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MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
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VA49er Offline
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Post: #41
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-18-2021 11:34 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-12-2021 06:43 AM)miko33 Wrote:  In what world is having a concern over deflation the same as actually seeing deflation in the numbers? You cannot equate these 2 as being equivalent. Yes, there was a concern that we MIGHT slip into a period of deflation and therefore had a lax monetary policy with ultra low interest rates. That said, the YOY inflation numbers were still between 1% - 2%. The YOY inflation goal is around 2% - 2.5%. Deflation never actually happened and it was staved off with a low interest rate environment WITHOUT major gov't spending levels as proposed by the BBB and the "infrastructure +" bill (with some nastiness not related to infrastructure...).

All of the extreme stimulus spending the Biden admin proposes could do what you suggest IF there was sufficient supply of goods and services but the demand simply isn't there. We are not in that type of environment. We're in an environment where the demand is there, people are willing to spend their money and have been even before Biden's first bailout checks directly to the people. Unfortunately the supply of goods and services are not available in sufficient quantities to meet demand. Why is that? Some of this has to do with supply chain problems with China. Also, the vaccine mandates are causing workers to quit so that domestically we aren't providing the same goods and services (production and logistics). Also - specifically to hydrocarbons - there is zero incentive for oil and gas producers to produce more given the hostile environment the Biden admin has created over the future of most of our energy companies.

Given all of this, the grossly high inflation rates lead us to this conclusion: You do not inflate the money supply when the supply of goods and services have contracted.

I did not see this until now.

Inflation was below 0% for much of 2015. And has been well below the target 2% for well over a decade until this year. It will likely in my view revert back to this once the supply chain issues clear and we get through this oil price cycle. Here is what you're missing:

We're just getting through the worst world supply chain shock since probably WWII. This caused oil prices to effectively go negative last year. First time this has ever happened. This resulted in oil investment to halt. Once investment halts, it takes years for it to rebound, and thus explains why oil is in short supply now. This has a huge influence on inflation.

However, reality is the growing influence of technology on the supply chain is what has resulted in low inflation the past decade despite massive government deficits. Once supply chains clear up, we'll be right back in that environment, even more so since this pandemic has boosted the influence of technology.

I'd like to know what color the sky is in your world where simply catching up with the rest of the industrial world in infrastructure and government services (as provided in the infrastructure and BBB bills) is considered "extreme stimulus spending"?

If you're so worried about the deficit, then explain to me where Bush and Trump paid for their tax cut bills or unnecessary wars in Iraq and Afghanistan? Once you can explain that, then you MIGHT be able to complain about spending bills that simply catches us up with the rest of the world. But that complaining is only valid to the extent that it is "paid for" through a shell game that falls back on reversing unpaid for tax cuts from Republican administrations.

Nothing happens in a vacuum. What part of highest inflation in 30+ years do the D's and apparently you not understand? This is basic economics. There is no way to spend out of inflation. No way, ever. The simple truth is the D's do not care about inflation, they are infatuated with the midterms and they only way they think to do that is to pass some legislation they can sell to their constituents back home. For one, they don't care about the impacts of said legislation on the economy, and two, they are really hoping their consitituents have never had an econ course.
11-19-2021 09:07 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-18-2021 11:34 PM)scorpius Wrote:  If you're so worried about the deficit, then explain to me where Bush and Trump paid for their tax cut bills or unnecessary wars in Iraq and Afghanistan? Once you can explain that, then you MIGHT be able to complain about spending bills that simply catches us up with the rest of the world. But that complaining is only valid to the extent that it is "paid for" through a shell game that falls back on reversing unpaid for tax cuts from Republican administrations.

Not defending deficits on the part of any party or president, but facts are facts.

The Mideast wars, and the tax cuts, comprise only minor elements of the deficit and debt, maybe $100B per year each in a deficit that has been close to or over $1 trillion. The vast majority of the deficit and resulting debt come from runaway social spending, and this bill hides some of that as "infrastructure." Republicans really can't talk too much about the deficit, given their track record, but as a member of neither party I can blame both--and the blame at this point is about 80% democrats, 20% republicans.

CBO's budget protections as of January 2017 (https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/...lumn.pdf), which "were completed before the new Administration took office on January 20, 2017, and did "not incorporate any effects of executive orders or other actions taken by that Administration," showed deficits (in billions) rising from 2017 to 2026, as follows: -559; -487; -601; -684; -797; -959; -1,000; -1,027; -1,165; and -1,297. Those are the numbers that were baked into the cake by the Obama administration, without any Trump tax cuts or other changes. And once again, the brain-dead republicans were asleep at the wheel when it came to pointing this out.

