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Game 10: JMU
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zablenoise Offline
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Post: #181
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-13-2021 07:03 PM)Tribester Wrote:  No such luck, but that WAS a particularly bad beat/backdoor cover in garbage time at the end. Feels bad for JMU fans who bet them to cover.

This has to be one of the all time greatest troll lines in boards history.

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11-14-2021 03:00 PM
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Harrisonburger Offline
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Post: #182
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-14-2021 02:57 PM)zablenoise Wrote:  
(11-14-2021 10:40 AM)Harrisonburger Wrote:  1. Didn't say I went to JMU. I didn't. :-)

Lol then why do you root for JMU you massive weirdo?

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:-) :-) :-)

I've lived in H'burg for over 35 years. I can walk to Bridgeforth from my house. They're basically my local club. If I'd ended up living in W'burg, I'd probably have ended up on this board b*tching about one thing or another.

Oh, and the wife DOES have two degrees from JMU. :-)

As for where I went undergrad, here's a hint. Roar lion roar, and wake the echoes of the Hudson Valley. So, a six hour drive to watch what's been some apocalyptically bad football over the years lacks some appeal relative to JMU. :-)
(This post was last modified: 11-14-2021 04:17 PM by Harrisonburger.)
11-14-2021 04:16 PM
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zablenoise Offline
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Post: #183
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-14-2021 04:16 PM)Harrisonburger Wrote:  As for where I went undergrad, here's a hint. Roar lion roar, and wake the echoes of the Hudson Valley. So, a six hour drive to watch what's been some apocalyptically bad football over the years lacks some appeal relative to JMU. :-)

Hey man don't be so down, they beat Brown yesterday! And I don't know if it's true still but when I was in school W&M and Columbia had a joint engineering program. So if any WMers wanted the degree they had to spend two years up in Morningside Heights.

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11-14-2021 04:27 PM
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Florida tribe fan Offline
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Post: #184
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-13-2021 10:01 PM)Zorch Wrote:  
(11-09-2021 09:20 AM)Zorch Wrote:  Back to football. Here are some keys to the game that W&M should strive for in order to pull off the upset:

1. Zero turnovers by the Tribe. At least two and preferably three or more turnovers by JMU.

2. Minimize penalties, especially the stupid unsportsmanlike ones that occur after the play is over. Let JMU be the one to make those mistakes.

3. Positive yardage on first and second downs. Get new first downs there instead of having to convert on third down. At least, keep from having numerous third and longs.

4. Hopefully Ethan Chang will be kicking only extra points...but if he attempts any field goals then he needs to make them. W&M cannot afford to leave any points on the table.

5. Be smart about when to "go for it". Sometimes the down side if you don't make it can be a game breaker.

Let's see how the Tribe did. #1...nope. #2...nope. #3...eh, not good enough. The Tribe did get 12 first downs even though we converted zero third downs. #4...well, at least Chang converted his two PAT attempts. #5...N/A.

First, the Tribe. Then the officials.

1. I couldn't believe that Wilson got benched in favor of a guy who hadn't played in 8 weeks.

2. I'm surprised that the offensive coordinator has been so bad since he was apparently so good at San Diego. All we see are side-to-side passes and deception plays. How about some good old fashioned passes up the field? Amazing how when we finally got around to doing that, we actually picked up some positive yardage.

3. Who played Center today? Every snap was limp and closer to 90 degrees rather than a crisp 45 degrees straight back to the QB. Cost precious time on every single snap. I can't believe it wasn't corrected as the game went on. Who knows, maybe Mathis prefers it that way.

4. Wasting a timeout early in the third quarter was inexcusable (as always).

5. I don't know who coaches the Defensive Backs but he needs to teach them to LOOK FOR THE BALL!! Just a simple look back and the Tribe could have had 4 interceptions easily. It looks to me like they are coached to stay with the receiver and then tackle him after he catches it....rather than looking for the ball, contesting the pass, and perhaps intercepting it. The DBs were absolutely terrible today.

