(12-14-2021 11:01 AM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  The upside for JMU's Sun Belt basketball attendance will be ODU, the downside will be almost everyone else. In the last non-COVID year, the CAA averaged 2,400 per game, the Sun Belt averaged 13% less at 2,100 per game. It is not a basketball league.
App State avg 1000, Coastal Carolina avg 1200, Ga State 1700, Ga Southern 1900. They can't even get fans at home. Surely, their fans won't attend a road game at JMU.

Marshall avg 6,000 which is good for a mid-major. Still it is 4 1/2 hours away, which is prohibitive for most college basketball fans. I'm sure there are some Marshall alums in the valley that may give a little uptick for games in the AUBC.

OOC scheduling will be critical to get regional D-1 teams that resonate with our fans and that includes former CAA peers. It is no different than JMU playing teams that left the CAA long ago. They are still good games. Richmond, George Mason, ODU, VCU all bailed on the CAA. Should we have stopped playing them forever since they hurt our feelings? Even ECU and Navy make sense to play as former conference mates with a history and geographical proximity.

Overall, college basketball attendance has declined more than 20% since its highwater mark in 1991. That is not happy news for us, but it is the reality. I'm happy with where attendance is at in year 2 of the AUBC and don't really expect it to get much better long term.

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketba...ndance.pdf

Win and attendance will take care of itself in the 5K range. I quite frankly could give a rip about visitor attendance, barring it being a big name that aint gonna move the needle. We can get that with any of the other D1 schools in VA. There is absolutely no need to throw a bone to existing/current CAA schools just because we want to be nice guys.....that ship kinda sailed a month ago when each and everyone of them let it be known how they feel about JMU student athletes. This is NOT 13 to 20 years ago when this was a more common practice.....THE CAA is literally the only conference in American that in 2021 still wants to be petty and punish student athletes. So why the hell would JMU want to schedule them period......there are plenty of other schools in the mid-atlantic. If you want to see W&M play so badly buy a ticket and go to Williamsburg.

5 years ago there was talk about, and JMU purchased the land for, building a new arena on the south end of town off exit 243. Thank goodness we got what we did where we did.

(12-14-2021 07:36 AM)CarRamrod Wrote:  +1, it's a newer trend, but it isn't going away anytime soon. Some need to stop acting like it's a JMU thing, all peer institutions are doing this. It makes scheduling much easier when a team 10 miles away can come fill out a week we are having trouble finding a home game. Let's move this along, we still have 30 games against good competition to figure out how good we are, 1 game is not a big deal.

That makes sense, but what about some of the other schools in the region? VMI would probably make for a decent draw, or maybe Longwood?

(12-14-2021 01:22 PM)Deez Nuts Wrote:  5 years ago there was talk about, and JMU purchased the land for, building a new arena on the south end of town off exit 243. Thank goodness we got what we did where we did.

hockey! hockey!

(12-14-2021 12:01 PM)ShadyP Wrote:  

(12-14-2021 11:01 AM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  The upside for JMU's Sun Belt basketball attendance will be ODU, the downside will be almost everyone else. In the last non-COVID year, the CAA averaged 2,400 per game, the Sun Belt averaged 13% less at 2,100 per game. It is not a basketball league.
App State avg 1000, Coastal Carolina avg 1200, Ga State 1700, Ga Southern 1900. They can't even get fans at home. Surely, their fans won't attend a road game at JMU.

Marshall avg 6,000 which is good for a mid-major. Still it is 4 1/2 hours away, which is prohibitive for most college basketball fans. I'm sure there are some Marshall alums in the valley that may give a little uptick for games in the AUBC.

OOC scheduling will be critical to get regional D-1 teams that resonate with our fans and that includes former CAA peers. It is no different than JMU playing teams that left the CAA long ago. They are still good games. Richmond, George Mason, ODU, VCU all bailed on the CAA. Should we have stopped playing them forever since they hurt our feelings? Even ECU and Navy make sense to play as former conference mates with a history and geographical proximity.

