As an attendee and PSU fan...it was a great game. Had good experiences with Utah fans. Yes, there were more of them there than PSU but..."a sea of red"...not exactly. Here's what gave it that illusion though...

1. Penn State calling a white out was dumb. If it was warm, sunny day...maybe it would have worked better. But in rainy, cold weather people just don't have jackets and coats and rain gear that is white. Group after group of PSU fan walked past us in blue/gray/black...I would guess that MAYBE half of PSU fans were actually in white. Many of them either didn't hear about the white out...or they didn't have warm clothing that was white.

2. Utah's main color is red. I bet every Utah fan had a red sweatshirt or jacket or coat at home. If it was a hot day, they may have been MORE likely to wear "not red." But when it's your team's main "coat color" it's what you wear on a dreary day like yesterday.

3. My guess is that the crowd was split 60-40 Utah to PSU. Of course they had more...we had a good (not great) season and our fans are centralized 2000 miles farther away from Pasadena than Utah's. But it wasn't a "sea of red" in reality. The actual breakdown was something like 50% red, 20% white, and 30% other (with PSU fans making up the majority of the "other" colors with their blue sweatshirts and black jackets). 50 to 20 (red to white) did make it look like a dominant Utah crowd...but it wasn't that bad.

(01-03-2023 04:17 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  

(01-03-2023 06:12 AM)AuzGrams Wrote:  

(01-03-2023 01:42 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  If you had told me in 2010 that Mountain West members Utah and TCU would be in 3 Rose Bowls and a National Championship Game over the next 12 years…

Utah didn’t win anything, but at least they’re getting some credit I guess.

They should get credit for getting there in back-to-back years. Penn State has better overall talent. Utah was playing without cornerback Clark Phillips and tight end Dalton Kincaid, who both opted out for the NFL. Both were first team All-Pac-12. They needed Cam Rising to help them keep up with PSU and once he went out, that was the end of the day for the Utes. Penn State had a star cornerback, Joey Porter Jr. opt-out for the NFL, but they barely missed him.

The attendance for the Rose Bowl game yesterday was 94,873. The traffic was a mess, but not unusual considering the fact that the Rose Bowl struggles to handle 50,000 fans. The Utah fans showed up in great numbers and they were loud, but I really have to give it to the Penn State fans. They were really loud and entertaining. In the 4th quarter, it was a joy to listen to them singing, "Sweet Caroline." That is one passionate fanbase and something you never see in the Rose Bowl when UCLA is playing.

I give credit to Utah for figuring out the formula for success in the PAC 12...beat the overrated PAC 12 darling twice and watch your 3-loss ranking soar! (Oregon x2 in 2021 and USC x2 in 2022).

Their back-to-back PAC 12 championship seasons and back-to-back Rose Bowl appearances correspond with their back-to-back 4-loss seasons and a whimpering 0-4 record against OOC P5 opponents, including their rival...a fitting tail-end to back-to-back-to-back-to-back bowl losses.

(01-03-2023 06:55 PM)micahandme Wrote:  As an attendee and PSU fan...it was a great game. Had good experiences with Utah fans. Yes, there were more of them there than PSU but..."a sea of red"...not exactly. Here's what gave it that illusion though...

1. Penn State calling a white out was dumb. If it was warm, sunny day...maybe it would have worked better. But in rainy, cold weather people just don't have jackets and coats and rain gear that is white. Group after group of PSU fan walked past us in blue/gray/black...I would guess that MAYBE half of PSU fans were actually in white. Many of them either didn't hear about the white out...or they didn't have warm clothing that was white.

2. Utah's main color is red. I bet every Utah fan had a red sweatshirt or jacket or coat at home. If it was a hot day, they may have been MORE likely to wear "not red." But when it's your team's main "coat color" it's what you wear on a dreary day like yesterday.

3. My guess is that the crowd was split 60-40 Utah to PSU. Of course they had more...we had a good (not great) season and our fans are centralized 2000 miles farther away from Pasadena than Utah's. But it wasn't a "sea of red" in reality. The actual breakdown was something like 50% red, 20% white, and 30% other (with PSU fans making up the majority of the "other" colors with their blue sweatshirts and black jackets). 50 to 20 (red to white) did make it look like a dominant Utah crowd...but it wasn't that bad.

It was pretty heavy red. Look at the views of the stadium on any replays. At least 60% Utah.

(01-03-2023 07:16 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-03-2023 06:55 PM)micahandme Wrote:  As an attendee and PSU fan...it was a great game. Had good experiences with Utah fans. Yes, there were more of them there than PSU but..."a sea of red"...not exactly. Here's what gave it that illusion though...

1. Penn State calling a white out was dumb. If it was warm, sunny day...maybe it would have worked better. But in rainy, cold weather people just don't have jackets and coats and rain gear that is white. Group after group of PSU fan walked past us in blue/gray/black...I would guess that MAYBE half of PSU fans were actually in white. Many of them either didn't hear about the white out...or they didn't have warm clothing that was white.

