..they need to join the MAC.
https://wmich.edu/news/2021/06/64413

I suppose MTSU is trying to just collect those exit fees and maybe in two years go into the MAC with WKU.

My side FU side hopes that WKU can wrangle someone else in the near future like an all-sport UmAss or UNI or MSU.

But while I'd be happy to watch MTSU get torched for trying to have their cake and eat it too, the reality is such decisions need to be made dispassionately. The MAC would be wise to sit down with MTSU if they are interested in the near future but that demand for something to show a decent tenure in the MAC is now stronger than it ever was.

The truth of the matter is that the MAC leadership over played their hand under the premise that Middle Tennessee was desperate. I do very much believe had the MAC not thrown a 20-year GOR demand out there, MT would have joined. I can appreciate the desire to want a solid long term commitment, but with so much uncertainty yet to come, there is no reason for schools outside of the P5 to sign a GOR for that long. The average annual value of the TV deal just isn't worth enough to request such a guarantee. Now, had ESPN offered the MAC a $5 to $7M per school pitch for MT and WKU joining that would have been a totally different story. But that's not what the reality was.

(11-14-2021 01:07 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  The truth of the matter is that the MAC leadership over played their hand under the premise that Middle Tennessee was desperate.

Overplaying their hand implies (1) The MAC needed this and (2) that the MAC asked for something whacky.

Neither of those are true.

1 - MAC didn't need this
2 - The GOR thing at this point is *STILL* nothing but a rumor, not a single detail is know.

Let me ask you if the MAC went to ESPN and said "what would this be worth" and ESPN said "well if you add these two teams and your conference signs a GOR for the remainder of this contract and the next (probably 12-15 years in total) would that be whacky?

I'm inclined to believe that if what the MAC was asking for was crazy than WKU would not have come out and said "we'll still join" when MTSU dropped out.

Quote: I do very much believe had the MAC not thrown a 20-year GOR demand out there, MT would have joined.

So do I. MT wanted to use the MAC as a motel six, *THATS* unreasonable.

Quote:I can appreciate the desire to want a solid long term commitment, but with so much uncertainty yet to come

So you appreciate it, but at the same time how dare the MAC ask?

Quote:there is no reason for schools outside of the P5 to sign a GOR for that long.

Unless that's the only way ESPN would give us the bump. Otherwise MTSU was asking for a warm bed for the night and a share of our pie with no real commitment at all.

Quote:The average annual value of the TV deal just isn't worth enough to request such a guarantee. Now, had ESPN offered the MAC a $5 to $7M per school pitch for MT and WKU joining that would have been a totally different story. But that's not what the reality was.

To be perfectly clear, you don't know that.

(11-14-2021 01:07 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  The truth of the matter is that the MAC leadership over played their hand under the premise that Middle Tennessee was desperate. I do very much believe had the MAC not thrown a 20-year GOR demand out there, MT would have joined. I can appreciate the desire to want a solid long term commitment, but with so much uncertainty yet to come, there is no reason for schools outside of the P5 to sign a GOR for that long. The average annual value of the TV deal just isn't worth enough to request such a guarantee. Now, had ESPN offered the MAC a $5 to $7M per school pitch for MT and WKU joining that would have been a totally different story. But that's not what the reality was.

That's your view. The MAC view is that this conference wants fully committed members over the long haul. No reason to expose yourself to be a stepping stone, hence the GOR. Besides, the MAC knows it has UMass on the ropes as the internal voices are gone from no way to it maybe ok. The Football fans are being vocal supporting a move to the MAC and we are wearing some basketball fans done. This is a big change for this poster.

Posted this in the "MTSU and WKU to MAC Gaining Traction" thread.

First posted this.

Quote:Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos
Post by Steve81 » Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:46 am

Regarding MAC basketball tonight
Akron lost with no time left against #17 Ohio State
Miami(OH) beat Georgia Tech.
Ohio beat an experienced Belmont team.
Toledo beat Valparaiso
Northern Illinois leads Washington by 5 with 7:28 minutes left.