6. Despite his late long reception, Zach Burdick had a bad day today, in my opinion. There was one play where Mathis was running it trying for a first down. Burdick was the only Tribe player in the area (with 3 or 4 Dukes zeroing in on Mathis). Instead of trying to block for him, Burdick just stood there and watched. Just a couple of minutes later a long pass to Burdick went incomplete but it sure looked like Zach could have caught it (even if it was perhaps thrown to the wrong shoulder). We need leadership in these big games.

The officials were absolutely horrendous, as everybody has already commented on. They were so incompetent that they never even figured out that the referee's microphone was not working correctly in the second half. Not mentioned is that they ROUTINELY shorted the Tribe on many spots. In the first half one of our guys caught a 12 yard pass that they marked for 10 (but at least we were credited with the first down). Later in the game we punted and the ball went out on the 48 yard line -- but the officials marked it at the 50. Sure, just a couple of yards each time but those yards add up. A really irritating missed call was when JMU roughed our punter but the refs said the ball was touched. That's not the irritating part. The bad part was that when our punter was getting up off the ground a JMU player pushed him hard back down. It was after that that the official threw the flag and I thought that -- finally -- an unsportsmanlike penalty had been called on JMU....but no, it was not called despite the fact that it happened right in front of that official. The refs also missed holding on every single long run by their QB.

The trouble with any playoff hopes is that Rhode Island is 7-3 and has a win over an FBS team (granted, it is just UMASS -- and our win over Villanova is actually more impressive).

EDIT: Forgot to mention that JMU certainly didn't look like a #2 team in the country to me. Basically, their QB is their whole team. Sure, he has a couple of good receivers to throw to...but it was their QB who won this game for them (and their offensive coordinator who at least has heard of the value of the forward pass).

One strange thing about yesterday's game was that even after almost three quarters and JMU ahead 23 - 0, it didn't seem like the Tribe had been dominated. It just seemed like one program had a passing attack, and the other didn't. In cutting the lead to 23 - 15, it was evident the Tribe had a speed advantage at running back, and wasn't overmatched along the line of scrimmage.

My suspicion is that W&M hasn't had many 200 yard passing games since 2015 and that this has had an outsized impact on wins and losses. An inability to move beyond being a one dimensional offense will probably leave the football program stuck in mediocrity, and won't help in increasing the entertainment value of the on field product.

Am curious to see how the JMU act will play in the Sun Belt. Am unsure how the product on the field yesterday fares against Appalachian, Coastal Carolina, etc. Am also trying to figure out the recruiting angle. Is the calculation in Harrisonburg and amongst JMU fandom that the Dukes will win recruits they're now losing to present Sun Belt schools? It would seem that being in Sun Belt won't help in winning recruiting battles vs UVA and Va Tech.
11-14-2021 05:03 PM
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Tribe3455 Offline
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Post: #185
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-13-2021 06:39 PM)TribeDeac Wrote:  We apparently can't complete a 10 yard pass. One of the worst offensive schemes I have ever seen. Take away two big plays we lose 40-0.

Take away 3 horrendous calls and it is 0-0 in the first half. But your point is valid.
11-14-2021 05:30 PM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #186
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-14-2021 01:03 PM)Zorch Wrote:  
(11-14-2021 12:43 PM)Tribe32 Wrote:  
(11-14-2021 10:38 AM)Rocco Wrote:  -Mathis had 128 yards passing, 77 of which came on 2 plays on the last drive of the game when the result was decided;

-Not counting the drives at the end of the 1st half and game where JMU was kneeling, 8 of 12 JMU drives reached the W&M red zone.

W&M's been muddling through this year with glaring weak spots but made it work through big plays and divine providence. Delaware and JMU spent the whole game punching the big tape X on W&M's belly and the Tribe didn't have an answer. You can't win today without a semblance of a passing game. It shouldn't be this hard to throw the football. Defensively, when you live off turnovers but stop getting turnovers, this is what happens. This team still has a ways to go if they want to be more than cannon fodder for other teams who can do more than one thing.
100%

I guess our third guy is really, really bad.