2. Utah's main color is red. I bet every Utah fan had a red sweatshirt or jacket or coat at home. If it was a hot day, they may have been MORE likely to wear "not red." But when it's your team's main "coat color" it's what you wear on a dreary day like yesterday.

3. My guess is that the crowd was split 60-40 Utah to PSU. Of course they had more...we had a good (not great) season and our fans are centralized 2000 miles farther away from Pasadena than Utah's. But it wasn't a "sea of red" in reality. The actual breakdown was something like 50% red, 20% white, and 30% other (with PSU fans making up the majority of the "other" colors with their blue sweatshirts and black jackets). 50 to 20 (red to white) did make it look like a dominant Utah crowd...but it wasn't that bad.

It was pretty heavy red. Look at the views of the stadium on any replays. At least 60% Utah.

Yeah. my guess from the various TV shots would be about 70% Utah.

(01-03-2023 06:55 PM)micahandme Wrote:  As an attendee and PSU fan...it was a great game. Had good experiences with Utah fans. Yes, there were more of them there than PSU but..."a sea of red"...not exactly. Here's what gave it that illusion though...

1. Penn State calling a white out was dumb. If it was warm, sunny day...maybe it would have worked better. But in rainy, cold weather people just don't have jackets and coats and rain gear that is white. Group after group of PSU fan walked past us in blue/gray/black...I would guess that MAYBE half of PSU fans were actually in white. Many of them either didn't hear about the white out...or they didn't have warm clothing that was white.

2. Utah's main color is red. I bet every Utah fan had a red sweatshirt or jacket or coat at home. If it was a hot day, they may have been MORE likely to wear "not red." But when it's your team's main "coat color" it's what you wear on a dreary day like yesterday.

3. My guess is that the crowd was split 60-40 Utah to PSU. Of course they had more...we had a good (not great) season and our fans are centralized 2000 miles farther away from Pasadena than Utah's. But it wasn't a "sea of red" in reality. The actual breakdown was something like 50% red, 20% white, and 30% other (with PSU fans making up the majority of the "other" colors with their blue sweatshirts and black jackets). 50 to 20 (red to white) did make it look like a dominant Utah crowd...but it wasn't that bad.

This is what it looked like to me. As I was driving in at five miles an hour in Rose Bowl traffic, and there was a constant flow of Utah fans in red walking by my car. Out of 94,873 fans, I would estimate that 25,000 were Penn State fans. Maybe 30,000 fans at best.

(01-03-2023 07:13 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(01-03-2023 04:17 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  

(01-03-2023 06:12 AM)AuzGrams Wrote:  

(01-03-2023 01:42 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  If you had told me in 2010 that Mountain West members Utah and TCU would be in 3 Rose Bowls and a National Championship Game over the next 12 years…

Utah didn’t win anything, but at least they’re getting some credit I guess.

They should get credit for getting there in back-to-back years. Penn State has better overall talent. Utah was playing without cornerback Clark Phillips and tight end Dalton Kincaid, who both opted out for the NFL. Both were first team All-Pac-12. They needed Cam Rising to help them keep up with PSU and once he went out, that was the end of the day for the Utes. Penn State had a star cornerback, Joey Porter Jr. opt-out for the NFL, but they barely missed him.

The attendance for the Rose Bowl game yesterday was 94,873. The traffic was a mess, but not unusual considering the fact that the Rose Bowl struggles to handle 50,000 fans. The Utah fans showed up in great numbers and they were loud, but I really have to give it to the Penn State fans. They were really loud and entertaining. In the 4th quarter, it was a joy to listen to them singing, "Sweet Caroline." That is one passionate fanbase and something you never see in the Rose Bowl when UCLA is playing.

I give credit to Utah for figuring out the formula for success in the PAC 12...beat the overrated PAC 12 darling twice and watch your 3-loss ranking soar! (Oregon x2 in 2021 and USC x2 in 2022).

Their back-to-back PAC 12 championship seasons and back-to-back Rose Bowl appearances correspond with their back-to-back 4-loss seasons and a whimpering 0-4 record against OOC P5 opponents, including their rival...a fitting tail-end to back-to-back-to-back-to-back bowl losses.

I don't know why you feel the need to take a cheap shot at Utah. Maybe it is a jealousy thing. Utah is #22 in 2023 football recruiting rankings, BYU is #68. They are trending in a different direction than BYU. Your team loses four in a row in the middle of the season, including a 41-14 loss at Liberty and a loss at home to East Carolina. BYU had a blowout loss at Oregon. You really want to this?

(01-02-2023 09:03 AM)AssKickingChicken Wrote:  It is still a game I don’t give two ***** about.

... he said, in a post about it.

(01-02-2023 05:34 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  All those Utah fans in the stands. The love football in that fast growing state. Honestly this is why many people --myself included-- see the Utes as a much better B1G target than Cal. Still I think they are sort of the Wisconsin of the Pac-12, good but never legitimate top 10 material.

