIW: if the PAC takes any MTW Schools, you could see NMSU & UTEP as targets. If they were to join the MTNWest, I think the addition of a few of the following schools like EKU, Austin Peay, Tarleton State, Stephen F. Austin and McNeese State will happen faster because they want to be at 10. If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.
(This post was last modified: 01-27-2023 07:59 AM by GTFletch.)
01-27-2023 07:58 AM
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DoubleRSU Offline
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Post: #107
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-26-2023 04:40 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  
(01-25-2023 08:52 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-22-2023 02:11 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Will the Sunbelt take them and EKU as the 15th and 16th members? I doubt MTSU is going to allow another school close to Nashville to be in the same conference as them, but I could be wrong. They may have a better relationship with each other than WKU has with EKU.

I think it may be CUSA that invites Austin Peay

The only way Austin Peay and or Eastern Kentucky would join the Conference USA is if Middle Tennessee and Western Kentucky left. The latter is going to block the former from joining while they're in the conference.

That’s not how it works. The conference will expand with the best candidates and the “school with a grudge” will always acquiesce and vote them in. You think A&M wanted UT and OU in the SEC? No, but they did what's best for the conference.
01-27-2023 08:59 AM
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #108
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 08:59 AM)DoubleRSU Wrote:  
(01-26-2023 04:40 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  
(01-25-2023 08:52 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-22-2023 02:11 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Will the Sunbelt take them and EKU as the 15th and 16th members? I doubt MTSU is going to allow another school close to Nashville to be in the same conference as them, but I could be wrong. They may have a better relationship with each other than WKU has with EKU.

I think it may be CUSA that invites Austin Peay

The only way Austin Peay and or Eastern Kentucky would join the Conference USA is if Middle Tennessee and Western Kentucky left. The latter is going to block the former from joining while they're in the conference.

That’s not how it works. The conference will expand with the best candidates and the “school with a grudge” will always acquiesce and vote them in. You think A&M wanted UT and OU in the SEC? No, but they did what's best for the conference.

I think that plays out very differently at different levels.

A Texas isn't going to get blocked, even by Texas A&M.
But a UCF 10-15 years ago can absolutely get blocked by a South Florida. A Temple can get blocked by a Villanova, until the conference is in survival mode.

I don't think that Eastern Kentucky and Austin Peay are the sort of must-have schools to override a blackball. CUSA can move down the list and take Tarleton STate and Missouri State or whoever.
01-27-2023 09:12 AM
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bill dazzle Offline
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Post: #109
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
Austin Peay is noteworthy in that its enrollment is growing fast and it is located in a small city that is booming. Following its recent evolution has been interesting. For craft beer fans, Montgomery County (of which Clarksville is the county seat) is home to seven breweries. The county population in 2020 was 220,000. That's more than three breweries for every 100,000 people — not bad at all for a small city. (For comparison, New York offers 13 breweries, or 0.16 breweries per 100,000 residents.)

https://www.move.org/the-best-us-cities-...er-lovers/
01-27-2023 09:33 AM
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Yosef181 Offline
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Post: #110
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 08:59 AM)DoubleRSU Wrote:  
(01-26-2023 04:40 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  
(01-25-2023 08:52 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-22-2023 02:11 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Will the Sunbelt take them and EKU as the 15th and 16th members? I doubt MTSU is going to allow another school close to Nashville to be in the same conference as them, but I could be wrong. They may have a better relationship with each other than WKU has with EKU.

I think it may be CUSA that invites Austin Peay

The only way Austin Peay and or Eastern Kentucky would join the Conference USA is if Middle Tennessee and Western Kentucky left. The latter is going to block the former from joining while they're in the conference.

That’s not how it works. The conference will expand with the best candidates and the “school with a grudge” will always acquiesce and vote them in. You think A&M wanted UT and OU in the SEC? No, but they did what's best for the conference.