Overall, college basketball attendance has declined more than 20% since its highwater mark in 1991. That is not happy news for us, but it is the reality. I'm happy with where attendance is at in year 2 of the AUBC and don't really expect it to get much better long term.

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketba...ndance.pdf

There is absolutely no need to throw a bone to existing/current CAA schools just because we want to be nice guys.....that ship kinda sailed a month ago when each and everyone of them let it be known how they feel about JMU student athletes. This is NOT 13 to 20 years ago when this was a more common practice.....THE CAA is literally the only conference in American that in 2021 still wants to be petty and punish student athletes. So why the hell would JMU want to schedule them period......there are plenty of other schools in the mid-atlantic. If you want to see W&M play so badly buy a ticket and go to Williamsburg.

You're right. Potential opponents run the gamut from cupcakes to "maybe we keep it within 15 points".

(12-14-2021 02:02 PM)94computerguy Wrote:  

(12-14-2021 01:22 PM)Deez Nuts Wrote:  5 years ago there was talk about, and JMU purchased the land for, building a new arena on the south end of town off exit 243. Thank goodness we got what we did where we did.

hockey! hockey!

Please!!!

(12-14-2021 01:22 PM)Deez Nuts Wrote:  5 years ago there was talk about, and JMU purchased the land for, building a new arena on the south end of town off exit 243. Thank goodness we got what we did where we did.

This is where the pitch for the JMU cricket team will be located.

(12-14-2021 02:02 PM)94computerguy Wrote:  

(12-14-2021 01:22 PM)Deez Nuts Wrote:  5 years ago there was talk about, and JMU purchased the land for, building a new arena on the south end of town off exit 243. Thank goodness we got what we did where we did.

hockey! hockey!

that would be too amazing to actually happen.

If JMU were to add an ice hockey team, assuming it would be fully funded like all of our sports, it would add 18 scholarships for men and/or women. The issue is the costs associated with the sport.

(12-15-2021 08:29 AM)AssyrianDuke Wrote:  If JMU were to add an ice hockey team, assuming it would be fully funded like all of our sports, it would add 18 scholarships for men and/or women. The issue is the costs associated with the sport.

Yes, seems unlikely given all the other expenses of moving to fbs near term.

What would be more realistic would be a hockey rink for intramural and club level teams, then maybe 10 years later it could become a varsity team.

Even that might need outside support if it counts as an athletics cost. JB said there are a lot of other projects on the board including improved softball facilities and overhaul of the convo to relocate some sports from godwin. Plus I would think a new IPF at some point.

Ice Hockey would be unlikely. Granted, something like MLAX would be far lower expenses, men's ice hockey already has an outstanding club that plays in a D2 conference against teams like UVA, WVU, UMD, Duke, NCSt, etc. The issue is that moving up doesn't include any conferencemates and there's no programs even close to us. We'd have to go to Penn St to hit the closest one (I think). There's a ton in New York and the rest of NE and then over in Ohio and the Midwest. Ice Hockey just doesn't make sense as a D1 program for JMU like archery and gymnastics didn't - not many D1 programs and none near us. The difference is that ice hockey is purely location based...we're in the wrong part of the country for it.

(12-14-2021 06:35 PM)DukeQuin Wrote:  

(12-14-2021 01:22 PM)Deez Nuts Wrote:  5 years ago there was talk about, and JMU purchased the land for, building a new arena on the south end of town off exit 243. Thank goodness we got what we did where we did.

This is where the pitch for the JMU cricket team will be located.

Nope, it's where the second H'burg HS will be located. Terrible place for a JMU facility, IMHO. Once the Atlantic Union idea took hold, the land became available to an interested buyer, which turned out to be the City.

