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Basketball Jones Offline
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Post: #21
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
We tore up Oakland's matador Zone Defense right from the beginning with excellent ball movement. 29 Assists tells the story -- we got whatever we wanted both inside and outside with very few forced shots. RayJ was the ringleader with 12 assists and only 1 turnover in 30 minutes of game action. CBS Sport's Jon Rothstein says Shumate and Milner are defensive mismatches on the inside and tonight they went off for 33 and 21 respectively. Yes, the defense was not very good in the second half but you have to credit Oakland some for shooting the lights out. Despite that, Toledo still outscored them 55-53. Bench play, can you say 33 points with 20 coming from Maddox Jr, who showed he can shoot it from deep and also take it to the basket. While we're only 3 games into the season, this team looks like it is going to very difficult to defend.
(This post was last modified: 11-16-2022 10:20 PM by Basketball Jones.)
11-16-2022 10:18 PM
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Screwball Offline
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Post: #22
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
AJ played about 8 1/2 minutes. He played 5 against UAB. I'm guessing they are working him in slowly, and he has to get adapted to game conditions as well. That's smart. He could be huge by the end of the year, even with limited minutes.
11-16-2022 10:48 PM
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PrettyGoodRocket Offline
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Post: #23
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
Despite the disappointment we faced against TDS in football yesterday, was nice to see this team play more good hoops. Sky is the limit here, really difficult to score on our guys, sometimes even harder to defend us. We play fast this year, the absolute dream for over bettors throughout the season. But seriously, we score in transition very well, JT Shumate is a bonafide star in this league and could play just about anywhere in college hoops. This time we can sit on here and genuinely, say that this is likely the deepest team of TK’s tenure. As others have mentioned, don’t wanna overreact because we are just three games in, but love the look of the team thus far.
(This post was last modified: 11-16-2022 11:21 PM by PrettyGoodRocket.)
11-16-2022 11:21 PM
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Basketball Jones Offline
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Post: #24
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-16-2022 10:48 PM)Screwball Wrote:  AJ played about 8 1/2 minutes. He played 5 against UAB. I'm guessing they are working him in slowly, and he has to get adapted to game conditions as well. That's smart. He could be huge by the end of the year, even with limited minutes.

AJ made his limited minutes count with 4 points and 8 rebounds. It's going to take some time, but hopefully he can continue to gain confidence during the non conference season as I think we will need him come MAC season against guys like Sparks from Ball St and Wilson from OU. Also, his development is key to providing Shumate some needed bench time to recharge during the course of a game.
11-16-2022 11:26 PM
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Screwball Offline
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Post: #25
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-16-2022 11:26 PM)Basketball Jones Wrote:  
(11-16-2022 10:48 PM)Screwball Wrote:  AJ played about 8 1/2 minutes. He played 5 against UAB. I'm guessing they are working him in slowly, and he has to get adapted to game conditions as well. That's smart. He could be huge by the end of the year, even with limited minutes.

AJ made his limited minutes count with 4 points and 8 rebounds. It's going to take some time, but hopefully he can continue to gain confidence during the non conference season as I think we will need him come MAC season against guys like Sparks from Ball St and Wilson from OU. Also, his development is key to providing Shumate some needed bench time to recharge during the course of a game.

Great point. He was productive while playing only 8 minutes. Numbers aside, he was setting good picks, and helped protect the rim as well.

I was also glad to see what Maddox contributed tonight. He's a player too. I haven't studied the stats yet, might not need to. When you score 112 points there are plenty things that went right, and a great job by many for that to happen.
(This post was last modified: 11-16-2022 11:49 PM by Screwball.)
11-16-2022 11:46 PM
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MotoRocket Offline
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Post: #26
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
The whole team looked good. Looks like what K said the other day about feeling good about the interior play of the team makes sense. Everybody on the team can rebound pretty well - they work hard at it.

I was never a fan of Coach K for most of his first 8-10 years. He's won me over with the teams over the past few years, but this team could be special - yes, the one that breaks The Drought.
11-17-2022 01:12 AM
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pono Offline
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Post: #27
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
impressive win. i think oakland will win a lot of games before all is said and done. career highs for shumate and farmer. AJ with a rebound a minute. need to get lorentsson up to speed to solidify the bench. off to crazy swamp land for 3 games in 3 days next week. let's get a trophy!
11-17-2022 03:33 AM
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Rocket75 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
I have seats behind the Toledo bench. In past years I could see most every play because the bench guys sat most of the game. This year the bench often blocks my view because they are standing up cheering for their teammates. There is awesome chemistry with these guys. That is part of the reason for so many assists---unselfish play.

