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Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
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TigerBlue4Ever Online
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Post: #41
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-19-2022 02:43 PM)MSU87 Wrote:  
(07-19-2022 01:08 PM)MemphisFootballFan Wrote:  Sports Illustrated recently ranked all P5 schools based on the value they bring to an athletic conference. They chose 5 factors (none of which were "crime"): Football Performance, Football Attendance, Football Viewership, Academics, and All Sports - which is performance in sports such as basketball and women's volleyball. They weight all of these factors equally though they confess that "all sports" "is the most disposable of the metrics here."

I think this a pretty decent ranking of the kinds of things that athletic conferences look at when evaluating schools, although I would throw out "All Sports" because conferences do not care about basketball or women's volleyball.

https://www.si.com/college/2022/07/14/po...big-ten-ac

The link is missing the last character. This works (unless CSNBBS truncates it.)

https://www.si.com/college/2022/07/14/po...ig-ten-acc

it often does
07-19-2022 09:10 PM
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ncrdbl1 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-19-2022 09:09 AM)MemTigers1998 Wrote:  One of these leagues is about to poach the other. Which one depends on what TV networks are willing to pay
After this last round of realignment the PAC 12 area still has 5 of the top 20 TV markets WITHOUT the LA market. The Big 12 only has 2 both in Texas.

The tricky part is that 3 of the PAC 12 are in California so UCLA and USC still for the most part are the top dogs in the state.

But all of the Big 12 top 20 markets are in Texas where the Horns and Aggies rule.

Outside of Texas the Big 12 cannot match PAC 12 TV markets of Phoenix, Denver and Seattle.
(This post was last modified: 07-19-2022 09:21 PM by ncrdbl1.)
07-19-2022 09:11 PM
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TigerBlue4Ever Online
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Post: #43
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-19-2022 07:41 PM)jsw3ent Wrote:  
(07-19-2022 07:30 PM)Keeper Wrote:  We were number 2 on everyone's list with the exception of the bigxii.

A couple weeks ago when you started a thread (which was removed) titled "the 3 worst posters on the board"--in which you listed -ME/HHT/STAMMERS--as your worst-----------------------------------------you stated that you had all 3 of us on ignore---------------------now you comment on a post I made------------------------------------do you make a habit of lying ?

Isn't that an AUP violation?
07-19-2022 09:13 PM
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gotigers1 Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
Honestly....and I know this won't be a popular opinion but whatever.....when the Big 12 took the 4 teams it did, that ended our shot right then and there, regardless of what they said afterwards.
07-19-2022 09:55 PM
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gotohellolemiss Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-18-2022 11:07 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 10:40 PM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  
Quote:New Big 12 commissioner Brett Yormark has maintained that the league is "open for business" and the conference has stressed that it plans to be aggressive about potential additions.

"We will leave no stone unturned to drive value for the conference," Yormark said at media day. He added: "There is no higher priority than to best position the Big 12 for its upcoming multimedia rights negotiations. Everything we do must create momentum for those negotiations."

Just pick up the phone ...

Would Memphis add value if they didn’t think the rest of the PAC 12 could do that?

Its a shame that this standard is not applied to the lesser programs in the SEC . Does Vandy bring in the money equal to that it receives? Does Ole Miss? Does MSU? Does a Kentucky football game interest anyone outside of the state of Kentucky? Or, in the Big 10, do Indiana, Illinois, Rutgers, Northwestern, or Maryland have a real shot at being national champion in football? The so called two power conferences still include a ton of schools that have no legitimate chance at winning a national championship.
07-19-2022 11:10 PM
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hk25 Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-18-2022 11:07 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 10:40 PM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  
Quote:New Big 12 commissioner Brett Yormark has maintained that the league is "open for business" and the conference has stressed that it plans to be aggressive about potential additions.

"We will leave no stone unturned to drive value for the conference," Yormark said at media day. He added: "There is no higher priority than to best position the Big 12 for its upcoming multimedia rights negotiations. Everything we do must create momentum for those negotiations."

Just pick up the phone ...

Would Memphis add value if they didn’t think the rest of the PAC 12 could do that?

That’s not how I interpreted the breakdown of communications & B12 “walking away”.

I think the PAC was only really open to a merger with them absorbing the B12 & the B12 doesn’t believe that is in their best interest.

I believe the B12 would accept any one of the existing PAC members if they applied for membership today.

