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EagleFWB Offline
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Post: #1
Superback
A few things....

I've got no real problem with this superback stuff, but we can't run it all game every game. Certainly not the whole season.

So do we just not have a backup QB? It's Keyes or superback? How does staff not have a backup that they will at least let take some snaps?
09-03-2022 10:35 PM
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EagNBran Offline
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RE: Superback
The fact our offense didn’t advance at all this offseason and looks just as anemic as ever with zero QB play is probably the most concerning thing I saw last night. It genuinely makes me question if Hall is the guy.
09-04-2022 06:27 AM
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Big Dub Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Superback
(09-04-2022 06:27 AM)EagNBran Wrote:  The fact our offense didn’t advance at all this offseason and looks just as anemic as ever with zero QB play is probably the most concerning thing I saw last night. It genuinely makes me question if Hall is the guy.

Admittedly, I've been pretty forgiving to coaches in these situations, the exception being Johnson.

Fedora caught a ton of flack every year for his coaching decisions except in 2011. Not implying Hall is Fedora's caliber but last night reminded me of a Fedora game, in it the whole time with a chance to win at the end.

There's no denying the QB situation is concerning, like very concerning, but the team looked better as a whole, especially on defense. One less turnover, one more defensive stop in the 4th and we're celebrating a win and griping mostly about the QB situation.

Jury is out on Keyes, he didn't look very good passing but we also didn't get to see a lot, if anything he might be too injury prone to rely on. Word from some player's parents and other word of mouth is that Lowe is a gamer in practice (I have no way to verify this, it is beyond second-hand information), that could be a totally untrue or there's a trust issue in game scenarios which he immediately confirmed with that INT.

Maybe Hall's not the guy, I just think it's too premature to pass judgement.
09-04-2022 08:05 PM
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Big Dub Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Superback
(09-03-2022 10:35 PM)EagleFWB Wrote:  A few things....

I've got no real problem with this superback stuff, but we can't run it all game every game. Certainly not the whole season.

So do we just not have a backup QB? It's Keyes or superback? How does staff not have a backup that they will at least let take some snaps?

Remember when Fletcher would run the Wild Eagle (I think that's what it was called, it was a terrible name). It was a good change of pace but unless you built an option team it's a terrible long term solution.

They gave Lowe a chance and he immediately threw a deep ball for an INT and turnover #4, so maybe they were just tired of giving the ball up and had more trust in Gore... it almost worked
09-04-2022 08:13 PM
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Was SoMs Eagle Offline
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RE: Superback
(09-04-2022 08:13 PM)Big Dub Wrote:  
(09-03-2022 10:35 PM)EagleFWB Wrote:  A few things....

I've got no real problem with this superback stuff, but we can't run it all game every game. Certainly not the whole season.

So do we just not have a backup QB? It's Keyes or superback? How does staff not have a backup that they will at least let take some snaps?

Remember when Fletcher would run the Wild Eagle (I think that's what it was called, it was a terrible name). It was a good change of pace but unless you built an option team it's a terrible long term solution.

They gave Lowe a chance and he immediately threw a deep ball for an INT and turnover #4, so maybe they were just tired of giving the ball up and had more trust in Gore... it almost worked

So make Gore the QB and build an offense around him. Might as well at this stage. This is so frustrating.
09-04-2022 08:50 PM
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Big Dub Offline
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RE: Superback
(09-04-2022 08:50 PM)Was SoMs Eagle Wrote:  
(09-04-2022 08:13 PM)Big Dub Wrote:  
(09-03-2022 10:35 PM)EagleFWB Wrote:  A few things....

I've got no real problem with this superback stuff, but we can't run it all game every game. Certainly not the whole season.

So do we just not have a backup QB? It's Keyes or superback? How does staff not have a backup that they will at least let take some snaps?

Remember when Fletcher would run the Wild Eagle (I think that's what it was called, it was a terrible name). It was a good change of pace but unless you built an option team it's a terrible long term solution.

They gave Lowe a chance and he immediately threw a deep ball for an INT and turnover #4, so maybe they were just tired of giving the ball up and had more trust in Gore... it almost worked

So make Gore the QB and build an offense around him. Might as well at this stage. This is so frustrating.

Ha, I'd love to run the triple option but I think that's a very specific personnel grouping we probably don't have
09-04-2022 09:16 PM
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eaglebeaver Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Superback
(09-04-2022 08:05 PM)Big Dub Wrote:  
(09-04-2022 06:27 AM)EagNBran Wrote:  The fact our offense didn’t advance at all this offseason and looks just as anemic as ever with zero QB play is probably the most concerning thing I saw last night. It genuinely makes me question if Hall is the guy.

Admittedly, I've been pretty forgiving to coaches in these situations, the exception being Johnson.

Fedora caught a ton of flack every year for his coaching decisions except in 2011. Not implying Hall is Fedora's caliber but last night reminded me of a Fedora game, in it the whole time with a chance to win at the end.

