If you are familiar with the UEFA Champion's League you will know that it has a league stage. Currently 32 teams enter the league stage with 8 groups of 4. Each group plays a double round robin (6 games), with the Top 2 in each group advancing to 16-team, four round knockout.

But beginning in 2024-2025, the league stage will be expanded to 36 teams in a single group. Each club will be scheduled for 8 games, 4 at home, and 4 on the road.

The teams will be seeded into four pots of nine, with two opponents drawn from each pot of nine, so that each team will have a roughly comparable schedule. This will also produce more interesting matches at the league stage. Under the existing format, each group has one of the top 8, one of the next 8, etc.

The Top 24 would advance to the knockout stage, with the top 8 receiving a bye, and #9 through #24 playing in the first round.

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So how might an NCAA Champion's League work. 36 teams in a single group, with 8 games randomly chosen. Teams could schedule the other OOL games. They might choose conference rivals, or perhaps buy games against FCS schools just like now.

The Top 16 or 24 would then enter the playoffs.

How would the 36 teams be chosen? In Europe each association (country) is allocated a certain number of berths, based on the strength of the association. Each country is limited to four berths. But there are 55 countries in UEFA. There are only 10 FBS conferences, so it would be no problem if the SEC had 9 or 12 or 15 teams.

In addition, teams from weaker countries have to win preliminary knockout games to enter the league stage. Applied to the NCAA, this might require a game between the champion of CUSA and Sun Belt, etc.

So let's choose our initial field of 36. We allocate 29 berths to P5 conferences (2024-25) on a proportional basis, and assign some to the G5.

SEC (7): Alabama, Georgia, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, Mississippi, Auburn, Kentucky
B1G(7): Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan State, Auburn, Kentucky
ACC+ND(6): Notre Dame, Clemson, Pittsburgh, NC State, Wake, Miami(FL)
B12(5): Oklahoma State, Baylor, Cincinnati, BYU, Iowa State
P10(4): Utah, Oregon, Arizona State, Oregon State
AAC(2): UAB, SMU
MtW(2): Boise State, AFA
SB(1): Louisiana
MAC(1): Central Michigan
CUSA(1): Western Kentucky

The other schools in each conference would participate in conference play:

SEC(9): Tennessee, Arkansas, Texas, Mississippi State, LSU, Florida, South Carolina, Missouri, Vanderbilt
B1G(9): Purdue, UCLA, Nebraska, USC, Maryland, Illinois, Indiana, Northwestern, Rutgers
ACC+ND(9): Louisville, North Carolina, Florida State, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Boston College, Syracuse, Georgia Tech, Duke
B12(7): Houston, Kansas State, UCF, Texas Tech, West Virginia, TCU, Kansas
P10:(6): Washington State, Washington, Cal, Stanford, Colorado, Arizona
Mountain West(10): San Diego State, Fresno State, Utah State, Nevada, Wyoming , San Jose State, Hawaii, Colorado State, UNLV, New Mexico
AAC(13): UTSA, Army*, Tulsa, Memphis, East Carolina, Navy, Tulane, Florida Atlantic, North Texas, USF, Charlotte, Rice, Temple
SB(13): Appalachian State, Coastal Carolina, Georgia State, Marshall, Troy, Old Dominion, James Madison, Georgia Southern, South Alabama, Southern Miss, Arkansas State, ULM, Arkansas State, Texas State
MAC(13): WMU, Toledo, Miami(OH), Northern Illinois, Ball State, Kent, Buffalo, EMU, Ohio, Bowling Green, Akron, UConn*, UMass*
CUSA(8): Liberty, MTSU, UTEP, Louisiana Tech, NMSU, FIU, Sam, Jacksonville State(AL)

*Because qualification for Champions League is by conference, Army has been assigned to the AAC (to go with Navy), UConn and UMass are assigned to the MAC, and Notre Dame is assigned to the ACC.

Because professional soccer teams play so many more games than college football, the UEFA Champions League is a poor comparison. It would make more sense to do an NCAA basketball comparison.

I do think a World Cup style Group Stage and Knockout Tournament could work for college football. CFB teams play a 10-game regular season with 8 conference games. Then, conference standings determine your next 3 games and whether you play in the CFP Tournament, the NIT Tournament, or a Regional Tournament.

The CFP tournament takes the top 20 teams, with some automatic champion qualifiers. Organize into five 4-team Groups wherein each team plays 3 Group stage games. The five Group winners and 3 runners up advance to the 8-team CFP. Flows into the NY6 bowls.

