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WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
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TroyFootball05 Offline
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Exclamation WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
What are the chances of this happening? And if it does happen, who does CUSA add to replace them?
05-08-2022 03:01 PM
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
I'm not sure about the "and" part. Western Kentucky will pretty clearly switch leagues if the MAC ever decides to add someone new. The question seems to be whether the MAC will ever have a reason to do that.

The MAC was clearly ready to take the two as a pair. But Western Kentucky and anyone else on the board (UMass? North Dakota State?) might be insufficient geographically for the conference ADs and presidents to go for it.

Would Middle Tennessee rethink the cold feet it got? No idea. Fans down there didn't seem thrilled with the MAC.

I'm having a hard time seeing why Middle Tennessee would wait for an American Athletic invitation that might never come, but there are some who swear they would be a good candidate for that conference.
05-08-2022 03:51 PM
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Crayton Offline
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Post: #3
RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
Now that 13 doesn’t require a 14, could see WKU being that 13. Don’t follow the Hilltoppers much though.
05-08-2022 04:01 PM
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DoubleRSU Offline
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
Why not give it a go in CUSA for a year or two, see how it is. It’s not like the MAC has great basketball or football. Is football better than CUSA? Yeah, not by much though. You can argue that CUSA basketball might be a lot better than MAC basketball.
05-08-2022 05:05 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Online
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
There’s always a chance, but it’s dead until we hear a credible report that brings it back to life.
05-08-2022 05:35 PM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #6
RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
Maybe they stick around CUSA long enough to collect some exit fees, then bolt for the MAC?

The MAC seems better, IMO.
05-08-2022 05:36 PM
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Crayton Offline
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
(05-08-2022 05:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Maybe they stick around CUSA long enough to collect some exit fees, then bolt for the MAC?

The MAC seems better, IMO.

Right. The MAC will be there in a few years. Even if the MAC lands UMass, they no longer need to fill a 14th spot right away.
05-08-2022 05:45 PM
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TroyTBoy Offline
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
(05-08-2022 05:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  The MAC seems better, IMO.

Bad take.

CUSA is going to be one of the best mid major conferences in NCAA Basketball. They literally got freed of most of the dead NET weight and added consistent programs like NMSU and Liberty (and a NCAA team in JSU).

As for football, CUSA just welcomed these name coaches:
Jerry Kill
Rich Rodriguez
Sonny Cumbie
Hugh Freeze

CUSA has much better brands than the MAC. UTEP, WKU, MTSU, FIU, and Louisiana Tech were all valued higher than the majority of the Sunbelt which is why they either departed the Sunbelt or poached the Sunbelt in 2013. Teams like ULM, USA, Troy, etc, are like a lot of the MAC teams those CUSA teams have tried to avoid.

Then, SHSU is a recent FCS National Champion and JSU won the upset of the year last year against Florida State.
Liberty is probably the jewel of the new CUSA. They are one of the most well-funded programs in the G5. Their contract with Freeze speaks to their commitment. NMSU just embarrassed UCONN in the NCAA tournament,

All of that doesn't even take into account that the MAC sits on a recruiting tundra.

All of the MAC schools are so close together in Michigan and Ohio that they cannibalize their fellow conference mates recruiting classes.

CUSA was fortunate to retain a Florida and Texas presence. The MAC just can't offer those recruiting fields. When you add in Louisiana and Alabama, CUSA still has access to the greatest regions for talent acquisition in FBS. (And they aren't suffocating each other trying to land a 2 star)

It can be argued that a 9-team league is preferable to a 14-team league with SBC caliber talent (or even a 12 team league with MAC caliber talent).

If I was CUSA, I might add 1 or 2 more and go into a Double Round Robin Scheduling philosophy. That's literally the optimal league structure for those programs (Southern bent and compact).
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2022 06:22 PM by TroyTBoy.)
05-08-2022 06:14 PM
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quo vadis Offline
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
(05-08-2022 06:14 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(05-08-2022 05:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  The MAC seems better, IMO.

Bad take.

CUSA is going to be one of the best mid major conferences in NCAA Basketball. They literally got freed of most of the dead NET weight and added consistent programs like NMSU and Liberty (and a NCAA team in JSU).

As for football, CUSA just welcomed these name coaches:
Jerry Kill
Rich Rodriguez
Sonny Cumbie
Hugh Freeze

CUSA has much better brands than the MAC. UTEP, WKU, MTSU, FIU, and Louisiana Tech were all valued higher than the majority of the Sunbelt which is why they either departed the Sunbelt or poached the Sunbelt in 2013. Teams like ULM, USA, Troy, etc, are like a lot of the MAC teams those CUSA teams have tried to avoid.

