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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #41
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.
06-16-2022 01:37 PM
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #42
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 12:45 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  C-USA looks to be in trouble from a media standpoint. .... But it's hard to see who would want them.

Ehh, there's always room on ESPN+.

I'm close to being persuaded that ESPN upped the Sun Belt deal from $4M per year a not so long ago to $21M a year, so I'm very persuadable that ESPN would throw CUSA a similar (everything-on-ESPN+ guaranteed, ESPN linear cable as an option) deal in the $5-$15M ballpark.

Quote:The current leadership has been unsuccessful in getting good media contracts. And that was with the lineup that included 9 schools who had enough value to be taken by other conferences. They have only 9 months to get something done. But what are they selling and to whom?

They're selling FBS football, and lottery-tickets that ESPN can cash in if FIU or UTEP or Sam Houston State goes 7-1 and makes the top 25 for a few weeks.

Or, if we want to be pessimistic, ESPN will continue freezing C-USA out, as a pre-emptive antitrust defense "No, we don't have ALL the FBS conferences under contract. There's C-USA and the Mountain West"
06-16-2022 01:44 PM
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mturn017 Online
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Post: #43
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

Look closer:

1.2M media rights then conference distributions (non media & bowl) was 1.5M plus another 300k in conference distributions for bowl revenue.

3M total from the SBC.
06-16-2022 01:45 PM
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ballantyneapp Offline
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Post: #44
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

the line says media rights @ $1.2MM
Then conference distributions less media rights and bowl at $1.5MM
the $1.5MM is CFB+NCAA credits+ whatever else

so the # is $3MM total payout.
06-16-2022 01:58 PM
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CoastalJuan Offline
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Post: #45
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 01:58 PM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

the line says media rights @ $1.2MM
Then conference distributions less media rights and bowl at $1.5MM
the $1.5MM is CFB+NCAA credits+ whatever else

so the # is $3MM total payout.

Ok so if we move to that goalpost, what are the total payouts by conference?

Looking for 2021 CFP payouts. I see incremental payout amounts (that conferences get $6m per playoff team, 2.63m to that team to cover expenses, $4m per non-playoff bowl), but not the total 2021 amounts per conference.

Here are 19-20 payouts
AAC: 27.6m
CUSA: 16.9m
MAC: 15.4m
MWC: 20.0m
SBC: 18.5m

No idea on tournament credits.
06-16-2022 02:36 PM
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #46
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
I'm a big ol' dummy. I was looking at the Louisiana Tech document.




(06-16-2022 01:45 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

Look closer:

1.2M media rights then conference distributions (non media & bowl) was 1.5M plus another 300k in conference distributions for bowl revenue.

3M total from the SBC.

(06-16-2022 01:58 PM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

the line says media rights @ $1.2MM
Then conference distributions less media rights and bowl at $1.5MM
the $1.5MM is CFB+NCAA credits+ whatever else

so the # is $3MM total payout.

I don't know what you guys are looking at. I'm looking at Statement A, page 15/21 of the not-a-PDF, labeled page 11. It's hard to track eyestrain type, but if you use your mouse to highlight, you can see what lines up with what. I'm bolding the final column, total money.

Media rights 176,964 66,504 46,278 140,216 $429,962
NCAA distributions 449,112 184,778 117,449 573,808 $1,325,147
Conference distributions (non media and non bowl) 126,537 58,993 33,091 326,325 $544,946
Conference distributions of football bowl generated revenue 653,841 $653,841

So, in terms of conference money, that's about $400,000 in media, $1.3M in NCAA money, $500,000 in "non-bowl, non-media" money ($300,000 supposedly from Other Sports, non-FB, non-MBB), $650,000 in bowl money.

Add that up, (counting on fingers) close to $3M from the conference. But only about $400,000 in ESPN money.


EDIT: The PDF is different, I'm not sure what to call the other document. This post will evolve.

But from the Statement A on the PDF, differnet but similar numbers.

Media rights 10,000 1,243,265 1,253,265
NCAA distributions 30,000 847,169 877,169
Conference distributions (non media and non football bowl) 1,560,936 1,560,936
Conference distributions of football bowl generated revenue 292,518 292,518

So this is a puzzle, at least for now.
Puzzle solved.
(This post was last modified: 06-16-2022 02:48 PM by johnbragg.)
06-16-2022 02:43 PM
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Post: #47
G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-13-2022 01:01 PM)nodak651 Wrote:  Do any of the G5 schools have local TV deals to supplement the media payouts from the conferences they are in (for games not on national tv)? I guess this would be like a second tier TV rights deal.


we have previously shown basketball games on fox college sports and locally on WKYU in Bowling Green and WBNA in Louisville. The Fox partnership ended years ago though due to conference media partnerships. We still show some stuff on local stations if the rights aren't picked up by anyone else (mostly for exhibition games).


