(04-29-2022 10:17 AM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  

(04-29-2022 09:39 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-28-2022 02:00 PM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  

(04-28-2022 10:31 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-28-2022 07:57 AM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  You can check the financials. Yes, we've both spent more than we ever have, but the AAC football results(with very little exception) have fallen almost directly down the budget line.

I'd post the list, but it's behind a paywall now. Last I looked, UCF/Cindy/Houston were spending ~10m more than the rest of us per year.

Fair point, and that would explain us falling behind UCF and Cincy. But relative to all of FBS, I have the sense that we are both worse off than we were 10-12 years ago, and I suspect we are spending more relative to all of FBS than we were then,

I guess it is an empirical question.

USF is definitely in a different situation because they were flung almost immediately into the Big East. If ECU ends up being average in the current AAC to the top of the "new" AAC, then we're doing better than our CUSA days.

OK, but has that happened? ECU has been in the AAC for 8 years. Are you doing better than you were 10-15 years ago in terms of overall football program strength?

Just my opinion, but I think so. 7-5 in an AAC with a CFP representative > 10-3 in the current CUSA. We're making more loot, have better tv exposure, we expanded the stadium, added more luxury seating, and are about to announce our IPF campaign.

I'm also of the opinion that we wouldn't have been any good in ANY conference with Scottie Mo at the helm. We certainly weren't any better off in the John Thompson era in CUSA. In other words, if we were going to be bad for a few years anyway, I'd rather be bad in the AAC than average in CUSA.

All that said, the ceiling is definitely higher. Go ask Missouri, who was way more competitive in the Big 12, if they've changed their minds about the SEC move. That question was posed in the lounge, and you weighed in.

were they though? they were the same kinda program in both conferences under pinkel. their struggles have less to do with conference and more to do with it not being the same coach. they won the SEC east in 2 of their first 3 years with the recruits they brought with them from the big 12.

(04-29-2022 11:42 AM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(04-28-2022 12:54 PM)Milwaukee Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 12:45 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  Exactly right. And much the same can be said for UNC-C, Rice, and UNT. Does anyone care? And the knock on effect is that these schools generate zero interest in our fans.

That may be the way you happen to see the situation, but if there's no evidence to back up that view, we may simply have to wait and see whether viewership over the next decade years will be higher or lower than it's been during the first decade of the AAC.

.

Some AAC (e.g., Temple) fans have asserted that fans of their teams have shown little interest in playing AAC teams.

However, the attendance data haven't supported that view:

...........................................................................Average Home
.............................................................................Attendance:

Last two seasons of play (2004 & 2012) in the Big East:..26,500

Most recent non-pandemic season in the AAC (2019):.....29,500

.

This and a range of other evidence indicates that Temple's home attendance for conference games has actually increased since they joined the AAC, despite the fact that they're not playing their well-established regional rivalry games vs. nearby former conference teams, such as Rutgers and Pittsburgh.

Such evidence suggests that it may be entirely possible that home football attendance will increase after the CUSA6 join the AAC.

.

ECU fans have zero interest in being associated with UNC-C and their JV football program. Is that clear enough for you?

clt says hahaahahhahaahahaha!

eCu was founded 40 years before Charlotte and we have passed you in enrollment, and endowment already. Now we are back in your conference and will announce massive athletic facility improvements soon.

(04-29-2022 04:03 PM)ghostofclt! Wrote:  

(04-29-2022 11:42 AM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(04-28-2022 12:54 PM)Milwaukee Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 12:45 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  Exactly right. And much the same can be said for UNC-C, Rice, and UNT. Does anyone care? And the knock on effect is that these schools generate zero interest in our fans.

That may be the way you happen to see the situation, but if there's no evidence to back up that view, we may simply have to wait and see whether viewership over the next decade years will be higher or lower than it's been during the first decade of the AAC.

.

Some AAC (e.g., Temple) fans have asserted that fans of their teams have shown little interest in playing AAC teams.

