So far this team isn't showing signs of getting better. Is this as good as it gets this year?

Okay, I'll start. So far Yasser has gotten better but I don't see him quickly becoming a game changer or offsetting the inside woes. Weber is a pleasant surprise and has gotten better since last year but seems to have plateaued over the season. I don't really see any more upside.

Judging by comments in the Asheville thread Oliver has already lost the fans, I hope he can keep the players on course.
I would hate to see mid-season defections or people quitting out of frustration. But this a ME first and NOW generation so guess
we will see. I can see a couple already that wouldn't surprise me if they split.

I think I already gave my opinion on it maybe two weeks ago or more. I just don't see much capability of significant upside. Sure, they'll win some games, but won't likely be dominating *anybody* not named Lenoir-Rhyne or Catawba. Even our guard play, stellar up until recently, seems to have gotten mired in the mud. We just don't have the horses, and I'll again repeat my opinion that Oliver should have put one more body on the (active) bench. That view was suspecting maybe an injury at some point, but with Adheke's departure, it sure would have been nice now. Worse.................the "chemistry", something I've always commented on on this board, is lacking. It's not terrible, but it's not positive enough to be an additive force.

All this shouldn't be surprising - but maybe the degree to which it's turning out is. New coach, new culture, new teammates, etc. I personally think Oliver hasn't yet found his sweet spot, mojo, m.o., regimen, whatever. He's still trying to figure it out, too, altho he'd never say that, and may not even realize it himself. All my opinion, of course.

I would pull the redshirt off Nunez and get him in rotation ASAP so we can have some chance at competing by 2nd half of conference and not throw Charlie Weber to the sharks in the SoCon tournament. ETSU basketball is boring again! Just like that. Fans are capricious. Attendance has already reflected low expectations to begin, and it will continue to drop off while the Bucs are losing. The only thing in the game day experience worth noting right now is the concessions and booze. I can get food and beer anywhere else I want!

12-15-15: ETSU at UNC-Asheville —- UNCA 84, ETSU 64 — Coach Steve Forbes first season. What was being said back then after that game? It’s been pointed out elsewhere that they finished 24-12 the 2015-16 season. I’m still mad, but need to get a grip. Half the rest of DI schools will chalk up a loss today/tonight — and looking at the ESPN scoreboard, ETSU ain’t alone this Saturday.

(12-18-2021 07:01 PM)Buc66 Wrote:  12-15-15: ETSU at UNC-Asheville —- UNCA 84, ETSU 64 — Coach Steve Forbes first season. What was being said back then after that game? It’s been pointed out elsewhere that they finished 24-12 the 2016-16 season. I’m still mad, but need to get a grip. Half the rest of DI schools will chalk up a loss today/tonight — and looking at the ESPN scoreboard, ETSU ain’t alone this Saturday.

I was at that game. In the 2016 season I felt the UNCA loss was an anomaly. Doesn't have the same feel this year. Hopefully I am wrong, I bleed blue and gold.

(12-18-2021 07:17 PM)BucDoctor Wrote:  

(12-18-2021 07:01 PM)Buc66 Wrote:  12-15-15: ETSU at UNC-Asheville —- UNCA 84, ETSU 64 — Coach Steve Forbes first season. What was being said back then after that game? It’s been pointed out elsewhere that they finished 24-12 the 2015-16 season. I’m still mad, but need to get a grip. Half the rest of DI schools will chalk up a loss today/tonight — and looking at the ESPN scoreboard, ETSU ain’t alone this Saturday.

BucDoctor was at that game. In the 2016 season I felt the UNCA loss was an anomaly. Doesn't have the same feel this year. Hopefully I am wrong, I bleed blue and gold.

“As good as it gets” is tough to tell because we have the chance to improve greatly during the academic break where the team isn’t restricted in the number of hours, etc. I am pretty pessimistic about the lineup of the veterans, but have young players with some upside. Comparing this team to Forbes’ first year is like night and day. That team had playmakers, this team is full of role players. And we can’t fix our depth issue this season.

