(01-10-2023 04:33 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:27 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:23 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:16 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:11 PM)Claw Wrote:  A smaller stadium in general would cut their revenue. They basically sold out the Liberty Bowl at 52,000. A 35,000 seat OCS would be a real income loss if they had to use it. The city also gets the concessions, parking, etc from those games, and the university pays them rent for each game we play. In addition, all the tax-paying hotels and restaurants would lose income. All of those people make campaign contributions too.

The irony is a P5 Memphis might be filling a 50,000 seat stadium after a few years, but we may not ever get to P5 in part because our stadium is too big now.

Why would they have to give up the Liberty Bowl? You have the bowl game, you have the SHC, and you have the Showboats playing. Make some modifications so that it can host other events, and it is still viable.

Orlando still hosts the Citrus Bowl game in the Citrus Bowl, even though UCF long abandoned it in favor of an OCS & P5 invite.

Unfortunately, that argument won't work. They did a $207 million renovation in 2014, and another $60 million in 2021. Bummer.

The city can do whatever it wants to do with the Liberty Bowl. They can choose to invest as did Orlando, or they can leave it as is. It should not involve us.

So now the total needed is $650 million, not including FEF. Makes sense, shouldn't be a problem getting it done.

(01-10-2023 05:12 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:33 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:27 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:23 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:16 PM)msu35 Wrote:  Why would they have to give up the Liberty Bowl? You have the bowl game, you have the SHC, and you have the Showboats playing. Make some modifications so that it can host other events, and it is still viable.

Orlando still hosts the Citrus Bowl game in the Citrus Bowl, even though UCF long abandoned it in favor of an OCS & P5 invite.

Unfortunately, that argument won't work. They did a $207 million renovation in 2014, and another $60 million in 2021. Bummer.

The city can do whatever it wants to do with the Liberty Bowl. They can choose to invest as did Orlando, or they can leave it as is. It should not involve us.

So now the total needed is $650 million, not including FEF. Makes sense, shouldn't be a problem getting it done.

The state is paying the bill for the stadium upgrades, not the city. The city should petition the state for FedEx Forum funding & the university should be making its case for an oncampus football facility. There is absolutely no reason these need to be combined. Fed Ex Forum, in its current state, is more than enough facility for Memphis Tiger basketball. If upgrades are needed, its the Grizzlies who are making that request.

(01-10-2023 05:11 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:06 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  As for taking the step…
I took it with The Pyramid and the school was ultimately suckered into offering up the 20 mil provided by the state to build its oncampus facility and giving that money to the city for what is now a Bass Pro Shop. We took that step in ‘65 with the Liberty Bowl & watched every one of our rivals move on to greener pastures. Sorry, but I will not take that step until I’m forced to step foot into that remodeled city-owned/managed white elephant.

Get those feet ready, because you'll be taking that step. For the record, it's a pretty nice Bass Pro Shop too, as far as Bass Pro Shops go.

Its very nice & I enjoy going. That being said, it was a terribly misguided investment by our university.

(01-10-2023 05:25 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:11 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:06 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  As for taking the step…
I took it with The Pyramid and the school was ultimately suckered into offering up the 20 mil provided by the state to build its oncampus facility and giving that money to the city for what is now a Bass Pro Shop. We took that step in ‘65 with the Liberty Bowl & watched every one of our rivals move on to greener pastures. Sorry, but I will not take that step until I’m forced to step foot into that remodeled city-owned/managed white elephant.

Get those feet ready, because you'll be taking that step. For the record, it's a pretty nice Bass Pro Shop too, as far as Bass Pro Shops go.

Its very nice & I enjoy going. That being said, it was a terribly misguided investment by our university.

I place most of that blame on Sidney Shlenker, shyster extraordinaire. Conceptually, if everything worked out as intended including the rebuilding and gentrification of the High Point Pinch, it could have been great. Unfortunately, the facility itself sucked, especially for music.

(01-10-2023 05:22 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:12 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:33 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:27 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:23 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  Orlando still hosts the Citrus Bowl game in the Citrus Bowl, even though UCF long abandoned it in favor of an OCS & P5 invite.