However, the attendance data haven't supported that view:

...........................................................................Average Home
.............................................................................Attendance:

Last two seasons of play (2004 & 2012) in the Big East:..26,500

Most recent non-pandemic season in the AAC (2019):.....29,500

.

This and a range of other evidence indicates that Temple's home attendance for conference games has actually increased since they joined the AAC, despite the fact that they're not playing their well-established regional rivalry games vs. nearby former conference teams, such as Rutgers and Pittsburgh.

Such evidence suggests that it may be entirely possible that home football attendance will increase after the CUSA6 join the AAC.

.

ECU fans have zero interest in being associated with UNC-C and their JV football program. Is that clear enough for you?

clt says hahaahahhahaahahaha!

eCu was founded 40 years before Charlotte and we have passed you in enrollment, and endowment already. Now we are back in your conference and will announce massive athletic facility improvements soon.

puddlepirate says **** off

Whenever an ECU fan says they’d rather be in the Sunbelt my mind explodes

(04-29-2022 07:02 PM)CLTPirate Wrote:  Whenever an ECU fan says they’d rather be in the Sunbelt my mind explodes

I think you can make a case for it. In the "realignment" forum, "TroyFootball05" posted the SBC eastern division, or what it will be once the new schools join in 2023:

App State
Marshall
Coastal Carolina
James Madison
Georgia State
Old Dominion
Georgia Southern

If I'm an ECU fan, I would find that lineup attractive. Lots of local schools, lots of fertile ground for rivalries.

Now granted, it's not an *aspirational* lineup of schools. Its not a lineup that screams upward mobility towards the SEC or something.

But if you are an ECU fan who cares more about playing regional schools that are from a common culture than playing a roster of far-flung schools that pays more money, gets on TV more and is more positional for possible future advancement, than it is a defensible position.

And IMO, there's nothing wrong with a fan valuing that.

(04-29-2022 07:02 PM)CLTPirate Wrote:  Whenever an ECU fan says they’d rather be in the Sunbelt my mind explodes

It's 100% the best move if this league gets pillaged again or when the AAC TV deal implodes... Which I fully expect to happen. Now if by some miracle we end up in whatever becomes of the B12 that's another story.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

(04-28-2022 09:08 AM)panama Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 05:26 PM)TealNation Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 04:23 PM)Tiger1983 Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 04:19 PM)Fishpro10987 Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 12:45 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  Exactly right. And much the same can be said for UNC-C, Rice, and UNT. Does anyone care? And the knock on effect is that these schools generate zero interest in our fans.

Which is why I would have just added UAB and Rice and stopped at 10. The MWC wasn't going to add Texas schools. It would have meant thinning their already small pie slices from their media deal. No need to add FAU's and Charlotte's of the world. They are like adding and Elvis lamp to your Vermont Woods Studio collection. Be a strong 10 team conference like the former Big 12. Add only the best if you get raided.

Agree, but I opt for UAB and Appy St.

AAC wasn't getting a SBC East school. CUSA was always the target. Using the presumed metric the AAC used to select schools, I believe ODU would've been a better add long term than some of the others. Fertile recruiting ground, decent market, solid fanbase and a bigger budget. Yet they ended up in the SBC. Maybe the goal was to pair them with JMU. ESPN is playing chess.

There really is no perfect situation other than getting invited into the SEC. Lol. Seriously though, we are all going grouse and groan about our situation and that x school doesn't create interest or that y school has no fans. Guess what? #MidMajorProblems. I look at our situation and personally I was upset that we ended up in any situation where we are not playing UAB. They are the closest G5 to us. Yet we now have JMU and Marshall. No offense to those schools. Really good programs. But they will create zero interest in Atlanta. Too far away and we don't work with their alumni daily. It's really going to be up to the programs, ADs and conference offices to create the interest for fans and create the narrative as to why Charlotte vs Tulane matters because btw, with the exception of maybe two or three schools who have the slight glimmering hope of moving to a P5 conference, THIS is it folks. This G5 landscape in the Phantom Zone is our home for the foreseeable future. Now to figure out how to accept it and live with it.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Why Charlotte v Tulane matters?
Are you kidding me?????

