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The BigXII new deal
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Garrettabc Offline
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Post: #21
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 02:47 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 02:08 PM)esayem Wrote:  lol gotta love new Big XII fans coming over to rub our noses in their inferior deal.

They did get a few more million than I expected, so good for them.

The only thing we love more are certain ACC fans who thought that schools like Cincinnati wasn't good enough for the ACC and rubbed it in our face and are now upset that we're just pointing out how well the Big 12 is doing WITHOUT trashing the ACC. Just telling you how the world turns

UC was at or near the top of most ACC fans realistic expansion wish list. I don’t think anyone was trying to make it personal. In 6-8 years UC’s stock might rise enough that they will be in the position to decide to stick with the BigXII or be seduced by the ACC. They will be in a great position.
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 03:32 PM by Garrettabc.)
10-30-2022 03:31 PM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #22
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 03:31 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 02:47 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 02:08 PM)esayem Wrote:  lol gotta love new Big XII fans coming over to rub our noses in their inferior deal.

They did get a few more million than I expected, so good for them.

The only thing we love more are certain ACC fans who thought that schools like Cincinnati wasn't good enough for the ACC and rubbed it in our face and are now upset that we're just pointing out how well the Big 12 is doing WITHOUT trashing the ACC. Just telling you how the world turns

UC was at or near the top of most ACC fans realistic expansion wish list. I don’t think anyone was trying to make it personal. In 6-8 years UC’s stock might rise enough that they will be in the position to decide to stick with the BigXII or be seduced by the ACC. They will be in a great position.

Nothing directed at you. There are a couple people on this board who have been trashing UC for over a decade. It’s always the same people who make the same tiring arguments.
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 03:42 PM by CliftonAve.)
10-30-2022 03:41 PM
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green Offline
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Post: #23
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 03:41 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 03:31 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 02:47 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 02:08 PM)esayem Wrote:  lol gotta love new Big XII fans coming over to rub our noses in their inferior deal.

They did get a few more million than I expected, so good for them.

The only thing we love more are certain ACC fans who thought that schools like Cincinnati wasn't good enough for the ACC and rubbed it in our face and are now upset that we're just pointing out how well the Big 12 is doing WITHOUT trashing the ACC. Just telling you how the world turns

UC was at or near the top of most ACC fans realistic expansion wish list. I don’t think anyone was trying to make it personal. In 6-8 years UC’s stock might rise enough that they will be in the position to decide to stick with the BigXII or be seduced by the ACC. They will be in a great position.

Nothing directed at you. There are a couple people on this board who have been trashing UC for over a decade. It’s always the same people who make the same tiring arguments.

ucf & wva ...

FULL STOP
10-30-2022 03:49 PM
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random asian guy Online
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Post: #24
RE: The BigXII new deal
Pete Thamel reporting the B12 schools are signg a new GoR. If indeed signed, then obviously it means no WVU, no Cincy, no UCF, and no TCU & Houstion. The remaining options for the ACC would be Pac schools and SMU.
10-30-2022 05:10 PM
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CatsClaw1 Offline
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Post: #25
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 02:53 PM)XLance Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 02:45 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTEOZAaBN3p5zAkyI8qGFj...p;usqp=CAU]

Hurt feelings I see! 03-lmfao
10-30-2022 05:23 PM
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esayem Offline
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Post: #26
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 03:41 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 03:31 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 02:47 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 02:08 PM)esayem Wrote:  lol gotta love new Big XII fans coming over to rub our noses in their inferior deal.

They did get a few more million than I expected, so good for them.

The only thing we love more are certain ACC fans who thought that schools like Cincinnati wasn't good enough for the ACC and rubbed it in our face and are now upset that we're just pointing out how well the Big 12 is doing WITHOUT trashing the ACC. Just telling you how the world turns

UC was at or near the top of most ACC fans realistic expansion wish list. I don’t think anyone was trying to make it personal. In 6-8 years UC’s stock might rise enough that they will be in the position to decide to stick with the BigXII or be seduced by the ACC. They will be in a great position.

Nothing directed at you. There are a couple people on this board who have been trashing UC for over a decade. It’s always the same people who make the same tiring arguments.

