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USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
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TallTexan Offline
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Post: #41
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
Of course USC & UCLA were always looking at a way out. It was an open secret like OU/UT. Everyone knew that consolidation would likely steal them away.

Hence why I've been advocating for years that Texas/OU should have called USC/UCLA and said "why don't we start a conference" & then just seen which friends they should bring.

That said, I hate that USC nixed this idea knowing they were headed out. Going to 16 would have killed the Big 12, shifting everyone earlier.

PAC would still exist, Big 12 might exist in name only as Baylor, Kansas State, ISU, WVU plus 8 AAC schools.

But it would have been a cleaner break overall. Now Washington & Oregon might be on the outside looking in for the future of college football while Miss State, Northwestern, & Baylor are included.
07-30-2022 04:09 PM
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RUScarlets Offline
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Post: #42
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
Should have been:

West: PAC6
East: UT OU CO Utah AU ASU

Scott needed to drop that dead weight, but I don't see how the PAC10 would have just dropped OSU/WSU from the ranks.

If it was PAC16, OSU/WSU would have stayed but I guess they didn't like the other options in Texas. Would it have been TTech? OkieSt? TCU? I think KU would have certainly been included.

Maybe KU and TTech with UT OU would have made the PAC16 viable. Houston also a possibility over TTech.
(This post was last modified: 07-30-2022 04:25 PM by RUScarlets.)
07-30-2022 04:23 PM
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WAChsenburggemeinde Offline
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Post: #43
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 04:23 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Should have been:

West: PAC6
East: UT OU CO Utah AU ASU

Scott needed to drop that dead weight, but I don't see how the PAC10 would have just dropped OSU/WSU from the ranks.

If it was PAC16, OSU/WSU would have stayed but I guess they didn't like the other options in Texas. Would it have been TTech? OkieSt? TCU? I think KU would have certainly been included.

Maybe KU and TTech with UT OU would have made the PAC16 viable. Houston also a possibility over TTech.

PAC 12 got played by USC and UCLA. Even just taking a couple schools e.g. OK State and TCU, they would be better off today. You can’t just look at the pay cut when dividing the pie more ways. You have to think strategically. One more defection and the PAC probably dies.
07-30-2022 05:54 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #44
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 05:54 PM)WAChsenburggemeinde Wrote:  
(07-30-2022 04:23 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Should have been:

West: PAC6
East: UT OU CO Utah AU ASU

Scott needed to drop that dead weight, but I don't see how the PAC10 would have just dropped OSU/WSU from the ranks.

If it was PAC16, OSU/WSU would have stayed but I guess they didn't like the other options in Texas. Would it have been TTech? OkieSt? TCU? I think KU would have certainly been included.

Maybe KU and TTech with UT OU would have made the PAC16 viable. Houston also a possibility over TTech.

PAC 12 got played by USC and UCLA. Even just taking a couple schools e.g. OK State and TCU, they would be better off today. You can’t just look at the pay cut when dividing the pie more ways. You have to think strategically. One more defection and the PAC probably dies.

Big 12 got played by OUT as well. They could have expanded like in 2016 by grabbing UCF, Cincinnati, Houston and maybe USF or Colorado State, but they didn't.
07-30-2022 05:58 PM
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Poster Offline
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Post: #45
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 09:37 AM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-30-2022 05:42 AM)OscarWildeCat Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 11:42 PM)Poster Wrote:  I don’t know what the story was with UT, OU and the PAC in 2010 and 2011, but it’s clear that the PAC really fu*ked up there. Two years in a row.

The Rumor was the PAC passed on UT and OU because Texas wanted an unequal distribution of funds; the same reason B12 schools with an option bailed.

Not true on either part.
The schools who left the Big 12 ALL favored unequal distribution. The 5 who opposed it are still in the Big 12.




Nebraska was definitely in favor of unequal distribution, and I assume that aTm probably was too. Missouri was in favor of equal distribution, and IDK about Colorado.
07-30-2022 06:09 PM
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Poster Offline
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Post: #46
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 02:43 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.

IMO, USC got very angry with the Pac-10/12 about its inability to land Texas, and when Texas decided to leave for the SEC, USC decided to pull a "Texas," and go to the B1G. As usual, UCLA was along for the ride.



Yeah, interesting point I never thought of.