Obama was a master of illusion. He and the democrats painted themselves as deficit busters by timing things so that the deficits bottomed out at the end of their watch, but immediately thereafter blew up, creating a massive hot potato for whoever followed them. Republicans stupidly played along by 1) not pointing this out at every opportunity and 2) not doing anything to address the problem.

Right now we have a pattern where democrats in power do everything they can to ruin this amazingly wonderful country, and republicans in power simply leave things in place and do nothing to dismantle the damage done by democrats. We cannot survive that way. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, but my enemies need better enemies.
11-19-2021 09:28 AM
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Was SoMs Eagle Offline
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Post: #43
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-10-2021 03:17 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-08-2021 05:46 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

That's the type of headline you'd expect to see on Fox News. 03-lmfao

Have you read your Carl Sagan quote?

Yes, it’s all Fox News’ fault……

How can someone be such an oblivious moron?
11-19-2021 09:35 AM
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Was SoMs Eagle Offline
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Post: #44
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-12-2021 06:47 AM)VA49er Wrote:  
(11-12-2021 06:43 AM)miko33 Wrote:  
(11-11-2021 07:07 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-10-2021 03:26 PM)miko33 Wrote:  
(11-10-2021 03:17 PM)scorpius Wrote:  That's the type of headline you'd expect to see on Fox News. 03-lmfao

We're not seeing that type of headline on Fox News. However, the title of this thread IS an actual headline from MSNBC. Inflation is good IF we were coming out of a deflationary spiral. We are not though, and given the inflation rates we're seeing in the ranges from 6% to 8% it's objectively a BAD thing...

What rock have you been sleeping under? [b]The Fed has been majorly concerned about deflation for years.[/b] That's why interest rates became virtually non-existent over the past decade. In fact it's still a major concern and thus why it's not bad at all if some of this inflation is permanent. If inflation was as concerning as the right seems to be making it out to be, the Fed would have already emergency pulled back all of it's stimulus and have started to raise rates by now. But it's looking like 2023 before we get to that point, if any time soon.

In what world is having a concern over deflation the same as actually seeing deflation in the numbers? You cannot equate these 2 as being equivalent. Yes, there was a concern that we MIGHT slip into a period of deflation and therefore had a lax monetary policy with ultra low interest rates. That said, the YOY inflation numbers were still between 1% - 2%. The YOY inflation goal is around 2% - 2.5%. Deflation never actually happened and it was staved off with a low interest rate environment WITHOUT major gov't spending levels as proposed by the BBB and the "infrastructure +" bill (with some nastiness not related to infrastructure...).

All of the extreme stimulus spending the Biden admin proposes could do what you suggest IF there was sufficient supply of goods and services but the demand simply isn't there. We are not in that type of environment. We're in an environment where the demand is there, people are willing to spend their money and have been even before Biden's first bailout checks directly to the people. Unfortunately the supply of goods and services are not available in sufficient quantities to meet demand. Why is that? Some of this has to do with supply chain problems with China. Also, the vaccine mandates are causing workers to quit so that domestically we aren't providing the same goods and services (production and logistics). Also - specifically to hydrocarbons - there is zero incentive for oil and gas producers to produce more given the hostile environment the Biden admin has created over the future of most of our energy companies.

Given all of this, the grossly high inflation rates lead us to this conclusion: You do not inflate the money supply when the supply of goods and services have contracted.

Exactly, which tells me the D's push to inject trillions now, during the highest inflation in over 30 years, is purely political and they DO NOT have the country's best interest at heart no matter how they try and spin it. I'd like to think at least some of them have taken an econ couruse at least once in their life.

Just setting the table for the real agenda. Negative interest rates and thus The Great Reset. Take your money and savings the criminal way and nothing you can do about it until it’s to late.
11-19-2021 10:12 AM
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stinkfist Offline
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Post: #45
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-19-2021 10:12 AM)Was SoMs Eagle Wrote:  
(11-12-2021 06:47 AM)VA49er Wrote:  
(11-12-2021 06:43 AM)miko33 Wrote:  
(11-11-2021 07:07 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-10-2021 03:26 PM)miko33 Wrote:  We're not seeing that type of headline on Fox News. However, the title of this thread IS an actual headline from MSNBC. Inflation is good IF we were coming out of a deflationary spiral. We are not though, and given the inflation rates we're seeing in the ranges from 6% to 8% it's objectively a BAD thing...

What rock have you been sleeping under? [b]The Fed has been majorly concerned about deflation for years.[/b] That's why interest rates became virtually non-existent over the past decade. In fact it's still a major concern and thus why it's not bad at all if some of this inflation is permanent. If inflation was as concerning as the right seems to be making it out to be, the Fed would have already emergency pulled back all of it's stimulus and have started to raise rates by now. But it's looking like 2023 before we get to that point, if any time soon.