(12-14-2021 07:08 AM)Duke Dawg Wrote:  

(12-13-2021 09:52 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  CAA > Sun Belt basketball as far as the strength of the conference but I don't know if I'd agree that the Sun Belt won't be better for attendance. Marshall, App State, and especially ODU are definitely games with more reason to care about the opponent than probably any CAA team and that'll become more and more true as the rivalries intensify through all sports including football. Coastal, GS, GSU I would think are at least on par with all CAA basketball teams except W&M(which you could argue W&M over Marshall/App for now) as far as how much JMU fans will care.

Other than that though, definitely agree with Hart overall. Hope we don't see more than one non-D1 game a year anymore and hope we can put together an attractive OOC schedule. Continuing to improve on the court should certainly help.

you will have an extremely difficult time finding ANY non-P7 that doesn't play at least one non-D1 game.

EVERYONE does.

the only reason we had 2 this year was because of a last minute bailout by a school. Can't remember if it was Fordham or Florida. We had no choice on the 2nd one.

but i can't absolutely guarantee you will see Bridgewater or EMU again next year.....and the year after....and the year after....and so on and so on.

Nope, As an example, VCU and the ticks didn't play non-DI schools this season. VCU hasn't played a DIII in 3 or 4 years. With the "new NET" the scheduling philosophy has changed for those mid's that have aspirations to make the NCAAT. Throwing away games is not how a program builds a resume.

(12-15-2021 01:30 PM)RamDawg Wrote:  

(12-14-2021 07:08 AM)Duke Dawg Wrote:  

(12-13-2021 09:52 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  CAA > Sun Belt basketball as far as the strength of the conference but I don't know if I'd agree that the Sun Belt won't be better for attendance. Marshall, App State, and especially ODU are definitely games with more reason to care about the opponent than probably any CAA team and that'll become more and more true as the rivalries intensify through all sports including football. Coastal, GS, GSU I would think are at least on par with all CAA basketball teams except W&M(which you could argue W&M over Marshall/App for now) as far as how much JMU fans will care.

Other than that though, definitely agree with Hart overall. Hope we don't see more than one non-D1 game a year anymore and hope we can put together an attractive OOC schedule. Continuing to improve on the court should certainly help.

you will have an extremely difficult time finding ANY non-P7 that doesn't play at least one non-D1 game.

EVERYONE does.

the only reason we had 2 this year was because of a last minute bailout by a school. Can't remember if it was Fordham or Florida. We had no choice on the 2nd one.

but i can't absolutely guarantee you will see Bridgewater or EMU again next year.....and the year after....and the year after....and so on and so on.

Nope, As an example, VCU and the ticks didn't play non-DI schools this season. VCU hasn't played a DIII in 3 or 4 years. With the "new NET" the scheduling philosophy has changed for those mid's that have aspirations to make the NCAAT. Throwing away games is not how a program builds a resume.

Oh great a BDK of basketball.

I believe non D-1 games were prohibited in the CAA when Bertovich was the associate commish for basketball. Of course that led to better games, better wins, and an increased RPI for the whole conference. Those were the glory days.

Of course you can argue that was the beginning of the end for the CAA as a good basketball conference when 2 teams made the Final Four in a span of 5 years then left the conference for greener pastures.

Perhaps the master strategy of Joey D is to not let any team or the overall league get too good, because then they will be attractive to other conferences and leave. Brilliant.

The Sun Belt is just as bad with basketball scheduling and it is shameful really.
Why don’t we start scheduling D-III games for baseball, soccer, softball, football ? If we are going to go soft, then be all-in on going soft

JMU can be better. JMU should be better. Even if the league doesn’t have a scheduling expectation.

Just my take, and I understand some fans are not into competition.

(12-15-2021 05:05 PM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  I believe non D-1 games were prohibited in the CAA when Bertovich was the associate commish for basketball. Of course that led to better games, better wins, and an increased RPI for the whole conference. Those were the glory days.

Of course you can argue that was the beginning of the end for the CAA as a good basketball conference when 2 teams made the Final Four in a span of 5 years then left the conference for greener pastures.