And that appears to be a real possibility especially for one or more of the 4 corner universities. While I doubt it happens, it’s still in the B12’s best interest to be proactive & see if any existing P5 schools will join them.

They can add from G5 at any time in the future if they need to.
07-20-2022 06:51 AM
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bluebacker Away
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Post: #47
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-19-2022 11:10 PM)gotohellolemiss Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 11:07 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 10:40 PM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  
Quote:New Big 12 commissioner Brett Yormark has maintained that the league is "open for business" and the conference has stressed that it plans to be aggressive about potential additions.

"We will leave no stone unturned to drive value for the conference," Yormark said at media day. He added: "There is no higher priority than to best position the Big 12 for its upcoming multimedia rights negotiations. Everything we do must create momentum for those negotiations."

Just pick up the phone ...

Would Memphis add value if they didn’t think the rest of the PAC 12 could do that?

Its a shame that this standard is not applied to the lesser programs in the SEC . Does Vandy bring in the money equal to that it receives? Does Ole Miss? Does MSU? Does a Kentucky football game interest anyone outside of the state of Kentucky? Or, in the Big 10, do Indiana, Illinois, Rutgers, Northwestern, or Maryland have a real shot at being national champion in football? The so called two power conferences still include a ton of schools that have no legitimate chance at winning a national championship.

That is all true but those schools have the good fortune of already being 'in'. It would probably be easier for the. SEC to dissolve itself with certain schools reforming a new conference than it would be to kick out Vanderbilt.... Plus, the top programs still need a breather or two on the conference schedule.
07-20-2022 07:40 AM
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MemphisFootballFan Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-19-2022 11:10 PM)gotohellolemiss Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 11:07 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 10:40 PM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  
Quote:New Big 12 commissioner Brett Yormark has maintained that the league is "open for business" and the conference has stressed that it plans to be aggressive about potential additions.

"We will leave no stone unturned to drive value for the conference," Yormark said at media day. He added: "There is no higher priority than to best position the Big 12 for its upcoming multimedia rights negotiations. Everything we do must create momentum for those negotiations."

Just pick up the phone ...

Would Memphis add value if they didn’t think the rest of the PAC 12 could do that?

Its a shame that this standard is not applied to the lesser programs in the SEC . Does Vandy bring in the money equal to that it receives? Does Ole Miss? Does MSU? Does a Kentucky football game interest anyone outside of the state of Kentucky? Or, in the Big 10, do Indiana, Illinois, Rutgers, Northwestern, or Maryland have a real shot at being national champion in football? The so called two power conferences still include a ton of schools that have no legitimate chance at winning a national championship.

Kentucky is investing heavily in football and they have had a lot of football success in the last several years because they understand that it is the only sport that matters.

https://footballscoop.com/news/mark-stoo...0contract.
07-20-2022 08:09 AM
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Tiger87 Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-19-2022 08:50 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  ACC would take some from Big12?


The 3 tier2 conferences are all eyeing each other.
WVU, UCF, and Cincy fit the ACC geographically - as do many AAC schools - Memphis is not a stretch.
The Texas schools would be a stretch, but might be possible.
It will come down to which of the tier2's is viewed as most stable; that conference might be able to pick a few existing P5's off.
Then doors open for us again.
07-20-2022 09:59 AM
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Unionman76 Offline
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Post: #50
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
sec football is not competitive

alabama and georgia voted 96 % chance of winning the conference

every other team less than 1 %
07-20-2022 01:29 PM
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SouthernMSTiger Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-20-2022 01:29 PM)Unionman76 Wrote:  sec football is not competitive

alabama and georgia voted 96 % chance of winning the conference

every other team less than 1 %

Shhhh! Don’t tell Auburn, LSU, or Florida that.
07-20-2022 01:46 PM
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Unionman76 Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
SEC Championship 2022 odds

Alabama -145
Georgia +140
Texas A&M +1500
Tennessee +4000
Ole Miss +5000
Arkansas +5000
Florida +5000
Kentucky +5000
LSU +6000
Auburn +10000
South Carolina +10000
Mississippi State +10000
Missouri +30000
Vanderbilt +50000

2022 AAC CHAMPIONSHIP ODDS

Cincinnati +200
Houston +280
UCF +280
Memphis +900
SMU +1200
ECU +2000
Tulane +2800
Tulsa +4000
USF +6000
Navy +10000
Temple +20000
07-20-2022 02:00 PM
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memtiger1987 Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-19-2022 11:10 PM)gotohellolemiss Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 11:07 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 10:40 PM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  
Quote:New Big 12 commissioner Brett Yormark has maintained that the league is "open for business" and the conference has stressed that it plans to be aggressive about potential additions.