Oliver hasn’t lost me. He has time to turn this season into a middle tier conference team, and he deserves the chance to get some new players in.

You could make an argument that the team Oliver inherited was a lot better off player talent wise compared to Forbes first year. The cupboard was not bare this year when Oliver came in. Sloan, the Brewer brothers, Adheke, and Vonnie (who has regressed greatly under Oliver) is not a bad core to build a team around. Heck Oliver was basically handed the majority of a team that finished tied for fourth last year. I see a lot of people making excuses for Oliver “ it’s his first year.” “He needs time to get his guys in.” “He’s building.” To me this is unacceptable. Forbes came in his first year and brought in guys that let us compete immediately (Guyn, Cromer, Bello) and guys like (Glass, and HMP) who had to sit out but gave us something to look forward too and pointed us in the right direction for years to come. That first year team with Forbes played with fire and passion as well, and this years team as many have noted looks like they are just out there to be there.

This current squad reached their peak with that early tournament win. It’s hard to look at the schedule and find another guaranteed win.

You could make an argument that the team Oliver inherited was a lot better off player talent wise compared to Forbes first year. The cupboard was not bare this year when Oliver came in. Sloan, the Brewer brothers, Adheke, and Vonnie (who has regressed greatly under Oliver) is not a bad core to build a team around. Heck Oliver was basically handed the majority of a team that finished tied for fourth last year. I see a lot of people making excuses for Oliver “ it’s his first year.” “He needs time to get his guys in.” “He’s building.” To me this is unacceptable. Forbes came in his first year and brought in guys that let us compete immediately (Guyn, Cromer, Bello) and guys like (Glass, and HMP) who had to sit out but gave us something to look forward too and pointed us in the right direction for years to come. That first year team with Forbes played with fire and passion as well, and this years team as many have noted looks like they are just out there to be there.

This current squad reached their peak with that early tournament win. It’s hard to look at the schedule and find another guaranteed win.

(12-18-2021 11:09 PM)Chicago_Buc Wrote:  Heck Oliver was basically handed the majority of a team that finished tied for fourth last year. I see a lot of people making excuses for Oliver “ it’s his first year.” “He needs time to get his guys in.” “He’s building.” To me this is unacceptable.

Wow, he inherited a team that TIED for fourth place (!3-12, 8-7) You are right sounds like a loaded team. Well sounds like you are out since you can't accept it and this the current reality, Guess you will jump back on the bandwagon when they start winning again and/or get of Oliver. Seya

(12-18-2021 11:38 PM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  

(12-18-2021 11:09 PM)Chicago_Buc Wrote:  Heck Oliver was basically handed the majority of a team that finished tied for fourth last year. I see a lot of people making excuses for Oliver “ it’s his first year.” “He needs time to get his guys in.” “He’s building.” To me this is unacceptable.

Wow, he inherited a team that TIED for fourth place (!3-12, 8-7) You are right sounds like a loaded team. Well sounds like you are out since you can't accept it and this the current reality, Guess you will jump back on the bandwagon when they start winning again and/or get of Oliver. Seya

Actually I will continue to watch the team win or lose. Just because I don’t like our current reality doesn’t mean my support for the players will waver. I’ll continue to support the guys who made a decision to play for our university despite anything that transpires.

I think if you want to questions anyone’s loyalty to the players, basketball program or university is should be to the donors and other “supporters” in the region who caused this reality in the first place. By making a mess of the program because they disagreed with the players rights and coaches decision to support his guys. (Not to get political at all because I’m not concerned with that aspect of it.) But all these people that say they love the program and donate money to it or the exact ones that destroyed it, and where are they now? Certainly not at the games showing support attendance has been abysmal as noted multiple times on the board. Also do you think the big donors will continue to donate as generously in the years to come if the program continues its trajectory? So we bent the knee to appease a few vocal “supporters” but in return we’ve lost them anyway and have to build our program back from the ground up.