Maddox and Cochran are terrific players. They play smart and are very skilled. There is no learning curve as they have blended in with the rest of the team really great. These 2 plus Edu give UT the best bench it has had in the Coach K era.
11-17-2022 06:01 AM
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rocket 51 Offline
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Post: #29
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
I would have to say that last night might have been the best total team play against a good program since TK has been here. I talked with Coach Kampe after the game and he said "this is a real good team". Greg has never been one to hide his thoughts. He did not have his best players in the back court for the game but that being said, that was a quality win. We still have as much quality depth as Toledo MBB has ever had. Even in the Coach Nichols era we did not have this type of line up.

For me, so far, its the attitude of this team that sets the tone. And their DEFENSE! Their willingness to make selfless hustle plays is impresssive.

Tyler Cochran is a BEAST. That guy is worth the price of admission ALONE. Got to be a pain for the other team with his constant active hands, poking and prodding.

Totally agree with AJ's progression. Obvious to see from Valpo to now. Have to remember that he has been through more than almost ANY athlete we have seen here, no matter the sport. The mental part alone is a substantial hurdle. Yesterday he looked very comfortable at both ends.
Its a very long journey. For me, quality depth and mental toughness will be the tale of the tape. I think we have both!
GO ROCKETS!
11-17-2022 08:53 AM
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eastisbest Offline
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Post: #30
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
Every year starts the same. Best team ever... I think waiting until we see if UAB measures up to their pre-season and Oakland to their normal solid before evaluating just how good this new line-up is. That's just me moderating expectations.

Conference coaches are solid. They will know where and how to attack. Can a team with a bulky big, stop Toledo? This year we have such a diversity and depth on the ball, a team wasting too many possessions trying to get a clean pass to the middle will lose. Our bigs may not be big but they're experienced and can position. That will affect bulky big's ability to RB. A big that can handle, bring the ball up himself? Can't wait to see how we approach the EMU game.
11-17-2022 10:33 AM
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Sleepy Offline
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Post: #31
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
Well, this week so far, Valpo beat WMU at home and then lost to Chicago St on the road. UAB beat Presbyterian in Birmingham last night by 31 pts.

Oalland didn't have much size or length inside to challenge on rbs. Kansasa City has 4 freshman on their roster over 6'9 but none of them appear to be dominant at this point in their development.
11-17-2022 12:57 PM
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MotoRocket Offline
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Post: #32
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-17-2022 12:57 PM)Sleepy Wrote:  Well, this week so far, Valpo beat WMU at home and then lost to Chicago St on the road. UAB beat Presbyterian in Birmingham last night by 31 pts.

Oalland didn't have much size or length inside to challenge on rbs. Kansasa City has 4 freshman on their roster over 6'9 but none of them appear to be dominant at this point in their development.

I had been looking at the men's basketball schedule and they didn't show the tournament they are playing in - just this game which is at 11am. Looking further I see they are playing Lourdes College on Dec. 29th. I looked at the Lourdes roster and see that Brett Lauf is playing for them after transferring from Grand Valley State. Possibly how they got the game with Toledo scheduled. The head coach at Lourdes? Some guy named Dennis Hopson. They have a 6'10" Norwegian guy on their team from the basketball hotspot of Wang Toppidrettsgymnas. They have 5 guys on their team from Toledo area high schools including 2 from Cardinal Stritch.
11-17-2022 08:55 PM
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Sleepy Offline
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Post: #33
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-16-2022 10:14 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  Oakland played 1-3-1 much of second half, unreal shooting, wish he would have played bench more in second half, big blonde, Edu need more second half min. Going to need them... develop now pays dividends later
Kid Rocket wrote last Spring "the attendance will continue to drop, no balls.... time zones, no 2 for ones, TK is such a fat cat, way too comfortable, .... can't wait to watch Oakland....prob beat ut with half the resources."
11-17-2022 10:57 PM
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eastisbest Offline
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Post: #34
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-17-2022 10:57 PM)Sleepy Wrote:  
(11-16-2022 10:14 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  Oakland played 1-3-1 much of second half, unreal shooting, wish he would have played bench more in second half, big blonde, Edu need more second half min. Going to need them... develop now pays dividends later
Kid Rocket wrote last Spring "the attendance will continue to drop, no balls.... time zones, no 2 for ones, TK is such a fat cat, way too comfortable, .... can't wait to watch Oakland....prob beat ut with half the resources."