Champions tournament takes the next 20 teams, again, with some automatic champion qualifiers. Five 4-team Groups within 3 Group stage games. The five Group winners and 3 runners up advance to an 8-team NIT.

Then, the remaining 90 or so teams divide into 4 or 5 Regional tournaments, with certain conference and bowl affiliations, that flow through Group stage games that lead to certain Bowl matchups.

I don't know that it's better than the status quo, but it would provide for a more interesting postseason. But, you HAVE to keep the regular-season conference schedules and the chance for OOC rivalries and payday games. The Group stage games essentially fill out the remainder of the OOC schedule with peer-based schedules that magnify the high-profile matchups...the importance of each Group stage game is heightened because they flow directly into either the CFP, the NIT, or one of the Regional Bowl determination games.

(08-08-2022 02:50 PM)YNot Wrote:  Because professional soccer teams play so many more games than college football, the UEFA Champions League is a poor comparison. It would make more sense to do an NCAA basketball comparison.

I do think a World Cup style Group Stage and Knockout Tournament could work for college football. CFB teams play a 10-game regular season with 8 conference games. Then, conference standings determine your next 3 games and whether you play in the CFP Tournament, the NIT Tournament, or a Regional Tournament.

The CFP tournament takes the top 20 teams, with some automatic champion qualifiers. Organize into five 4-team Groups wherein each team plays 3 Group stage games. The five Group winners and 3 runners up advance to the 8-team CFP. Flows into the NY6 bowls.

Champions tournament takes the next 20 teams, again, with some automatic champion qualifiers. Five 4-team Groups within 3 Group stage games. The five Group winners and 3 runners up advance to an 8-team NIT.

Then, the remaining 90 or so teams divide into 4 or 5 Regional tournaments, with certain conference and bowl affiliations, that flow through Group stage games that lead to certain Bowl matchups.

I don't know that it's better than the status quo, but it would provide for a more interesting postseason. But, you HAVE to keep the regular-season conference schedules and the chance for OOC rivalries and payday games. The Group stage games essentially fill out the remainder of the OOC schedule with peer-based schedules that magnify the high-profile matchups...the importance of each Group stage game is heightened because they flow directly into either the CFP, the NIT, or one of the Regional Bowl determination games.

Based on 2021 pre-CCG CFP rankings, the CFP Group Stage would look something like this. I would give 1-seed positions to the top-5 conference champions and automatic berths to the top-7 conferences. Avoid same-conference positioning for the top-3 seed within each Group.

GROUP A
(1)Georgia
(2)Oregon
(3)Michigan State
(4)Clemson

GROUP B
(1)Michigan
(2)Ole Miss
(3)BYU
(4)San Diego State

GROUP C
(1)Alabama
(2)Baylor
(3)Iowa
(4)NC State

GROUP D
(1)Cincinnati
(2)Ohio State
(3)Oklahoma
(4)Wake

GROUP E
(1)Oklahoma State
(2)Notre Dame
(3)Pitt
(4)Utah

(08-08-2022 02:50 PM)YNot Wrote:  Because professional soccer teams play so many more games than college football, the UEFA Champions League is a poor comparison. It would make more sense to do an NCAA basketball comparison.

I do think a World Cup style Group Stage and Knockout Tournament could work for college football. CFB teams play a 10-game regular season with 8 conference games. Then, conference standings determine your next 3 games and whether you play in the CFP Tournament, the NIT Tournament, or a Regional Tournament.

The CFP tournament takes the top 20 teams, with some automatic champion qualifiers. Organize into five 4-team Groups wherein each team plays 3 Group stage games. The five Group winners and 3 runners up advance to the 8-team CFP. Flows into the NY6 bowls.

Champions tournament takes the next 20 teams, again, with some automatic champion qualifiers. Five 4-team Groups within 3 Group stage games. The five Group winners and 3 runners up advance to an 8-team NIT.

Then, the remaining 90 or so teams divide into 4 or 5 Regional tournaments, with certain conference and bowl affiliations, that flow through Group stage games that lead to certain Bowl matchups.

I don't know that it's better than the status quo, but it would provide for a more interesting postseason. But, you HAVE to keep the regular-season conference schedules and the chance for OOC rivalries and payday games. The Group stage games essentially fill out the remainder of the OOC schedule with peer-based schedules that magnify the high-profile matchups...the importance of each Group stage game is heightened because they flow directly into either the CFP, the NIT, or one of the Regional Bowl determination games.

I was interested in the idea where you could have a large group of schools in a single competition playing what is effectively a sample of the other teams. It is a big improvement over the small groups currently used where you take four teams and have them play each other twice (6 games total) just to determine which two are the best.