Unfortunately, that argument won't work. They did a $207 million renovation in 2014, and another $60 million in 2021. Bummer.

The city can do whatever it wants to do with the Liberty Bowl. They can choose to invest as did Orlando, or they can leave it as is. It should not involve us.

So now the total needed is $650 million, not including FEF. Makes sense, shouldn't be a problem getting it done.

The state is paying the bill for the stadium upgrades, not the city. The city should petition the state for FedEx Forum funding & the university should be making its case for an oncampus football facility. There is absolutely no reason these need to be combined. Fed Ex Forum, in its current state, is more than enough facility for Memphis Tiger basketball. If upgrades are needed, its the Grizzlies who are making that request.

You seem to be confused. Are you trying to say that the school hasn't ever approached the state or the city for help funding an OCS? That's adorable.

(01-10-2023 05:25 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:11 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:06 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  As for taking the step…
I took it with The Pyramid and the school was ultimately suckered into offering up the 20 mil provided by the state to build its oncampus facility and giving that money to the city for what is now a Bass Pro Shop. We took that step in ‘65 with the Liberty Bowl & watched every one of our rivals move on to greener pastures. Sorry, but I will not take that step until I’m forced to step foot into that remodeled city-owned/managed white elephant.

Get those feet ready, because you'll be taking that step. For the record, it's a pretty nice Bass Pro Shop too, as far as Bass Pro Shops go.

Its very nice & I enjoy going. That being said, it was a terribly misguided investment by our university.

And that is where you and the handful of other miserables are completely wrong. It is infinitely better than staying in the exact same stadium with nothing being done.

(01-10-2023 05:37 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:25 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:11 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:06 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  As for taking the step…
I took it with The Pyramid and the school was ultimately suckered into offering up the 20 mil provided by the state to build its oncampus facility and giving that money to the city for what is now a Bass Pro Shop. We took that step in ‘65 with the Liberty Bowl & watched every one of our rivals move on to greener pastures. Sorry, but I will not take that step until I’m forced to step foot into that remodeled city-owned/managed white elephant.

Get those feet ready, because you'll be taking that step. For the record, it's a pretty nice Bass Pro Shop too, as far as Bass Pro Shops go.

Its very nice & I enjoy going. That being said, it was a terribly misguided investment by our university.

I place most of that blame on Sidney Shlenker, shyster extraordinaire. Conceptually, if everything worked out as intended including the rebuilding and gentrification of the High Point Pinch, it could have been great. Unfortunately, the facility itself sucked, especially for music.

The gift of experience clearly shows the university should have built its own 14k seat arena on campus. It would have done a world of good for the program & the university. The Pyramid was an over promised/ under funded disaster.

(01-10-2023 05:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:22 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:12 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:33 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:27 PM)Stammers Wrote:  Unfortunately, that argument won't work. They did a $207 million renovation in 2014, and another $60 million in 2021. Bummer.

The city can do whatever it wants to do with the Liberty Bowl. They can choose to invest as did Orlando, or they can leave it as is. It should not involve us.

So now the total needed is $650 million, not including FEF. Makes sense, shouldn't be a problem getting it done.

The state is paying the bill for the stadium upgrades, not the city. The city should petition the state for FedEx Forum funding & the university should be making its case for an oncampus football facility. There is absolutely no reason these need to be combined. Fed Ex Forum, in its current state, is more than enough facility for Memphis Tiger basketball. If upgrades are needed, its the Grizzlies who are making that request.

You seem to be confused. Are you trying to say that the school hasn't ever approached the state or the city for help funding an OCS? That's adorable.

Are you stating they have? Link?

(01-10-2023 05:54 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  The gift of experience clearly shows the university should have built its own 14k seat arena on campus. It would have done a world of good for the program & the university. The Pyramid was an over promised/ under funded disaster.

It is my belief that most people love the Forum. I know I do and being downtown on Beale Street is wonderful. Better than slumming the Highland strip. If the High Point Pinch was built up as promised, it could have been a similar experience, but ending with the Forum was serendipitous.

(01-10-2023 05:57 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:54 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  The gift of experience clearly shows the university should have built its own 14k seat arena on campus. It would have done a world of good for the program & the university. The Pyramid was an over promised/ under funded disaster.