Green Wave v Cocky Green Beans?

# GREEN LIVES MATTER

(04-29-2022 07:07 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-29-2022 07:02 PM)CLTPirate Wrote:  Whenever an ECU fan says they’d rather be in the Sunbelt my mind explodes

I think you can make a case for it. In the "realignment" forum, "TroyFootball05" posted the SBC eastern division, or what it will be once the new schools join in 2023:

App State
Marshall
Coastal Carolina
James Madison
Georgia State
Old Dominion
Georgia Southern

If I'm an ECU fan, I would find that lineup attractive. Lots of local schools, lots of fertile ground for rivalries.

Now granted, it's not an *aspirational* lineup of schools. Its not a lineup that screams upward mobility towards the SEC or something.

But if you are an ECU fan who cares more about playing regional schools that are from a common culture than playing a roster of far-flung schools that pays more money, gets on TV more and is more positional for possible future advancement, than it is a defensible position.

And IMO, there's nothing wrong with a fan valuing that.

(Has there been) a change in the AAC contract when the three teams leave?
(Is there going to be)

clt says eCu for odu could be interesting, are you are aware of the odu tennis facility?

(04-29-2022 04:03 PM)ghostofclt! Wrote:  

(04-29-2022 11:42 AM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(04-28-2022 12:54 PM)Milwaukee Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 12:45 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  Exactly right. And much the same can be said for UNC-C, Rice, and UNT. Does anyone care? And the knock on effect is that these schools generate zero interest in our fans.

That may be the way you happen to see the situation, but if there's no evidence to back up that view, we may simply have to wait and see whether viewership over the next decade years will be higher or lower than it's been during the first decade of the AAC.

.

Some AAC (e.g., Temple) fans have asserted that fans of their teams have shown little interest in playing AAC teams.

However, the attendance data haven't supported that view:

...........................................................................Average Home
.............................................................................Attendance:

Last two seasons of play (2004 & 2012) in the Big East:..26,500

Most recent non-pandemic season in the AAC (2019):.....29,500

.

This and a range of other evidence indicates that Temple's home attendance for conference games has actually increased since they joined the AAC, despite the fact that they're not playing their well-established regional rivalry games vs. nearby former conference teams, such as Rutgers and Pittsburgh.

Such evidence suggests that it may be entirely possible that home football attendance will increase after the CUSA6 join the AAC.

.

ECU fans have zero interest in being associated with UNC-C and their JV football program. Is that clear enough for you?

clt says hahaahahhahaahahaha!

eCu was founded 40 years before Charlotte and we have passed you in enrollment, and endowment already. Now we are back in your conference and will announce massive athletic facility improvements soon.

The AAC remainers, as a group, know that they're going to have to welcome the CUSA6 in with open arms, the same way the original AAC schools welcomed Navy, Tulane, Tulsa, ECU, and Wichita State in with open arms, or at least didn't do a lot of trash talking against the incoming teams.

There were some exceptions then, and there are some now who have been expressing mixed feelings about the incoming schools and teams. However, it's not in the interest of the AAC remainers to make the CUSA6 feel unwelcome, since we're all going to be in the same boat a year from now, and we're all going to sink or swim together.

.

(04-29-2022 11:18 PM)Milwaukee Wrote:  

(04-29-2022 04:03 PM)ghostofclt! Wrote:  

(04-29-2022 11:42 AM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(04-28-2022 12:54 PM)Milwaukee Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 12:45 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  Exactly right. And much the same can be said for UNC-C, Rice, and UNT. Does anyone care? And the knock on effect is that these schools generate zero interest in our fans.

That may be the way you happen to see the situation, but if there's no evidence to back up that view, we may simply have to wait and see whether viewership over the next decade years will be higher or lower than it's been during the first decade of the AAC.

.

Some AAC (e.g., Temple) fans have asserted that fans of their teams have shown little interest in playing AAC teams.

