(12-20-2021 03:04 PM)bullet Wrote:  One thing a split might help is the scholarship limits. Let schools figure out their Title IX compliance instead of having more women's scholarships for the same sports.
There are more for women's basketball than men's, women's track than men's, women's golf than men's, etc.

Not sure how a split changes the math of "women don't play football". So if you're obligated to split athletic scholarships 50-50, and you're giving out 40 or 60 or 85 football scholarships................

EDIT: I think I get what you're saying now. If South Carolina wants to give the entire softball team full rides while women's soccer splits 20 schollies, while North Carolina prefers to give the entire women's soccer team full rides and softball splits 20 schollies, that's not the NCAA's business anymore?

(12-20-2021 02:28 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 02:25 PM)DawgNBama Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 10:27 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 09:21 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  They are talking about a split for all sports

Not really. The split talk is all about football and men's basketball. Nothing else makes any money, so you can leave that amateur and it's fine.

Quote: which will never happen because it will kill certain sports where there are not as many programs. Big 10, Big 12 and PAC 12 have affiliates for other sports like wrestling, LAX and the likes. Plus, you have schools bunch together with FCS, non football schools, D2 and some D3 schools for a single sport conferences like gymnastics, wrestling, water sports, fencing, etc. Men and Women's hockey would be boring if there are a split between the P5 and the rest.

P5 would think it is fine, but I am saying that the G5 might have an issue.

I don't expect anyone to ask their opinion.

That's not what I am saying. I'm saying that the G5 could do to the P5 in non revenue sports what the P5 is wanting to do to the G5 in revenue sports

Basically, what you would have is an entirely split NCAA: the P5 would approve of part of the split but not all of it (non-revenue being split would be an issue for the P5 due to distance concerns), and vice versa for the G5 (revenue being split for the G5 would be an issue due to obvious reasons).
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(12-20-2021 10:27 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 09:21 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  They are talking about a split for all sports

Not really. The split talk is all about football and men's basketball. Nothing else makes any money, so you can leave that amateur and it's fine.

Quote: which will never happen because it will kill certain sports where there are not as many programs. Big 10, Big 12 and PAC 12 have affiliates for other sports like wrestling, LAX and the likes. Plus, you have schools bunch together with FCS, non football schools, D2 and some D3 schools for a single sport conferences like gymnastics, wrestling, water sports, fencing, etc. Men and Women's hockey would be boring if there are a split between the P5 and the rest.

The Alston case and the NIL applies to all sports and not football and basketball.

(12-20-2021 04:25 PM)DawgNBama Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 02:28 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 02:25 PM)DawgNBama Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 10:27 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 09:21 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  They are talking about a split for all sports

Not really. The split talk is all about football and men's basketball. Nothing else makes any money, so you can leave that amateur and it's fine.

Quote: which will never happen because it will kill certain sports where there are not as many programs. Big 10, Big 12 and PAC 12 have affiliates for other sports like wrestling, LAX and the likes. Plus, you have schools bunch together with FCS, non football schools, D2 and some D3 schools for a single sport conferences like gymnastics, wrestling, water sports, fencing, etc. Men and Women's hockey would be boring if there are a split between the P5 and the rest.

P5 would think it is fine, but I am saying that the G5 might have an issue.

I don't expect anyone to ask their opinion.

That's not what I am saying. I'm saying that the G5 could do to the P5 in non revenue sports what the P5 is wanting to do to the G5 in revenue sports

Basically, what you would have is an entirely split NCAA: the P5 would approve of part of the split but not all of it (non-revenue being split would be an issue for the P5 due to distance concerns), and vice versa for the G5 (revenue being split for the G5 would be an issue due to obvious reasons).
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I don't think I follow you here. The P5 have the money to ship their non-revenue sports around the country to play each other if that's what they have to do. It would be cheaper for the Ohio State womens' soccer team to play MAC schools than PAC schools, but they can afford it.

Not sure if this is unusual, I just looked up the OSU women's soccer schedule and they only play 1 non-conference road game, @ BYU.
Let's see what a less prosperous Big Ten school does, like Indiana.
Road games @ Louisville, Notre Dame, Memphis, Kansas State.

So if they went to a P5 only schedule, they'd have fewer home games against reasonably local opposition, and more road trips to other P5s to fill out non-conference schedules.

