A little background. I grew up in western New York. Attended New Mexico State University for undergrad and the University of Delaware for grad school. Now I love in Georgia. I have had a long time affinity for "the little guy". This means that I often enjoy minor league games better than major league games. I am sure that this is in part due to the local sport scene from Rochester where I grew up (Red Wings AAA, Amerks AHL, Knighthawks and Rhinos). As a result, I grew accustomed to seeing a turnover of the teams on a yearly basis. There were some players at the Amerks (Jody Gage) who stayed there multiple seasons, but the majority were either moving up to the Sabers or Orioles, our out.

With this as a backdrop, Mid-Major sports, and some of the major colleges, are seeing a similar think. My two alma matters made March Madness this season. NMSU has a new coach and the potential or a significantly different make-up of the team. I think that I just need to change my view, instead of four years of players developing, we are seeing a different version of one and done.

I can still enjoy the teams, just as I did with the minor league sports teams, but I need to shift my focus.

(04-26-2022 05:05 AM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  A little background. I grew up in western New York. Attended New Mexico State University for undergrad and the University of Delaware for grad school. Now I love in Georgia. I have had a long time affinity for "the little guy". This means that I often enjoy minor league games better than major league games. I am sure that this is in part due to the local sport scene from Rochester where I grew up (Red Wings AAA, Amerks AHL, Knighthawks and Rhinos). As a result, I grew accustomed to seeing a turnover of the teams on a yearly basis. There were some players at the Amerks (Jody Gage) who stayed there multiple seasons, but the majority were either moving up to the Sabers or Orioles, our out.

With this as a backdrop, Mid-Major sports, and some of the major colleges, are seeing a similar think. My two alma matters made March Madness this season. NMSU has a new coach and the potential or a significantly different make-up of the team. I think that I just need to change my view, instead of four years of players developing, we are seeing a different version of one and done.

I can still enjoy the teams, just as I did with the minor league sports teams, but I need to shift my focus.

This isn't limited to mid-major schools. The transfer portal means that players at all schools can leave on a whim, making all rosters subject to significant turnover on a yearly basis.

Devil’s advocate is NIL, which we’re seeing players go places they never would have gone before. See Jackson State.

(04-26-2022 06:55 AM)esayem Wrote:  Devil’s advocate is NIL, which we’re seeing players go places they never would have gone before. See Jackson State.

Right but I wouldn't expect much out of that player. He is going to be mincing all over the field in an effort to avoid injury.

(04-26-2022 05:05 AM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  A little background. I grew up in western New York. Attended New Mexico State University for undergrad and the University of Delaware for grad school. Now I love in Georgia. I have had a long time affinity for "the little guy". This means that I often enjoy minor league games better than major league games. I am sure that this is in part due to the local sport scene from Rochester where I grew up (Red Wings AAA, Amerks AHL, Knighthawks and Rhinos). As a result, I grew accustomed to seeing a turnover of the teams on a yearly basis. There were some players at the Amerks (Jody Gage) who stayed there multiple seasons, but the majority were either moving up to the Sabers or Orioles, our out.

With this as a backdrop, Mid-Major sports, and some of the major colleges, are seeing a similar think. My two alma matters made March Madness this season. NMSU has a new coach and the potential or a significantly different make-up of the team. I think that I just need to change my view, instead of four years of players developing, we are seeing a different version of one and done.

I can still enjoy the teams, just as I did with the minor league sports teams, but I need to shift my focus.

Similar background (grew up in South-Central NY on the Soda/Pop line, went to a football playing D3 SUNY school near Rochester, grad school at Florida State, lived in Orlando, Charleston, and Hampton Roads), so I have seen quite a bit of difference over time. With D3, you might see a rare player at a level to go into the portal, you see more of this at a mid to high end D1 program

(04-26-2022 06:55 AM)esayem Wrote:  Devil’s advocate is NIL, which we’re seeing players go places they never would have gone before. See Jackson State.

No, unless "never before" only dates back as far as the early 1970's or so.

There were plenty of black players who enjoyed glorious careers at Jackson State and other HBCU's before going on to star in the NFL.

Only when those working in and supporting the major college football industry decided having African-Americans on the team wasn't too big of a price to pay if it meant winning more games did this unwritten policy that limited options for many change.

(04-26-2022 11:44 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-26-2022 06:55 AM)esayem Wrote:  Devil’s advocate is NIL, which we’re seeing players go places they never would have gone before. See Jackson State.