So I’ll admit I’ve been rough on Oliver, and I’m not his biggest fan so far with what he’s done. But I’m more mad about the program and where we are because of a few people got their feeling hurt over taking a knee. I’m obviously not talking to everyone. I know there’s a lot of people out there that love ETSU basketball myself included. I just wished people realized you can still love something and show support and not agree with every aspect of it.

Perhaps the best we can hope for this year is a middle-of-conference performance. But I don't know. Perhaps Coach Oliver can make some calls over Christmas and get some tips from past mentors. Although he's been in the coaching business for a while, this is his first as a head coach.

We've got a good roster capable of better performance; let's see if Coach can find the right adjustments.

The way our roster's structured, we need to get all we can out of the upperclassmen. The Brewer brothers are pulling their weight offensively. David's got to get his shooting back. We need much more on-court contribution from Vonnie; I think he can have some big influence on the defensive end in particular. And I hope the upperclassmen will decide that they need to focus on defense.

(12-19-2021 01:19 AM)Chicago_Buc Wrote:  

(12-18-2021 11:38 PM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  

(12-18-2021 11:09 PM)Chicago_Buc Wrote:  Heck Oliver was basically handed the majority of a team that finished tied for fourth last year. I see a lot of people making excuses for Oliver “ it’s his first year.” “He needs time to get his guys in.” “He’s building.” To me this is unacceptable.

Wow, he inherited a team that TIED for fourth place (!3-12, 8-7) You are right sounds like a loaded team. Well sounds like you are out since you can't accept it and this the current reality, Guess you will jump back on the bandwagon when they start winning again and/or get of Oliver. Seya

Actually I will continue to watch the team win or lose. Just because I don’t like our current reality doesn’t mean my support for the players will waver. I’ll continue to support the guys who made a decision to play for our university despite anything that transpires.

I think if you want to questions anyone’s loyalty to the players, basketball program or university is should be to the donors and other “supporters” in the region who caused this reality in the first place. By making a mess of the program because they disagreed with the players rights and coaches decision to support his guys. (Not to get political at all because I’m not concerned with that aspect of it.) But all these people that say they love the program and donate money to it or the exact ones that destroyed it, and where are they now? Certainly not at the games showing support attendance has been abysmal as noted multiple times on the board. Also do you think the big donors will continue to donate as generously in the years to come if the program continues its trajectory? So we bent the knee to appease a few vocal “supporters” but in return we’ve lost them anyway and have to build our program back from the ground up.

So I’ll admit I’ve been rough on Oliver, and I’m not his biggest fan so far with what he’s done. But I’m more mad about the program and where we are because of a few people got their feeling hurt over taking a knee. I’m obviously not talking to everyone. I know there’s a lot of people out there that love ETSU basketball myself included. I just wished people realized you can still love something and show support and not agree with every aspect of it.

''But all these people that say they love the program and donate money to it or the exact ones that destroyed it, and where are they now?''

We're still here, and I guess we're the root cause of all your life's frustrations. I also appreciate the fact your rant steered clear of politics. I'm befuddled at those who continually believe anyone that takes a position opposite their logic, is inherently flawed.

(12-19-2021 08:27 AM)squeak Wrote:  

(12-19-2021 01:19 AM)Chicago_Buc Wrote:  

(12-18-2021 11:38 PM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  

(12-18-2021 11:09 PM)Chicago_Buc Wrote:  Heck Oliver was basically handed the majority of a team that finished tied for fourth last year. I see a lot of people making excuses for Oliver “ it’s his first year.” “He needs time to get his guys in.” “He’s building.” To me this is unacceptable.