Trashing Cincinnati by pointing out they don’t bring enough value to warrant expansion at this point? That’s the truth whether you want to accept it or not. Nothing personal, just business. Why don’t you complain about the Big Ten fans that don’t want your school in their conference? Why are a few Cincinnati fans obsessed with the ACC??
10-30-2022 05:26 PM
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CatsClaw1 Offline
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Post: #27
RE: The BigXII new deal
The Big 12 will get an extra 5 million or so in Tier 3 sponsorship and radio money along with what appears to be added revenue from ESPN+. That's why the payout will go over 50 million without CFP expansion revenue, I think that McMurphy was the only one not to mention that part. Since the Big 12 is the only Power 5 conference with a conference network that revenue is never publicly reported.
10-30-2022 05:42 PM
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OrangeDude Offline
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Post: #28
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 01:32 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  Let’s assume that UH, UC and UCF are worth $31.7m each. That comes up to be $95m total. The AAC’s contract is/was $7m per team x12 = $84m. So let me get this straight; UCF, UH and UC are worth far more in the BigXII than in the AAC? This does not compute.

It could. In the AAC the most valuable games are those three schools facing off against each. In the nB12 the number of tv potential games increase with games against Baylor, TCU, Oklahoma State, Kansas State, Texas Tech, and maybe Iowa State.

I think $31M per team by the 2025-26 year sounds about right.

See Random Asian's Guy's Post for where the ACC will be at in 2025-26 and a follow-up of mine to his post which will be done soon.

Cheers,
Neil
10-30-2022 05:52 PM
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TexanMark Offline
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Post: #29
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 05:42 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  The Big 12 will get an extra 5 million or so in Tier 3 sponsorship and radio money along with what appears to be added revenue from ESPN+. That's why the payout will go over 50 million without CFP expansion revenue, I think that McMurphy was the only one not to mention that part. Since the Big 12 is the only Power 5 conference with a conference network that revenue is never publicly reported.

Some will get that...all be determined how strong your local radio and TV deals are.
10-30-2022 06:03 PM
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random asian guy Online
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Post: #30
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 06:03 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 05:42 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  The Big 12 will get an extra 5 million or so in Tier 3 sponsorship and radio money along with what appears to be added revenue from ESPN+. That's why the payout will go over 50 million without CFP expansion revenue, I think that McMurphy was the only one not to mention that part. Since the Big 12 is the only Power 5 conference with a conference network that revenue is never publicly reported.

Some will get that...all be determined how strong your local radio and TV deals are.

Per Pete Thamel, no T3 rights for the B12. The B12 is in competition with the P12 for the fourth spot.

Pete Thamel

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4h
Story on the Big 12 on the cusp of a deal with ESPN/FOX.
*Grant of rights per length of the deal.
*Elimination of third-tier rights for schools to sell
*Makes Big 12 "a really viable entity and keeps it strongly positioned."
*Will this impact Pac-12?
10-30-2022 06:14 PM
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SouthernConfBoy Offline
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Post: #31
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 12:40 PM)random asian guy Wrote:  Let's compare it with the ACC money.

The ACC television revenue was $397.4 M for 2020-2021 including ND
Without ND, it would have been $370.91M. The ACC TV money increases at 4.1 percent per year (the ACCN revenue increases faster but let's try to be conservative).

2020-2021 $370.91
2021-2022 $386.23
2022-2023 $402.19
2023-2024 $418.81
2024-2025 $436.12
2025-2026 $454.14
2026-2027 $472.91
2027-2028 $492.45
2028-2029 $512.80
2029-2030 $533.99
2030-2031 $556.05
Six Year Average 2526-30/31 $503.72
Average Payout per team $35.98

The B12 money doesn't include Tier 3 but the ACCN payout was not fully developed in 2020-2021. The inflation does help the B12 but the ACC team will get at least $5 million more than the B12 team.

My math is a little different.

One thing that I notice is that a lot of folks like to present numbers "on the come" meaning they present fiscal 2020 as if it were the calendar year 2020.

ACC numbers always have the football season at the start of a fiscal year s fiscal year 2020 is actually football season 2019.

I have FY 19,20, and 21 tv at $288 M, $322 M, and $373 M for the 14 ACC members while that last year number in total was $413 M (this includes the full ND share).

Going foward I get the following:

FY Total Per School Slightly Rounded
22 393 28M
23 411 29M
24 430 31M
25 449 32 M
26 470 33.5 M
27 490 35 M
28 513 36.6 M
29 536 38.2 M
30 560 40 M
31 585 41.8 M
So for the 2030 football season that's $ 585 shown at June 30, 2031.