Maybe USC was mad at the Pac for failing to land Oklahoma and Texas. (With any remaining chance at that being eliminated when they joined the SEC.) And maybe that is part of why USC joined the Big 10.
07-30-2022 06:12 PM
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WAChsenburggemeinde Offline
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Post: #47
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 05:58 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(07-30-2022 05:54 PM)WAChsenburggemeinde Wrote:  
(07-30-2022 04:23 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Should have been:

West: PAC6
East: UT OU CO Utah AU ASU

Scott needed to drop that dead weight, but I don't see how the PAC10 would have just dropped OSU/WSU from the ranks.

If it was PAC16, OSU/WSU would have stayed but I guess they didn't like the other options in Texas. Would it have been TTech? OkieSt? TCU? I think KU would have certainly been included.

Maybe KU and TTech with UT OU would have made the PAC16 viable. Houston also a possibility over TTech.

PAC 12 got played by USC and UCLA. Even just taking a couple schools e.g. OK State and TCU, they would be better off today. You can’t just look at the pay cut when dividing the pie more ways. You have to think strategically. One more defection and the PAC probably dies.

Big 12 got played by OUT as well. They could have expanded like in 2016 by grabbing UCF, Cincinnati, Houston and maybe USF or Colorado State, but they didn't.
Agreed.

Had they taken, say BYU and UCF, those programs would have had a couple more years of more money, better recruiting and increased exposure to develop themselves as a P5 school.
07-30-2022 06:29 PM
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constance Offline
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Post: #48
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
The Pittsburgh of the PAC
07-30-2022 07:02 PM
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Scoochpooch1 Offline
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Post: #49
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.

Tech in 1994? No one even knew of that school other than Bam Morris. Texas with A&M should have gone there in 1990.
(This post was last modified: 07-30-2022 08:18 PM by Scoochpooch1.)
07-30-2022 08:17 PM
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Scoochpooch1 Offline
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Post: #50
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-29-2022 11:42 PM)Poster Wrote:  I don’t know what the story was with UT, OU and the PAC in 2010 and 2011, but it’s clear that the PAC really fu*ked up there. Two years in a row.

PAC made a shrewd attempt to get Texas, A&M, OK, OK St, Tex Tech, and Colorado in 2010. It would have been so awesome and been much better for CFB. Big 12 gone, leftovers were headed to Big East. Texas ultimately didn't want to move West and blackmailed ESPN to give them more money via LHN. A&M saw what Texas was doing and wanted to go to SEC. Kansas would have replaced Utah and A&M here.

In 2011, OK and OK State wanted out and proposed to join the PAC-12. Shockingly they were declined. I have a feeling at Colorado and Utah said no which IMO was ridiculous since Scott shouldn't have allowed them to vote for a couple of years on expansion matters. If true, you can probably blame those 2 schools for current situation.
07-30-2022 08:25 PM
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Scoochpooch1 Offline
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Post: #51
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 09:46 AM)esayem Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.

What? I’ve never heard that. It was Colorado and Texas, and Texas didn’t pull the trigger.

Heard the same. Colorado was peaking then.
(This post was last modified: 07-30-2022 08:28 PM by Scoochpooch1.)
07-30-2022 08:28 PM
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Post: #52
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 08:17 PM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.

Tech in 1994? No one even knew of that school other than Bam Morris. Texas with A&M should have gone there in 1990.


I think that Texas was the only SWC team flirting with the PAC. BYU and Colorado were sometimes rumored as potential partners to get to 12. (I guess the PAC didn't object to religious schools back then.)

Texas A&M is supposed to have wanted to go to the SEC with Arkansas, and Texas is supposed to. have wanted to go to the PAC. Texas Tech and Baylor politicians are supposed to have instead forced them to stay in the SWC for four more years until the Big 12 deal could get signed.
07-30-2022 08:30 PM
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Post: #53
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 08:30 PM)Poster Wrote:  
(07-30-2022 08:17 PM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.

Tech in 1994? No one even knew of that school other than Bam Morris. Texas with A&M should have gone there in 1990.


I think that Texas was the only SWC team flirting with the PAC. BYU and Colorado were sometimes rumored as potential partners to get to 12. (I guess the PAC didn't object to religious schools back then.)

Texas A&M is supposed to have wanted to go to the SEC with Arkansas, and Texas is supposed to. have wanted to go to the PAC. Texas Tech and Baylor politicians are supposed to have instead forced them to stay in the SWC for four more years until the Big 12 deal could get signed.

Politicians were behind the curve in 1990 and Baylor and Tech didn't have the influence they had later. Stanford killed UT to the Pac. A&M stayed when Texas couldn't leave. But Arkansas went ahead and left.
07-30-2022 10:43 PM
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Post: #54
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
A&M has never had any interest in the PAC at any point in time for a variety of reasons and given recent history it’s been a smart policy
(This post was last modified: 07-31-2022 11:48 AM by 10thMountain.)
07-31-2022 11:48 AM
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Post: #55
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-29-2022 11:28 PM)Poster Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.