No, unless "never before" only dates back as far as the early 1970's or so.

There were plenty of black players who enjoyed glorious careers at Jackson State and other HBCU's before going on to star in the NFL.

Only when those working in and supporting the major college football industry decided having African-Americans on the team wasn't too big of a price to pay if it meant winning more games did this unwritten policy that limited options for many change.

Yeah and Ivy League schools won football championships and went to Rose Bowls.

I know history, and maybe I should have said “modern history” so nitpickers would be silenced.

(04-26-2022 05:05 AM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  A little background. I grew up in western New York. Attended New Mexico State University for undergrad and the University of Delaware for grad school. Now I love in Georgia. I have had a long time affinity for "the little guy". This means that I often enjoy minor league games better than major league games. I am sure that this is in part due to the local sport scene from Rochester where I grew up (Red Wings AAA, Amerks AHL, Knighthawks and Rhinos). As a result, I grew accustomed to seeing a turnover of the teams on a yearly basis. There were some players at the Amerks (Jody Gage) who stayed there multiple seasons, but the majority were either moving up to the Sabers or Orioles, our out.

With this as a backdrop, Mid-Major sports, and some of the major colleges, are seeing a similar think. My two alma matters made March Madness this season. NMSU has a new coach and the potential or a significantly different make-up of the team. I think that I just need to change my view, instead of four years of players developing, we are seeing a different version of one and done.

I can still enjoy the teams, just as I did with the minor league sports teams, but I need to shift my focus.

I have similar concerns, and have been shifting my focus gradually, but if the rules changes result in the professionalization of college basketball, I'm not sure that I'm going to be as much of a college basketball fan as I've been, because I don't enjoy following professional sports.

It's early days, still, and what we're seeing now is only a hint of what may be coming once the NIL process gets moving at full speed.

What I find dismaying at this point is the fact that so many players are transferring out. Some of us enjoy "getting to know" the players (by watching the games and reading about them), and that helps us feel a more personal connection with the teams.

.

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/stor...new-school

Found this link on th Jax St board.

Just curious: how’d you end up at NMSU?

(04-26-2022 05:05 AM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  A little background. I grew up in western New York. Attended New Mexico State University for undergrad and the University of Delaware for grad school. Now I love in Georgia. I have had a long time affinity for "the little guy". This means that I often enjoy minor league games better than major league games. I am sure that this is in part due to the local sport scene from Rochester where I grew up (Red Wings AAA, Amerks AHL, Knighthawks and Rhinos). As a result, I grew accustomed to seeing a turnover of the teams on a yearly basis. There were some players at the Amerks (Jody Gage) who stayed there multiple seasons, but the majority were either moving up to the Sabers or Orioles, our out.

With this as a backdrop, Mid-Major sports, and some of the major colleges, are seeing a similar think. My two alma matters made March Madness this season. NMSU has a new coach and the potential or a significantly different make-up of the team. I think that I just need to change my view, instead of four years of players developing, we are seeing a different version of one and done.

I can still enjoy the teams, just as I did with the minor league sports teams, but I need to shift my focus.

Yes, I agree as a fan of Little Rock (UALR). The days of finding diamonds in the rough (ex. Derek Fisher) and watching them develop into great players are likely gone. I see little advantage in bringing in promising freshman, just to have them leave after a couple of years. I think we would be better off focusing on transfers and Jucos. If we do sign a freshman, and he excels, he will likely be gone after a couple of seasons and I can't really blame him when you can play immediately at a "big time" school and get a bunch of NIL money. When that happens we just have to find someone who is languishing on the bench at a Big 12 or SEC school. I used to love watching and getting to know our players over their 4 or 5 years careers. I'll just have to get used to having a relatively new roster every year and making sure I pick up a program. It is what it is and I doubt we'll be going back to what it used to be.

You will still find those diamonds in the rough. You may have them 2 years, and they will be gone. Mid-majors will be the new junior college. I am one who believes the split is coming a lot sooner than predicted. And it will include basketball and the NCAA tournament.