I don't think that is what's going to make the P5 think twice about a split.

(12-20-2021 05:05 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 10:27 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 09:21 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  They are talking about a split for all sports

Not really. The split talk is all about football and men's basketball. Nothing else makes any money, so you can leave that amateur and it's fine.

Quote: which will never happen because it will kill certain sports where there are not as many programs. Big 10, Big 12 and PAC 12 have affiliates for other sports like wrestling, LAX and the likes. Plus, you have schools bunch together with FCS, non football schools, D2 and some D3 schools for a single sport conferences like gymnastics, wrestling, water sports, fencing, etc. Men and Women's hockey would be boring if there are a split between the P5 and the rest.

The Alston case and the NIL applies to all sports and not football and basketball.

But no other sports produce significant revenue, so what difference does it make? Sure you have a handful of gymnasts etc getting NIL money, but there isn't a pie for the athletes to demand a piece of, outside of football and basketball.

(12-20-2021 03:23 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 03:04 PM)bullet Wrote:  One thing a split might help is the scholarship limits. Let schools figure out their Title IX compliance instead of having more women's scholarships for the same sports.
There are more for women's basketball than men's, women's track than men's, women's golf than men's, etc.

Not sure how a split changes the math of "women don't play football". So if you're obligated to split athletic scholarships 50-50, and you're giving out 40 or 60 or 85 football scholarships................

EDIT: I think I get what you're saying now. If South Carolina wants to give the entire softball team full rides while women's soccer splits 20 schollies, while North Carolina prefers to give the entire women's soccer team full rides and softball splits 20 schollies, that's not the NCAA's business anymore?

Right.
If Rice wants to give 6 golf scholarships to men (instead of the 4.5 limit) to match the 6 they are giving to women, that's fine. Now maybe that means they need 1-2 less scholarships in men's track. But they allocate it instead of having the NCAA set lower standards for scholarhips for men's sports in order to offset football.

(12-20-2021 05:07 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 05:05 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 10:27 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 09:21 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  They are talking about a split for all sports

Not really. The split talk is all about football and men's basketball. Nothing else makes any money, so you can leave that amateur and it's fine.

Quote: which will never happen because it will kill certain sports where there are not as many programs. Big 10, Big 12 and PAC 12 have affiliates for other sports like wrestling, LAX and the likes. Plus, you have schools bunch together with FCS, non football schools, D2 and some D3 schools for a single sport conferences like gymnastics, wrestling, water sports, fencing, etc. Men and Women's hockey would be boring if there are a split between the P5 and the rest.

The Alston case and the NIL applies to all sports and not football and basketball.

But no other sports produce significant revenue, so what difference does it make? Sure you have a handful of gymnasts etc getting NIL money, but there isn't a pie for the athletes to demand a piece of, outside of football and basketball.

https://swimswam.com/university-of-texas...l-program/
This is a University of Texas fund with an initial committment of $10 million for NIL deals for ALL sports.

It will not be confined to football and basketball.

(12-20-2021 07:18 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 05:07 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 05:05 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 10:27 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-20-2021 09:21 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  They are talking about a split for all sports

Not really. The split talk is all about football and men's basketball. Nothing else makes any money, so you can leave that amateur and it's fine.

Quote: which will never happen because it will kill certain sports where there are not as many programs. Big 10, Big 12 and PAC 12 have affiliates for other sports like wrestling, LAX and the likes. Plus, you have schools bunch together with FCS, non football schools, D2 and some D3 schools for a single sport conferences like gymnastics, wrestling, water sports, fencing, etc. Men and Women's hockey would be boring if there are a split between the P5 and the rest.

The Alston case and the NIL applies to all sports and not football and basketball.

But no other sports produce significant revenue, so what difference does it make? Sure you have a handful of gymnasts etc getting NIL money, but there isn't a pie for the athletes to demand a piece of, outside of football and basketball.

https://swimswam.com/university-of-texas...l-program/
This is a University of Texas fund with an initial committment of $10 million for NIL deals for ALL sports.

It will not be confined to football and basketball.

Athletes from all sports are eligible. That doesn't mean many of those outside the revenue sports will get significant payments. I'm not sure how Title IX could require gender or sport equity for NIL deals since the money isn't coming from the schools.