In what world is having a concern over deflation the same as actually seeing deflation in the numbers? You cannot equate these 2 as being equivalent. Yes, there was a concern that we MIGHT slip into a period of deflation and therefore had a lax monetary policy with ultra low interest rates. That said, the YOY inflation numbers were still between 1% - 2%. The YOY inflation goal is around 2% - 2.5%. Deflation never actually happened and it was staved off with a low interest rate environment WITHOUT major gov't spending levels as proposed by the BBB and the "infrastructure +" bill (with some nastiness not related to infrastructure...).

All of the extreme stimulus spending the Biden admin proposes could do what you suggest IF there was sufficient supply of goods and services but the demand simply isn't there. We are not in that type of environment. We're in an environment where the demand is there, people are willing to spend their money and have been even before Biden's first bailout checks directly to the people. Unfortunately the supply of goods and services are not available in sufficient quantities to meet demand. Why is that? Some of this has to do with supply chain problems with China. Also, the vaccine mandates are causing workers to quit so that domestically we aren't providing the same goods and services (production and logistics). Also - specifically to hydrocarbons - there is zero incentive for oil and gas producers to produce more given the hostile environment the Biden admin has created over the future of most of our energy companies.

Given all of this, the grossly high inflation rates lead us to this conclusion: You do not inflate the money supply when the supply of goods and services have contracted.

Exactly, which tells me the D's push to inject trillions now, during the highest inflation in over 30 years, is purely political and they DO NOT have the country's best interest at heart no matter how they try and spin it. I'd like to think at least some of them have taken an econ couruse at least once in their life.

Just setting the table for the real agenda. Negative interest rates and thus The Great Reset. Take your money and savings the criminal way and nothing you can do about it until it’s to late.

#marginCallInWaiting
11-19-2021 11:40 AM
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stinkfist Offline
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Post: #46
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-19-2021 09:28 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-18-2021 11:34 PM)scorpius Wrote:  If you're so worried about the deficit, then explain to me where Bush and Trump paid for their tax cut bills or unnecessary wars in Iraq and Afghanistan? Once you can explain that, then you MIGHT be able to complain about spending bills that simply catches us up with the rest of the world. But that complaining is only valid to the extent that it is "paid for" through a shell game that falls back on reversing unpaid for tax cuts from Republican administrations.

Not defending deficits on the part of any party or president, but facts are facts.

The Mideast wars, and the tax cuts, comprise only minor elements of the deficit and debt, maybe $100B per year each in a deficit that has been close to or over $1 trillion. The vast majority of the deficit and resulting debt come from runaway social spending, and this bill hides some of that as "infrastructure." Republicans really can't talk too much about the deficit, given their track record, but as a member of neither party I can blame both--and the blame at this point is about 80% democrats, 20% republicans.

CBO's budget protections as of January 2017 (https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/...lumn.pdf), which "were completed before the new Administration took office on January 20, 2017, and did "not incorporate any effects of executive orders or other actions taken by that Administration," showed deficits (in billions) rising from 2017 to 2026, as follows: -559; -487; -601; -684; -797; -959; -1,000; -1,027; -1,165; and -1,297. Those are the numbers that were baked into the cake by the Obama administration, without any Trump tax cuts or other changes. And once again, the brain-dead republicans were asleep at the wheel when it came to pointing this out.

Obama was a master of illusion. He and the democrats painted themselves as deficit busters by timing things so that the deficits bottomed out at the end of their watch, but immediately thereafter blew up, creating a massive hot potato for whoever followed them. Republicans stupidly played along by 1) not pointing this out at every opportunity and 2) not doing anything to address the problem.

Right now we have a pattern where democrats in power do everything they can to ruin this amazingly wonderful country, and republicans in power simply leave things in place and do nothing to dismantle the damage done by democrats. We cannot survive that way. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, but my enemies need better enemies.

you continue to repeat the ‘pub se(nt)diment’ … when the ultimate ‘majority’ is controlled by banking + both parties are funded by such, explain how anyone with their hand in ye ol’ cookie jar is going to slit their own throat …

the avg. voter doesn’t have a clue other than what is force ‘fed’ … you know how they tip the scales to maintain control … hell, your pal Rand and others are trying … what’s the end result when the bulk of the blob tube (boob - blob … does it matter at this point?$!)

this is my issue with 3rd party bs from intellectuals … you guys are fighting an insurmountable wave in the wrong fashion …