It is my belief that most people love the Forum. I know I do and being downtown on Beale Street is wonderful. Better than slumming the Highland strip. If the High Point Pinch was built up as promised, it could have been a similar experience, but ending with the Forum was serendipitous.

I think the chance to play in an NBA arena has helped keep recruiting going even in the down years. For whatever reason, basketball in the city's arena has been successful in arena after arena. Football hasn't. It is what it is.

The university still needs something on campus that can seat 10,000 people together.

(01-10-2023 05:54 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:37 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:25 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:11 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 05:06 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  As for taking the step…
I took it with The Pyramid and the school was ultimately suckered into offering up the 20 mil provided by the state to build its oncampus facility and giving that money to the city for what is now a Bass Pro Shop. We took that step in ‘65 with the Liberty Bowl & watched every one of our rivals move on to greener pastures. Sorry, but I will not take that step until I’m forced to step foot into that remodeled city-owned/managed white elephant.

Get those feet ready, because you'll be taking that step. For the record, it's a pretty nice Bass Pro Shop too, as far as Bass Pro Shops go.

Its very nice & I enjoy going. That being said, it was a terribly misguided investment by our university.

I place most of that blame on Sidney Shlenker, shyster extraordinaire. Conceptually, if everything worked out as intended including the rebuilding and gentrification of the High Point Pinch, it could have been great. Unfortunately, the facility itself sucked, especially for music.

The gift of experience clearly shows the university should have built its own 14k seat arena on campus. It would have done a world of good for the program & the university. The Pyramid was an over promised/ under funded disaster.

Marc - your negativity really clouds your judgement.
The Tomb of Doom, was freakin' awesome. It rocked while it lasted. The Forum is a first class facility and is a huge recruiting advantage for Penny. I've traveled with the Tigers to some shoddy on campus areanas. Clearly not the same.

(01-10-2023 04:53 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:43 PM)Alanda Wrote:  I think the point is if you are looking at schools to add to your P5 conference, our stadium/arena look doesn't resemble that of the others already there. I can't say it's a dealbreaker, but it's not a good look. And I can definitely say the LB is not closer than many OCSs at P5. If it's the same or further than the Liberty Bowl then it's not an OCS. Here is an article I found at the time that helped my research. It showed all the FBS schools that played at a football stadium a mile or further away from the campus. They listed only 23 and not all of them are P5.

https://herosports.com/teams-playing-hom...mpus-aiai/

What I found at the time was that NC State is the only one that played both basketball and football off campus like Memphis. But like I mentioned before they still own the football stadium.

You're misunderstanding. Many campuses are very large. What is your point of reference? Just because it's an OCS doesn't mean that the stadium proper won't be 2 miles or more from where you have to park, for example. Your list only shows the FBS programs that have an off-campus stadium and the distance to said stadium from the extremities of the campus.

What I was saying is that even though a stadium may be on the campus, the distance from the Memphis campus to the Liberty Bowl is as close or closer than many programs that do have an OCS in relation to how far it will be from where your vehicle is. On campus parking is often very limited. Many schools will require private parking of some kind, off campus. At least the Liberty Bowl has plenty of parking at the venue.

I'm not misunderstanding because you didn't mention campus size or parking in the other post. So to be fair that's not on me. My point of reference is the definition of an campus stadium. An on campus stadium means it is on the main campus. Where you park doesn't define that. You have to go on the campus to get to the stadium no matter how far away you park. And getting people on the campus is a goal of an OCS, especially for those that didn't have one before. That website "only" shows those things because that's what defines off campus which doesn't include parking.

And the parking availability is very debatable. When I went to a couple games as a student we parked near those baseball/softball fields North of the stadium and walked to the LB. If the stadium were on campus we wouldn't have needed to drive just to find another parking spot to walk from. Our students are expected to do that for football and end even further for men's basketball. Like I and others have mentioned before the Memphis main campus has more parking spots than the LB. And the school could monetize that for extra revenue. As I think I mentioned to you before Arkansas' parking situation in comparison would essentially be worse because their available parking space % over Memphis vs their stadium capacity % over what Memphis would need would be worse. They deal with it just like many others do. A lot of them even provide shuttle services. To me parking is not a good counter to having an OCS.

