In the world of cell phone providers we had AT&T, Verizon, T-Mobile, and Sprint.

The later 2 lagged behind the first 2 and their solution to stay in the fight was to merge.

Let’s set the Big 12 aside for a moment because the other leagues have picked their best parts up and right now they are relatively stable and any change to their membership is likely to be a 2nd domino.

The PAC 12 and ACC don’t have a lot of synergy on the surface but if you combine their assets and maybe trim some of the fat you’ve got a coast-to-coast league that can air content in every time slot. Maybe an all out merger isn’t the answer but an alliance where they pool their tv rights and negotiate them jointly perhaps makes financial sense, especially if, as some have speculated, expansion among the big leagues had halted because there’s no one, but ND, who can add $70M+/yr in value to the SEC and Big 10.

ND actually fits into this alliance well since they are obliged to play 5 ACC schools a year and traditionally play 2 PAC 12 schools annually.

The devils advocate argument is, of course, that the top ACC schools will be out the door as soon as they can so why even bother.

What are your thoughts folks?

Is the old A&P logo available to buy?



As a Florida State fan I'd certainly rather be in that conference than trapped with only the other ACC schools on the schedule. A PAC school coming to Tallahassee every season and FSU traveling to another out west would at least be fun and different from the stale ACC slate. But would it lessen my interest in joining the SEC at the first available opportunity? No, not in the slightest. Maybe if FSU & Clemson escape to the SEC that would be the perfect time to do this, an A&P merger each with 12 school divisions.

I agree with you it would be a perfect setup for Notre Dame, assuming the A&P would make a deal with them similar to what the ACC has now.

I think something on that scale is very unlikely. However, I do think the ACC and Pac-12 could benefit from a scheduling alliance. It wouldn't make a ton of money, but I think Disney and FOX could get on board with coughing up some cash for something like ten to twelve games a year between the two conferences. You could have some fan friendly matchups like Miami vs Oregon, Clemson vs USC, FSU vs UCLA, that can be shown on ABC and FOX. Then, the not as attractive matchups could be good content for all of the other networks. Having twelve games a season could allow Clemson, FSU, GT, and Louisville the ability to sit it out half of the time due to their SEC rivalries and ND commitments. If necessary, only going with ten games could also allow USC and Stanford to sit it out sometimes due to their annual ND games.

They should add a few Big 12 schools (I’m thinking Kansas, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, TCU and Cincinnati) plus Notre Dame, and merge to form the first 32-team superconference.

…

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Okay, okay, I’m just kidding. It’s June after all.

Don’t think the ACC can get more money out of ESPN. For them the question is one of gate revenue and exposure. I think playing Pac-12 games would reduce both, unless maybe (maybe) you are replacing an OOC Game and the ND games count as a 9th, not 10th game.

On the Pac-12 side, I have said before they could use more exposure to Eastern fans. An alliance would be a good way to accomplish that. I think the Big 12 and (yuck) the American are the only potential suitors.

(06-16-2022 11:37 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  They should add a few Big 12 schools (I’m thinking Kansas, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, TCU and Cincinnati) plus Notre Dame, and merge to form the first 32-team superconference.

…

…

Okay, okay, I’m just kidding. It’s June after all.

OK. This is fun to fantasize about. How about a new conference, the Great Atlantic and Pacific (GAP)? 28 members in all, formed at the DFW Airport.

Atlantic: Clemson, FSU, Miami, Va Tech, Ga Tech, UNC, NC State, Duke, Virginia

Central: OK State, Baylor, K State, TCU, WVU, Louisville, Pitt, Texas Tech, Kansas

Pacific: Oregon, Stanford, Washington, USC, Utah, UCLA, Cal, Arizona, Colorado

Notre Dame

Play an 8-1-1 schedule, with the Irish playing 4 against the Atlantic and 2 each against the Central and Pacific. The Irish qualify for a four team CCT if they rank ahead of the three division runners up.

I'd bet that this conference would rate a media contract better than any of the three existing ones. Twelve ACC schools and nine PAC schools are enough to dissolve those conferences and the Big XII contracts are due to expire anyway.

I remember when Stanford came to UCF that there were a bunch of excuses about a West Coast team traveling to the East Coast and the time difference affecting the athletes.

(06-17-2022 09:52 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  I remember when Stanford came to UCF that there were a bunch of excuses about a West Coast team traveling to the East Coast and the time difference affecting the athletes.

Meh, there are a few articles out there that speak to how poorly West coast teams perform when playing on the East coast, so yes it's a thing. That said IIRC the game you are referring to had a 3:30pm kickoff, so Stanford had no excuse, UCF just whooped them.

(06-17-2022 09:44 AM)ken d Wrote:  

(06-16-2022 11:37 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  They should add a few Big 12 schools (I’m thinking Kansas, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, TCU and Cincinnati) plus Notre Dame, and merge to form the first 32-team superconference.

…

…

Okay, okay, I’m just kidding. It’s June after all.