#henceDJT #DJTexperiment was ‘last chance, Charlie’ … you know it as do too many others…

all this is, is how it’s transformed into the final land mass conquering within itself via $$$ (simplest version)

the smart folk are continually shrinking … and too many succumb to muh mean tweets via what ‘they’ hear…

we’ll both be dead before the shite really hits the ‘proverbial’ … the bibble won’t mean shite, and faith will be lost in transit as always…

the only question left, is who absorbs Mother Earth as a species …

@mereSpeckOfDust
11-19-2021 12:05 PM
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Eldonabe Offline
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Post: #47
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-19-2021 09:07 AM)VA49er Wrote:  
(11-18-2021 11:34 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-12-2021 06:43 AM)miko33 Wrote:  In what world is having a concern over deflation the same as actually seeing deflation in the numbers? You cannot equate these 2 as being equivalent. Yes, there was a concern that we MIGHT slip into a period of deflation and therefore had a lax monetary policy with ultra low interest rates. That said, the YOY inflation numbers were still between 1% - 2%. The YOY inflation goal is around 2% - 2.5%. Deflation never actually happened and it was staved off with a low interest rate environment WITHOUT major gov't spending levels as proposed by the BBB and the "infrastructure +" bill (with some nastiness not related to infrastructure...).

All of the extreme stimulus spending the Biden admin proposes could do what you suggest IF there was sufficient supply of goods and services but the demand simply isn't there. We are not in that type of environment. We're in an environment where the demand is there, people are willing to spend their money and have been even before Biden's first bailout checks directly to the people. Unfortunately the supply of goods and services are not available in sufficient quantities to meet demand. Why is that? Some of this has to do with supply chain problems with China. Also, the vaccine mandates are causing workers to quit so that domestically we aren't providing the same goods and services (production and logistics). Also - specifically to hydrocarbons - there is zero incentive for oil and gas producers to produce more given the hostile environment the Biden admin has created over the future of most of our energy companies.

Given all of this, the grossly high inflation rates lead us to this conclusion: You do not inflate the money supply when the supply of goods and services have contracted.

I did not see this until now.

Inflation was below 0% for much of 2015. And has been well below the target 2% for well over a decade until this year. It will likely in my view revert back to this once the supply chain issues clear and we get through this oil price cycle. Here is what you're missing:

We're just getting through the worst world supply chain shock since probably WWII. This caused oil prices to effectively go negative last year. First time this has ever happened. This resulted in oil investment to halt. Once investment halts, it takes years for it to rebound, and thus explains why oil is in short supply now. This has a huge influence on inflation.

However, reality is the growing influence of technology on the supply chain is what has resulted in low inflation the past decade despite massive government deficits. Once supply chains clear up, we'll be right back in that environment, even more so since this pandemic has boosted the influence of technology.

I'd like to know what color the sky is in your world where simply catching up with the rest of the industrial world in infrastructure and government services (as provided in the infrastructure and BBB bills) is considered "extreme stimulus spending"?

If you're so worried about the deficit, then explain to me where Bush and Trump paid for their tax cut bills or unnecessary wars in Iraq and Afghanistan? Once you can explain that, then you MIGHT be able to complain about spending bills that simply catches us up with the rest of the world. But that complaining is only valid to the extent that it is "paid for" through a shell game that falls back on reversing unpaid for tax cuts from Republican administrations.

Nothing happens in a vacuum. What part of highest inflation in 30+ years do the D's and apparently you not understand? This is basic economics. There is no way to spend out of inflation. No way, ever. The simple truth is the D's do not care about inflation, they are infatuated with the midterms and they only way they think to do that is to pass some legislation they can sell to their constituents back home. For one, they don't care about the impacts of said legislation on the economy, and two, they are really hoping their constituents have never had an econ course.


It is quite clear which constituent here has not taken an econ course.....
11-19-2021 12:45 PM
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scorpius Offline
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Post: #48
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-17-2021 08:21 AM)miko33 Wrote:  
scorpius Wrote:What rock have you been sleeping under? The Fed has been majorly concerned about deflation for years. That's why interest rates became virtually non-existent over the past decade. In fact it's still a major concern and thus why it's not bad at all if some of this inflation is permanent. If inflation was as concerning as the right seems to be making it out to be, the Fed would have already emergency pulled back all of it's stimulus and have started to raise rates by now. But it's looking like 2023 before we get to that point, if any time soon.

In bold, this was your response to an earlier comment I made in this thread. Are you saying my response to this comment was garbage? If so, please detail exactly where I went off the rails and show me how I'm wrong.

ETA: You never responded to my comment where I responded to your statements in bold. Thought we were having a serious discussion. Was I wrong?

Your response wasn't what I was referring to. I replied to it yesterday, but will add more here to put this "inflation fear" in better perspective. Despite record one-year inflation numbers, real inflation-adjusted food costs is still near record lows and likely to stay that way for the forseeable future.

Compared to 1986, the inflation-adjusted cost of a turkey dinner today is 26% cheaper, and 37% cheaper measured in “time cost” for the average worker. Despite all of the hand-wringing and alarm bells about inflation, this year’s Thanksgiving dinner in America is among the most affordable of the past 36 years relative to our income and relative to the cost of in past years.