Telling people not to discuss an OCS is wasted energy because I expect the talking to continue even after the renovations.

(01-10-2023 04:32 PM)gusrob Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:23 PM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:16 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:11 PM)Claw Wrote:  A smaller stadium in general would cut their revenue. They basically sold out the Liberty Bowl at 52,000. A 35,000 seat OCS would be a real income loss if they had to use it. The city also gets the concessions, parking, etc from those games, and the university pays them rent for each game we play. In addition, all the tax-paying hotels and restaurants would lose income. All of those people make campaign contributions too.

The irony is a P5 Memphis might be filling a 50,000 seat stadium after a few years, but we may not ever get to P5 in part because our stadium is too big now.

Why would they have to give up the Liberty Bowl? You have the bowl game, you have the SHC, and you have the Showboats playing. Make some modifications so that it can host other events, and it is still viable.

Orlando still hosts the Citrus Bowl game in the Citrus Bowl, even though UCF long abandoned it in favor of an OCS & P5 invite.

UCF in P5. My mind is still blown. They basically didn't have a football a football program until they hired George O'Leary IN EARLY 2000s and got into Div 1, joining MAC. In P5 IN LESS THAN 20 years. SONOFA&#$%$

I don't think there's a need to get mad about that. Even if they did come in later with their football program, they still have one of the largest enrollments in the country. A competent football program was all they needed to get there.

(01-10-2023 06:33 PM)Alanda Wrote:  I'm not misunderstanding because you didn't mention campus size or parking in the other post. So to be fair that's not on me.

Yes, you're misunderstanding. My exact words:

Quote:The Liberty Bowl is certainly not on campus, but at only two miles away, it is closer than many OCSs at P5 schools.

If the stadium is on campus, what could it be further away from? Probably where a person's endpoint is before they have to actually walk to said facility since you don't typically park at the stadium itself. Common sense and all. Perhaps it's more apparent to people who have traveled to games at other schools where they do have an OCS, like Knoxville. Next time I'll be more verbose.

(01-10-2023 06:33 PM)Alanda Wrote:  And the parking availability is very debatable. When I went to a couple games as a student we parked near those baseball/softball fields North of the stadium and walked to the LB. If the stadium were on campus we wouldn't have needed to drive just to find another parking spot to walk from.

It's your opinion that parking isn't an argument against, and that's fair. I don't feel it matters at this stage anyway, because an OCS isn't happening in the near future. My personal opinion on it is that if one doesn't live on campus, parking will be more annoying with an OCS. It's annoying enough for the commuting students who don't live on campus, just to get to class.

(01-10-2023 04:22 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:07 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 03:48 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 03:33 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 03:02 PM)Stammers Wrote:  Obviously, it is in the state and the city's best interests to fund a municipally owned stadium, that the city will continue to own, especially when you factor in that it will guarantee the viability of both the LB and SHC. If 20,000 fans come in from out of town and spend a paltry $500 each, that is $20 million per year in revenue to the city.

Okay, so let's say the Liberty Bowl will attract 20,000 out of town visitors to the sum of $10,000,000 annually. For the sake of discussion, I won't dispute that figure, but how is that any different than 20,000 out of town visitors coming to the city to watch games in an OCS? They won't be staying on campus and will still require the services of the same private hotels and restaurants. Are you suggesting that $500 is to be collected by the city through city-owned concessions?

This is a good discussion. There were 52,000 at the bowl game this year. I can't prove it, but I would estimate 10,000 were locals and roughly 40,000 were out of towners. That's double your 20,000 estimate. Average of two nights in a hotel with average of say $150/person. That's 6 million in hotel revenue.

Quote: HOTEL taxes inMemphis
Tennessee state tax is 7%.
Memphis local tax is 2.25%
Memphis lodging tax is 6%.
Total tax for a hotel room in Memphis is 15.25%.

There is 915,000 dollars in tax revenue. 495,000 in Memphis taxes.

In addition you get sales taxes on all food. Gas taxes. Rental car taxes.

Plus the city gets parking and concession revenue from game day sales.