(04-26-2022 03:26 PM)mjs Wrote:  

(04-26-2022 05:05 AM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  A little background. I grew up in western New York. Attended New Mexico State University for undergrad and the University of Delaware for grad school. Now I love in Georgia. I have had a long time affinity for "the little guy". This means that I often enjoy minor league games better than major league games. I am sure that this is in part due to the local sport scene from Rochester where I grew up (Red Wings AAA, Amerks AHL, Knighthawks and Rhinos). As a result, I grew accustomed to seeing a turnover of the teams on a yearly basis. There were some players at the Amerks (Jody Gage) who stayed there multiple seasons, but the majority were either moving up to the Sabers or Orioles, our out.

With this as a backdrop, Mid-Major sports, and some of the major colleges, are seeing a similar think. My two alma matters made March Madness this season. NMSU has a new coach and the potential or a significantly different make-up of the team. I think that I just need to change my view, instead of four years of players developing, we are seeing a different version of one and done.

I can still enjoy the teams, just as I did with the minor league sports teams, but I need to shift my focus.

Yes, I agree as a fan of Little Rock (UALR). The days of finding diamonds in the rough (ex. Derek Fisher) and watching them develop into great players are likely gone. I see little advantage in bringing in promising freshman, just to have them leave after a couple of years. I think we would be better off focusing on transfers and Jucos. If we do sign a freshman, and he excels, he will likely be gone after a couple of seasons and I can't really blame him when you can play immediately at a "big time" school and get a bunch of NIL money. When that happens we just have to find someone who is languishing on the bench at a Big 12 or SEC school. I used to love watching and getting to know our players over their 4 or 5 years careers. I'll just have to get used to having a relatively new roster every year and making sure I pick up a program. It is what it is and I doubt we'll be going back to what it used to be.

as we edge closer to pro league.
will the players hang around for 10 yrs
you can't tell them 4 yrs your done.
that would be restaint of trade.

tier 1 players would want the pro league for chance at NFL
tier 2 & 3 players would look for the free education,
and play FB at Wake Forrest

(04-26-2022 04:58 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  as we edge closer to pro league.
will the players hang around for 10 yrs
you can't tell them 4 yrs your done.
that would be restaint of trade.

tier 1 players would want the pro league for chance at NFL
tier 2 & 3 players would look for the free education,
and play FB at Wake Forrest

Disagree on that. Eligibility rules are unchanged at present. If a student doesn't meet eligibility requirements of the NCAA and their school is still in the voluntary association, (ie going to classes, maintaining a certain GPA), 4 years of eligibility in a five year window, no judge is going to force them eligible.

There are pro options. No restraint of trade in this case.

(04-26-2022 01:36 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Just curious: how’d you end up at NMSU?

When I went in the late 1990s, tuition was only about $1000 per semester. At the SUNY schools it was about $1500 a semester. That was the major factor.

I was also a Recreation Area's Management Major, and NMSU had a great program for that. I changed my major after a year, too much Chemistry.

Plus, I could golf all year long.

(04-26-2022 06:55 AM)esayem Wrote:  Devil’s advocate is NIL, which we’re seeing players go places they never would have gone before. See Jackson State.

Jackson State has more NFL hall of famers than any other school in the state of Mississippi and more than half of the SEC.

(04-26-2022 05:02 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(04-26-2022 04:58 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  as we edge closer to pro league.
will the players hang around for 10 yrs
you can't tell them 4 yrs your done.
that would be restaint of trade.

tier 1 players would want the pro league for chance at NFL
tier 2 & 3 players would look for the free education,
and play FB at Wake Forrest

Disagree on that. Eligibility rules are unchanged at present. If a student doesn't meet eligibility requirements of the NCAA and their school is still in the voluntary association, (ie going to classes, maintaining a certain GPA), 4 years of eligibility in a five year window, no judge is going to force them eligible.

There are pro options. No restraint of trade in this case.

Correct.

There are lots of professions that have a pretty explicit "up or out" employment model (e.g. you get 2 years as an associate at an investment bank). That's not a restraint of trade at all. What was a restraint of trade was collectively agreeing that players can't be compensated.

(04-26-2022 08:21 PM)RobtheAggie Wrote:  

(04-26-2022 01:36 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Just curious: how’d you end up at NMSU?

When I went in the late 1990s, tuition was only about $1000 per semester. At the SUNY schools it was about $1500 a semester. That was the major factor.

I was also a Recreation Area's Management Major, and NMSU had a great program for that. I changed my major after a year, too much Chemistry.

Plus, I could golf all year long.

Rochester may have some great courses, but Jan/Feb golf isn't happening. Besides, for the program you wanted, Cornell or ESF are really your only options in NYS.