The Utes are all upside.

(01-02-2023 08:36 PM)schmolik Wrote:  And Penn State wins the last ever Big Ten-Pac 12 Rose Bowl!

Marty McFly from 1985 is looking at the Rose Bowl score and saying

'Penn State played Utah?'

It felt not too long ago like Franklin was on the hot seat.

https://twitter.com/brucefeldmancfb/stat...5-qd1tGEcw

That was painful. Whittingham has spent years trying to find an offensive identity to match the defense. Ludwig finally figured something out with the 2-3 TE personnel sets to provide at least some semblance of a passing game despite being run first. But that is not a formula for recruiting WRs who basically never touch the ball. And with the top two TEs out (Kuithe was #1, the guy who wound up all-American was #2), there simply were no playmakers on the field. And defensive aggression doesn’t work unless you have a guy who can generate INTs in the secondary.

I think the formula is in place, and the upside is set barring some unexpected recruiting success at the WR or QB position. We will get one blue chip TE and one blue chip CB recruit who will each carry the defense and offense that is otherwise a bunch of hard-working overachieving 3*.

When they’re injured (like Kuithe, Kincaid, and Phillips were for a significant stretch of games) or opt out we’ll go from being a marginal top 10 team to a marginal top 20 team because the recruiting will never compare with the top 10. I think a lot of programs fit this description and simply cycle up and down every year based on injury luck/misfortune.

Only top 10 recruiting programs have the kind of high end talent outside of their feature/focus positions to weather the typical level of CFB injury attrition. I haven’t really followed TCU much, but they sort of fit this description as well, and I assume they managed to have an outlier good year in the injury front, which is what any 10-20 tier program has to hope for.

(01-04-2023 10:52 AM)Hokie4Skins Wrote:  It felt not too long ago like Franklin was on the hot seat.

https://twitter.com/brucefeldmancfb/stat...5-qd1tGEcw

Heck, after the way Michigan and Ohio State worked them over, it wasn't long at all. Sadly, there are those malcontents in any of these top program "fanbases." To them, what good is Franklin if he can't beat these Ohio State or Michigan teams; if he can't beat them both in a single season? Not much different than those getting tough on Harbaugh for his bowl/playoff shortcomings, or, probably the more ridiculous one: Day and his shortcomings against Michigan.

One could simply ignore their insufferableness, but, sadly, there are those within their count who have influence. It just makes the entire college scene unenjoyable. My one hope with the expanded playoff is that it relieves some of this pressure at the top because of its widening.

As a PSU alum, while I would have wished PSU fans were "different" than those at other major programs, that tweet says it all. Franklin isn't perfect, but he's doing more in his time annually than Paterno ever really did. You can't tell the Joebots that, though.

(01-04-2023 10:52 AM)Hokie4Skins Wrote:  It felt not too long ago like Franklin was on the hot seat.

https://twitter.com/brucefeldmancfb/stat...5-qd1tGEcw

IMO, he never should have been on the hot seat. He has been a slam-dunk coach.

Now has been Urban or Dabo or Saban or Kirby? No, but how many other guys are? You can't fire a guy just because he isn't those guys. Yeah, they were mediocre in 2020 and 2021, but those were covid years.

I understand that Penn State aspires to national titles, and they have every right to do that. But even Paterno didn't win a national title until his 17th season as head coach. Those are few and far between for even most blue-blood programs. Franklin has been to four NY6 bowls in eight years, winning three of them. IMO he is an outstanding coach.

(01-04-2023 12:20 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(01-04-2023 10:52 AM)Hokie4Skins Wrote:  It felt not too long ago like Franklin was on the hot seat.

https://twitter.com/brucefeldmancfb/stat...5-qd1tGEcw

IMO, he never should have been on the hot seat. He has been a slam-dunk coach.

Now has been Urban or Dabo or Saban or Kirby? No, but how many other guys are? You can't fire a guy just because he isn't those guys.

I understand that Penn State aspires to national titles, and they have every right to do that. But even Paterno didn't win a national title until his 17th season as head coach. Those are few and far between for even most blue-blood programs. Franklin has been to four NY6 bowls in eight years, winning three of them. IMO he is an outstanding coach.

Yeah, one of the ironies of Paterno was how he almost died on the hill for his "system" of benching youth for a pro-senior starting roster. 2000, 2001, 2003, and 2004 were insufferable years. The guy should have lost his job. Anyone else but Joe Paterno WOULD have lost their job for that stretch. But, heh, wouldn't you know, he keeps his job, and the 2005 team might be one of his best ever. 2008 and 2009 then follow. Until he (and leadership) were exposed for the wretches they were in 2011, that it ever got to a point where that story of Joe rushing leadership off his yard at the thought of stepping down became something to snicker at...what a disillusioned bunch some of those fans are.