It's a lot of money for the city. It's a lot of money for the hotels. It's a lot of money for the restaurants.

I suspect my numbers are too low. A lot of people spent more than two nights here, and some of them paid more than that for their rooms per person.

It's a lot of money.

Would the city not get that same hotel, restaurant, tax money if the bowl game was in a new OCS (less some parking and concessions)?
Which leads us back to, what is the conspiratorial motivation to keep us down?

The issue would be capacity. There is no point building an OCS if there are more than 44,000 seats max. There would a reasonable chance that 44,000 wouldn't be enough for the LB or SHC, even though I'm sure the SHC has less than that actual attendance most years.

IF you could do 44,000 with 8,000 temporary bleacher seats, I suppose that would work, but who has ever done that?

I agree on OCS capacity. I think 40k personally is the right number. It MIGHT cut back on a LB game every 3rd year, and it MIGHT cut back on a SHC game every 10th year. At the same time, it allows you to charge even more for tix for these events.

But yeah, it could cut tax/hotel revenue by 10% max.

(01-10-2023 07:21 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:22 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 04:07 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 03:48 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 03:33 PM)msu35 Wrote:  Okay, so let's say the Liberty Bowl will attract 20,000 out of town visitors to the sum of $10,000,000 annually. For the sake of discussion, I won't dispute that figure, but how is that any different than 20,000 out of town visitors coming to the city to watch games in an OCS? They won't be staying on campus and will still require the services of the same private hotels and restaurants. Are you suggesting that $500 is to be collected by the city through city-owned concessions?

This is a good discussion. There were 52,000 at the bowl game this year. I can't prove it, but I would estimate 10,000 were locals and roughly 40,000 were out of towners. That's double your 20,000 estimate. Average of two nights in a hotel with average of say $150/person. That's 6 million in hotel revenue.

Quote: HOTEL taxes inMemphis
Tennessee state tax is 7%.
Memphis local tax is 2.25%
Memphis lodging tax is 6%.
Total tax for a hotel room in Memphis is 15.25%.

There is 915,000 dollars in tax revenue. 495,000 in Memphis taxes.

In addition you get sales taxes on all food. Gas taxes. Rental car taxes.

Plus the city gets parking and concession revenue from game day sales.

It's a lot of money for the city. It's a lot of money for the hotels. It's a lot of money for the restaurants.

I suspect my numbers are too low. A lot of people spent more than two nights here, and some of them paid more than that for their rooms per person.

It's a lot of money.

Would the city not get that same hotel, restaurant, tax money if the bowl game was in a new OCS (less some parking and concessions)?
Which leads us back to, what is the conspiratorial motivation to keep us down?

The issue would be capacity. There is no point building an OCS if there are more than 44,000 seats max. There would a reasonable chance that 44,000 wouldn't be enough for the LB or SHC, even though I'm sure the SHC has less than that actual attendance most years.

IF you could do 44,000 with 8,000 temporary bleacher seats, I suppose that would work, but who has ever done that?

I agree on OCS capacity. I think 40k personally is the right number. It MIGHT cut back on a LB game every 3rd year, and it MIGHT cut back on a SHC game every 10th year. At the same time, it allows you to charge even more for tix for these events.

But yeah, it could cut tax/hotel revenue by 10% max.

In my head it's 42,000, but I think 99% of the board agrees that the number is between 40-44k. It would generate much more revenue than a 50k stadium and probably at least double what we are getting now.

(01-10-2023 08:11 PM)Stammers Wrote:  In my head it's 42,000, but I think 99% of the board agrees that the number is between 40-44k. It would generate much more revenue than a 50k stadium and probably at least double what we are getting now.

What happens to the fans that demand $5 tickets? Pretty elitist of you.

(01-10-2023 06:49 PM)msu35 Wrote:  Yes, you're misunderstanding. My exact words:

Quote:The Liberty Bowl is certainly not on campus, but at only two miles away, it is closer than many OCSs at P5 schools.

If the stadium is on campus, what could it be further away from? Probably where a person's endpoint is before they have to actually walk to said facility since you don't typically park at the stadium itself. Common sense and all. Perhaps it's more apparent to people who have traveled to games at other schools where they do have an OCS, like Knoxville. Next time I'll be more verbose.