Despite concerns about inflation, the real cost (and ‘time cost’) of Thanksgiving dinner this year is among the most affordable in history

THIS is why the average American is a porker. If it were left up to me, I'd double the cost of food and put the poor on basic essential food rations from soup kitchens. Then we'd be more comparable to the rest of the world when it comes to food availability.

(11-19-2021 09:28 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-18-2021 11:34 PM)scorpius Wrote:  If you're so worried about the deficit, then explain to me where Bush and Trump paid for their tax cut bills or unnecessary wars in Iraq and Afghanistan? Once you can explain that, then you MIGHT be able to complain about spending bills that simply catches us up with the rest of the world. But that complaining is only valid to the extent that it is "paid for" through a shell game that falls back on reversing unpaid for tax cuts from Republican administrations.

Not defending deficits on the part of any party or president, but facts are facts.

The Mideast wars, and the tax cuts, comprise only minor elements of the deficit and debt, maybe $100B per year each in a deficit that has been close to or over $1 trillion. The vast majority of the deficit and resulting debt come from runaway social spending, and this bill hides some of that as "infrastructure." Republicans really can't talk too much about the deficit, given their track record, but as a member of neither party I can blame both--and the blame at this point is about 80% democrats, 20% republicans.

CBO's budget protections as of January 2017 (https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/...lumn.pdf), which "were completed before the new Administration took office on January 20, 2017, and did "not incorporate any effects of executive orders or other actions taken by that Administration," showed deficits (in billions) rising from 2017 to 2026, as follows: -559; -487; -601; -684; -797; -959; -1,000; -1,027; -1,165; and -1,297. Those are the numbers that were baked into the cake by the Obama administration, without any Trump tax cuts or other changes. And once again, the brain-dead republicans were asleep at the wheel when it came to pointing this out.

Obama was a master of illusion. He and the democrats painted themselves as deficit busters by timing things so that the deficits bottomed out at the end of their watch, but immediately thereafter blew up, creating a massive hot potato for whoever followed them. Republicans stupidly played along by 1) not pointing this out at every opportunity and 2) not doing anything to address the problem.

Right now we have a pattern where democrats in power do everything they can to ruin this amazingly wonderful country, and republicans in power simply leave things in place and do nothing to dismantle the damage done by democrats. We cannot survive that way. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, but my enemies need better enemies.

So basically you're saying the rest of the industrialized world can afford these "extreme" government services, but the great American can not?!

That's HOGWASH! We can afford it and then some. Reality is Republicans lower taxes in a self-admitting "starve the beast" strategy, only then to blame Democrats for trying to raise taxes or simply legislate government services and spending that the rest of the world seems to all agree is morally appropriate.

The only President we have had where the budget was actually balanced was Bill Clinton. And what did Bush do right when he got in office? Lower taxes and blow up the budget. That's before he conned us all into believing spending 2 trillion in Iraq was appropriate. But wait, there's MORE! That's before even stripping the financial industry of so much regulation that it blew up the housing market and trashed the economy as he left office.

Why do you just complain about Obama's deficit projections, but conveniently don't mention Clinton's surplus projects? Or whatever disasters both Bush's projected. Or the 2 trillions I'm sure was projected after one term of Trump. I have ZERO doubt the projection after Biden will be lower than Trump's as he left office. In fact I challenge you to name ANY Republican President in the modern age that lowered deficit projects in their term compared to a prior Democrat President. You can't.

In the modern age Democrat Presidents consistently left office with lower deficit projections. This is because of the Republican "starve the beast" strategy since Clinton. THAT is what has been blowing up the country when it comes to national debt and deficits.
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2021 05:30 PM by scorpius.)
11-19-2021 05:22 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #49
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-19-2021 12:05 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  what’s the end result when the bulk of the blob tube (boob - blob … does it matter at this point?$!)

"Blob" is maybe more appropriate there than you realize. I follow a blog channel, WarOnTheRocks, that describes itself as "National security, for insiders, by insiders." Those insiders refer to the national security establishment, probably the deepest of all deep states, as the "blob." When insiders call it the blob, that's not good.
11-19-2021 06:37 PM
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scorpius Offline
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Post: #50
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
I'd still like to know the color of the sky in the world of someone who thinks we have "extreme" inflation in light of the fact the inflation-adjusted real cost and time cost of a Thanksgiving meal this year is still near record lows.

[Image: turkey2021a.png?x91208]

[Image: turkey2021b.png?x91208]

Despite concerns about inflation, the real cost (and ‘time cost’) of Thanksgiving dinner this year is among the most affordable in history
11-21-2021 09:39 PM
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Post: #51
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-19-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  THIS is why the average American is a porker. If it were left up to me, I'd double the cost of food and put the poor on basic essential food rations from soup kitchens.