Perhaps the master strategy of Joey D is to not let any team or the overall league get too good, because then they will be attractive to other conferences and leave. Brilliant.

The Sun Belt is just as bad with basketball scheduling and it is shameful really.
Why don’t we start scheduling D-III games for baseball, soccer, softball, football ? If we are going to go soft, then be all-in on going soft

JMU can be better. JMU should be better. Even if the league doesn’t have a scheduling expectation.

Just my take, and I understand some fans are not into competition.

Seriously you are gonna 'bag' on the basketball team and all this coach and team have accomplished b/c they schedule a local D3 game each year for the community......the Carlow (sp?) game was an anomaly b/c Fordham (D1-A10) cancelled on us at the last minute.

It seems that you are making a mountain out of a mole-hill.....oh and by the way baseball and softball sorta do the same thing with the ncaa permitted scrimmages they are able to have in the fall, out of season. Again these D3/D2 games grew out of the ncaa banning exhibition games for college basketball of which back in the day JMU almost always had 1 in November.

It is like you are looking hard for something to gripe about. Here is a simple solution then, don't come and wactch that game.....pretend it does not exist.

(12-15-2021 04:38 PM)Dukester Wrote:  

(12-15-2021 01:30 PM)RamDawg Wrote:  

(12-14-2021 07:08 AM)Duke Dawg Wrote:  

(12-13-2021 09:52 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  CAA > Sun Belt basketball as far as the strength of the conference but I don't know if I'd agree that the Sun Belt won't be better for attendance. Marshall, App State, and especially ODU are definitely games with more reason to care about the opponent than probably any CAA team and that'll become more and more true as the rivalries intensify through all sports including football. Coastal, GS, GSU I would think are at least on par with all CAA basketball teams except W&M(which you could argue W&M over Marshall/App for now) as far as how much JMU fans will care.

Other than that though, definitely agree with Hart overall. Hope we don't see more than one non-D1 game a year anymore and hope we can put together an attractive OOC schedule. Continuing to improve on the court should certainly help.

you will have an extremely difficult time finding ANY non-P7 that doesn't play at least one non-D1 game.

EVERYONE does.

the only reason we had 2 this year was because of a last minute bailout by a school. Can't remember if it was Fordham or Florida. We had no choice on the 2nd one.

but i can't absolutely guarantee you will see Bridgewater or EMU again next year.....and the year after....and the year after....and so on and so on.

Nope, As an example, VCU and the ticks didn't play non-DI schools this season. VCU hasn't played a DIII in 3 or 4 years. With the "new NET" the scheduling philosophy has changed for those mid's that have aspirations to make the NCAAT. Throwing away games is not how a program builds a resume.

Oh great a BDK of basketball.

haha. wow. 2 teams.

i think the point is clear.

(12-16-2021 10:02 AM)ShadyP Wrote:  

(12-15-2021 05:05 PM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  I believe non D-1 games were prohibited in the CAA when Bertovich was the associate commish for basketball. Of course that led to better games, better wins, and an increased RPI for the whole conference. Those were the glory days.

Of course you can argue that was the beginning of the end for the CAA as a good basketball conference when 2 teams made the Final Four in a span of 5 years then left the conference for greener pastures.

Perhaps the master strategy of Joey D is to not let any team or the overall league get too good, because then they will be attractive to other conferences and leave. Brilliant.

The Sun Belt is just as bad with basketball scheduling and it is shameful really.
Why don’t we start scheduling D-III games for baseball, soccer, softball, football ? If we are going to go soft, then be all-in on going soft

JMU can be better. JMU should be better. Even if the league doesn’t have a scheduling expectation.

Just my take, and I understand some fans are not into competition.

Seriously you are gonna 'bag' on the basketball team and all this coach and team have accomplished b/c they schedule a local D3 game each year for the community......the Carlow (sp?) game was an anomaly b/c Fordham (D1-A10) cancelled on us at the last minute.