LOL. How can the misunderstanding be on me for something that vague? You asked for a point of reference only after the fact. If you mention the LB is only two miles away from the campus I would have looked at that as two miles from the closest building on campus or from the center of campus without any other details. So how in the world would I translate that to parking when all you say is "it is closer than many OCSs at P5 schools"? That doesn't need common sense. That needs a proper explanation that you gave later. Looking at it further it's not even a good comparison. How many people are parking on the main campus and then going to the LB?

(01-10-2023 06:49 PM)msu35 Wrote:  It's your opinion that parking isn't an argument against, and that's fair. I don't feel it matters at this stage anyway, because an OCS isn't happening in the near future. My personal opinion on it is that if one doesn't live on campus, parking will be more annoying with an OCS. It's annoying enough for the commuting students who don't live on campus, just to get to class.

Trust me I get why you are saying it doesn't matter. And of course it's my opinion. And that opinion is based on my experiences. I went to at least one away Memphis game at Ole Miss (I was a student then) and very briefly attended Arkansas before transferring to Memphis. I'm from Arkansas BTW. Before my health turned causing me to move back I lived almost as long in Memphis as I did in my hometown. My dorm at Arkansas (Pomfret) was down the street from the stadium. I didn't go to any games while I was there, but saw some of the traffic to get to the games. Distance-wise I would say Pomfret to Razorback Stadium was roughly the same as walking from the former Richardson Towers (where I lived on campus at Memphis) to the library, maybe a little shorter. In all of the situations I have seen or experienced directly with parking or not parking for an OCS vs parking for the LB and having to walk, the OCS experiences were much better or similar to deal with. So to me that's why talking about parking as a reason against an OCS is not a good one. The pros outweigh the cons IMO.

Also as an eventual commuting student to Memphis I didn't recall having a big inconvenience with parking. And I know for sure parking options in the late 90s/early 00s were worse than it is now.

I'm not saying you believe this, but it feels like when some think of an OCS they expect and/or want some kind of "perfect" parking situation. It also feels like that's why they needed to acquire more land which led to an OCS costing more, like maybe trying to recreate Tiger Lane for example. And if that is somewhat true in either situation then I would say it's not necessary to make an OCS work. That's a want, not a need.

(01-10-2023 08:37 PM)Alanda Wrote:  LOL. How can the misunderstanding be on me for something that vague?

I agree, it could have been expressed more descriptively. I assumed that common sense would fill in the blanks, but that comes from a frame of reference where I already knew what I was attempting to express. Sometimes something is obvious to the author because they're following a certain path in their thinking, but it doesn't always translate well without a better explanation.

(01-10-2023 08:37 PM)Alanda Wrote:  Distance-wise I would say Pomfret to Razorback Stadium was roughly the same as walking from the former Richardson Towers (where I lived on campus at Memphis) to the library, maybe a little shorter. In all of the situations I have seen or experienced directly with parking or not parking for an OCS vs parking for the LB and having to walk, the OCS experiences were much better or similar to deal with.

I agree. Some OCS situations are better than others. Many schools aren't as convenient. It's a mixed bag.

(01-10-2023 08:37 PM)Alanda Wrote:  Also as an eventual commuting student to Memphis I didn't recall having a big inconvenience with parking. And I know for sure parking options in the late 90s/early 00s were worse than it is now.

Things may be better now. Among my contemporaries, parking was one of their biggest gripes with constant complaints about it, but this was when the school was still known as Memphis State. I haven't been to the campus in ages, so I will take your word for it.

(01-10-2023 08:37 PM)Alanda Wrote:  I'm not saying you believe this, but it feels like when some think of an OCS they expect and/or want some kind of "perfect" parking situation.

I think people like convenience in today's world. Everyone is used to instant gratification. It looks like the school has options for where they can build a stadium, but available parking for the big games will still be a challenge. I can see that making things annoying for some games, but it comes with the territory and isn't a major detraction from the OCS concept if the land is available.

