I don't know if Covid hit the Men's and Women's teams or not, but I Hope during this layoff, Coaches Burno and Carlson had the time to regroup and work on some of the glaring problems we have seen so far.

I don't expect the men's team to win many MAC games, but I would like to see them competitive in those games.

As far as the WBB team, at this time in Coach Carlsen's tenure, I expected to see better basketball than what has been displayed. I hope the team can turn it around.

(01-03-2022 02:06 AM)Schaefer Beer Wrote:  I don't know if Covid hit the Men's and Women's teams or not, but I Hope during this layoff, Coaches Burno and Carlson had the time to regroup and work on some of the glaring problems we have seen so far.

I don't expect the men's team to win many MAC games, but I would like to see them competitive in those games.

As far as the WBB team, at this time in Coach Carlsen's tenure, I expected to see better basketball than what has been displayed. I hope the team can turn it around.

I will go to the games as COVID allows. However, I also have little hope for MBB this year. I do look forward to the next couple years when Coach Burno gets his team in place.

WBB is an enigma. The ladies play hard and leave their hearts on the floor. I feel that they are doing the best they can. It is a coaching problem IMO. We have had some superb players the past several years, and yet the results have been mediocre. Not sure exactly what’s the cause.

(01-03-2022 10:33 AM)Dog Fan Wrote:  

(01-03-2022 02:06 AM)Schaefer Beer Wrote:  I don't know if Covid hit the Men's and Women's teams or not, but I Hope during this layoff, Coaches Burno and Carlson had the time to regroup and work on some of the glaring problems we have seen so far.

I don't expect the men's team to win many MAC games, but I would like to see them competitive in those games.

As far as the WBB team, at this time in Coach Carlsen's tenure, I expected to see better basketball than what has been displayed. I hope the team can turn it around.

I will go to the games as COVID allows. However, I also have little hope for MBB this year. I do look forward to the next couple years when Coach Burno gets his team in place.

WBB is an enigma. The ladies play hard and leave their hearts on the floor. I feel that they are doing the best they can. It is a coaching problem IMO. We have had some superb players the past several years, and yet the results have been mediocre. Not sure exactly what’s the cause.

Interesting point, DF. It almost seems a comparison to Matt Nagy. Even though coaching is a major issue, the team still plays hard.

I pose this question, are players developing under
Coach Carlsen? Are they more complete players than when they arrived?
I felt this was a major issue under Monty, it seems that players did not develop under Monty's regime.

Carlsen has been doing it a long time. She had great success at Lewis U. My belief is she knows the X’s and O’s of the game. She can recruit. Her fault lies with her hiring of staff. Tandez is a big personality and has been the constant link during her time at NIU. She’s had turnover is her assistants and that has been a set back to the program.

Any speculation on what problem(s) are with WBB is just that, but that does not mean we can't discuss possibilities. Just a few:

--- Carlsen was successful at Lewis (DII) but that does not always translate to DI. Smaller schools tend to be guard-oriented since good taller players go elsewhere. That may mean less experience coaching taller players, and a tendency to lean to/rely on guard play as the primary. Switching back and forth between the run-and-gun and half-court is a tangle.
--- Carlsen seems a classy and nice person; so was Montgomery. That and the above may mean she wants a "comfortable" staff like herself. Good thing, bad thing? Adam Tandez, whose background is also DII, has been associate head coach for the past 3 of his 6 years at NIU. Neither Carlsen nor Tandez came to NIU with much if any DI experience.
--- Mikayla Brandon seems to get how to convert from being a bigger player to being a guard-forward, but that's a hard transition for most taller players moving from high school -- where they played post -- to the run-and-gun. Note that A'Jah Davis is successful playing in the paint, not trying to be a guard.
--- The above limits recruiting; it's hard to tell someone who's 6-0 or taller thay have to learn a guard-based offense. They just want to play, but going to the r-n-g might be viewed almost like starting over.
--- Despite extensions due to Covid-19, NIU has carried over a lot of players due to injury, which limits recruiting. Part of that is the sudden start-stop, twist-turn of the r-n-g. NIU brought in an "advisor" for a while to help "educate" players on how to maneuver. Don't know what happened with that.
--- NIU lacks depth. NIU had four players out when it played Drake, down to 10. But Drake stomped NIU with 12. I question the strength of recruiting. If I dig back, I can count maybe 3-4 good 6-0 players from the local area who have chosen to go elsewhere, and not all to "big" programs. NIU's sole incoming player, at 6-0/6-1 (conflicting NIU reports), is coming off a post-injury season.
--- I question whether fundamentals are stressed in practice. Northern should not hit less than 80-85% of freethrows on a bad day. If net aiming isn't working, use the backboard. No points for style. It's the only uncontested shot in the game with parameters that never change.