"We will leave no stone unturned to drive value for the conference," Yormark said at media day. He added: "There is no higher priority than to best position the Big 12 for its upcoming multimedia rights negotiations. Everything we do must create momentum for those negotiations."

Just pick up the phone ...

Would Memphis add value if they didn’t think the rest of the PAC 12 could do that?

Its a shame that this standard is not applied to the lesser programs in the SEC . Does Vandy bring in the money equal to that it receives? Does Ole Miss? Does MSU? Does a Kentucky football game interest anyone outside of the state of Kentucky? Or, in the Big 10, do Indiana, Illinois, Rutgers, Northwestern, or Maryland have a real shot at being national champion in football? The so called two power conferences still include a ton of schools that have no legitimate chance at winning a national championship.

Good points. But, these teams are in. Whether they provide value at this point is irrelevant. When conferences are looking to add members, do they add value (tv contract primarily)? Houston, Cinci, and UCF added no value to the B12 until they imploded. Right now we just don’t. We need a shakeup and a need to add the best available.. then we add value!
07-20-2022 02:30 PM
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Stammers Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-20-2022 02:30 PM)memtiger1987 Wrote:  
(07-19-2022 11:10 PM)gotohellolemiss Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 11:07 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 10:40 PM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  
Quote:New Big 12 commissioner Brett Yormark has maintained that the league is "open for business" and the conference has stressed that it plans to be aggressive about potential additions.

"We will leave no stone unturned to drive value for the conference," Yormark said at media day. He added: "There is no higher priority than to best position the Big 12 for its upcoming multimedia rights negotiations. Everything we do must create momentum for those negotiations."

Just pick up the phone ...

Would Memphis add value if they didn’t think the rest of the PAC 12 could do that?

Its a shame that this standard is not applied to the lesser programs in the SEC . Does Vandy bring in the money equal to that it receives? Does Ole Miss? Does MSU? Does a Kentucky football game interest anyone outside of the state of Kentucky? Or, in the Big 10, do Indiana, Illinois, Rutgers, Northwestern, or Maryland have a real shot at being national champion in football? The so called two power conferences still include a ton of schools that have no legitimate chance at winning a national championship.

Good points. But, these teams are in. Whether they provide value at this point is irrelevant. When conferences are looking to add members, do they add value (tv contract primarily)? Houston, Cinci, and UCF added no value to the B12 until they imploded. Right now we just don’t. We need a shakeup and a need to add the best available.. then we add value!

By that criteria we definitely add value. We are worth much more to those conferences than Boston College, Wake Forest, Syracuse, Iowa State, Vanderbilt and South Carolina.

You could make the argument that because our tv contract with high exposure weeknight games, and avoiding FS1, FS2 and not being relegated to ESPNU and ESPN News has made us a bigger brand than quite a few P5 schools.

We would definitely add value to the Big 12. We would drop Kansas and Texas Tech down a rung on the TV network list. Less people would be forced to watch them.
07-20-2022 03:17 PM
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CRM114 Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-20-2022 03:17 PM)Stammers Wrote:  
(07-20-2022 02:30 PM)memtiger1987 Wrote:  
(07-19-2022 11:10 PM)gotohellolemiss Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 11:07 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 10:40 PM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  Just pick up the phone ...

Would Memphis add value if they didn’t think the rest of the PAC 12 could do that?

Its a shame that this standard is not applied to the lesser programs in the SEC . Does Vandy bring in the money equal to that it receives? Does Ole Miss? Does MSU? Does a Kentucky football game interest anyone outside of the state of Kentucky? Or, in the Big 10, do Indiana, Illinois, Rutgers, Northwestern, or Maryland have a real shot at being national champion in football? The so called two power conferences still include a ton of schools that have no legitimate chance at winning a national championship.

Good points. But, these teams are in. Whether they provide value at this point is irrelevant. When conferences are looking to add members, do they add value (tv contract primarily)? Houston, Cinci, and UCF added no value to the B12 until they imploded. Right now we just don’t. We need a shakeup and a need to add the best available.. then we add value!