All excellent and valid points -- but keep in mind that winning hides all evils. If we had won our recent games -- despite our flaws -- then I think most of us would have been okay with it. I prefer a balanced attack or, if anything, I actually prefer a prolific passing game. But I prefer winning most of all. (Yes, yes, and unfortunately now our flaws have caught up to us and we are not winning. I'm just saying that if we were winning then it wouldn't seem like such a big deal).

If you say "this thing that's leading to victories isn't sustainable" after wins, the Cool Kids call you an a-hole and say you're rooting for losses and not a real fan. (They love that particular taunt, until you throw it back at them and they pretend it's the worst thing anyone could say.) Ultimately, the staff is running the offense in the way they have to run it this year to succeed with state of the QB play. When you can only play in one specific way and have no Plan B, it leaves you vulnerable when Plan A fails. As with pretty much every other visible flaw with this team, it would be easier to write it off if we didn't see all of these specific flaws on displays with London at UVA.
11-14-2021 06:37 PM
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Tribe3455 Offline
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Post: #187
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-14-2021 10:38 AM)Rocco Wrote:  -Mathis had 128 yards passing, 77 of which came on 2 plays on the last drive of the game when the result was decided;

-Not counting the drives at the end of the 1st half and game where JMU was kneeling, 8 of 12 JMU drives reached the W&M red zone.

W&M's been muddling through this year with glaring weak spots but made it work through big plays and divine providence. Delaware and JMU spent the whole game punching the big tape X on W&M's belly and the Tribe didn't have an answer. You can't win today without a semblance of a passing game. It shouldn't be this hard to throw the football. Defensively, when you live off turnovers but stop getting turnovers, this is what happens. This team still has a ways to go if they want to be more than cannon fodder for other teams who can do more than one thing.

Just for kicks I decided to look at your 8 of 12 drives stats. Without rechecking, I think you might be off slightly on the numbers. But even if you aren't you are counting 'drives' of 1 yard from the 14 to the 13 that ended in a field goal and a 'drive' from the 34 to the 12 that also ended in a field goal. And a 'drive' that was changed from an interception to a first down by virtue of a ridiculous roughing the passer call where the QB didn't even fall down. The defense played well for the most part. Completely stopped the run game. Was simply on the field too many time early in rapid fire fashion. The drive that started on the 8 and went the length of the field was the one time I was frustrated with the defense. Other than that it was not a weakness.
11-16-2021 01:38 PM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #188
RE: Game 10: JMU
If a drive starts and ends in the red zone, it reached the red zone. Take that part out of it and look at their drives. JMU's drives:

11 plays, 50 yards (turnover on downs)
14 plays, 86 yards (FG)
3 plays, 7 yards (punt)
12 plays, 74 yards (FG)
5 plays, 50 yards (TD)
1 play, -1 yard (end of half)
11 plays, 57 yards (FG)
4 plays, 34 yards (TD)
3 plays, -1 yard (punt)
5 plays, 4 yards (punt)
8 plays, 68 yards (FG)
9 plays, 46 yards (FG)
4 plays, 1 yard (FG)
2 plays, -3 yards (end of game)

Two 3 and outs, three punts total. That's not great. When W&M pulled to within one score JMU got a FG to go up 11, then took 5 minutes off the clock to get another FG and go up 14.
Unlike Towson's QB, JMU's QB didn't start blindly throwing it into coverage under pressure. It was death by papercut. W&M took away the run and dared JMU to pass on them which is what happened. Great red zone defense kept it interesting.
11-16-2021 03:43 PM
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Post: #189
RE: Game 10: JMU
What has not been discussed is the starting QB decision of replacing Wilson with Mathis. More importantly who should start against Richmond?
11-17-2021 08:05 AM
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billymac Offline
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Post: #190
RE: Game 10: JMU
With both QB's dealing with accuracy issues, it looks like they may be favoring the one that gives them the most versatility in the running game. Mathis is the quicker of the two (and may be the quickest guy, outside of Imoh, on the team). I suspect that it will be Mathis again this week.