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06-16-2022 03:17 PM
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Post: #48
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 01:58 PM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

the line says media rights @ $1.2MM
Then conference distributions less media rights and bowl at $1.5MM
the $1.5MM is CFB+NCAA credits+ whatever else

so the # is $3MM total payout.

So the reports of the SBC TV deal being worth up to $2MM starting in 2023 seems accurate. I guess those CUSA fans that came on the SBC board and said those reports were insane will be eating crow.
06-16-2022 03:32 PM
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Post: #49
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 02:36 PM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:58 PM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

the line says media rights @ $1.2MM
Then conference distributions less media rights and bowl at $1.5MM
the $1.5MM is CFB+NCAA credits+ whatever else

so the # is $3MM total payout.

Ok so if we move to that goalpost, what are the total payouts by conference?

Looking for 2021 CFP payouts. I see incremental payout amounts (that conferences get $6m per playoff team, 2.63m to that team to cover expenses, $4m per non-playoff bowl), but not the total 2021 amounts per conference.

Here are 19-20 payouts
AAC: 27.6m
CUSA: 16.9m
MAC: 15.4m
MWC: 20.0m
SBC: 18.5m

No idea on tournament credits.

I'd imagine the AAC, MWC, and SBC will all be very similar within a few years with the continuing to MAC trail by about $5M, and then CUSA bringing up the rear unless someone really overvalues Liberty.
06-16-2022 03:34 PM
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Post: #50
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 01:45 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

Look closer:

1.2M media rights then conference distributions (non media & bowl) was 1.5M plus another 300k in conference distributions for bowl revenue.

3M total from the SBC.

Media rights are not all from the conference. It would seem logical that the vast majority would be from the conference, but there are local radio rights and licensing. I have no idea how much those would be.
06-16-2022 04:06 PM
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Stugray2 Offline
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Post: #51
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
It's looking like the SBC media deal is at least $1.2m now, and likely bumps with the extension. 25% bump would put it close to $1.5m.

This is higher than the current MAC deal ($10m for 12 schools), but they have an extension coming up in a couple years, a bump of 25-30% is likely given inflation and the continuing need for November weeknight programming on ESPN channels.

The way i look at it is how much money will the schools likely get from 2023-31 (using standard 3% escalator for current contracts)

Primary Media contracts:

BIG (for comparison, based on current media estimates, which are likely 10% low; SEC may even be higher) = $663,424,291

AAC remaining 8 = $58,767,743
// note schools will also receive $4.75m each in exit fee distributions (UC, UH, UCF) over this period

Boise State = $47,118,817 to $53,678,149
// range of MWC bump from 0% to 33% (IMO will be closer to the high); assumes $1.7m additional per year from ESPN

MWC "10" school = $34,518,817 to $41,078,149
// same MWC bump range. Hawaii has a different carve out, but similar money

AAC incoming 6 = $29,383,872
// these schools get half shares; note they forfeited around $2.5-3m to leave C-USA

SBC schools = $14,641,443
// started at $1.2m, assumes a modest 20% bump and low escalator. Likely a low estimate by $3-4m
// schools exiting C-USA settled for around $2.5m each

MAC schools = $8,953,161
// the MAC made a horrible 13 year deal that runs through 2026-27. It should double if not treble with an extension; I used a lower estimate
// the deal was $10m per year for 12 schools, and ESPN subleased $8m to CBSSN.
// MACtion November has got to be worth $30m alone in programming for ESPN; inflation could push that to $40m by 2027

C-USA has no deal in place for 2023-31.
06-16-2022 04:54 PM
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mturn017 Online
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Post: #52
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 04:06 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:45 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

Look closer:

1.2M media rights then conference distributions (non media & bowl) was 1.5M plus another 300k in conference distributions for bowl revenue.

3M total from the SBC.

Media rights are not all from the conference. It would seem logical that the vast majority would be from the conference, but there are local radio rights and licensing. I have no idea how much those would be.