I'm pretty sure kidrocket is a clone, one of the paid posters pretending in order to illicit positive comments from critical posters. Remember fake campbell? Probably one of the silver spoons. The negatives are too obviously over the top.
11-18-2022 12:36 PM
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Kid Rocket Offline
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Post: #35
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-17-2022 10:57 PM)Sleepy Wrote:  
(11-16-2022 10:14 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  Oakland played 1-3-1 much of second half, unreal shooting, wish he would have played bench more in second half, big blonde, Edu need more second half min. Going to need them... develop now pays dividends later
Kid Rocket wrote last Spring "the attendance will continue to drop, no balls.... time zones, no 2 for ones, TK is such a fat cat, way too comfortable, .... can't wait to watch Oakland....prob beat ut with half the resources."

Definitely ate my words there, UT played well... Oakland good we will see if it's a typical OU team....

but... we have been here before... not sure if Kampe has any NCAA appearances, I'll have to check if UT does under TK... Our attendance keeps falling, Savage is a quarter full on most nights.

Apathy has slowly taken hold, hard to believe with TK's charisma and gigantic wins we can be proud of. I will have to check if other coaches from UT beat teams from larger conferences, prob not.

UT not deserving of NCAA appearance or big wins, small town, average facilities, basketball recruits are hundreds of miles away, poor fan base bottom of the MAC, campus is unattractive, UT offers virtually zero worthwhile degrees. TK doesn't earn enough $ to dedicate time developing talented at risk players. It is stressful leading a team with guys that come well raised without baggage.

This UT team I believe is talented and deep, I'm sure TK, players will be right there to win MAC and tournament, is this the year?
(This post was last modified: 11-18-2022 01:06 PM by Kid Rocket.)
11-18-2022 12:47 PM
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Kid Rocket Offline
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Post: #36
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-18-2022 12:36 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  
(11-17-2022 10:57 PM)Sleepy Wrote:  
(11-16-2022 10:14 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  Oakland played 1-3-1 much of second half, unreal shooting, wish he would have played bench more in second half, big blonde, Edu need more second half min. Going to need them... develop now pays dividends later
Kid Rocket wrote last Spring "the attendance will continue to drop, no balls.... time zones, no 2 for ones, TK is such a fat cat, way too comfortable, .... can't wait to watch Oakland....prob beat ut with half the resources."

I'm pretty sure kidrocket is a clone, one of the paid posters pretending in order to illicit positive comments from critical posters. Remember fake campbell? Probably one of the silver spoons. The negatives are too obviously over the top.

Nope, just want more, we've had average to good basketball with TK, just want more
(This post was last modified: 11-18-2022 01:09 PM by Kid Rocket.)
11-18-2022 12:50 PM
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rkt Offline
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Post: #37
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-18-2022 12:50 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  
(11-18-2022 12:36 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  
(11-17-2022 10:57 PM)Sleepy Wrote:  
(11-16-2022 10:14 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  Oakland played 1-3-1 much of second half, unreal shooting, wish he would have played bench more in second half, big blonde, Edu need more second half min. Going to need them... develop now pays dividends later
Kid Rocket wrote last Spring "the attendance will continue to drop, no balls.... time zones, no 2 for ones, TK is such a fat cat, way too comfortable, .... can't wait to watch Oakland....prob beat ut with half the resources."

I'm pretty sure kidrocket is a clone, one of the paid posters pretending in order to illicit positive comments from critical posters. Remember fake campbell? Probably one of the silver spoons. The negatives are too obviously over the top.

Nope, just want more, we've had average to good basketball with TK, just want more

This team is way better than “average to good,” I want more also. It would start if TK would stop talking about how good we are until he does something special. Regular season championships are a lot more than average to good, but I don’t think they’re something special. It can’t happen during the regular season because we don’t play anybody good enough that a win would be special (Indiana, Michigan countless times, Michigan State, Iowa - in that tournament he’s never been to - etc, etc.)

TK can really recruit and is an excellent coach. But he talks like he’s something special. This year I think he’s going to prove it. In his thirteenth year.
(This post was last modified: 11-18-2022 10:48 PM by rkt.)
11-18-2022 10:47 PM
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MotoRocket Offline
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Post: #38
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-18-2022 12:47 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  
(11-17-2022 10:57 PM)Sleepy Wrote:  
(11-16-2022 10:14 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  Oakland played 1-3-1 much of second half, unreal shooting, wish he would have played bench more in second half, big blonde, Edu need more second half min. Going to need them... develop now pays dividends later
Kid Rocket wrote last Spring "the attendance will continue to drop, no balls.... time zones, no 2 for ones, TK is such a fat cat, way too comfortable, .... can't wait to watch Oakland....prob beat ut with half the resources."

Definitely ate my words there, UT played well... Oakland good we will see if it's a typical OU team....

but... we have been here before... not sure if Kampe has any NCAA appearances, I'll have to check if UT does under TK... Our attendance keeps falling, Savage is a quarter full on most nights.