However, the attendance data haven't supported that view:

...........................................................................Average Home
.............................................................................Attendance:

Last two seasons of play (2004 & 2012) in the Big East:..26,500

Most recent non-pandemic season in the AAC (2019):.....29,500

.

This and a range of other evidence indicates that Temple's home attendance for conference games has actually increased since they joined the AAC, despite the fact that they're not playing their well-established regional rivalry games vs. nearby former conference teams, such as Rutgers and Pittsburgh.

Such evidence suggests that it may be entirely possible that home football attendance will increase after the CUSA6 join the AAC.

.

ECU fans have zero interest in being associated with UNC-C and their JV football program. Is that clear enough for you?

clt says hahaahahhahaahahaha!

eCu was founded 40 years before Charlotte and we have passed you in enrollment, and endowment already. Now we are back in your conference and will announce massive athletic facility improvements soon.

The AAC remainers, as a group, know that they're going to have to welcome the CUSA6 in with open arms, the same way the original AAC schools welcomed Navy, Tulane, Tulsa, ECU, and Wichita State in with open arms, or at least didn't do a lot of trash talking against the incoming teams.

There were some exceptions then, and there are some now who have been expressing mixed feelings about the incoming schools and teams. However, it's not in the interest of the AAC remainers to make the CUSA6 feel unwelcome, since we're all going to be in the same boat a year from now, and we're all going to sink or swim together.

.

(04-27-2022 08:49 PM)Cubanbull1 Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 08:42 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 07:43 PM)Cubanbull1 Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 06:51 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 09:04 AM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  With few exceptions, there seems to be a direct relationship between budgets/revenue and football success. I don't expect that formula to be turned on its head over the next 10 years.

Oh I'm sure that's the case, especially at the P-level.

But we're in a G-world, and I'm not so sure about that.

I think your school and mine are cases in point: I bet both USF and ECU spent more money on football the past eight years than we ever have in our history - and what do we have to show for it? Mostly bad years.

Not like the other schools in the AAC have been standing still in their football spending.
USF last 8 years, 4 winning bowl seasons, 4 losing seasons. So no not mostly bad years, 47-49 record

Right, but the trend over those 8 years is bad. The first 4.5 years, we were 40-17. The last 3.5 years, we are 7-32.

That's a steep tumble while spending has kept going up.

I wouldn’t say that, USF hasn’t really spent on football facilities much in past 8 years, other than practice fields. And yes what happened in those last 3.5 years to cause that big drop? One name for you, Charlie Strong, he decided to change our style to a more power run style which we didn’t have recruits to run and then proceeded to not being able to recruit to run that system.
We are paying for a bad hire and not spending to improve facilities.
Look at what we did in those 8 years football wise?
We redid outside practice fields.

In past year.
Redid football locker rooms
Building IPF
Working on OCS.

USF has spent more in past year on football facilities than in those previous 8 years

Spending money on facilities like an on campus stadium is a must. For some strange reason USF decided it wasn't necessary. But more than that they need a great marketing campaign to overcome the backseat USF takes to the Bucs. I think the best season for average attendance ever was around 44,000 and three years later it was 41,000. So winning consistently and winning some championships are necessary to win the fans back. The potential has always been there but unrealized.

(04-30-2022 01:53 PM)knightmite Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 08:49 PM)Cubanbull1 Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 08:42 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 07:43 PM)Cubanbull1 Wrote:  

(04-27-2022 06:51 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Oh I'm sure that's the case, especially at the P-level.

But we're in a G-world, and I'm not so sure about that.

I think your school and mine are cases in point: I bet both USF and ECU spent more money on football the past eight years than we ever have in our history - and what do we have to show for it? Mostly bad years.

Not like the other schools in the AAC have been standing still in their football spending.
USF last 8 years, 4 winning bowl seasons, 4 losing seasons. So no not mostly bad years, 47-49 record

Right, but the trend over those 8 years is bad. The first 4.5 years, we were 40-17. The last 3.5 years, we are 7-32.

That's a steep tumble while spending has kept going up.