All the other distributions run about $12 million a year so add that to the TV total so that's $40 M (this year) to $54 M by 2030. No increase in football playoff or recapture of NCAA basketball tourney shown. No added schools. No big negotiated ratchet.
10-30-2022 06:20 PM
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OrangeDude Offline
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Post: #32
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 05:42 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  The Big 12 will get an extra 5 million or so in Tier 3 sponsorship and radio money along with what appears to be added revenue from ESPN+. That's why the payout will go over 50 million without CFP expansion revenue, I think that McMurphy was the only one not to mention that part. Since the Big 12 is the only Power 5 conference with a conference network that revenue is never publicly reported.

The above contract figures for the B12 being discussed I assume are indeed Tier 1 and Tier 2 exclusive to OTA FOX (FS1 and FS2) and ESPN/ABC (ESPN2, ESPNU) outlets. Whether or not the missing Tier 3 content will add up to at least $5M per school is still to be determined. But it wouldn't surprise me if it is at least $3M per school. I believe when it started Texas and Oklahoma chose not to be involved at all and TCU, Texas Tech, Iowa State, and WVU waited a year before signing on.

It's my understanding that ESPN+ is the Tier 3 content owner of Big12Now through 2024-25 for a set figure rather than a share of the profits but not completely sure about that.

A similar contract will likely be continued via a separate ESPN contract for that since individual schools will not likely want to take back that aspect in these times nor is FOX involved with that. If ESPN deemed the content to pay more than $5 million I assume they would rather have it as a separate Network like SECN or ACCN. But I have been known to be wrong before.

Way back when Cincy joined the Big East a poster (coincidentally a poster with your handle or at least a similar one) schooled me on the value of Cincy and I became a convert shortly thereafter.

Cheers,
Neil
10-30-2022 06:21 PM
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Hokie Mark Offline
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Post: #33
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 01:40 PM)random asian guy Wrote:  The real news here is that the B12 as a whole is likley more valuable than the Pac 12 as a whole, which is struggling to get $30 million per team.

...Maybe the ACC does have to look should have looked at the B12 schools for the expansion.

FIFY.

The ACC had one realistic move after the SEC took UT and OU, and Commissioner Phillips and the Presidents threw it away by not expanding. Stupid decision in hindsight (which many of us said even at the time).
10-30-2022 06:29 PM
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SouthernConfBoy Offline
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Post: #34
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 06:29 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 01:40 PM)random asian guy Wrote:  The real news here is that the B12 as a whole is likley more valuable than the Pac 12 as a whole, which is struggling to get $30 million per team.

...Maybe the ACC does have to look should have looked at the B12 schools for the expansion.

FIFY.

The ACC had one realistic move after the SEC took UT and OU, and Commissioner Phillips and the Presidents threw it away by not expanding. Stupid decision in hindsight (which many of us said even at the time).

What move? Toss out two schools?
10-30-2022 08:24 PM
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UCGrad1992 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 01:42 PM)Maize Wrote:  It is a good day for the Big XII … I offer nothing but congrats to the remaining schools and the new incoming members especially Cincinnati, UCF and Houston

Thank you kind sir. No ill will toward the ACC. Many of us "GFivers" are ecstatic and thankful to get this kind of deal. Cincinnati has had to fight and claw for everything and a little more than two decades after leaving CUSA...well, here we are.
10-30-2022 08:25 PM
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SouthernConfBoy Offline
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Post: #36
RE: The BigXII new deal
If the ACC schools received a check for $100 million each tomorrow, certain posters would be here in 20 seconds claiming:

A - it did not happen
B - they got a bigger check
C - in two years they will get double

It's been this way over a decade. It started with the Dude.


You can't reason with people who do not understand that revenue is not profit.

You can't reason with people who cherry pick past numbers and compare them with future number yet to arrive.

You can't reason with people who conflate net with gross.

I tried this for several years back in the day, and ultimately I just had to fire them because they were too dumb to allow to hang around the organization.

It's like people who can see only one dimension of movement at a time. The B12 got a good contract. UCF and Cincy and Houston, and BYU help the the B12 a great deal after losing Texas and OU.