Tell that to ECU, who was blocked by Louisville from becoming a founding member of Conference USA. Louisville said they would leave the conference if ECU was allowed to join.
01-27-2023 09:42 AM
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inutech Offline
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Post: #111
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 07:58 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.

Why?
01-27-2023 10:02 AM
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GTFletch Offline
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Post: #112
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 10:02 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 07:58 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.

Why?
Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!
(This post was last modified: 01-27-2023 10:16 AM by GTFletch.)
01-27-2023 10:14 AM
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inutech Offline
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Post: #113
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 10:14 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:02 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 07:58 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.

Why?
Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!

Per school?

I still don't understand the continued insistence that more inventory leads to more money. The conference is just the teams in it. Nobody cares about the total conference contract - it only matters per school.

If CUSA could get $100 for ten schools and $120 for twelve schools, that's "more money in the next deal" technically. But who is that better for? If you could get $100 for ten schools but $110 for 12 schools, that's also technically "more money in the next deal" but is actually worse for everyone (except maybe the 11th and 12th schools, depending on what they'd have made in their previous conference).


Y'all have heard of division right? That's still a thing in math?
01-27-2023 10:51 AM
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #114
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 10:14 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:02 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 07:58 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.

Why?
Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!

But more inventory also means more mouths to feed. The CUSA deal is let's say $7.5M for the 10 schools in the tent as of Nov 2022. If you expand by 2 schools, I'm not at all sure that the value of the deal increases by 20%. CUSA is already having to put games on Tuesday and Wednesday nights. Where and when are they going to show a 6th game every week (or a 5th game if the plan is to have October bye weeks)?
01-27-2023 10:52 AM
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Post: #115
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 10:51 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:14 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:02 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 07:58 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.

Why?
Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!

Per school?

I still don't understand the continued insistence that more inventory leads to more money. The conference is just the teams in it. Nobody cares about the total conference contract - it only matters per school.

If CUSA could get $100 for ten schools and $120 for twelve schools, that's "more money in the next deal" technically. But who is that better for? If you could get $100 for ten schools but $110 for 12 schools, that's also technically "more money in the next deal" but is actually worse for everyone (except maybe the 11th and 12th schools, depending on what they'd have made in their previous conference).


Y'all have heard of division right? That's still a thing in math?

Right.. it seems a lot of the people that advocate for more seemingly unnecessary FCS moveups always claim that more schools will make more money. The schools that might have been capable of adding value have already moved up.
01-27-2023 11:04 AM
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inutech Offline
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Post: #116
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 10:52 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:14 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:02 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 07:58 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.

Why?
Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!

But more inventory also means more mouths to feed. The CUSA deal is let's say $7.5M for the 10 schools in the tent as of Nov 2022. If you expand by 2 schools, I'm not at all sure that the value of the deal increases by 20%. CUSA is already having to put games on Tuesday and Wednesday nights. Where and when are they going to show a 6th game every week (or a 5th game if the plan is to have October bye weeks)?

As someone who will benefit directly from the weeknight games, but views them (in themselves) as a bad thing for the program over-all, and as someone who hasn't seen the contract to know how this would work, and as someone who doesn't have to provide socks for the cross-country team or fly the volleyball team to Miami - I would happily trade some amount of the money per school for fewer weeknight games (for my school).

Unfortunately, I don't think it works quite that way.

But if it did, you could sell that to me a lot easier than "more teams = more inventory = more overall money for the whole deal." Because logic. And division. And a clear benefit (as I see it) in exchange for what you'd be giving up.

You can also make (potentially) an argument for the same money per school, but travel cost savings due to divisional scheduling with additional teams (but I'm going to want to see the receipts before I am convinced it's worth it).
01-27-2023 11:13 AM
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #117
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 11:13 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:52 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:14 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:02 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 07:58 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.

Why?
Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!

But more inventory also means more mouths to feed. The CUSA deal is let's say $7.5M for the 10 schools in the tent as of Nov 2022. If you expand by 2 schools, I'm not at all sure that the value of the deal increases by 20%. CUSA is already having to put games on Tuesday and Wednesday nights. Where and when are they going to show a 6th game every week (or a 5th game if the plan is to have October bye weeks)?