Wow, he inherited a team that TIED for fourth place (!3-12, 8-7) You are right sounds like a loaded team. Well sounds like you are out since you can't accept it and this the current reality, Guess you will jump back on the bandwagon when they start winning again and/or get of Oliver. Seya

Actually I will continue to watch the team win or lose. Just because I don’t like our current reality doesn’t mean my support for the players will waver. I’ll continue to support the guys who made a decision to play for our university despite anything that transpires.

I think if you want to questions anyone’s loyalty to the players, basketball program or university is should be to the donors and other “supporters” in the region who caused this reality in the first place. By making a mess of the program because they disagreed with the players rights and coaches decision to support his guys. (Not to get political at all because I’m not concerned with that aspect of it.) But all these people that say they love the program and donate money to it or the exact ones that destroyed it, and where are they now? Certainly not at the games showing support attendance has been abysmal as noted multiple times on the board. Also do you think the big donors will continue to donate as generously in the years to come if the program continues its trajectory? So we bent the knee to appease a few vocal “supporters” but in return we’ve lost them anyway and have to build our program back from the ground up.

So I’ll admit I’ve been rough on Oliver, and I’m not his biggest fan so far with what he’s done. But I’m more mad about the program and where we are because of a few people got their feeling hurt over taking a knee. I’m obviously not talking to everyone. I know there’s a lot of people out there that love ETSU basketball myself included. I just wished people realized you can still love something and show support and not agree with every aspect of it.

''But all these people that say they love the program and donate money to it or the exact ones that destroyed it, and where are they now?''

We're still here, and I guess we're the root cause of all your life's frustrations. I also appreciate the fact your rant steered clear of politics. I'm befuddled at those who continually believe anyone that takes a position opposite their logic, is inherently flawed.

''But all these people that say they love the program and donate money to it or the exact ones that destroyed it, and where are they now?''

What kind of an asinine comment is that? Come on. Those who actually love ETSU and the basketball program would have never dragged politics into it in the first place — no matter which side of the issue they were on because they would have had the foresight to foresee the only possible outcome — harm to ETSU as an institution and harm to the basketball program, which is exactly what happened.

(12-19-2021 10:33 AM)Buc66 Wrote:  We're still here, and I guess we're the root cause of all your life's frustrations. I also appreciate the fact your rant steered clear of politics. I'm befuddled at those who continually believe anyone that takes a position opposite their logic, is inherently flawed.

[/quote]

I don't think their logic is flawed because it is the opposite of mine. I don't care if anyone agrees with me, you don't know me or have any reason to respect my opinions, I don't hold that against you, I don't respect anyone else's on this board for the same reason, don't know you.
But I find funny (and like to point it out) all of these declarations made as if fact.
Oliver wasn't hired to win just because he was a "safe" choice (I read that He was African American) He will be gone in a few years and Sander/Carter will go get someone who can win.
He didn't recruit the WAY I wanted and the way Forbes did so therefore he is wrong.
FYI he did try and bring in transfers, including lots of big men. Might be a tough sale with the **** show he inherited. Hey, come play in front of these racist rednecks for the last year or two of your career while I try and pull this back together.
That is for sure how ETSU was being portrayed in the media all over the country.
I guess he should have just snapped his fingers and magically made all these wishes come true instead of working with what he has to build something.

Yeah I am not happy with the last couple of games and have lowered expectations for this year.

(12-18-2021 05:35 PM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  Judging by comments in the Asheville thread Oliver has already lost the fans, I hope he can keep the players on course.
I would hate to see mid-season defections or people quitting out of frustration. But this a ME first and NOW generation so guess
we will see. I can see a couple already that wouldn't surprise me if they split.

Since I have seen so much of it I will indulge in a prediction bit of speculation of my own tooa bit. I would be surprised if the Brewer brothers return for their final season. Wow, that was fun,, kind of freeing. I want to do it again...

Id like to look on the positive side. We are in a learning and adapting stage. And not far from success. Im giving this team time to find themselves. Have faith in our talent. Go Bucs