Just saying there is good basketball in the MAC and the talent level is the same as the A10 except for the one top 25 team as the Bonnies.

We go all sports to the MAC, will donate at least $1,500 to the Gridiron club during this April's Flag Forward fund raising.

Quote:Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos
Post by TheInsider » Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:15 am

I agree with Steve's main point.. I don't care if the A10 is an 8 bid league if we finish 9th every year. When you look at the other sports, the MAC on average is just as good or better than the A10.. We wouldn't be sacrificing the competition level across the board for football.

Quote:Post by 69MG » Wed Nov 10, 2021 2:48 pm

I don't think I have commented on this subject, maybe once? I am not a big fan of the MAC as we don't have natural or regional ties with any of the schools. However, times have changed. When we declined to go all in, the A10 was a very strong BB conference and it would have been a major downgrade for BB to go there. There isn't nearly as much difference now in the 2 leagues for BB and the other sports are also relatively equal.

So as painful as it is for me to say this, if going to the MAC in all sports saves football I guess we should do it. I am a BB person far more than football and I will miss the A10. What I see, though, is the A10 losing some of the top teams to other conferences and that will hurt BB as well. That's my rationale for grudgingly saying yes to the MAC.

(11-14-2021 10:14 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(11-14-2021 01:07 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  The truth of the matter is that the MAC leadership over played their hand under the premise that Middle Tennessee was desperate.

Overplaying their hand implies (1) The MAC needed this and (2) that the MAC asked for something whacky.

Neither of those are true.

1 - MAC didn't need this
2 - The GOR thing at this point is *STILL* nothing but a rumor, not a single detail is know.

Let me ask you if the MAC went to ESPN and said "what would this be worth" and ESPN said "well if you add these two teams and your conference signs a GOR for the remainder of this contract and the next (probably 12-15 years in total) would that be whacky?

I'm inclined to believe that if what the MAC was asking for was crazy than WKU would not have come out and said "we'll still join" when MTSU dropped out.

Quote: I do very much believe had the MAC not thrown a 20-year GOR demand out there, MT would have joined.

So do I. MT wanted to use the MAC as a motel six, *THATS* unreasonable.

Quote:I can appreciate the desire to want a solid long term commitment, but with so much uncertainty yet to come

So you appreciate it, but at the same time how dare the MAC ask?

Quote:there is no reason for schools outside of the P5 to sign a GOR for that long.

Unless that's the only way ESPN would give us the bump. Otherwise MTSU was asking for a warm bed for the night and a share of our pie with no real commitment at all.

Quote:The average annual value of the TV deal just isn't worth enough to request such a guarantee. Now, had ESPN offered the MAC a $5 to $7M per school pitch for MT and WKU joining that would have been a totally different story. But that's not what the reality was.

To be perfectly clear, you don't know that.

You seem hostile and emotional about this. I addressed most of this in the response to the longer thread and explained what happened at MT. The GOR issue was real. Will just leave it at that. And all I was saying about that is that the University's leadership had some concerns about being forced into such a long term commitment given the impact it was expected to have on recruiting. I'm not saying the GOR was whacky. I don't think anyone said anything even remotely to that effect. Whether it is or isn't is a matter of perspective. I personally don't think it's crazy per se, but not sure why any program would do that for what could realistically be anticipated in terms of TV revenue. So, it just happened to be a deal breaker, because MT could get in the league and then it turn out to be a complete disaster for the school. I mean it could have been a match made in heaven. Who knows? But if it was not working out and recruiting was severely impeded to the point MT couldn't be competitive, a 20-year commitment is a long time to be in something.

(11-17-2021 08:43 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  You seem hostile and emotional about this.

You're misreading my post. I'm being more "matter of factly" about it.

Quote:I'm not saying the GOR was whacky.

Kind of what "over playing their hand" implies.

(11-14-2021 01:07 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  The truth of the matter is that the MAC leadership over played their hand

To suggest the MAC overplayed its hand is to imply that the MAC lost something here.

The MAC lost nothing.

Good luck to you in Conference USA. I'm sure your volleyball team will enjoy those flights to El Paso and Miami.