As someone who will benefit directly from the weeknight games, but views them (in themselves) as a bad thing for the program over-all, and as someone who hasn't seen the contract to know how this would work, and as someone who doesn't have to provide socks for the cross-country team or fly the volleyball team to Miami - I would happily trade some amount of the money per school for fewer weeknight games (for my school).

Ok, that makes some amount of sense. Off the top of my head I think it's 20 Tuesday-Wednesday games, spread over 10 teams that's 2 home and 2 road games (one bye week). Spread over 12 teams that's 1 2/3 home games, 1 2/3 road games (or 5 games over 3 years).

Of course that contradicts the current conference party line that weeknight games give you EXPOSURE that builds the program.
01-27-2023 11:22 AM
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inutech Offline
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Post: #118
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 11:22 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 11:13 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:52 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:14 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:02 AM)inutech Wrote:  Why?
Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!

But more inventory also means more mouths to feed. The CUSA deal is let's say $7.5M for the 10 schools in the tent as of Nov 2022. If you expand by 2 schools, I'm not at all sure that the value of the deal increases by 20%. CUSA is already having to put games on Tuesday and Wednesday nights. Where and when are they going to show a 6th game every week (or a 5th game if the plan is to have October bye weeks)?

As someone who will benefit directly from the weeknight games, but views them (in themselves) as a bad thing for the program over-all, and as someone who hasn't seen the contract to know how this would work, and as someone who doesn't have to provide socks for the cross-country team or fly the volleyball team to Miami - I would happily trade some amount of the money per school for fewer weeknight games (for my school).

Ok, that makes some amount of sense. Off the top of my head I think it's 20 Tuesday-Wednesday games, spread over 10 teams that's 2 home and 2 road games (one bye week). Spread over 12 teams that's 1 2/3 home games, 1 2/3 road games (or 5 games over 3 years).

Of course that contradicts the current conference party line that weeknight games give you EXPOSURE that builds the program.

I really doubt it's written this way, but if it were, say, X dollars (out of the whole deal, which also includes other sports and some streaming for non-October Saturdays) for 20 games, and if we add 2 schools the money stays the same (or only goes up a little) for 20 weeknight October games plus ESPN+ for the rest - you'd just have to fight over the details.

It's uneven this year. So maybe some of those AD's actually buy the line they're selling about how this is such a great opportunity for exposure and really prefer (or don't care) about playing weeknights. You give 4 teams 1 home weeknight game and the other 8 2 home weeknight games (and the away games can work however they work - so long as they're not too close together, like a Sat followed by a Tuesday or the Thursday followed by Tuesday Tech got stuck with this year the away weeknight games don't matter. That doesn't hurt your fans.)

You could rotate who gets that one less home weeknight game or (if enough schools really buy the exposure bit) you just let schools pick their preference for the length of the deal. Or maybe the new schools get stuck one way or the other. You could make it work. Naturally, I'd want my school to drop one weeknight game per year for the whole deal - I don't care what the other schools want or prefer necessarily but you have negotiate these things. If we only save ourselves one weeknight home game over 5 years and end up with less money overall and get stuck with two more fledgling FBS programs and the travel doesn't get notably better - obviously you've got to weigh whether it's worth it. But that "reduce your weeknight home games" pitch is still way more appealing to me than "more inventory" by itself.

But I bet the deal has language about adding schools already built in. And it probably just increases the payout (maybe or maybe not at the break-even point, I doubt at a better per school rate - but maybe so, dependent on the schools or something) in exchange for 4 more weeknight games in October (that would almost certainly not make it to linear tv).
(This post was last modified: 04-06-2023 03:06 PM by inutech.)
01-27-2023 11:48 AM
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #119
RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 11:48 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 11:22 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 11:13 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:52 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:14 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!