That's a long list ... and rambling ... but step back, add it all up. Something is not right. Now within 7th season, record at 95-99, ... . What does NIU want from its WBB program? Everybody has Covid issues, but when NIU cannot even beat EIU and WIU ...

All those may be accurate assessments of the situation 75, but in the end it all falls back to the Head coach. If her trademark is the RNG and after 7 years she can't get the players she needs to be successful then she needs to play a style more suitable to her players talents. I was optimistic when she was hired but it hasn't panned out. She may be hamstrung in hiring of assistants because of ability to pay limitations but you have to be creative in the hiring process. Ultimately she most likely will be allowed to run out the clock on her contract and NIU will be looking at another rebuild.

(01-03-2022 05:57 PM)NIUSAE Wrote:  All those may be accurate assessments of the situation 75, but in the end it all falls back to the Head coach. If her trademark is the RNG and after 7 years she can't get the players she needs to be successful then she needs to play a style more suitable to her players talents. I was optimistic when she was hired but it hasn't panned out. She may be hamstrung in hiring of assistants because of ability to pay limitations but you have to be creative in the hiring process. Ultimately she most likely will be allowed to run out the clock on her contract and NIU will be looking at another rebuild.

I was trying to be polite, diplomatic, whatever, and vague since I/we really don't know the internals of the situation with WBB. You summarized what I meant when I said step back and add it all up. For whatever reason(s), the program seems to be where it pretty much was 7 years ago ... treading water, with some exciting moments sprinkled in. That's tiring for everyone ... ADept., fans, players, whoever.

Wild guess ... no contract extension, and the team knows (or suspects) it. They love the game and will do their best, but at season's end, women can use the transfer portal too. Chelby Koker, A'Jah Davis, maybe Mikayla Brandon ... big losses ... or a solid foundation for whatever comes next.

Biggest problem ... with what tools does NIU WBB recruit? MBB can offer a chance to be part of The Big Rebuild. WBB ... more of the same? Sad when some of us are already thinking "wait until next year" just 9 games in.

If it doesn’t get postponed or canceled, women are playing Ball State Wednesday at 6:00 pm. Live and in color on ESPN3.

“ I question whether fundamentals are stressed in practice. Northern should not hit less than 80-85% of freethrows on a bad day. If net aiming isn't working, use the backboard. No points for style.”. Wow PK. Advocating banking free throws suggest a severe lack of basketball knowledge.

(01-03-2022 10:09 PM)huskies77 Wrote:  “ I question whether fundamentals are stressed in practice. Northern should not hit less than 80-85% of freethrows on a bad day. If net aiming isn't working, use the backboard. No points for style.”. Wow PK. Advocating banking free throws suggest a severe lack of basketball knowledge.

I've been over this before, but it's not that the team shoots poorly at FT. It's that there are 4 guys who are getting a ton of FTs and they a missing them at an unbelievable clip and bringing the entire team's average down. One of those guys is Hankerson who has always been a very good FT shooter. But he can't seem to shoot anything this year, including FTs. And he shoots a lot of them. Same with Crump who is shooting like 25% but since he maximizes every possession he has he takes a ton of shots and gets fouled a lot.

Honestly, if Burno just quit ever letting Crump play (as in...0 minutes a game), their FT and FG percentage would go up a ton.

Anyway, the culprits are Hankerson, Crump, Makuoi and one other (maybe Osten but I don't think he plays enough to make much of an impact but it might be him).

Outside of those 3 or 4, the rest of the team is pretty decent at FTs.

With that said, expecting 80-85% FT from any team is ridiculous.

There are only 6 teams in the nation that shoot 80+% from the line. VMI, Monmouth, Kent State, Montana, Colorado State, and Portland (and Portland is the best at 81.36%).

FWIW, a couple of those teams are pretty good and some of them are pretty bad.

I'd say, realistically, if you could get 75-78% from a team from the line, you'd be just fine. You're always going to have someone struggle which makes anything north of 80% almost unattainable for most teams.

Crazy stats on Free Throws in only a 10-game sample.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-basket...s/regular/
Crump at 38%. Most high school starters are over 65%.

(01-03-2022 10:09 PM)huskies77 Wrote:  “ I question whether fundamentals are stressed in practice. Northern should not hit less than 80-85% of freethrows on a bad day. If net aiming isn't working, use the backboard. No points for style.”. Wow PK. Advocating banking free throws suggest a severe lack of basketball knowledge.

I'm aware of the "problems" of banking a head-on shot but -- as cited -- I mentioned banking in the same point as practice/fundamentals. And then started mixing points. A "severe lack" of thinking before typing is the problem.