By that criteria we definitely add value. We are worth much more to those conferences than Boston College, Wake Forest, Syracuse, Iowa State, Vanderbilt and South Carolina.

You could make the argument that because our tv contract with high exposure weeknight games, and avoiding FS1, FS2 and not being relegated to ESPNU and ESPN News has made us a bigger brand than quite a few P5 schools.

We would definitely add value to the Big 12. We would drop Kansas and Texas Tech down a rung on the TV network list. Less people would be forced to watch them.

We would certainly add something, but question is would we add value above the average school payout (post UT/OU) for the existing schools? If every team gets $20M from whatever deal they end up with, but we are only worth $15M, every current B12 team takes a pay cut to add us.

Unless, of course, we are admitted at a lower payout as a new member. As long as it's not a decrease from existing AAC payout, and there's some path to full payout as our value increases, I'd think we would take that in a heartbeat. Just the improved exposure, recruiting and fan interest/ticket sales would be worth it.
07-20-2022 05:18 PM
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Tiger87 Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-20-2022 05:18 PM)CRM114 Wrote:  Unless, of course, we are admitted at a lower payout as a new member. As long as it's not a decrease from existing AAC payout, and there's some path to full payout as our value increases, I'd think we would take that in a heartbeat. Just the improved exposure, recruiting and fan interest/ticket sales would be worth it.

That's the ticket!
Everyone now talking about restructuring payment within the P5's based upon value anyway. (Could be a bad deal for the Vandy's of the world.)
I wouldn't be surprised if some type of scale is applied to the 4 B12 newbies, and anyone else moving "up" in conferences in the coming months.
07-20-2022 05:28 PM
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Stammers Offline
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Post: #57
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-20-2022 05:28 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(07-20-2022 05:18 PM)CRM114 Wrote:  Unless, of course, we are admitted at a lower payout as a new member. As long as it's not a decrease from existing AAC payout, and there's some path to full payout as our value increases, I'd think we would take that in a heartbeat. Just the improved exposure, recruiting and fan interest/ticket sales would be worth it.

That's the ticket!
Everyone now talking about restructuring payment within the P5's based upon value anyway. (Could be a bad deal for the Vandy's of the world.)
I wouldn't be surprised if some type of scale is applied to the 4 B12 newbies, and anyone else moving "up" in conferences in the coming months.

I have thought for many years that eventually college football will become like Spotify. Schools might get paid a base amount for being in a conference, but if 6 million people watch Ohio State - Michigan on ABC, and 350,000 watch Ole Piss and Vandy on ESPNU, each will get paid accordingly.

With that type of model, we could compete.
07-20-2022 08:22 PM
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memtiger1987 Offline
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Post: #58
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-20-2022 03:17 PM)Stammers Wrote:  
(07-20-2022 02:30 PM)memtiger1987 Wrote:  
(07-19-2022 11:10 PM)gotohellolemiss Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 11:07 PM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  
(07-18-2022 10:40 PM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  Just pick up the phone ...

Would Memphis add value if they didn’t think the rest of the PAC 12 could do that?

Its a shame that this standard is not applied to the lesser programs in the SEC . Does Vandy bring in the money equal to that it receives? Does Ole Miss? Does MSU? Does a Kentucky football game interest anyone outside of the state of Kentucky? Or, in the Big 10, do Indiana, Illinois, Rutgers, Northwestern, or Maryland have a real shot at being national champion in football? The so called two power conferences still include a ton of schools that have no legitimate chance at winning a national championship.

Good points. But, these teams are in. Whether they provide value at this point is irrelevant. When conferences are looking to add members, do they add value (tv contract primarily)? Houston, Cinci, and UCF added no value to the B12 until they imploded. Right now we just don’t. We need a shakeup and a need to add the best available.. then we add value!

By that criteria we definitely add value. We are worth much more to those conferences than Boston College, Wake Forest, Syracuse, Iowa State, Vanderbilt and South Carolina.

You could make the argument that because our tv contract with high exposure weeknight games, and avoiding FS1, FS2 and not being relegated to ESPNU and ESPN News has made us a bigger brand than quite a few P5 schools.

We would definitely add value to the Big 12. We would drop Kansas and Texas Tech down a rung on the TV network list. Less people would be forced to watch them.

