(11-13-2022 07:10 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  

(11-12-2022 10:05 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  The winner of a primary is the candidate with the most loyal most energized base---and Trump is that guy pretty much everywhere other than maybe Florida. Unless you expect Trump to bow out gracefully (C'mon---ya know that aint happening), then its going to be an ugly primary and Trump probably will reveal or say ugly things about DeSantis---and DeSantis will probably say some blunt ugly things about Trump. In other words, its not likely either come out of the primary as a more attractive candidate than either is right now. After its all over, we still probably end up with Trump.

An ugly primary is exactly what I expect. But, more to the point, I am sure it is exactly what Ron DeSantis expects. He will need to decide if he is up for the political fight. If he is, then I absolutely expect him to win it.

Donald Trump is a proven loser. A skilled politician such as Ron DeSantis will make mincemeat of him in a straight-up contest. (Donald Trump knows that, which is why we are seeing such premature, juvenile, unprovoked attacks coming from Donald - - directed at DeSantis, at Youngkin, and at his own selected candidates who didn’t perform as expected.)

If Ron DeSantis is not up for this fight, and that’s certainly possible, then I hope and expect that someone else will step up to challenge Donald Trump for the 2024 nomination: Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, Tom Cotton, Mike Pompeo, Nikki Haley, and countless others. I again expect it to be an ugly nomination process, but believe that any of them would prevail in a straight-up primary contest with Donald Trump. (The ONLY advantage that Donald Trump has over these others is the cynical support from a complicit media who want him to be the more easily defeated nominee, and donations from the Soros dark-money folks who agree. But I don’t think that even that will be enough. Donald Trump is that tainted.)

If it turns out that I am wrong on that, and Donald Trump emerges as the 2024 Republican nominee, then I will vote for him - - as I did in 2020. The one way that I will not vote for him is if he is anointed the Republican selection in an underhanded process - - via overt or covert threats directed at other, better choices. That is what I am reading in your post; please forgive me if I am misreading your meaning. But if that’s how things go down, and Trump gets the nomination solely via political bullying, then I will vote 3rd party - - as I did in 2016.

Bottom line, coog. If Donald Trump were the incumbent, just coming off of a successful first term, then he would deserve the kind of deference that I think you are suggesting. He is not. He instead is some who lost to a mental turnip in 2020, and then managed to parlay his deeply unpleasant loser personality into a crushingly disappointing midterms.

Final concession (to anticipate the response from Claw and others): Donald Trump is plainly not as bad as Joe Biden. But, sadly, that is the ONLY thing that can be said in his favor. and it is an unacceptable threshold for someone who wants to be president of this nation. Because he is worse - - way worse - - than Ron DeSantis and pretty much any other possible candidate that the Republicans might offer up as a nominee.

Its not so much deference Im suggesting as its just an acknowledgement that a brutal primary fight simply decreases our chances even more. Im not arguing that DeSantis woundnt be a good candidate----however, I suspect the DeSantis we see today could very well be politically wounded DeSantis after a bruising primary. From what I gather---I dont think we disagree on that.

As I said in another thread---the Democrats are not beating Republicans by fielding better candidates or by being better on the issues---they are winning seats and close elections because they have developed an entire nationwide ballot harvesting machine that spends a month delivering votes to the polls. As long as Republicans continue to pin all their hopes on a one day turnout----its going to be very difficult to overcome a month of ballot harvesting with a one day turnout. The Republicans dont need a bruising primary spending hundreds of millions of dollars--they need to pour hundreds of millions of dollars into building an effective nationwide ballot harvesting operation that will offset the biggest election advantage the Democrats own. Rather than a brutal primary---it would be better if the Republican stars spend those primary months barnstorming America to expand the party and build support for its local and national candidates.

(11-13-2022 11:13 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  The best thing that could happen for the republican party would be for one of the democrat anti-Trump witch hunts to find a witch big enough to sideline Trump. So far, they have not come close.

Well, does anybody still have Christine O'Donnell's number?