Banking is not a solution; it's a practice method used to clean up the shooter's motion, timing, muscle memory, etc., starting with simple aim. That's why it's used with kids just starting out so they understand the concept of freethrow shooting; the only goals are to get the ball above the rim and in the invisible "alley" between the left and right "sides" of the rim. If an "older" player is hitting 40% or so, they need a reset. I've been in practices where a coach tells a player "just aim for the backboard above the rim," then stands behind them until they get the aim right. Shot motion/distance is next. And then a ton of practice to develop muscle memory for net shooting.

Most of my "direct" experience in the past has been in practices, so what I see in games takes me back to that.

To Big Red ... I picked 80-85% because I've seen constant practice produce that level, in practice (we had "contests" where some guys hit 30-40 in a row). But in-game it can drop dramatically; switching from in-motion (most of the shooting) to "still" shots is difficult; different muscle memory. Familiar with drops to 55-60%.

(01-04-2022 12:42 AM)pvk75 Wrote:  

(01-03-2022 10:09 PM)huskies77 Wrote:  “ I question whether fundamentals are stressed in practice. Northern should not hit less than 80-85% of freethrows on a bad day. If net aiming isn't working, use the backboard. No points for style.”. Wow PK. Advocating banking free throws suggest a severe lack of basketball knowledge.

I'm aware of the "problems" of banking a head-on shot but -- as cited -- I mentioned banking in the same point as practice/fundamentals. And then started mixing points. A "severe lack" of thinking before typing is the problem.

Banking is not a solution; it's a practice method used to clean up the shooter's motion, timing, muscle memory, etc., starting with simple aim. That's why it's used with kids just starting out so they understand the concept of freethrow shooting; the only goals are to get the ball above the rim and in the invisible "alley" between the left and right "sides" of the rim. If an "older" player is hitting 40% or so, they need a reset. I've been in practices where a coach tells a player "just aim for the backboard above the rim," then stands behind them until they get the aim right. Shot motion/distance is next. And then a ton of practice to develop muscle memory for net shooting.

Most of my "direct" experience in the past has been in practices, so what I see in games takes me back to that.

To Big Red ... I picked 80-85% because I've seen constant practice produce that level, in practice (we had "contests" where some guys hit 30-40 in a row). But in-game it can drop dramatically; switching from in-motion (most of the shooting) to "still" shots is difficult; different muscle memory. Familiar with drops to 55-60%.

PK, I stand corrected and apologize for my poor assessment of your basketball acumen. You obviously know of what you speak. Thanks for educating me.

77 ... No need. You were right based on what I initially wrote. I sometimes get wordy, but in the wrong places, on wrong subjects. And I assume every reader knows what I mean. Bad habit.

Keep posting. We need all the Dog Pound(ers) we can get. This is our "clubhouse."

Wbb takes yet another L on the season. This time at home. Fought back from down big to make it into OT and then pffffffff.

This team can’t get out of its own way.

(01-06-2022 08:49 AM)62423dp Wrote:  Wbb takes yet another L on the season. This time at home. Fought back from down big to make it into OT and then pffffffff.

This team can’t get out of its own way.

....and on of all things----a put back off a rebound of missed free throw with one second left....NIU up one with two seconds left---Ball State misses a free throw to tie and gets the rebounds and puts it in to take the lead and the win.

(Note: did not see game; don't get ESPN3.)

Problem is depth/talent on bench. NIU listed 10 for the game, BallSt 11. Stats pretty even except one: BallSt got 28 points from its bench, NIU got 7. Continuing trend.

Northern plays Ohio-a, WMU-a and Toledo-H next three. In terms of overall record, Toledo and WMU are two of the top 3, and Ohio is in the middle of the pack. Right now, NIU is 11th overall.

The frustrating thing was our big went forward to rebound that missed FT instead of getting low And making hard contact with ball state kid. You check out their and you win the game. NIU had TWO timeouts left. Would’ve like to use one to emphasize BOX OUT and we win. Might’ve even “froze FT shooter’” although she missed both anyway. Tough loss after fighting all the way back.

(01-06-2022 10:14 AM)huskies77 Wrote:  The frustrating thing was our big went forward to rebound that missed FT instead of getting low And making hard contact with ball state kid. You check out their and you win the game. NIU had TWO timeouts left. Would’ve like to use one to emphasize BOX OUT and we win. Might’ve even “froze FT shooter’” although she missed both anyway. Tough loss after fighting all the way back.

Again, I didn't see the game, but from what you said ... and a good point ... fundamentals again. The BallSt player knew what she was going to do if she missed. NIU obviously didn't. NIU left with 1 sec; that ticks off at the in-bound catch. Makes me wonder what they do in practice.

Oh well. Tough(er) next 3 coming up.