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First, Stetson plays non-scholarship football. Stetson wants to play non-scholarship teams. Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play the best programs possible - not non-scholarship teams.

Second, Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play schools/programs they see as peers: Central Arkansas, Eastern Kentucky, Austin Peay, etc. They didn’t move up to the ASUN to play the same D2 programs they were just playing.

Third, a lot of those D2 programs don’t have the budgets (or desire) to move up to D1. West Florida could probably do it, but they don’t appear interested right now.

(05-12-2022 05:13 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  First, Stetson plays non-scholarship football. Stetson wants to play non-scholarship teams. Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play the best programs possible - not non-scholarship teams.

Second, Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play schools/programs they see as peers: Central Arkansas, Eastern Kentucky, Austin Peay, etc. They didn’t move up to the ASUN to play the same D2 programs they were just playing.

Third, a lot of those D2 programs don’t have the budgets (or desire) to move up to D1. West Florida could probably do it, but they don’t appear interested right now.

1. They could be added as a member of the football conference despite not offering scholarships. They are already a member of the conference in other sports.

2. The only reason why those teams were added to the conference in the first place is that those teams were fed up with the bad leadership in their old conferences, despite them being stable. Those teams sacrificed stability for leadership, and there will be some buyer's remorse down the road.

3. True, but not all of those teams would be added, probably one or two. I've heard West Florida mentioned before, but they are clearly fine where they are now. However, that could all change if the ASUN loses more to teams to conference realignment in the future.

How much of that is also because they don’t want to wait 4 years. If it changes to 2 years how many make the jump

(05-12-2022 05:48 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 05:13 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  First, Stetson plays non-scholarship football. Stetson wants to play non-scholarship teams. Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play the best programs possible - not non-scholarship teams.

Second, Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play schools/programs they see as peers: Central Arkansas, Eastern Kentucky, Austin Peay, etc. They didn’t move up to the ASUN to play the same D2 programs they were just playing.

Third, a lot of those D2 programs don’t have the budgets (or desire) to move up to D1. West Florida could probably do it, but they don’t appear interested right now.

1. They could be added as a member of the football conference despite not offering scholarships. They are already a member of the conference in other sports.

Not when the people involved don’t want it to happen. If everyone wanted non-scholarship Stetson playing ASUN football, they would already be in ASUN football, considering ASUN football doesn’t even meet the minimum right now.

This isn’t something subjective. It takes both sides to want it, and neither does. Any further discussion exits the realm of reality.

(05-12-2022 06:44 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 05:48 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 05:13 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  First, Stetson plays non-scholarship football. Stetson wants to play non-scholarship teams. Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play the best programs possible - not non-scholarship teams.

Second, Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play schools/programs they see as peers: Central Arkansas, Eastern Kentucky, Austin Peay, etc. They didn’t move up to the ASUN to play the same D2 programs they were just playing.

Third, a lot of those D2 programs don’t have the budgets (or desire) to move up to D1. West Florida could probably do it, but they don’t appear interested right now.

1. They could be added as a member of the football conference despite not offering scholarships. They are already a member of the conference in other sports.

Not when the people involved don’t want it to happen. If everyone wanted non-scholarship Stetson playing ASUN football, they would already be in ASUN football, considering ASUN football doesn’t even meet the minimum right now.

This isn’t something subjective. It takes both sides to want it, and neither does. Any further discussion exits the realm of reality.

I could see the larger D2 schools move up like West Florida, Valdosta State, Albany State, UNC-Pembroke could move up, and still add schools like UCA, EKU and others from D1.

to the OP...this is actually much of what the ASUN tried to do. But it takes two to tango...

At a minimum, the league would need four existing Division I members playing football, since it is difficult to invite more than two schools from Division II at one time.

(05-12-2022 04:20 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Suppose the ASUN had started to sponsor football by bringing up members from D2 instead of adding members from existing conferences?

Here are the starting teams:
Kennesaw State
North Alabama
Stetson

From there, who would they have picked up from D2 that are within the geographic outline of the conference?

Suppose they had taken call ups from the Gulf South Conference, here are the teams that could have been on the conference's radar:
Delta State
Mississippi College
North Greenville
Shorter
Valdotsa State
West Alabama
West Florida
West Georgia

It hasn’t been very long since Mississippi College dropped down to D3 and then moved back up to D2. There is no desire there to move up to D1.

(05-12-2022 09:22 PM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  to the OP...this is actually much of what the ASUN tried to do. But it takes two to tango...

Yes, and only 3 of those schools would actually be on the list...

(05-12-2022 06:44 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 05:48 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 05:13 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  First, Stetson plays non-scholarship football. Stetson wants to play non-scholarship teams. Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play the best programs possible - not non-scholarship teams.

Second, Kennesaw St and North Alabama want to play schools/programs they see as peers: Central Arkansas, Eastern Kentucky, Austin Peay, etc. They didn’t move up to the ASUN to play the same D2 programs they were just playing.

Third, a lot of those D2 programs don’t have the budgets (or desire) to move up to D1. West Florida could probably do it, but they don’t appear interested right now.

1. They could be added as a member of the football conference despite not offering scholarships. They are already a member of the conference in other sports.

Not when the people involved don’t want it to happen. If everyone wanted non-scholarship Stetson playing ASUN football, they would already be in ASUN football, considering ASUN football doesn’t even meet the minimum right now.