Then, SHSU is a recent FCS National Champion and JSU won the upset of the year last year against Florida State.
Liberty is probably the jewel of the new CUSA. They are one of the most well-funded programs in the G5. Their contract with Freeze speaks to their commitment. NMSU just embarrassed UCONN in the NCAA tournament,

All of that doesn't even take into account that the MAC sits on a recruiting tundra.

All of the MAC schools are so close together in Michigan and Ohio that they cannibalize their fellow conference mates recruiting classes.

CUSA was fortunate to retain a Florida and Texas presence. The MAC just can't offer those recruiting fields. When you add in Louisiana and Alabama, CUSA still has access to the greatest regions for talent acquisition in FBS. (And they aren't suffocating each other trying to land a 2 star)

It can be argued that a 9-team league is preferable to a 14-team league with SBC caliber talent (or even a 12 team league with MAC caliber talent).

If I was CUSA, I might add 1 or 2 more and go into a Double Round Robin Scheduling philosophy. That's literally the optimal league structure for those programs (Southern bent and compact).

IMO, CUSA is the worst dumpster fire. The MAC at least has a tight-knit culture. CUSA raided the SBC in 2013 and seemed to be gunning for the MW as the second-best G5, everyone was predicting big things.

And what happened over the last 8 years? IMO CUSA went in to the toilet.

And why did that happen? Because CUSA foolishly pursued "markets" instead of programs with actual histories and cultures of successful football. CUSA did the SBC a favor by ridding it of over-bloated, under-performing "market" schools**.

CUSA is like the shadow-AAC, except it has fallen behind the Sun Belt so is now the Shadow-Shadow-AAC.

About the worst thing to be.


** Ironically, the AAC has arguably done CUSA a favor by taking some of those same "market" schools off CUSA hands.
(This post was last modified: 05-09-2022 07:52 AM by quo vadis.)
05-08-2022 06:26 PM
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DoubleRSU Offline
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Post: #10
RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
I like how Jacksonville had the “upset of the year”, then proceeded to lose 5 games to FCS teams. Then using that as justification for their inclusion in CUSA.
05-08-2022 06:39 PM
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esayem Offline
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
(05-08-2022 06:14 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(05-08-2022 05:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  The MAC seems better, IMO.

Bad take.

CUSA is going to be one of the best mid major conferences in NCAA Basketball. They literally got freed of most of the dead NET weight and added consistent programs like NMSU and Liberty (and a NCAA team in JSU).

As for football, CUSA just welcomed these name coaches:
Jerry Kill
Rich Rodriguez
Sonny Cumbie
Hugh Freeze

CUSA has much better brands than the MAC. UTEP, WKU, MTSU, FIU, and Louisiana Tech were all valued higher than the majority of the Sunbelt which is why they either departed the Sunbelt or poached the Sunbelt in 2013. Teams like ULM, USA, Troy, etc, are like a lot of the MAC teams those CUSA teams have tried to avoid.

Then, SHSU is a recent FCS National Champion and JSU won the upset of the year last year against Florida State.
Liberty is probably the jewel of the new CUSA. They are one of the most well-funded programs in the G5. Their contract with Freeze speaks to their commitment. NMSU just embarrassed UCONN in the NCAA tournament,

All of that doesn't even take into account that the MAC sits on a recruiting tundra.

All of the MAC schools are so close together in Michigan and Ohio that they cannibalize their fellow conference mates recruiting classes.

CUSA was fortunate to retain a Florida and Texas presence. The MAC just can't offer those recruiting fields. When you add in Louisiana and Alabama, CUSA still has access to the greatest regions for talent acquisition in FBS. (And they aren't suffocating each other trying to land a 2 star)

It can be argued that a 9-team league is preferable to a 14-team league with SBC caliber talent (or even a 12 team league with MAC caliber talent).

If I was CUSA, I might add 1 or 2 more and go into a Double Round Robin Scheduling philosophy. That's literally the optimal league structure for those programs (Southern bent and compact).

More garbage you can’t back up. Jeez, here I am defending northern teams, but up there MTSU and FIU may as well be Saturn State and Neptune International.

Face it, C-USA is the same tier as the MAC, it’s just spread across the south into the mountain time zone. If I cared enough I could probably handpick some MAC upsets the past few years. I’m pretty sure I remember Toledo beating Arkansas or somebody. Northern Illinois was in a BCS bowl? WMU did that row boat thing.
05-08-2022 06:42 PM
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Post: #12
RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
I think it's dead. Neither of these two ever actually got an invitation from the MAC. MTSU recruits in the south and would not fit culturally in the MAC.
05-08-2022 06:57 PM
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TOPSTRAIGHT Offline
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
Rerun thread. Already seen this show--recently. I'm changing channels.
05-08-2022 07:04 PM
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CatsClaw1 Offline
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
(05-08-2022 06:14 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(05-08-2022 05:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  The MAC seems better, IMO.