Apathy has slowly taken hold, hard to believe with TK's charisma and gigantic wins we can be proud of. I will have to check if other coaches from UT beat teams from larger conferences, prob not.

UT not deserving of NCAA appearance or big wins, small town, average facilities, basketball recruits are hundreds of miles away, poor fan base bottom of the MAC, campus is unattractive, UT offers virtually zero worthwhile degrees. TK doesn't earn enough $ to dedicate time developing talented at risk players. It is stressful leading a team with guys that come well raised without baggage.

This UT team I believe is talented and deep, I'm sure TK, players will be right there to win MAC and tournament, is this the year?

I can answer some of your questions and comments based on memory

this should be a decent Oakland team, but not as good as some of the past (prior to the past 4-5 years). They were 20-12 last year, 12-18 (2020-21), 14-19 (2019-20) and 16-17 (2018-19). That would be 62-66 over the past 4 years. So there may need to be a new definition of what defines a good Oakland team.

Kampe has had Oakland in 3 NCAA tourneys with one being a Play-in game that I remember. I think that was the only win of the 3 tourneys they made it to. Don't know which years without looking it up, but one of the years was when they had Benson at center. He also played in the NBA for a couple of years - maybe more. In fact I think Oakland has had 3 or 4 players make it to the NBA. So Kampe has put players in the NBA and made NCAA tourney appearances in his +35 years at Oakland while Toledo has done neither in the past +40 years.

I would think you are either very young or not a Toledo fan if you do not know that Toledo has not made an NCAA tourney appearance under TK.

I can't comment on the attendance numbers. My last game in person was in 2021 and a long time before that. Hard to justify a 1 1/2 hour trip down and then back to watch a game that is usually less than 2 hours long. The trade off of gas prices made monthly ESPN+ an easy choice.

Couldn't really follow what you wrote after that or why you think "UT is not deserving big wins because of small town, average facilities and recruits living hundreds of miles away..." I think the players live on campus - they don't have to travel very far to get to practice or games....

The rest is laughable at best. "poor fan base bottom of the MAC, campus is unattractive, UT offers virtually zero worthwhile degrees. TK doesn't earn enough $ to dedicate time developing talented at risk players"
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2022 12:00 AM by MotoRocket.)
11-18-2022 11:52 PM
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DetroitRocket Offline
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Post: #39
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-18-2022 11:52 PM)MotoRocket Wrote:  
(11-18-2022 12:47 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  
(11-17-2022 10:57 PM)Sleepy Wrote:  
(11-16-2022 10:14 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  Oakland played 1-3-1 much of second half, unreal shooting, wish he would have played bench more in second half, big blonde, Edu need more second half min. Going to need them... develop now pays dividends later
Kid Rocket wrote last Spring "the attendance will continue to drop, no balls.... time zones, no 2 for ones, TK is such a fat cat, way too comfortable, .... can't wait to watch Oakland....prob beat ut with half the resources."

Definitely ate my words there, UT played well... Oakland good we will see if it's a typical OU team....

but... we have been here before... not sure if Kampe has any NCAA appearances, I'll have to check if UT does under TK... Our attendance keeps falling, Savage is a quarter full on most nights.

Apathy has slowly taken hold, hard to believe with TK's charisma and gigantic wins we can be proud of. I will have to check if other coaches from UT beat teams from larger conferences, prob not.

UT not deserving of NCAA appearance or big wins, small town, average facilities, basketball recruits are hundreds of miles away, poor fan base bottom of the MAC, campus is unattractive, UT offers virtually zero worthwhile degrees. TK doesn't earn enough $ to dedicate time developing talented at risk players. It is stressful leading a team with guys that come well raised without baggage.

This UT team I believe is talented and deep, I'm sure TK, players will be right there to win MAC and tournament, is this the year?

I can answer some of your questions and comments based on memory

this should be a decent Oakland team, but not as good as some of the past (prior to the past 4-5 years). They were 20-12 last year, 12-18 (2020-21), 14-19 (2019-20) and 16-17 (2018-19). That would be 62-66 over the past 4 years. So there may need to be a new definition of what defines a good Oakland team.

Kampe has had Oakland in 3 NCAA tourneys with one being a Play-in game that I remember. I think that was the only win of the 3 tourneys they made it to. Don't know which years without looking it up, but one of the years was when they had Benson at center. He also played in the NBA for a couple of years - maybe more. In fact I think Oakland has had 3 or 4 players make it to the NBA. So Kampe has put players in the NBA and made NCAA tourney appearances in his +35 years at Oakland while Toledo has done neither in the past +40 years.