Personally, I'm not opposed to an OCS if the funding/support is there, and it makes sense; but, we're going to be in the Liberty Bowl and I was just trying to see the positives considering that will be the reality for a while. Ultimately, it's not a bad stadium and with renovations/upgrades, there is the potential to make it something everyone can appreciate. It might be less convenient for resident students to have to drive a couple of miles versus walking, but it will ultimately be more convenient for those who are driving anyway.

(01-10-2023 09:01 PM)msu35 Wrote:  

(01-10-2023 08:37 PM)Alanda Wrote:  LOL. How can the misunderstanding be on me for something that vague?

I agree, it could have been expressed more descriptively. I assumed that common sense would fill in the blanks, but that comes from a frame of reference where I already knew what I was attempting to express. Sometimes something is obvious to the author because they're following a certain path in their thinking, but it doesn't always translate well without a better explanation.

(01-10-2023 08:37 PM)Alanda Wrote:  Distance-wise I would say Pomfret to Razorback Stadium was roughly the same as walking from the former Richardson Towers (where I lived on campus at Memphis) to the library, maybe a little shorter. In all of the situations I have seen or experienced directly with parking or not parking for an OCS vs parking for the LB and having to walk, the OCS experiences were much better or similar to deal with.

I agree. Some OCS situations are better than others. Many schools aren't as convenient. It's a mixed bag.

(01-10-2023 08:37 PM)Alanda Wrote:  Also as an eventual commuting student to Memphis I didn't recall having a big inconvenience with parking. And I know for sure parking options in the late 90s/early 00s were worse than it is now.

Things may be better now. Among my contemporaries, parking was one of their biggest gripes with constant complaints about it, but this was when the school was still known as Memphis State. I haven't been to the campus in ages, so I will take your word for it.

(01-10-2023 08:37 PM)Alanda Wrote:  I'm not saying you believe this, but it feels like when some think of an OCS they expect and/or want some kind of "perfect" parking situation.

I think people like convenience in today's world. Everyone is used to instant gratification. It looks like the school has options for where they can build a stadium, but available parking for the big games will still be a challenge. I can see that making things annoying for some games, but it comes with the territory and isn't a major detraction from the OCS concept if the land is available.

Personally, I'm not opposed to an OCS if the funding/support is there, and it makes sense; but, we're going to be in the Liberty Bowl and I was just trying to see the positives considering that will be the reality for a while. Ultimately, it's not a bad stadium and with renovations/upgrades, there is the potential to make it something everyone can appreciate. It might be less convenient for resident students to have to drive a couple of miles versus walking, but it will ultimately be more convenient for those who are driving anyway.

All good. I've done that before as well. I was just hoping to show you why I was having trouble with the sentence.

I agree about the idea of convenience. It's easier when you know what you are dealing with and are comfortable with it vs the unknown. That unknown being "What all would I have to deal with just to go to a game on the actual campus?" While my experiences with OCSs are what I would like to see for Memphis, I can't truly say it would be better or worse until it actually happens. Reality is even if we were getting an OCS some of those unknowns wouldn't be found till after it's finished and people start going to games.

The reason I don't think big games will be much of an issue is because not only are they far and few between, the campus wouldn't be dealing with 58k+ fans like the LB does for those games. We're probably looking at 37k-40k in the beginning if the OCS is designed to expand somewhere down the road.

I get the support for the OCS and the support for the LB. I'm an OCS supporter, but I'm not going to bash the LB to make an OCS look better. The LB on it's own isn't the problem for me and as long as the football team has to use it then make it look as good as possible. I talked about my experiences with parking and getting to the stadium, but that's not my #1 reason for wanting an OCS (might be #3 at best). My clear #1 is I want the school to keep as much revenue as possible for itself. And that is reduced playing in the LB and FEF. I know it gets pointed out that playing in an NBA arena helps recruiting. But to me Memphis Tigers basketball didn't become Memphis Tigers basketball sharing an arena with an NBA team. A coach that's good at recruiting doesn't need an NBA facility to be good at that. And at times it feels like obstacles are being created out of nowhere to keep an OCS from happening instead of doing everything possible to make it work so that more of the revenue stays in house. We shouldn't solely be hoping for P5 money when we can also create a way to generate more revenue.