Didn’t politics prevent Texas and aTm from moving to any conference without Texas Tech and Baylor in the 1990-94 period?


Wasn’t the Big 8 ultimately chosen because they were the only conference that was willing to take Texas Tech and Baylor?

Nope, it was the Longhorn Network that killed that deal.
08-01-2022 09:06 AM
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jacksfan29! Offline
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Post: #56
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(08-01-2022 09:06 AM)jacksfan29! Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 11:28 PM)Poster Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.


Didn’t politics prevent Texas and aTm from moving to any conference without Texas Tech and Baylor in the 1990-94 period?


Wasn’t the Big 8 ultimately chosen because they were the only conference that was willing to take Texas Tech and Baylor?

Nope, it was the Longhorn Network that killed that deal.

Actually, that was the later, around 2010. The historical mess that was the SW Conference, Arkansas to the SEC, A&M flirting with the SEC, the Big 8, Big 12.... and rumors around the PAC is long and sorted. It was CU and Texas around 1994, both turned the offer from the PAC down.
08-01-2022 09:13 AM
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Post: #57
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-30-2022 06:09 PM)Poster Wrote:  
(07-30-2022 09:37 AM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-30-2022 05:42 AM)OscarWildeCat Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 11:42 PM)Poster Wrote:  I don’t know what the story was with UT, OU and the PAC in 2010 and 2011, but it’s clear that the PAC really fu*ked up there. Two years in a row.

The Rumor was the PAC passed on UT and OU because Texas wanted an unequal distribution of funds; the same reason B12 schools with an option bailed.

Not true on either part.
The schools who left the Big 12 ALL favored unequal distribution. The 5 who opposed it are still in the Big 12.




Nebraska was definitely in favor of unequal distribution, and I assume that aTm probably was too. Missouri was in favor of equal distribution, and IDK about Colorado.

The haves were aligned-Texas, Texas A&M, Oklahoma, Nebraska, Kansas, Colorado, Missouri. The have nots were opposed-Iowa St., Kansas St., Oklahoma St., Texas Tech, Baylor. Don't remember who said it, but someone said, "there were no schools more aligned on revenue than Texas and Nebraska."
08-01-2022 10:24 AM
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Post: #58
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(08-01-2022 09:13 AM)jacksfan29! Wrote:  
(08-01-2022 09:06 AM)jacksfan29! Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 11:28 PM)Poster Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.


Didn’t politics prevent Texas and aTm from moving to any conference without Texas Tech and Baylor in the 1990-94 period?


Wasn’t the Big 8 ultimately chosen because they were the only conference that was willing to take Texas Tech and Baylor?

Nope, it was the Longhorn Network that killed that deal.

Actually, that was the later, around 2010. The historical mess that was the SW Conference, Arkansas to the SEC, A&M flirting with the SEC, the Big 8, Big 12.... and rumors around the PAC is long and sorted. It was CU and Texas around 1994, both turned the offer from the PAC down.

LHN contract wasn't even bid until late 2010. ESPN and Fox promised the Big 12 would get about the same money as the Pac 16. That is what killed the deal. Why move for the same money?
08-01-2022 10:26 AM
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Hokie Mark Offline
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Post: #59
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(07-29-2022 10:28 PM)SouthEastAlaska Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:26 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.

I am talking about this last expansion. The Pac have no one but themselves to blame.

Domer you are spot on, the PAC has always had no one to blame but themselves.

That may be true, but it doesn't justify celebrating deception and betrayal.
08-01-2022 10:29 AM
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SouthEastAlaska Offline
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Post: #60
RE: USC ‘shut down’ potential Pac-12 expansion plans last year
(08-01-2022 10:29 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:28 PM)SouthEastAlaska Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:26 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(07-29-2022 10:11 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  Smart move. The Pac deserves what it has gotten.

They turned down Texas alone in 1990. And had they been willing to take Texas Tech with UT in 1993-94 they could have had them then with A&M going to the SEC.

I am talking about this last expansion. The Pac have no one but themselves to blame.

Domer you are spot on, the PAC has always had no one to blame but themselves.

That may be true, but it doesn't justify celebrating deception and betrayal.

Oh I'm definitely not celebrating what has happened but we all have to recognize that the PAC has had numerous opportunities over the last 40 years to better the conferences position and they have bumbled all of them. Hence the statement that they have no one to blame but themselves.
08-01-2022 10:43 AM
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