There's no denying the QB situation is concerning, like very concerning, but the team looked better as a whole, especially on defense. One less turnover, one more defensive stop in the 4th and we're celebrating a win and griping mostly about the QB situation.

Jury is out on Keyes, he didn't look very good passing but we also didn't get to see a lot, if anything he might be too injury prone to rely on. Word from some player's parents and other word of mouth is that Lowe is a gamer in practice (I have no way to verify this, it is beyond second-hand information), that could be a totally untrue or there's a trust issue in game scenarios which he immediately confirmed with that INT.

Maybe Hall's not the guy, I just think it's too premature to pass judgement.

nice take dub....concerned Miahmah is gonna put 10 in the box and dare us to throw the ball....the kid at Liberty came out and took control, that's what we need a QB to do.
(This post was last modified: 09-05-2022 04:05 PM by eaglebeaver.)
09-05-2022 04:04 PM
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Post: #8
RE: Superback
I'm still confused as to why we didn't come out with Lowe at least a couple of series. His Int wasn't that bad of a throw. It's the beginning of the year #2 should be ready to go. Agree with the above that you can't just go superback the whole time.
09-06-2022 07:59 AM
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Post: #9
RE: Superback
Hall has obviously made every position better but one- Liberty has been a much better program than us over the past five years, with Hugh Freeze coaching, and in the first game of his second year, Hall took them to 4 OT and turnovers kept us from winning. But the one position he needed to be adequate was terrible. No progress since last year. I don't see Keyes as any answer at QB. He'd better hope that Wilcke can be the answer. Because if this keeps up all that will be left at the games is parents and coaches' families. It shouldn't look impossible to build an offense in the portal area but Hall is making it look like he doesn't have the first clue.
09-07-2022 07:39 AM
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Post: #10
RE: Superback
I didn’t think Keyes looked that bad. He looked, well, young. The interceptions he threw were ones I’d expect from a quarterback playing in his fifth game. One defender made a heck of an effort to catch one on the tip and the other was due to a freshman quarterback not reading the defense correctly. Plus this was his first game where the offensive line were actually giving him some pass protection. Last year it was take the snap and hope there was time to get the ball to the first read. I fully expected to lose some games because of quarterback mistakes this year. Now if he looks the same by the end of the season and into next year, by all means get Wilcke in there. But from what I saw Keyes looked like he could do it. I’ve seen a lot worse at quarterback here. He’s got a lot to learn in real game situations. Regardless, I hope Wilcke progresses enough to be able to be a useable back up for us this season. I’d love to see the superback used to throw the defenses off pace. It could be really effective.
09-07-2022 09:56 AM
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Post: #11
RE: Superback
(09-07-2022 09:56 AM)joeye04 Wrote:  I didn’t think Keyes looked that bad. He looked, well, young. The interceptions he threw were ones I’d expect from a quarterback playing in his fifth game. One defender made a heck of an effort to catch one on the tip and the other was due to a freshman quarterback not reading the defense correctly. Plus this was his first game where the offensive line were actually giving him some pass protection. Last year it was take the snap and hope there was time to get the ball to the first read. I fully expected to lose some games because of quarterback mistakes this year. Now if he looks the same by the end of the season and into next year, by all means get Wilcke in there. But from what I saw Keyes looked like he could do it. I’ve seen a lot worse at quarterback here. He’s got a lot to learn in real game situations. Regardless, I hope Wilcke progresses enough to be able to be a useable back up for us this season. I’d love to see the superback used to throw the defenses off pace. It could be really effective.

Did Keyes look like AD or Mullen? No.

But again he's learning. I did read where Wilcke may see playing time in Miami.. Hall didn't want to throw him in a close game with Liberty. He said he got better production with Superback than with the traditional offense in the first half. And his other comment was right, the defense was holding, all night Liberty couldn't drive the field and score until they put the gunslinger in.. At that point our DC should've made adjustments.. 81 yards in 4 plays with a minute left shouldn't happen.
09-07-2022 10:57 AM
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Big Dub Offline
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RE: Superback
(09-07-2022 10:57 AM)gdunn Wrote:  
(09-07-2022 09:56 AM)joeye04 Wrote:  I didn’t think Keyes looked that bad. He looked, well, young. The interceptions he threw were ones I’d expect from a quarterback playing in his fifth game. One defender made a heck of an effort to catch one on the tip and the other was due to a freshman quarterback not reading the defense correctly. Plus this was his first game where the offensive line were actually giving him some pass protection. Last year it was take the snap and hope there was time to get the ball to the first read. I fully expected to lose some games because of quarterback mistakes this year. Now if he looks the same by the end of the season and into next year, by all means get Wilcke in there. But from what I saw Keyes looked like he could do it. I’ve seen a lot worse at quarterback here. He’s got a lot to learn in real game situations. Regardless, I hope Wilcke progresses enough to be able to be a useable back up for us this season. I’d love to see the superback used to throw the defenses off pace. It could be really effective.