Admittedly, I skipped most of the last couple of pages of posts, but the above quote caught my eye. Unless I'm crazy, this was posted by our resident liberal.

And it's the conservatives who hate poor people?
11-22-2021 09:03 AM
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Post: #52
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
CBS Poll: 67 Percent Disapprove of Biden's Handling of Inflation

Quote:Americans overwhelmingly disapprove of President Joe Biden's handling of the inflation crisis (67%), according to the results from the latest CBS-YouGov Poll.

There were 33% of Americans that did approve, though, which is just 11 points less than Biden's presidential approval rating of 44% in the poll.

There were 82% of American adults polled who have experienced the rising costs compared to just one year ago, while around 67% have seen items out of stock on store shelves.

Biden is struggling below a majority approval on a number of other issues, including race relations, the economy, and immigration. They combine to render a majority of Americans disapproving of the job Biden has done through his first 11 months in office (56%).

A 64% majority in the poll rate the U.S. economy as "fairly bad" or "very bad," with inflation being the No. 1 reason for 84% of those respondents, CBS News reported.

Despite the negative view on inflation, a majority (58%) approved of the passage of the $1.2 trillion infrastructure bill. The roughly $2 trillion Build Back Better budget reconciliation package passed the House on Friday, which was the final day of the poll, so they were not asked to respond to the approval on that one, CBS reported.

The CBS News poll was conducted by YouGov No. 15-19 among 2,058 U.S. adults with a margin of error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.
11-22-2021 12:37 PM
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scorpius Offline
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Post: #53
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-22-2021 09:03 AM)ODUCoach Wrote:  
(11-19-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  THIS is why the average American is a porker. If it were left up to me, I'd double the cost of food and put the poor on basic essential food rations from soup kitchens.

Admittedly, I skipped most of the last couple of pages of posts, but the above quote caught my eye. Unless I'm crazy, this was posted by our resident liberal.

And it's the conservatives who hate poor people?

I was wondering how long it would take before someone would note this. I'm not as "liberal" as people make me out to be. I'm a moderate. What I find among the most offensive in this country is the fact that people on foodstamps tend to be the porkiest. It's beyond the pale. We could 100% get rid of poverty in this country as it relates to malnutrition by spending the existing food stamp budget more efficiently and create a healthier thinner population in the process. Raising the food stamp budget just because the average American is consuming more calories is absolutely beyond the pale. That's like saying lets prescribe more opioids because the average American is taking more. Offensive and disgusting logic.
(This post was last modified: 11-22-2021 05:30 PM by scorpius.)
11-22-2021 05:22 PM
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Oman Offline
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Post: #54
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-22-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-22-2021 09:03 AM)ODUCoach Wrote:  
(11-19-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  THIS is why the average American is a porker. If it were left up to me, I'd double the cost of food and put the poor on basic essential food rations from soup kitchens.

Admittedly, I skipped most of the last couple of pages of posts, but the above quote caught my eye. Unless I'm crazy, this was posted by our resident liberal.

And it's the conservatives who hate poor people?

I was wondering how long it would take before someone would note this. I'm not as "liberal" as people make me out to be. I'm a moderate. What I find among the most offensive in this country is the fact that people on foodstamps tend to be the porkiest. It's beyond the pale. We could 100% get rid of poverty in this country as it relates to malnutrition by spending the existing food stamp budget more efficiently and create a healthier thinner population in the process. Raising the food stamp budget just because the average American is consuming more calories is absolutely beyond the pale. That's like saying lets prescribe more opioids because the average American is taking more. Offensive and disgusting logic.

most people who are liberal think they are moderate, you have liberal viewpoints on virtually every issue, budgetary, social, the role of government. Scorp, you an i have had may discussions over the last years, in what area(s) would you consider yourself a moderate? i consider you only moderate in that you're not a full blown socialist.
11-22-2021 05:39 PM
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Was SoMs Eagle Offline
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Post: #55
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-22-2021 09:03 AM)ODUCoach Wrote:  
(11-19-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  THIS is why the average American is a porker. If it were left up to me, I'd double the cost of food and put the poor on basic essential food rations from soup kitchens.

Admittedly, I skipped most of the last couple of pages of posts, but the above quote caught my eye. Unless I'm crazy, this was posted by our resident liberal.

And it's the conservatives who hate poor people?

What it is is a great example of their desire to control every aspect of other peoples lives. They don’t understand the road they want to travel down. Thus they are a danger to us all.
11-22-2021 05:53 PM
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stinkfist Offline
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Post: #56
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-22-2021 05:53 PM)Was SoMs Eagle Wrote:  
(11-22-2021 09:03 AM)ODUCoach Wrote:  
(11-19-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  THIS is why the average American is a porker. If it were left up to me, I'd double the cost of food and put the poor on basic essential food rations from soup kitchens.

