https://thefederalist.com/2022/03/14/the...me-change/

I'm reading a lot of these types of articles. They seem to think doing even less than the Russians did to help the North Vietnamese and North Koreans against us is somehow crossing a line.

And they believe these types of comments and stretch to apply them to the Ukraine conflict:

“Threaten our homeland, our way of life, and most importantly our leader, and yes, we will nuke the sh-t of out you. I guarantee it.” That’s what a senior retired Russian diplomat told me on the sidelines of a Track 2.0 dialogue in 2012 when I asked him what would happen during a NATO-Russian war or a threat to the Russian government itself.

He was pretty clear: Threats Russia’s sovereignty, ability to control its territory, run its economy—and most of all, ensure leadership survival—were all things it might go to nuclear war over. Isn’t that what we are doing today regarding the Ukraine crisis?..."

No fly zones are risky militarily as well as being a direct conflict. But there is nothing else that is a big deal. And while its possible Putin has lost his marbles, all of those around him have not. Russia is struggling to lick Ukraine. They aren't going to attack NATO. They might go after Moldova or Georgia (doubt they are interested in the rest of Georgia), but not Poland, Estonia or Latvia.

I'm with the "snowflake".

Quote:The West’s undeclared goal is simple: Putin has to go. Or, Putin has to die, as some on right are now cheerleading.

Yes, that means regime change, wrapped in all of its fantastical failures, is making a comeback in Washington, and no one seems to notice or even care. No one also seems to understand that’s our new goal now, what that means, and the ramifications for our world—like a full-blown nuclear war if we push Putin too far into the geopolitical gutter.

We've got idiots in charge right now and y'all are just cheering it on regardless of what happens on the other side of it.
Question nothing. Just obey. Change your facebook profile to a blue and yellow flag.

(03-14-2022 12:56 PM)b2b Wrote:  I'm with the "snowflake".

Quote:The West’s undeclared goal is simple: Putin has to go. Or, Putin has to die, as some on right are now cheerleading.

Yes, that means regime change, wrapped in all of its fantastical failures, is making a comeback in Washington, and no one seems to notice or even care. No one also seems to understand that’s our new goal now, what that means, and the ramifications for our world—like a full-blown nuclear war if we push Putin too far into the geopolitical gutter.

We've got idiots in charge right now and y'all are just cheering it on regardless of what happens on the other side of it.
Question nothing. Just obey. Change your facebook profile to a blue and yellow flag.

Nobody with a brain seriously believes that quote you posted (alright, I'm excluding our president and vice-president...).

(03-14-2022 01:00 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-14-2022 12:56 PM)b2b Wrote:  I'm with the "snowflake".

Quote:The West’s undeclared goal is simple: Putin has to go. Or, Putin has to die, as some on right are now cheerleading.

Yes, that means regime change, wrapped in all of its fantastical failures, is making a comeback in Washington, and no one seems to notice or even care. No one also seems to understand that’s our new goal now, what that means, and the ramifications for our world—like a full-blown nuclear war if we push Putin too far into the geopolitical gutter.

We've got idiots in charge right now and y'all are just cheering it on regardless of what happens on the other side of it.
Question nothing. Just obey. Change your facebook profile to a blue and yellow flag.

Nobody with a brain seriously believes that quote you posted (alright, I'm excluding our president and vice-president...).

So why are our pols and media openly calling for Putin's assassination? These are the same idiots that thought funding biolabs in China and Ukraine was a good idea. I bet you thought W was a good president.

(03-14-2022 01:11 PM)b2b Wrote:  

(03-14-2022 01:00 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-14-2022 12:56 PM)b2b Wrote:  I'm with the "snowflake".

Quote:The West’s undeclared goal is simple: Putin has to go. Or, Putin has to die, as some on right are now cheerleading.

Yes, that means regime change, wrapped in all of its fantastical failures, is making a comeback in Washington, and no one seems to notice or even care. No one also seems to understand that’s our new goal now, what that means, and the ramifications for our world—like a full-blown nuclear war if we push Putin too far into the geopolitical gutter.

We've got idiots in charge right now and y'all are just cheering it on regardless of what happens on the other side of it.
Question nothing. Just obey. Change your facebook profile to a blue and yellow flag.

Nobody with a brain seriously believes that quote you posted (alright, I'm excluding our president and vice-president...).

So why are our pols and media openly calling for Putin's assassination? These are the same idiots that thought funding biolabs in China and Ukraine was a good idea. I bet you thought W was a good president.