Maybe we should go Triple Wing.
11-17-2021 09:06 AM
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wmmii Online
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Post: #191
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-17-2021 09:06 AM)billymac Wrote:  With both QB's dealing with accuracy issues, it looks like they may be favoring the one that gives them the most versatility in the running game. Mathis is the quicker of the two (and may be the quickest guy, outside of Imoh, on the team). I suspect that it will be Mathis again this week.

Maybe we should go Triple Wing.

The lack of an effective passing game is killing us. IMO whoever is the better passer should start but not claiming to know which one meets that criteria.
11-17-2021 10:13 AM
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ttgwm02 Offline
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Post: #192
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-17-2021 10:13 AM)wmmii Wrote:  
(11-17-2021 09:06 AM)billymac Wrote:  With both QB's dealing with accuracy issues, it looks like they may be favoring the one that gives them the most versatility in the running game. Mathis is the quicker of the two (and may be the quickest guy, outside of Imoh, on the team). I suspect that it will be Mathis again this week.

Maybe we should go Triple Wing.

The lack of an effective passing game is killing us. IMO whoever is the better passer should start but not claiming to know which one meets that criteria.

Aside from Ward at Richmond (who was largely a Clausen product) this is par for course for London. His QB development at UVA was a nightmare to watch. Constantly burning redshirts, swapping quarterbacks, and generally demonstrating the patience of a teenage boy in a car dealership. The fact that three of his QBs went on to be more successful after leaving Virginia for greener pastures (Lambert, Strauss, Rocco) speaks volumes. As for Sims and Watford, the less said the better. I cannot think of a single quarterback who consistently improved on his watch at Virginia.

JL certainly did not set the world on fire with his QB development after Callahan and Archer, but London is not much better at this point.
11-18-2021 12:31 AM
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Sitting bull Offline
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Post: #193
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-17-2021 09:06 AM)billymac Wrote:  With both QB's dealing with accuracy issues, it looks like they may be favoring the one that gives them the most versatility in the running game. Mathis is the quicker of the two (and may be the quickest guy, outside of Imoh, on the team). I suspect that it will be Mathis again this week.

Maybe we should go Triple Wing.

Has Mathis won a game yet? It’s like we keep waiting for this flower to bloom. This is a big game. I’m not in favor of rolling more dice on this.

The team seems to move with Wilson. He sure seemed accurate enough throwing to Pitts at Elon. Not sure why that play suddenly disappeared.
11-18-2021 07:27 AM
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Tribe4SF Offline
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Post: #194
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-18-2021 07:27 AM)Sitting bull Wrote:  
(11-17-2021 09:06 AM)billymac Wrote:  With both QB's dealing with accuracy issues, it looks like they may be favoring the one that gives them the most versatility in the running game. Mathis is the quicker of the two (and may be the quickest guy, outside of Imoh, on the team). I suspect that it will be Mathis again this week.

Maybe we should go Triple Wing.

Has Mathis won a game yet? It’s like we keep waiting for this flower to bloom. This is a big game. I’m not in favor of rolling more dice on this.

The team seems to move with Wilson. He sure seemed accurate enough throwing to Pitts at Elon. Not sure why that play suddenly disappeared.

As fans, of course, we're able to cherry pick examples from the past. Mathis is 1-1 as a starter this year. Team moved with Wilson except for the Delaware game.

There are 11 guys on the field with the offense and they all have to do their job. We have an OC with a long history of success who will use the available pieces in ways he sees as giving us the best chance to be successful. Recent performance, practice performance, and weekly opponent profile all go into personnel decisions.

Go Tribe!!! Beat Richmond!!!
11-18-2021 08:05 AM
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Tribe2025 Offline
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Post: #195
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-18-2021 08:05 AM)Tribe4SF Wrote:  
(11-18-2021 07:27 AM)Sitting bull Wrote:  
(11-17-2021 09:06 AM)billymac Wrote:  With both QB's dealing with accuracy issues, it looks like they may be favoring the one that gives them the most versatility in the running game. Mathis is the quicker of the two (and may be the quickest guy, outside of Imoh, on the team). I suspect that it will be Mathis again this week.