Admittedly, I skipped most of the last couple of pages of posts, but the above quote caught my eye. Unless I'm crazy, this was posted by our resident liberal.

And it's the conservatives who hate poor people?

What it is is a great example of their desire to control every aspect of other peoples lives. They don’t understand the road they want to travel down. Thus they are a danger to us all.

however, they’re only a danger when votes yield the only incompatible platform via ‘mail’ or boob tube washtubbytonnage …

you’re scared b/c their numbers were designed to be former sig line 1b) …

oh wellzy…

@shouldaBeenAJew




starting to figure this out, yet …






suckers
11-22-2021 08:54 PM
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scorpius Offline
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Post: #57
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-22-2021 05:39 PM)Oman Wrote:  
(11-22-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-22-2021 09:03 AM)ODUCoach Wrote:  
(11-19-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  THIS is why the average American is a porker. If it were left up to me, I'd double the cost of food and put the poor on basic essential food rations from soup kitchens.

Admittedly, I skipped most of the last couple of pages of posts, but the above quote caught my eye. Unless I'm crazy, this was posted by our resident liberal.

And it's the conservatives who hate poor people?

I was wondering how long it would take before someone would note this. I'm not as "liberal" as people make me out to be. I'm a moderate. What I find among the most offensive in this country is the fact that people on foodstamps tend to be the porkiest. It's beyond the pale. We could 100% get rid of poverty in this country as it relates to malnutrition by spending the existing food stamp budget more efficiently and create a healthier thinner population in the process. Raising the food stamp budget just because the average American is consuming more calories is absolutely beyond the pale. That's like saying lets prescribe more opioids because the average American is taking more. Offensive and disgusting logic.

most people who are liberal think they are moderate, you have liberal viewpoints on virtually every issue, budgetary, social, the role of government. Scorp, you an i have had may discussions over the last years, in what area(s) would you consider yourself a moderate? i consider you only moderate in that you're not a full blown socialist.

It just appears that way because I usually debate from the left because it's more entertaining on a message board 95% conservative. I could easily switch sides and be just as convincing. But in reality, if it weren't for Republicans complete disregard for the separation of church and state, and now their current Trump-inspired Authoritarian stance, I'd most likely vote Republican. And that's just a fact. I've been saying it for 20+ years, the day liberals have safe control of the Supreme Court is the day I start voting Republican. Unfortunately due to Republican shenanigans with court nominations the past few years, I'll probably be stuck voting Democrat for the rest of my life.
(This post was last modified: 11-23-2021 11:46 PM by scorpius.)
11-23-2021 11:38 PM
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JMUDunk Offline
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Post: #58
MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
“Shenanigans” the last few years?

Such as what? The Sloe* Biden rule?

To your other note above, you’re kidding on the “Republican refusal to separate Church and State” statement, right?

Who ACTUALLY campaigns IN Churches? Holds fundraisers? Have Ministers endorsing candidates all over the place and actively campaigning for them?

It ain a bunch of Lutherans or Presbyterians.
11-24-2021 04:45 AM
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bearcat65 Offline
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Post: #59
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
(11-23-2021 11:38 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-22-2021 05:39 PM)Oman Wrote:  
(11-22-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  
(11-22-2021 09:03 AM)ODUCoach Wrote:  
(11-19-2021 05:22 PM)scorpius Wrote:  THIS is why the average American is a porker. If it were left up to me, I'd double the cost of food and put the poor on basic essential food rations from soup kitchens.

Admittedly, I skipped most of the last couple of pages of posts, but the above quote caught my eye. Unless I'm crazy, this was posted by our resident liberal.

And it's the conservatives who hate poor people?

I was wondering how long it would take before someone would note this. I'm not as "liberal" as people make me out to be. I'm a moderate. What I find among the most offensive in this country is the fact that people on foodstamps tend to be the porkiest. It's beyond the pale. We could 100% get rid of poverty in this country as it relates to malnutrition by spending the existing food stamp budget more efficiently and create a healthier thinner population in the process. Raising the food stamp budget just because the average American is consuming more calories is absolutely beyond the pale. That's like saying lets prescribe more opioids because the average American is taking more. Offensive and disgusting logic.

most people who are liberal think they are moderate, you have liberal viewpoints on virtually every issue, budgetary, social, the role of government. Scorp, you an i have had may discussions over the last years, in what area(s) would you consider yourself a moderate? i consider you only moderate in that you're not a full blown socialist.

It just appears that way because I usually debate from the left because it's more entertaining on a message board 95% conservative. I could easily switch sides and be just as convincing. But in reality, if it weren't for Republicans complete disregard for the separation of church and state, and now their current Trump-inspired Authoritarian stance, I'd most likely vote Republican. And that's just a fact. I've been saying it for 20+ years, the day liberals have safe control of the Supreme Court is the day I start voting Republican. Unfortunately due to Republican shenanigans with court nominations the past few years, I'll probably be stuck voting Democrat for the rest of my life.