Anybody calling for assassination by definition doesn't believe these sanctions will cause people to rise up against Putin. They're calling for basically a deus ex machina.

As for the media, what part of "nobody with a brain" did you not understand?!

(03-14-2022 12:39 PM)bullet Wrote:  https://thefederalist.com/2022/03/14/the...me-change/

I'm reading a lot of these types of articles. They seem to think doing even less than the Russians did to help the North Vietnamese and North Koreans against us is somehow crossing a line.

And they believe these types of comments and stretch to apply them to the Ukraine conflict:

“Threaten our homeland, our way of life, and most importantly our leader, and yes, we will nuke the sh-t of out you. I guarantee it.” That’s what a senior retired Russian diplomat told me on the sidelines of a Track 2.0 dialogue in 2012 when I asked him what would happen during a NATO-Russian war or a threat to the Russian government itself.

He was pretty clear: Threats Russia’s sovereignty, ability to control its territory, run its economy—and most of all, ensure leadership survival—were all things it might go to nuclear war over. Isn’t that what we are doing today regarding the Ukraine crisis?..."

No fly zones are risky militarily as well as being a direct conflict. But there is nothing else that is a big deal. And while its possible Putin has lost his marbles, all of those around him have not. Russia is struggling to lick Ukraine. They aren't going to attack NATO. They might go after Moldova or Georgia (doubt they are interested in the rest of Georgia), but not Poland, Estonia or Latvia.

Im afraid I dont follow that logic. How is not allowing Russia to invade Ukraine, overthrow its government, and take what they want in terms of territory---threatening the existence of Russia or its government? In a worst case scenario for Russia---even if they end up NOT being able to take Ukraine---Russia will still exist and will likely swallow additional portions of Ukraine. Heck---Russia existed and its continued existence was never in doubt PRIOR to the invasion---and that hasnt changed. The existence of Ukraine never threatened Russian existence.

Frankly---the willingness to fire nukes if threatened is pretty much the only thing you need to insure the security of the Russian government and its territory. The mere fact that Russia has been in an all out shooting war for nearly three weeks and its territory hasnt been touched by a single Ukrainian weapon---tells me Ukraine was never any security threat to Russia in the first place. If NATO was all about wrecking Russia, NATO air power could make a blood bath of this invasion---yet NATO has done nothing more than provide Ukraine with a very limited arsenal of light defensive weapons. That tells me the NATO posture was zero threat to Russia.

Seems to me---if this was about Russian military security---its backfired badly. Its resulted in a massive increase in NATO military spending, additional troops and equipment in eastern Europe, and a degrading of the total amount of Russian men and equipment opposing NATO. Worse yet, it has exposed the Russian military as being something NATO would rip apart if Russia tried to invade Europe. Putin now has less leverage than he did the day before the invasion was launched.

(03-14-2022 01:18 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-14-2022 01:11 PM)b2b Wrote:  

(03-14-2022 01:00 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-14-2022 12:56 PM)b2b Wrote:  I'm with the "snowflake".

Quote:The West’s undeclared goal is simple: Putin has to go. Or, Putin has to die, as some on right are now cheerleading.

Yes, that means regime change, wrapped in all of its fantastical failures, is making a comeback in Washington, and no one seems to notice or even care. No one also seems to understand that’s our new goal now, what that means, and the ramifications for our world—like a full-blown nuclear war if we push Putin too far into the geopolitical gutter.

We've got idiots in charge right now and y'all are just cheering it on regardless of what happens on the other side of it.
Question nothing. Just obey. Change your facebook profile to a blue and yellow flag.

Nobody with a brain seriously believes that quote you posted (alright, I'm excluding our president and vice-president...).

So why are our pols and media openly calling for Putin's assassination? These are the same idiots that thought funding biolabs in China and Ukraine was a good idea. I bet you thought W was a good president.

Anybody calling for assassination by definition doesn't believe these sanctions will cause people to rise up against Putin. They're calling for basically a deus ex machina.

As for the media, what part of "nobody with a brain" did you not understand?!

Not necessarily. Removing Putin from power would be the quickest way to end the bloodshed while minimizing the amount of economic damage the rank and file Russian citizen would have to endure. The next quickest way to end all this is to give Putin a diplomatic off ramp---where some sort of negotiated settlement gives him enough concessions for him to claim a face saving victory (which is where I think we are probably headed).