I would think you are either very young or not a Toledo fan if you do not know that Toledo has not made an NCAA tourney appearance under TK.

I can't comment on the attendance numbers. My last game in person was in 2021 and a long time before that. Hard to justify a 1 1/2 hour trip down and then back to watch a game that is usually less than 2 hours long. The trade off of gas prices made monthly ESPN+ an easy choice.

Couldn't really follow what you wrote after that or why you think "UT is not deserving big wins because of small town, average facilities and recruits living hundreds of miles away..." I think the players live on campus - they don't have to travel very far to get to practice or games....

The rest is laughable at best. "poor fan base bottom of the MAC, campus is unattractive, UT offers virtually zero worthwhile degrees. TK doesn't earn enough $ to dedicate time developing talented at risk players"

Very strange post. I will say that it's a lot easier to win the Horizon League for an automatic NCAA berth than the MAC. Even though no HL schools play football, so they should have decent resources for BB, it's just not a good league. The majority of the schools didn't exist before 1960.
11-19-2022 03:43 AM
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Post: #40
RE: UT vs Oakland game thread
(11-19-2022 03:43 AM)DetroitRocket Wrote:  
(11-18-2022 11:52 PM)MotoRocket Wrote:  
(11-18-2022 12:47 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  
(11-17-2022 10:57 PM)Sleepy Wrote:  
(11-16-2022 10:14 PM)Kid Rocket Wrote:  Oakland played 1-3-1 much of second half, unreal shooting, wish he would have played bench more in second half, big blonde, Edu need more second half min. Going to need them... develop now pays dividends later
Kid Rocket wrote last Spring "the attendance will continue to drop, no balls.... time zones, no 2 for ones, TK is such a fat cat, way too comfortable, .... can't wait to watch Oakland....prob beat ut with half the resources."

Definitely ate my words there, UT played well... Oakland good we will see if it's a typical OU team....

but... we have been here before... not sure if Kampe has any NCAA appearances, I'll have to check if UT does under TK... Our attendance keeps falling, Savage is a quarter full on most nights.

Apathy has slowly taken hold, hard to believe with TK's charisma and gigantic wins we can be proud of. I will have to check if other coaches from UT beat teams from larger conferences, prob not.

UT not deserving of NCAA appearance or big wins, small town, average facilities, basketball recruits are hundreds of miles away, poor fan base bottom of the MAC, campus is unattractive, UT offers virtually zero worthwhile degrees. TK doesn't earn enough $ to dedicate time developing talented at risk players. It is stressful leading a team with guys that come well raised without baggage.

This UT team I believe is talented and deep, I'm sure TK, players will be right there to win MAC and tournament, is this the year?

I can answer some of your questions and comments based on memory

this should be a decent Oakland team, but not as good as some of the past (prior to the past 4-5 years). They were 20-12 last year, 12-18 (2020-21), 14-19 (2019-20) and 16-17 (2018-19). That would be 62-66 over the past 4 years. So there may need to be a new definition of what defines a good Oakland team.

Kampe has had Oakland in 3 NCAA tourneys with one being a Play-in game that I remember. I think that was the only win of the 3 tourneys they made it to. Don't know which years without looking it up, but one of the years was when they had Benson at center. He also played in the NBA for a couple of years - maybe more. In fact I think Oakland has had 3 or 4 players make it to the NBA. So Kampe has put players in the NBA and made NCAA tourney appearances in his +35 years at Oakland while Toledo has done neither in the past +40 years.

I would think you are either very young or not a Toledo fan if you do not know that Toledo has not made an NCAA tourney appearance under TK.

I can't comment on the attendance numbers. My last game in person was in 2021 and a long time before that. Hard to justify a 1 1/2 hour trip down and then back to watch a game that is usually less than 2 hours long. The trade off of gas prices made monthly ESPN+ an easy choice.

Couldn't really follow what you wrote after that or why you think "UT is not deserving big wins because of small town, average facilities and recruits living hundreds of miles away..." I think the players live on campus - they don't have to travel very far to get to practice or games....

The rest is laughable at best. "poor fan base bottom of the MAC, campus is unattractive, UT offers virtually zero worthwhile degrees. TK doesn't earn enough $ to dedicate time developing talented at risk players"

Very strange post. I will say that it's a lot easier to win the Horizon League for an automatic NCAA berth than the MAC. Even though no HL schools play football, so they should have decent resources for BB, it's just not a good league. The majority of the schools didn't exist before 1960.

sarcasm, most of it, Dr. says I have UT fan fatigue
11-19-2022 10:02 AM
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