This isn’t something subjective. It takes both sides to want it, and neither does. Any further discussion exits the realm of reality.

It's a possibility that a discussion could take place in the future. Never rule out any possibility for that to happen.

(05-13-2022 08:58 AM)The Roach Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 04:20 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  Suppose the ASUN had started to sponsor football by bringing up members from D2 instead of adding members from existing conferences?

Here are the starting teams:
Kennesaw State
North Alabama
Stetson

From there, who would they have picked up from D2 that are within the geographic outline of the conference?

Suppose they had taken call ups from the Gulf South Conference, here are the teams that could have been on the conference's radar:
Delta State
Mississippi College
North Greenville
Shorter
Valdotsa State
West Alabama
West Florida
West Georgia

It hasn’t been very long since Mississippi College dropped down to D3 and then moved back up to D2. There is no desire there to move up to D1.

Mississippi College would not be added, true, but they would still be on the conference's radar since they are looking for schools that can be added for football.

(05-12-2022 09:22 PM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  to the OP...this is actually much of what the ASUN tried to do. But it takes two to tango...

I understand that, but this scenario would imply that it could occur in an alternate timeline.

(05-14-2022 09:04 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 09:22 PM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  to the OP...this is actually much of what the ASUN tried to do. But it takes two to tango...

Yes, and only 3 of those schools would actually be on the list...

True, but that doesn't mean that they wouldn't exhaust all of their options before coming to a decision on who to add.

(05-14-2022 10:13 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(05-14-2022 09:04 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 09:22 PM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  to the OP...this is actually much of what the ASUN tried to do. But it takes two to tango...

Yes, and only 3 of those schools would actually be on the list...

True, but that doesn't mean that they wouldn't exhaust all of their options before coming to a decision on who to add.

You're a little late to this discussion. Check out the ASUN Expansion and ASUN Football threads where this has been discussed a lot.

As of now, the conference just added non-football Queens (from the SAC in D2), who had been rumored to be in the same group (with West GA and Valdosta St) getting vetted by the ASUN since last September.

Selfishly, I would love for UWF to join since I live in Pensacola. But, they have stadium issues to deal with now.

No other GSC schools are D1 capable at this time or likely ever. But, those three are larger than several current ASUN schools including UNA.

(05-14-2022 03:29 PM)unalions Wrote:  

(05-14-2022 10:13 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(05-14-2022 09:04 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 09:22 PM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  to the OP...this is actually much of what the ASUN tried to do. But it takes two to tango...

Yes, and only 3 of those schools would actually be on the list...

True, but that doesn't mean that they wouldn't exhaust all of their options before coming to a decision on who to add.

You're a little late to this discussion. Check out the ASUN Expansion and ASUN Football threads where this has been discussed a lot.

As of now, the conference just added non-football Queens (from the SAC in D2), who had been rumored to be in the same group (with West GA and Valdosta St) getting vetted by the ASUN since last September.

Selfishly, I would love for UWF to join since I live in Pensacola. But, they have stadium issues to deal with now.

No other GSC schools are D1 capable at this time or likely ever. But, those three are larger than several current ASUN schools including UNA.

Why would the ASUN add a non-football school to the conference? Queens would have been better off joining the Big South.

(05-14-2022 06:17 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(05-14-2022 03:29 PM)unalions Wrote:  

(05-14-2022 10:13 AM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(05-14-2022 09:04 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(05-12-2022 09:22 PM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  to the OP...this is actually much of what the ASUN tried to do. But it takes two to tango...

Yes, and only 3 of those schools would actually be on the list...

True, but that doesn't mean that they wouldn't exhaust all of their options before coming to a decision on who to add.

You're a little late to this discussion. Check out the ASUN Expansion and ASUN Football threads where this has been discussed a lot.

As of now, the conference just added non-football Queens (from the SAC in D2), who had been rumored to be in the same group (with West GA and Valdosta St) getting vetted by the ASUN since last September.

Selfishly, I would love for UWF to join since I live in Pensacola. But, they have stadium issues to deal with now.

No other GSC schools are D1 capable at this time or likely ever. But, those three are larger than several current ASUN schools including UNA.

Why would the ASUN add a non-football school to the conference? Queens would have been better off joining the Big South.

It came down to timing for Queens. I believe that Queens wanted in the Big South, but they wanted to move now and the Big South said they wasn’t ready to add them to the upcoming season and the ASUN said yes.

Yeah KSU needs to be in C-USA.

Quote:They could be added as a member of the football conference despite not offering scholarships. They are already a member of the conference in other sports.

If you want to know why this is basically the worst idea imaginable, just take a look at what UT-Martin did in the late 90s/early 2000s. Here's the scenario:

In the OVC, Morehead State and Austin Peay had already gone non-scholarship and were playing football only in the Pioneer League as Stetson is doing currently. But UT-Martin tried to avoid that...by funding only half of the full scholarship allotment for FCS. They played in the OVC with a team consisting of about 30 scholarship equivalencies, and It. Was. Devastating.

There's almost no way to describe how bad this went for them, and they were dead weight in a conference that wasn't nearly as strong as ASUN football would probably be...and they had like 30 scholarships more than Stetson. This whole notion of somehow playing football in the conference while still being non-scholarship is absolutely crazy.