But more inventory also means more mouths to feed. The CUSA deal is let's say $7.5M for the 10 schools in the tent as of Nov 2022. If you expand by 2 schools, I'm not at all sure that the value of the deal increases by 20%. CUSA is already having to put games on Tuesday and Wednesday nights. Where and when are they going to show a 6th game every week (or a 5th game if the plan is to have October bye weeks)?

As someone who will benefit directly from the weeknight games, but views them (in themselves) as a bad thing for the program over-all, and as someone who hasn't seen the contract to know how this would work, and as someone who doesn't have to provide socks for the cross-country team or fly the volleyball team to Miami - I would happily trade some amount of the money per school for fewer weeknight games (for my school).

Ok, that makes some amount of sense. Off the top of my head I think it's 20 Tuesday-Wednesday games, spread over 10 teams that's 2 home and 2 road games (one bye week). Spread over 12 teams that's 1 2/3 home games, 1 2/3 road games (or 5 games over 3 years).

Of course that contradicts the current conference party line that weeknight games give you EXPOSURE that builds the program.

I really doubt it's written this way, but if it were, say, X dollars (out of the whole deal, which also includes other sports and some streaming for non-October Saturdays)

The value of the rest is pretty trivial. I'd argue that the only things the TV networks find of real value in the CUSA deal is the weeknight FBS games.

Quote:for 20 games, and if we add 2 schools the money stays the same (or only goes up a little) for 20 weeknight October games plus ESPN+ for the rest - you'd just have to fight over the details.

[quote]If we only save ourselves one weeknight home game over 5 years and end up with less money overall and get stuck with two more fledgling FBS programs and the travel doesn't get notably better - obviously you've got to weigh whether it's worth it. But that "reduce your weeknight home games" pitch is still way more appealing to me than "more inventory" by itself.

That's because "something" is worth more than "nothing", no matter how trivial the "something" is.

Quote:But I bet the deal has language about adding schools already built it.

I'd be less specific. CBS and ESPN have probably already decided what they want to do about CUSA expansion, and the contract reflects it. But whether what CBS and ESPN want is "sure we'll pay another $1.5M a year for Missouri State and Tarleton State" or not, is reflected in whethere there's a pro rata clause or not.

Quote: And it probably just increases the payout (maybe or maybe not at the break-even point, I doubt at a better per school rate - but maybe so, dependent on the schools or something) in exchange for 4 more weeknight games in October (that would almost certainly not make it to linear tv).

The value of a weeknight FBS game drops dramatically if it's on ESPN+, I think. I don't think I'd ante up for that, if I'm ESPN. Much less CBS-SN.
01-27-2023 12:20 PM
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RE: When Austin Peay joins the FBS in 2024...
(01-27-2023 10:51 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:14 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 10:02 AM)inutech Wrote:  
(01-27-2023 07:58 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  If they get to 12 it will be better especially for the next TV deal.

Why?
Going to 12 teams gives them more inventory for network partners. That would allow them to get more $$ in the next Deal. This where CUSA may have an advantage over MAC. They can still expand and while the new media deal will not be P5 level, the new inventory can help increase the next deal!

Per school?

I still don't understand the continued insistence that more inventory leads to more money. The conference is just the teams in it. Nobody cares about the total conference contract - it only matters per school.

If CUSA could get $100 for ten schools and $120 for twelve schools, that's "more money in the next deal" technically. But who is that better for? If you could get $100 for ten schools but $110 for 12 schools, that's also technically "more money in the next deal" but is actually worse for everyone (except maybe the 11th and 12th schools, depending on what they'd have made in their previous conference).


Y'all have heard of division right? That's still a thing in math?

Sorry if this comes across too strong.

It's just that I've been reading the argument forever and somehow it keeps coming up - Kennesaw State isn't USC. Tarrleton and SFA aren't OU and UT. You've got to remember the denominator.

I guess it's sort of message board culture to repeat the same conversations with different people (sometimes the same people) so it often seems more frustrating when our pet peeves get scratched than it really ought to.
01-27-2023 01:36 PM
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