OK. This is fun to fantasize about. How about a new conference, the Great Atlantic and Pacific (GAP)? 28 members in all, formed at the DFW Airport.

Atlantic: Clemson, FSU, Miami, Va Tech, Ga Tech, UNC, NC State, Duke, Virginia

Central: OK State, Baylor, K State, TCU, WVU, Louisville, Pitt, Texas Tech, Kansas

Pacific: Oregon, Stanford, Washington, USC, Utah, UCLA, Cal, Arizona, Colorado

Notre Dame

Play an 8-1-1 schedule, with the Irish playing 4 against the Atlantic and 2 each against the Central and Pacific. The Irish qualify for a four team CCT if they rank ahead of the three division runners up.

I'd bet that this conference would rate a media contract better than any of the three existing ones. Twelve ACC schools and nine PAC schools are enough to dissolve those conferences and the Big XII contracts are due to expire anyway.

Basically a P5 version of the G5 coast-to-coast BOR conference that has been proposed on this board many times over the years. Of course it's at least as unrealistic as an MWC-AAC merger ever was, but I agree, fun to think about.

(06-17-2022 09:52 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  I remember when Stanford came to UCF that there were a bunch of excuses about a West Coast team traveling to the East Coast and the time difference affecting the athletes.

Funny, ND travels to California every November.

In 2018, ND traveled to New York City and to Los Angeles in consecutive weeks.

ND made two West Coast trips that year, playing Navy in San Diego three weeks before the trip to L.A.

No excuses were heard or offered. ND beat USC to finish 12-0 that year.

Stanford needs to man up, apparently.


P.S. Neither USC or Stanford will travel to South Bend in November. It is stipulated in their contracts that they will always play ND in South Bend in October, with ND always traveling to California for the last game of the season.

(06-16-2022 07:49 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  In the world of cell phone providers we had AT&T, Verizon, T-Mobile, and Sprint.

The later 2 lagged behind the first 2 and their solution to stay in the fight was to merge.

Let’s set the Big 12 aside for a moment because the other leagues have picked their best parts up and right now they are relatively stable and any change to their membership is likely to be a 2nd domino.

The PAC 12 and ACC don’t have a lot of synergy on the surface but if you combine their assets and maybe trim some of the fat you’ve got a coast-to-coast league that can air content in every time slot. Maybe an all out merger isn’t the answer but an alliance where they pool their tv rights and negotiate them jointly perhaps makes financial sense, especially if, as some have speculated, expansion among the big leagues had halted because there’s no one, but ND, who can add $70M+/yr in value to the SEC and Big 10.

ND actually fits into this alliance well since they are obliged to play 5 ACC schools a year and traditionally play 2 PAC 12 schools annually.

The devils advocate argument is, of course, that the top ACC schools will be out the door as soon as they can so why even bother.

What are your thoughts folks?

I think all of this talk is premature since the Pac-12 is about to get a right-sized TV contract (including finally monetizing the Tier 2 and Tier 3 content that has been languishing on the Pac-12 Networks for the last decade. (People continue to keep forgetting that when the Pac-12 signed their current TV deal, it was the largest for any conference in history up to that time.) My belief is that the Pac-12 is going to be very substantially ahead of the ACC at least in terms of media money to the point where it makes no sense to loop them together. The Pac-12 will still be behind the Big Ten and SEC as the #3 league, but any notion that they're equals with the ACC or even Big 12 will be completely erased.

(06-16-2022 08:26 PM)Schema Wrote:  I think something on that scale is very unlikely. However, I do think the ACC and Pac-12 could benefit from a scheduling alliance. It wouldn't make a ton of money, but I think Disney and FOX could get on board with coughing up some cash for something like ten to twelve games a year between the two conferences. You could have some fan friendly matchups like Miami vs Oregon, Clemson vs USC, FSU vs UCLA, that can be shown on ABC and FOX. Then, the not as attractive matchups could be good content for all of the other networks. Having twelve games a season could allow Clemson, FSU, GT, and Louisville the ability to sit it out half of the time due to their SEC rivalries and ND commitments. If necessary, only going with ten games could also allow USC and Stanford to sit it out sometimes due to their annual ND games.

If the Pac12 and the ACC can't get their TV revenue distribution equal to the SEC and the B10 as individual conferences, what makes you think they will get there as some kind of combined entity. The only major draw would be a USC (west) game against Clemson, Florida St., and maybe Miami if the get back to their 80's swagger.

(06-18-2022 08:44 AM)panite Wrote:  If the Pac12 and the ACC can't get their TV revenue distribution equal to the SEC and the B10 as individual conferences, what makes you think they will get there as some kind of combined entity. The only major draw would be a USC (west) game against Clemson, Florida St., and maybe Miami if the get back to their 80's swagger.

I don't think a combination of the ACC and Pac-12 would be able to equal the SEC or B1G. That's why I don't think any kind of combination of the two conferences is likely. Instead, I think they could each make a little extra money by offering an annual matchup between the two conferences.