I wouldn’t say that, USF hasn’t really spent on football facilities much in past 8 years, other than practice fields. And yes what happened in those last 3.5 years to cause that big drop? One name for you, Charlie Strong, he decided to change our style to a more power run style which we didn’t have recruits to run and then proceeded to not being able to recruit to run that system.
We are paying for a bad hire and not spending to improve facilities.
Look at what we did in those 8 years football wise?
We redid outside practice fields.

In past year.
Redid football locker rooms
Building IPF
Working on OCS.

USF has spent more in past year on football facilities than in those previous 8 years

Spending money on facilities like an on campus stadium is a must. For some strange reason USF decided it wasn't necessary. But more than that they need a great marketing campaign to overcome the backseat USF takes to the Bucs. I think the best season for average attendance ever was around 44,000 and three years later it was 41,000. So winning consistently and winning some championships are necessary to win the fans back. The potential has always been there but unrealized.

The Bucs fans are a different crowd. USF needs to win and have an exciting Offense. The exciting part went out once Strong came in, the winning stopped once the players he inherited left.
For USF an avg of 45k would be ideal, which is why building an OCS smaller than RJS is needed. But an OCS won’t solve all of USF’s problems, we will see how Scott does this year.

The OCS situation has been addressed many times, USF was never going to build an OCS until either a Big Booster donated big money or a Power conference said you need it to move up.

WhennUSF was winning in Big East they did well in RJS

clt says the lowly sunbelt maybe a good fit for eCu

Declining enrollment
Rural area
Acceptance rate nearing 100%
Budget in the red

Odu should move up to the aac and eCu can step down

(04-30-2022 03:11 PM)ghostofclt! Wrote:  clt says the lowly sunbelt maybe a good fit for eCu

Declining enrollment
Rural area
Acceptance rate nearing 100%
Budget in the red

Odu should move up to the aac and eCu can step down

Purple CLT says you can’t talk trash about things off the field when ECU fans outnumber Charlotte fans in Charlotte

(04-30-2022 03:11 PM)ghostofclt! Wrote:  clt says the lowly sunbelt maybe a good fit for eCu

Declining enrollment
Rural area
Acceptance rate nearing 100%
Budget in the red

Odu should move up to the aac and eCu can step down

Lowly Sun Belt guy chiming in. Honestly seems like ODU could've been in the AAC if they wanted. They would've definitely been one of my adds going 6, using AAC metrics.

Also, Google says UNCC's acceptance rate is 80%...

(04-30-2022 04:41 PM)CLTPirate Wrote:  

(04-30-2022 03:11 PM)ghostofclt! Wrote:  clt says the lowly sunbelt maybe a good fit for eCu

Declining enrollment
Rural area
Acceptance rate nearing 100%
Budget in the red

Odu should move up to the aac and eCu can step down

Purple CLT says you can’t talk trash about things off the field when ECU fans outnumber Charlotte fans in Charlotte

clt just donated $49 to the pirate club and became a top 50 member!

Interesting thread for sure. It is probably best to revisit this around 5 years from now to gauge how much the CUSA6 help/hurt the AAC. I think the AAC messed up taking 6 schools, but only time will tell. Marshall doesn't fit what the AAC was looking for, so no sour grapes from me. I do think you all should have stopped at 12 though. UAB was a natural fit. ODU would have been the other add if I was picking.

The only real loser this time around in realignment was CUSA. Short term they will survive, but long term I wonder how viable that league will be. Especially if WKU and MTSU leave. The media deal was already bad, one would think it will not get better from here.

If we are making future predictions then I will throw one out. Over the next 10 years the AAC will to be a highly competitive conference as long as they hang onto Memphis and USF. If you lose those two then my perspective changes a lot. The Big 12 will come hunting for 2 more teams in a few years. It will be a dog fight between Boise, Memphis, and USF for those slots.