Again, it’s not the Vandy’s or Wake Forest’s that add value. They were just lucky enough to be in the right conference. It’s the Alabama’s and Clemson’s that add the real value. Obviously Texas and OU provided the real $$ to the B12 TV contract (or the USC/UCLA to the PAC).

Are we better than a lot of the P5 schools (or add more value to their conference)? Absolutely. However, they are in and we aren’t. A ton of these teams would never be invited to a P5 conference if they weren’t in it. But it’s rare to kick teams out. I can’t think of many in the recent future, but Temple was booted from the Big East about 20 years ago. A lot of the P5 teams are total dead weight, but again, it’s rare to kick out current members. For hopefuls like Memphis, we have to be a net gain to the conference, and we really aren’t right now. We easily could have been an invitee to the B12, and could have been helpful when they needed teams. Just like UCF, Houston and Cinci, we need some big movement for us to get our chance.
07-20-2022 08:48 PM
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TigerFan38134 Offline
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Post: #59
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-20-2022 08:22 PM)Stammers Wrote:  
(07-20-2022 05:28 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(07-20-2022 05:18 PM)CRM114 Wrote:  Unless, of course, we are admitted at a lower payout as a new member. As long as it's not a decrease from existing AAC payout, and there's some path to full payout as our value increases, I'd think we would take that in a heartbeat. Just the improved exposure, recruiting and fan interest/ticket sales would be worth it.

That's the ticket!
Everyone now talking about restructuring payment within the P5's based upon value anyway. (Could be a bad deal for the Vandy's of the world.)
I wouldn't be surprised if some type of scale is applied to the 4 B12 newbies, and anyone else moving "up" in conferences in the coming months.

I have thought for many years that eventually college football will become like Spotify. Schools might get paid a base amount for being in a conference, but if 6 million people watch Ohio State - Michigan on ABC, and 350,000 watch Ole Piss and Vandy on ESPNU, each will get paid accordingly.

With that type of model, we could compete.

So if that model gets legs across the board, do conferences like the AAC have a higher payout per school than some low teir teams get in the SEC/BIG-10, making them look outside of their current conference affiliation, opening spots for team that bring actual value to the conference? Outside of conference tournaments, why not pay each school what it's worth instead of paying it what the conference is worth as a whole? If that's the case, would we be better/worse off than we are currently?
07-22-2022 11:51 AM
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Stammers Offline
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Post: #60
RE: Report: Big 12 and PAC 12 won’t partner; talks end
(07-22-2022 11:51 AM)TigerFan38134 Wrote:  
(07-20-2022 08:22 PM)Stammers Wrote:  
(07-20-2022 05:28 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(07-20-2022 05:18 PM)CRM114 Wrote:  Unless, of course, we are admitted at a lower payout as a new member. As long as it's not a decrease from existing AAC payout, and there's some path to full payout as our value increases, I'd think we would take that in a heartbeat. Just the improved exposure, recruiting and fan interest/ticket sales would be worth it.

That's the ticket!
Everyone now talking about restructuring payment within the P5's based upon value anyway. (Could be a bad deal for the Vandy's of the world.)
I wouldn't be surprised if some type of scale is applied to the 4 B12 newbies, and anyone else moving "up" in conferences in the coming months.

I have thought for many years that eventually college football will become like Spotify. Schools might get paid a base amount for being in a conference, but if 6 million people watch Ohio State - Michigan on ABC, and 350,000 watch Ole Piss and Vandy on ESPNU, each will get paid accordingly.

With that type of model, we could compete.

So if that model gets legs across the board, do conferences like the AAC have a higher payout per school than some low teir teams get in the SEC/BIG-10, making them look outside of their current conference affiliation, opening spots for team that bring actual value to the conference? Outside of conference tournaments, why not pay each school what it's worth instead of paying it what the conference is worth as a whole? If that's the case, would we be better/worse off than we are currently?

Probably not, but there wouldn't be as big of a disparity, and I think this seems to be the most logical step. The bottom feeders would still get a good payout just for being in the conference, and if they have one game against Alabama or Ohio State that's on ABC/CBS/ESPN it will result in a huge payout, but otherwise, we would come out ahead of them game by game.

Our Thursday night games that draw between 800,000 - 1,200,000 on ESPN, would dwarf those Kansas - Central Michigan games on ESPN News.
07-22-2022 01:47 PM
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