Did Keyes look like AD or Mullen? No.

But again he's learning. I did read where Wilcke may see playing time in Miami.. Hall didn't want to throw him in a close game with Liberty. He said he got better production with Superback than with the traditional offense in the first half. And his other comment was right, the defense was holding, all night Liberty couldn't drive the field and score until they put the gunslinger in.. At that point our DC should've made adjustments.. 81 yards in 4 plays with a minute left shouldn't happen.

He made adjustments defense just whiffed. He caught onto the QB rolling right every time and the spy missed a tackle for loss that turned into a huge gain one series and on another we had coverage but he absolutely threaded the needle with a pass through 2 well placed defenders. I actually thought we intercepted or it was an incomplete pass at first but the replay showed it was thrown through the tightest of windows. I'd have to watch the game again to know exactly when they happened but these were 2 huge conversions, that pass completion was a back-breaker and it almost couldn't have been covered better.

Stars aligned for Liberty, I thought we looked like the more athletic team but those turnovers were a killer.
09-07-2022 03:47 PM
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EagNBran Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Superback
Keyes looked like a guy who has always been able to use his legs to get out of trouble. He’s never learned to play in the pocket and make passes with people coming at him. His natural instinct is to juke and take off. But as we saw and have seen with others like him (Alford comes to mind), when D1 defenses are coming, you just get smacked and your poor throws become exposed
09-07-2022 04:08 PM
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Big Dub Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Superback
(09-07-2022 04:08 PM)EagNBran Wrote:  Keyes looked like a guy who has always been able to use his legs to get out of trouble. He’s never learned to play in the pocket and make passes with people coming at him. His natural instinct is to juke and take off. But as we saw and have seen with others like him (Alford comes to mind), when D1 defenses are coming, you just get smacked and your poor throws become exposed

You might be right, hell you probably are but I don't think it's reasonable to expect Keyes to develop into a pocket passer right away. Part of QB development is easing him into that role so you allow him to do things he's comfortable with at first. My point is he may never get where we need him to be but it's just entirely too early say one way or another.

Also as a counterpoint, Liberty's QB beat us in large part through use of his legs. Hopefully Keyes can put that mobility and accuracy together like that kid.
09-07-2022 04:19 PM
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Post: #15
RE: Superback
(09-07-2022 10:57 AM)gdunn Wrote:  
(09-07-2022 09:56 AM)joeye04 Wrote:  I didn’t think Keyes looked that bad. He looked, well, young. The interceptions he threw were ones I’d expect from a quarterback playing in his fifth game. One defender made a heck of an effort to catch one on the tip and the other was due to a freshman quarterback not reading the defense correctly. Plus this was his first game where the offensive line were actually giving him some pass protection. Last year it was take the snap and hope there was time to get the ball to the first read. I fully expected to lose some games because of quarterback mistakes this year. Now if he looks the same by the end of the season and into next year, by all means get Wilcke in there. But from what I saw Keyes looked like he could do it. I’ve seen a lot worse at quarterback here. He’s got a lot to learn in real game situations. Regardless, I hope Wilcke progresses enough to be able to be a useable back up for us this season. I’d love to see the superback used to throw the defenses off pace. It could be really effective.

Did Keyes look like AD or Mullen? No.

But again he's learning. I did read where Wilcke may see playing time in Miami.. Hall didn't want to throw him in a close game with Liberty. He said he got better production with Superback than with the traditional offense in the first half. And his other comment was right, the defense was holding, all night Liberty couldn't drive the field and score until they put the gunslinger in.. At that point our DC should've made adjustments. 81 yards in 4 plays with a minute left shouldn't happen.

Time of possession for the 1st qtr was about 12 mins to 3 mins for USM. Rest of the game it was 28 mins to 17 mins for Liberty. By the time the third QB was inserted, our D was gassed.
09-07-2022 04:51 PM
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Post: #16
RE: Superback
Quote:He made adjustments defense just whiffed. He caught onto the QB rolling right every time and the spy missed a tackle for loss that turned into a huge gain one series and on another we had coverage but he absolutely threaded the needle with a pass through 2 well placed defenders. I actually thought we intercepted or it was an incomplete pass at first but the replay showed it was thrown through the tightest of windows.

Yep, every time he was successful he was rolling to the right. He created many near misses.
Know the play, I thought it was a interception too. Dang it!
09-08-2022 02:05 PM
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Golden Fogg Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Superback
Has there been any update on Keyes?
09-08-2022 02:06 PM
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gdunn Offline
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RE: Superback
(09-08-2022 02:06 PM)Golden Fogg Wrote:  Has there been any update on Keyes?

Depth chart shows him starting
09-08-2022 02:11 PM
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Post: #19
RE: Superback
(09-08-2022 02:11 PM)gdunn Wrote:  
(09-08-2022 02:06 PM)Golden Fogg Wrote:  Has there been any update on Keyes?

Depth chart shows him starting

He’s not starting or playing.
09-10-2022 04:20 AM
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