Maybe we should go Triple Wing.

Has Mathis won a game yet? It’s like we keep waiting for this flower to bloom. This is a big game. I’m not in favor of rolling more dice on this.

The team seems to move with Wilson. He sure seemed accurate enough throwing to Pitts at Elon. Not sure why that play suddenly disappeared.

As fans, of course, we're able to cherry pick examples from the past. Mathis is 1-1 as a starter this year. Team moved with Wilson except for the Delaware game.

There are 11 guys on the field with the offense and they all have to do their job. We have an OC with a long history of success who will use the available pieces in ways he sees as giving us the best chance to be successful. Recent performance, practice performance, and weekly opponent profile all go into personnel decisions.

Go Tribe!!! Beat Richmond!!!

I think we and maybe even the coaching staff have under estimated the i impact of losing Lester. Lester was a big back who could run inside and out and catch out the backfield. Our other backs seemed to be more suited for outside runs. I think if u realize that the teams worst FCS offensive performance came the first week Lester was out then you stop blaming the passing game. We have been run heavy all year throwing the fewest passes in the conference. We lost our big gun in the running game makes sense that the offense took a hit with it.

As for the QB development aspect both Johns and Taylor played QB in college. Hopefully that gives us some experience and expertise where it could be lacking with London.
11-18-2021 10:15 AM
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TribeinVB Offline
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Post: #196
RE: Game 10: JMU
(11-18-2021 10:15 AM)Tribe2025 Wrote:  
(11-18-2021 08:05 AM)Tribe4SF Wrote:  
(11-18-2021 07:27 AM)Sitting bull Wrote:  
(11-17-2021 09:06 AM)billymac Wrote:  With both QB's dealing with accuracy issues, it looks like they may be favoring the one that gives them the most versatility in the running game. Mathis is the quicker of the two (and may be the quickest guy, outside of Imoh, on the team). I suspect that it will be Mathis again this week.

Maybe we should go Triple Wing.

Has Mathis won a game yet? It’s like we keep waiting for this flower to bloom. This is a big game. I’m not in favor of rolling more dice on this.

The team seems to move with Wilson. He sure seemed accurate enough throwing to Pitts at Elon. Not sure why that play suddenly disappeared.

As fans, of course, we're able to cherry pick examples from the past. Mathis is 1-1 as a starter this year. Team moved with Wilson except for the Delaware game.

There are 11 guys on the field with the offense and they all have to do their job. We have an OC with a long history of success who will use the available pieces in ways he sees as giving us the best chance to be successful. Recent performance, practice performance, and weekly opponent profile all go into personnel decisions.

Go Tribe!!! Beat Richmond!!!

I think we and maybe even the coaching staff have under estimated the i impact of losing Lester. Lester was a big back who could run inside and out and catch out the backfield. Our other backs seemed to be more suited for outside runs. I think if u realize that the teams worst FCS offensive performance came the first week Lester was out then you stop blaming the passing game. We have been run heavy all year throwing the fewest passes in the conference. We lost our big gun in the running game makes sense that the offense took a hit with it.

As for the QB development aspect both Johns and Taylor played QB in college. Hopefully that gives us some experience and expertise where it could be lacking with London.

I'd say Yoder runs pretty well between the tackles. He rarely goes down on first contact, carries tacklers and usually falls forward. Lester is great, but I don't think his absence had any impact vs JMU. There were receivers open down field behind their coverage that were completely missed. Both Wilson and Mathis have happy feet in the pocket and take off before routes fully develop. To me, it looks like our passing scheme is very simplistic involving usually one or two routes max, and I know this is not because our OC doesn't know how to design a more complicated passing attack. Its because our QBs can't run it. Wilson is a freshman so I get it that he needs more time, but Mathis does not appear to me to be someone who is ever going to develop into a top passer, which is shame because his freshman year I thought he would be the next Shawn Knight. I say go with Wilson on Saturday and hopefully the following week.
11-18-2021 11:05 AM
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