Let's consider the 2026 World Cup. Instead of increasing the field to 48, lets just go to 40 in a single group. Each team would play 5 games, with the Top 16 advancing to a knockout. 3-2-0 (9 points probably advances but not for certain). You might even have playoffs to break ties rather than goal difference, etc. You are much less likely to get in match-fixing situations.

I had also thought about sample scheduling for conference play, particularly for larger conferences (e.g. SEC and B1G at 16 or beyond.) Imagine that as a condition for breaking up the ACC early, the SEC and B1G are forced to take everybody.

The B1G takes Notre Dame, and Syracuse, BC, and Pitt which the SEC has no interest in. The SEC takes Clemson and FSU. They agree to halve the states of Virginia and North Carolina. The B1G takes UVA, UNC, and Duke based on academics. The SEC takes VT, NC State, and Wake Forest based on southernness. The SEC gets the Raleigh and Winston-Salem-Greensboro markets and a heads-up on Charlotte. The B1G is limited to Chapel Hill and Durham and can't expand into the Boone or Greenville markets.

The SEC takes Louisville, which the B1G would not touch. That leaves Miami and Georgia Tech. The B1G is somewhat interested in GT because of academics but realize it is even more of an island that USC-UCLA. The deal is completed when Rutgers insists on bringing in their cousins in Miami.

So the B1G is at 24, and the SEC is at 23. At this point the Western Alliance is formed from the PAC-10, B12, and MtW: 34 schools. This is not a merger but just a scheduling alliance. The American Alliance is formed by the AAC, Sun Belt, CUSA, and MAC, plus the three remaining independents (Army, UConn, and UMass): 52 schools.

For B1G scheduling the schools are grouped in five pots:

Pot 1: Ohio State, Michigan, Notre Dame, Wisconsin, Iowa.
Pot 2: Pitt, Michigan State, Penn State, Minnesota, Purdue
Pot 3: Miami(FL), UCLA, North Carolina, Nebraska
Pot 4: USC, Maryland, Virginia, Boston College, Illinois
Pot 5: Syracuse, Indiana, Northwestern, Rutgers, Duke

For a 10-game conference schedule, each school draws two opponents from each pot. But because Pot 3 only has four schools, there has to be additional draws. There will be one extra draw of Pot 1, Pot 2, Pot 4, and Pot 5. The schools that play an extra intra-pot game will only play one game against Pot 3 schools.

Rather than a purely random draw, schools will be able to designate some of their opponents. For example Ohio State and Michigan could be Pot 1 opponents and Wisconsin and Minnesota could be Pot 2 vs. Pot 3 opponents. There might also be forced draws to match up infrequent opponents.

For the SEC the five pots will be:

Pot 1: Alabama, Georgia, Clemson, Oklahoma, Texas A&M
Pot 2: Ole Miss, NC State, Auburn, Kentucky
Pot 3: Wake Forest, Tennessee, Arkansas, Texas, Mississippi State
Pot 4: LSU, Florida, Louisville, South Carolina
Pot 5: FSU, Virginia Tech, Missouri, Georgia Tech, Vanderbilt

There will adjustments to account for the different sized pots.

For the Western Alliance:

Pot 1: Oklahoma State, Utah, Baylor, Cincinnati, Oregon, BYU, Iowa State
Pot 2: Houston, Kansas State, Boise State, UCF, AFA, San Diego State, Arizona State
Pot 3: Texas Tech, West Virginia, Fresno State, TCU, Oregon State, Utah State
Pot 4: Washington State, Washington, Nevada, Cal, Stanford, Wyoming, Colorado
Pot 5: San Jose State, Hawaii, Colorado State, Arizona, Kansas, UNLV, New Mexico

As much as possible intra-conference games will be drawn.

Texas or USC will never self-relegate. The Champions League, in reality, will be just the Big 10 and the SEC, and maybe, maybe, some amalgam of what's left, but if they can make it work with just two leagues, they'll do it.

Some schools were left behind in the national picture when the NCAA went to the University vs. College Divisions, others when Division I subdivided. This will be much the same.

(08-08-2022 10:55 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  Texas or USC will never self-relegate. The Champions League, in reality, will be just the Big 10 and the SEC, and maybe, maybe, some amalgam of what's left, but if they can make it work with just two leagues, they'll do it.

Some schools were left behind in the national picture when the NCAA went to the University vs. College Divisions, others when Division I subdivided. This will be much the same.

The SEC and B1G would choose their best teams to participate in the Champions League. They would not select Texas or USC because that could cost them prestige and money.