Sometime in the mid 2030's the rest of us will be regulated to another form of division 2 separate from the current P5. Shoot, there maybe some current P5 schools that chose not participate in the pay for play super conferences/division and join us in the lower division. Either way, everyone in the AAC not named Memphis/USF better better get used to the idea that there is no more moving up after this. The CUSA6 are ecstatic to be here, as they should be. Only those of us that escaped CUSA truly know the euphoric feeling of not dealing with that inept leadership anymore. However, this is it. The line will be drawn, and none of us in the AAC, SBC, MWC, and MAC will be included.

(04-30-2022 05:59 PM)GreenDaddy Wrote:  Interesting thread for sure. It is probably best to revisit this around 5 years from now to gauge how much the CUSA6 help/hurt the AAC. I think the AAC messed up taking 6 schools, but only time will tell. Marshall doesn't fit what the AAC was looking for, so no sour grapes from me. I do think you all should have stopped at 12 though. UAB was a natural fit. ODU would have been the other add if I was picking.

The only real loser this time around in realignment was CUSA. Short term they will survive, but long term I wonder how viable that league will be. Especially if WKU and MTSU leave. The media deal was already bad, one would think it will not get better from here.

If we are making future predictions then I will throw one out. Over the next 10 years the AAC will to be a highly competitive conference as long as they hang onto Memphis and USF. If you lose those two then my perspective changes a lot. The Big 12 will come hunting for 2 more teams in a few years. It will be a dog fight between Boise, Memphis, and USF for those slots.

Sometime in the mid 2030's the rest of us will be regulated to another form of division 2 separate from the current P5. Shoot, there maybe some current P5 schools that chose not participate in the pay for play super conferences/division and join us in the lower division. Either way, everyone in the AAC not named Memphis/USF better better get used to the idea that there is no more moving up after this. The CUSA6 are ecstatic to be here, as they should be. Only those of us that escaped CUSA truly know the euphoric feeling of not dealing with that inept leadership anymore. However, this is it. The line will be drawn, and none of us in the AAC, SBC, MWC, and MAC will be included.

Realistic take... I think to a point, most all of us are in the same 'general' boat - there will be a few more stepping up to the BIG XII, but otherwise, there's not a whole lot of separation for we 'G5ers' - heck, even the 'new look' CUSA has potential, at least in football... it's apparent there will be a 50-60 team 'mega-conference-league' within 10-12 years, which ultimately will allow the 'level below' that to set up a championship of their own - a new 'I-AA', if you will...

...and a take on the 'general' topic - people tend to forget that the AAC (with the apparent 'coercing' of ESPN) initially tried to grab the top of the MWC (non-ESPN conference), and when that failed, they grabbed the CUSA-6 (another non-ESPN conference), somewhat to 'block' Texas access to the MWC, but also to try and ELIMINATE C-USA... ...not sure how things would have shaken out if the AAC COULD have gotten BSU/CSU/AFA, etc. from the MWC - I still think the Sun Belt adds would have jumped, and, as a Blazer, would like to have thought UAB would have landed either in the AAC or SBC in that scenario.

(04-29-2022 07:07 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-29-2022 07:02 PM)CLTPirate Wrote:  Whenever an ECU fan says they’d rather be in the Sunbelt my mind explodes

I think you can make a case for it. In the "realignment" forum, "TroyFootball05" posted the SBC eastern division, or what it will be once the new schools join in 2023:

App State
Marshall
Coastal Carolina
James Madison
Georgia State
Old Dominion
Georgia Southern

If I'm an ECU fan, I would find that lineup attractive. Lots of local schools, lots of fertile ground for rivalries.

Now granted, it's not an *aspirational* lineup of schools. Its not a lineup that screams upward mobility towards the SEC or something.

But if you are an ECU fan who cares more about playing regional schools that are from a common culture than playing a roster of far-flung schools that pays more money, gets on TV more and is more positional for possible future advancement, than it is a defensible position.

And IMO, there's nothing wrong with a fan valuing that.

There is definitely a segment of the ECU fan base that really prefers that type of schedule. That was the group long time AD Terry Holland seemed to cater to back in the day. He felt that was the way to build a fan base. It certainly worked well during his tenure.