One of the things that folks can wrap their heads around is that some schools have a much greater value to Conference B, than they do to Conference C or A. These are the folks who can't convert pears, pineapples, and nuts to apples and then make calculations. I eventually fired all them as well.

Essentially the B12 is plugging a 45%-50% value hole with BYU, UCF, Houston, and Cincy and getting back to 90% of where the B12 would have been at 10 schools. That is good work.
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 08:39 PM by SouthernConfBoy.)
10-30-2022 08:26 PM
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CardinalJim Online
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Post: #37
RE: The BigXII new deal


Lord knows I hate to agree with Stewart Mandel but he’s right. This entire thread is three midgets arguing over who is the tallest.

It does not matter.

Mandel directs his tweet toward The PAC and The Big 12 but The ACC is right there staring at the back side of the lead dogs too.

“Unless you’re the lead dog the view never changes”

I do note the new Big 12 deal ends in 6 years. That’s 2030. It’s also about the time The ACC will be carved up like a Thanksgiving Turkey, unless something unforeseen happens.

If that happens The PAC, Big 12 and ACC are going to look like Black Friday leftovers. Of course we’ll all be trying to make turkey salad to make swallowing the dry reality we’re going to be relegated to the college football’s 2nd Division.
10-30-2022 08:41 PM
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SouthernConfBoy Offline
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Post: #38
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 08:41 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  

Lord knows I hate to agree with Stewart Mandel but he’s right. This entire thread is three midgets arguing over who is the tallest.

It does not matter.

Mandel directs his tweet toward The PAC and The Big 12 but The ACC is right there staring at the back side of the lead dogs too.

“Unless you’re the lead dog the view never changes”

I do note the new Big 12 deal ends in 6 years. That’s 2030. It’s also about the time The ACC will be carved up like a Thanksgiving Turkey, unless something unforeseen happens.

If that happens The PAC, Big 12 and ACC are going to look like Black Friday leftovers. Of course we’ll all be trying to make turkey salad to make swallowing the dry reality we’re going to be relegated to the college football’s 2nd Division.

Jim, tell us when did the ACC schools lead the nation in football attendance? Or the number of alumni?

Was it 1922? 1942? 1962? 1982? 2002? 2022? will it be 2042?

When did a check to take an ass whippin' become a spectator sport?

I bet MD, Rutgers, Indiana, Purdue, Minn, NW, Nebraska et., al. are fired up about that Big 10 check. I bet that check makes their fans happy. 03-puke
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 08:48 PM by SouthernConfBoy.)
10-30-2022 08:47 PM
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UCGrad1992 Offline
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Post: #39
RE: The BigXII new deal
^^^^
In the endgame, you're right CardinalJim. It's really about positioning for the future. College football is contracting to fewer haves. For now, I can't worry about the P2 because Cincinnati got a life boat out to a better rental. I do like that our deal can be renegotiated in about 7 years - a lot can happen in that amount of time. It also gives the B12 time to build our brand in football and IMHO the hoops league is already pretty damn good. Time will tell...
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 08:49 PM by UCGrad1992.)
10-30-2022 08:48 PM
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OrangeDude Offline
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Post: #40
RE: The BigXII new deal
(10-30-2022 06:14 PM)random asian guy Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 06:03 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  
(10-30-2022 05:42 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  The Big 12 will get an extra 5 million or so in Tier 3 sponsorship and radio money along with what appears to be added revenue from ESPN+. That's why the payout will go over 50 million without CFP expansion revenue, I think that McMurphy was the only one not to mention that part. Since the Big 12 is the only Power 5 conference with a conference network that revenue is never publicly reported.

Some will get that...all be determined how strong your local radio and TV deals are.

Per Pete Thamel, no T3 rights for the B12. The B12 is in competition with the P12 for the fourth spot.

Pete Thamel

@PeteThamel
·
4h
Story on the Big 12 on the cusp of a deal with ESPN/FOX.
*Grant of rights per length of the deal.
*Elimination of third-tier rights for schools to sell
*Makes Big 12 "a really viable entity and keeps it strongly positioned."
*Will this impact Pac-12?

So in 2025-26 when will we first hear "It will only take SEVEN schools to dissolve the B12 to get out of that GoR"? 03-lmfao

Sorry, couldn't help myself.

04-bolt

Cheers,
Neil
10-30-2022 09:10 PM
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