Absolutely. If you look at ULL statements it has 10k under football and the rest under unspecified. Probably a weekly coaches show, radio or local TV. I’d agree with vast majority.
06-16-2022 05:39 PM
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mturn017 Online
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RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 02:43 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  I'm a big ol' dummy. I was looking at the Louisiana Tech document.

[s]

03-lmfao04-cheers

I did look at the most recent 990 and I think it only showed 2.25M for the entire conference. It’s a year prior but that’d be less than 225k/school which is less they’ve been reportedly making even then. Not sure the disconnect there.
06-16-2022 05:48 PM
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EagleNationRising Online
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Post: #54
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-16-2022 03:34 PM)JTApps1 Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 02:36 PM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:58 PM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:37 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(06-16-2022 01:13 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  Louisiana reported just over 1.2M in media rights last year compared to just under $500k for LT. The number for LT jives with what ODU showed in CUSA.


https://app.lla.state.la.us/PublicReport...25A3CA.pdf

https://app.lla.state.la.us/publicreport...t&.7773098

That matches the numbers from the 2019 Form 990, about $1.5M per school in total conference revenue, $400,000 from ESPN. Doesn't look like the pandemic had a big effect on the Sun Belt TV contract or conference distributions in 2020-21.

Quote:Edit:

And this is for year ending 6/30/21, before the announcement of a renewed deal in July 2021.

Right. So the TV contract is probably higher than $400,000. Is it the $1.5M-$2M number that's being thrown around in the media, or is that $1.5M-$2M for the total conference distributions? We'll see in a year or two.

the line says media rights @ $1.2MM
Then conference distributions less media rights and bowl at $1.5MM
the $1.5MM is CFB+NCAA credits+ whatever else

so the # is $3MM total payout.

Ok so if we move to that goalpost, what are the total payouts by conference?

Looking for 2021 CFP payouts. I see incremental payout amounts (that conferences get $6m per playoff team, 2.63m to that team to cover expenses, $4m per non-playoff bowl), but not the total 2021 amounts per conference.

Here are 19-20 payouts
AAC: 27.6m
CUSA: 16.9m
MAC: 15.4m
MWC: 20.0m
SBC: 18.5m

No idea on tournament credits.

I'd imagine the AAC, MWC, and SBC will all be very similar within a few years with the continuing to MAC trail by about $5M, and then CUSA bringing up the rear unless someone really overvalues Liberty.

I think Liberty will be savvy enough to procure a nice side deal much like Boise.
06-17-2022 10:48 PM
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Saint3333 Offline
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Post: #55
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
When comparing it is important to bifurcate the existing and new CUSAAC members. New guys are getting 1/3 to 1/2 the legacy members.
06-18-2022 06:16 AM
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Post: #56
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-18-2022 06:16 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  When comparing it is important to bifurcate the existing and new CUSAAC members. New guys are getting 1/3 to 1/2 the legacy members.

If we're comparing schools, yes. E.g., if we compare ECU's payout to App State's, then we have to be sure to use the roughly $7m media payout that ECU is getting.

But if we are comparing conferences, then the conference number is what is relevant, and that's just the gross media payout divided by the number of schools. For the AAC, that's currently at around $7m (media payout only) per year per school, but will drop to around $5.5m once the new schools join. So if for 2024 we are comparing the AAC and MAC, it would be $5.5m with whatever the MAC is getting.
06-18-2022 07:27 AM
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Saint3333 Offline
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Post: #57
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
Schools vs schools is what matters.

No matter how loud South Carolina chats SEC they’ll still taking that L.
06-18-2022 07:32 AM
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RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-18-2022 07:32 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Schools vs schools is what matters.

No matter how loud South Carolina chats SEC they’ll still taking that L.

Sure, if you're interested in school comparisons.

But if you're interested in conference comparisons, its conferences.

But FWIW, taking an "L" from within the SEC isn't a bad place to be, LOL.
(This post was last modified: 06-18-2022 07:40 AM by quo vadis.)
06-18-2022 07:38 AM
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Saint3333 Offline
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Post: #59
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
Losing sucks no matter where you are.
06-18-2022 08:23 AM
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goodknightfl Offline
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Post: #60
RE: G5 Media Deals & Payouts
(06-13-2022 11:05 PM)AztecNation Wrote:  Pretty sure Hawaii has its own local tv deal and doesn't get a full MWC tv share because of it.

I believe this is correct.
06-20-2022 07:06 AM
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