It seems that you are making a mountain out of a mole-hill.....oh and by the way baseball and softball sorta do the same thing with the ncaa permitted scrimmages they are able to have in the fall, out of season. Again these D3/D2 games grew out of the ncaa banning exhibition games for college basketball of which back in the day JMU almost always had 1 in November.

It is like you are looking hard for something to gripe about. Here is a simple solution then, don't come and wactch that game.....pretend it does not exist.

I don’t attend those games so I agree with you.
Seems like the closed scrimmage would work, no? Hold it preseason like they did with Richmond this year.

One thing that JMU has done in the past and could be repeated to get an adequate number of home games is to schedule an OOC team home and away in the same year.

I can’t remember what year, but JMU played Marshall home and away in the same season.

Maybe that is a good strategy for all the in state OOC teams. Then there is no arguing about who gets the home game first or if there is an exchange of money. George Mason, Richmond, VCU, Liberty, W&M. All would be great candidates for home and away in the same season.

Coach takes about next years schedule a little in his press conference. This much is known for next year… home vs Eastern Kentucky, home vs Penn, away vs UVA. That is a good start

(12-16-2021 01:52 PM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  

(12-16-2021 10:02 AM)ShadyP Wrote:  

(12-15-2021 05:05 PM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  I believe non D-1 games were prohibited in the CAA when Bertovich was the associate commish for basketball. Of course that led to better games, better wins, and an increased RPI for the whole conference. Those were the glory days.

Of course you can argue that was the beginning of the end for the CAA as a good basketball conference when 2 teams made the Final Four in a span of 5 years then left the conference for greener pastures.

Perhaps the master strategy of Joey D is to not let any team or the overall league get too good, because then they will be attractive to other conferences and leave. Brilliant.

The Sun Belt is just as bad with basketball scheduling and it is shameful really.
Why don’t we start scheduling D-III games for baseball, soccer, softball, football ? If we are going to go soft, then be all-in on going soft

JMU can be better. JMU should be better. Even if the league doesn’t have a scheduling expectation.

Just my take, and I understand some fans are not into competition.

Seriously you are gonna 'bag' on the basketball team and all this coach and team have accomplished b/c they schedule a local D3 game each year for the community......the Carlow (sp?) game was an anomaly b/c Fordham (D1-A10) cancelled on us at the last minute.

It seems that you are making a mountain out of a mole-hill.....oh and by the way baseball and softball sorta do the same thing with the ncaa permitted scrimmages they are able to have in the fall, out of season. Again these D3/D2 games grew out of the ncaa banning exhibition games for college basketball of which back in the day JMU almost always had 1 in November.

It is like you are looking hard for something to gripe about. Here is a simple solution then, don't come and wactch that game.....pretend it does not exist.

I don’t attend those games so I agree with you.
Seems like the closed scrimmage would work, no? Hold it preseason like they did with Richmond this year.

One thing that JMU has done in the past and could be repeated to get an adequate number of home games is to schedule an OOC team home and away in the same year.

I can’t remember what year, but JMU played Marshall home and away in the same season.

Maybe that is a good strategy for all the in state OOC teams. Then there is no arguing about who gets the home game first or if there is an exchange of money. George Mason, Richmond, VCU, Liberty, W&M. All would be great candidates for home and away in the same season.

Coach takes about next years schedule a little in his press conference. This much is known for next year… home vs Eastern Kentucky, home vs Penn, away vs UVA. That is a good start

Geez you are all about some W&M.......no way we should be playing W&M or any other full member CAA teams for years. OOC home and homes are rare and typically only used if both teams are in a bind.....I don't see that as a viable option and also gets kind of boring playing the same teams OOC too much, no variety.

Not sure about NET, but playing bad division 1 teams actually hurts you rpi, while playing division 2 or 3 doesn't affect it. If you want a tune up game or a game to kind of reset things after a hard road trip, I'm not convinced playing one against a lower division isn't the strategy.