Bad take.

CUSA is going to be one of the best mid major conferences in NCAA Basketball. They literally got freed of most of the dead NET weight and added consistent programs like NMSU and Liberty (and a NCAA team in JSU).

As for football, CUSA just welcomed these name coaches:
Jerry Kill
Rich Rodriguez
Sonny Cumbie
Hugh Freeze

CUSA has much better brands than the MAC. UTEP, WKU, MTSU, FIU, and Louisiana Tech were all valued higher than the majority of the Sunbelt which is why they either departed the Sunbelt or poached the Sunbelt in 2013. Teams like ULM, USA, Troy, etc, are like a lot of the MAC teams those CUSA teams have tried to avoid.

Then, SHSU is a recent FCS National Champion and JSU won the upset of the year last year against Florida State.
Liberty is probably the jewel of the new CUSA. They are one of the most well-funded programs in the G5. Their contract with Freeze speaks to their commitment. NMSU just embarrassed UCONN in the NCAA tournament,

All of that doesn't even take into account that the MAC sits on a recruiting tundra.

All of the MAC schools are so close together in Michigan and Ohio that they cannibalize their fellow conference mates recruiting classes.

CUSA was fortunate to retain a Florida and Texas presence. The MAC just can't offer those recruiting fields. When you add in Louisiana and Alabama, CUSA still has access to the greatest regions for talent acquisition in FBS. (And they aren't suffocating each other trying to land a 2 star)

It can be argued that a 9-team league is preferable to a 14-team league with SBC caliber talent (or even a 12 team league with MAC caliber talent).

If I was CUSA, I might add 1 or 2 more and go into a Double Round Robin Scheduling philosophy. That's literally the optimal league structure for those programs (Southern bent and compact).

Not a bad take at all because the MAC is far more stable. C-USA is trying to piece these existence together using a number of FCS schools.
05-08-2022 07:38 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Online
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
(05-08-2022 06:57 PM)sstaedtler88 Wrote:  I think it's dead. Neither of these two ever actually got an invitation from the MAC. MTSU recruits in the south and would not fit culturally in the MAC.

They didn’t get an invitation because that isn’t sent out until it’s a formality. As McMurphy, Thamel, etc reported, the MAC wanted WKU/MTSU but MTSU withdrew interest. The invitation was dependent on both WKU/MTSU joining.

MTSU President did cite southern culture in his public comment as you alluded to. Unless MTSU has a change of heart, this package deal is dead.
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2022 07:43 PM by IWokeUpLikeThis.)
05-08-2022 07:38 PM
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
Package deal is dead. WKU is still interested if I had to guess, but if the new C-USA can land a half decent media deal at the next negotiation then there won't be a reason to move without it making sense across the board. I like the MAC and think it could be a good fit, but I won't pretend that it is perfect. FBS as we know it might not exist in 5 years. Might as well wait and see how things shake out before lobbying for a switch again.
05-08-2022 08:09 PM
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
Looks like a hip tie package with them, unless a spot opens in the AAC or SBC for only one school. The MAC could be back in play if the Big 12 adds two AAC schools and everyone else below that stays put. Ball is in the Big 12s court for now.
05-08-2022 08:11 PM
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freshtop Offline
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
(05-08-2022 08:11 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Looks like a hip tie package with them, unless a spot opens in the AAC or SBC for only one school. The MAC could be back in play if the Big 12 adds two AAC schools and everyone else below that stays put. Ball is in the Big 12s court for now.

It was a package deal for sure, but there won't be any package deals going forward. We might end up in the same league via realignment, but either program would leave the other at the drop of a hat right now.
05-08-2022 08:34 PM
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
(05-08-2022 06:14 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  the MAC sits on a recruiting tundra.

Ohio is a very strong source of football talent, and Pennsylvania is right next door.
05-08-2022 08:53 PM
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RE: WKU and MTSU to the MAC Still Alive?
No dog in this C-USA realignment. But need TV sets. Get UCONN and UMASS for football only....Then get UNO and UT-A ( they will leave WAC in a heartbeat) for Hoops and all others sports. Then Kennesaw state for all sports !!! 5 VERY BIG TV MARKETS !! Teams are up and down yearly. Markets are constant !! East-Uconn--Umass--Liberty--Kennesaw state--JSU--FIU.....West- WKU--MTSU--LA. TECH--Sam Houston st.--UTEP--NMSU....5 Division games--3 non-division games changing every 2 years .....Hoops can be done a number of ways.....I'm very happy to see C-USA survive !!
05-08-2022 11:36 PM
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