If you understand the meaning of authoritarian then you are voting for it by voting democrat. To say otherwise ignores the obvious.
11-24-2021 08:40 AM
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CrimsonPhantom Offline
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Post: #60
RE: MSNBC: Inflation a Good Thing
CBO: Democrats’ Spending Spree Will Make Inflation Even Worse For Years

Quote:So much for fiscal responsibility. The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) score of Democrats’ “Build Back Bankrupt” spending spree didn’t stop the House of Representatives from passing the legislation last Friday.

Ironically, House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy, R-California, did more to delay the vote on the bill, speaking on the House floor for more than eight hours Thursday night and postponing the vote on House passage until Friday morning. But lawmakers who claim to care about our nation’s rapidly growing pile of debt, like Sens. Joe Manchin, D-W.V. and Kyrsten Sinema, D-Arizona, should review the CBO analysis in detail.

Unlike its “score” of many other bills, the budget office did not release a textual narrative describing the legislation’s fiscal impact—at least, not yet. But even the series of spreadsheets CBO has thus far published demonstrate the dangerous impact of Democrats’ sprint towards socialism.

Raises the Deficit
The summary table shows that the bill will increase the deficit by $367 billion over its first ten years. While budgetary scorekeeping provisions prohibit CBO from using new revenue from tax enforcement to offset the bill’s deficit impact, the budget office predicts $207 billion of revenue from increased audits and other IRS-related activities.

The White House claims that Treasury will generate more revenue from tax enforcement than CBO projects, erasing the supposed deficit impact of $160 billion ($367 billion total deficit minus $207 billion from IRS enforcement). But the fact that the IRS has yet to audit Joe Biden’s taxes speaks to the falsity of this assertion. Moreover, the other gimmicks and tricks included in the bill far outweigh a deficit impact of “only” $367 billion, or even $160 billion.

Raises Inflation
As expected, CBO projected the bill will raise federal deficits—and thus inflation—in the short and medium term. In fact, the bill will exacerbate inflation within mere months. Consider the net fiscal impact by fiscal year:

Fiscal Year 2022 (now through next September 30): $155.1 billion deficit
Fiscal Year 2023 (starts next October 1): $161.1 billion deficit
Fiscal Year 2024: $147.2 billion deficit
Fiscal Year 2025: $209.3 billion deficit
Fiscal Year 2026: $119 billion deficit

All told, the bill will increase deficits by $791.6 billion in its first five years. Only in Fiscal Year 2027 and thereafter will the bill reduce the deficit—at least on paper.

That means that, over the next few years, the gusher of federal spending will continue, on top of the more than $5 trillion in “stimulus” spending Congress has approved since COVID first hit last spring, along with the trillions of dollars the Federal Reserve has printed over the same period as part of its quantitative easing program.

Budget Gimmicks Galore
The CBO tables reveal the many tricks Democrats have employed to disguise the full amount of the bill’s spending. To use but one example, CBO claimed that increased Obamacare subsidies would cost $57 billion—$43.8 billion in government spending (i.e., payments to people who have no income tax liability), and an additional $13.2 billion in reduced revenues.

But a CBO analysis from last year found that increased subsidies would cost $212.4 billion, or nearly three times as much as this year’s estimate. Why the much lower financial impact?

Simple: The Democratic bill would extend the subsidies for three years only—2023, 2024, and 2025. Of course, the left has no interest in letting the subsidies expire at the end of 2025. The early cut-off instead just serves to lower the bill’s upfront cost, and make the bill seem less expensive, and less radical, than it is.

Most of the bill’s major entitlements operate on this premise: The pre-K and child care programs; the Obamacare subsidies; and the child welfare credit, which the bill would extend for next year only. Little wonder then that the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget said the House-passed measure’s true long-term cost lies at nearly $5 trillion—roughly double the $2.4 trillion estimate for the bill as written.

Tax Increases Ahead
One could easily summarize the CBO tables, and the bill in general, with five simple words: “Hold on to your wallet.” Democrats claim that only “the rich” will pay for the bill’s spending spree, but the $2.4 trillion cost of the bill as written represents only a fraction of the revenue needed to fund the left’s socialist paradise. To even hope of paying for all this spending, taxes will have to sharply rise on every single American.

Economist Herbert Stein famously noted that unsustainable trends are in the long run unsustainable. That maxim applies as much to the notion that middle-class families can get all these new programs “for free” as it does to the fact that America’s creditors may soon weary of funding the $29 trillion (and counting) in debt to pay for them.
11-24-2021 10:03 AM
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