(11-04-2021 08:47 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 02:31 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 12:24 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 12:08 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  Seems to me that UMass and CUSA could work out a deal. X number of ooc basketball games annually, rotated through the CUSA membership. Say 4. And UMass gets a football only membership.

That may not be a bad thing.

The New CUSA is shaping up to be pretty solid in basketball.

How about trying to get UMass, Dayton, St. Louis and maybe VCU? Then you would have 1 school with a basketball title (UTEP) and 4 others who made the final 4 (UMass, Dayton, VCU and NMSU). Offer the 4 top attendance schools in the A10, 2 of which have lousy geography already.

Most of the A-10 is a bus trip away from UMass. I can't imagine any circumstance where UMass would willingly trade mostly bus trips for mostly flying its Olympic sports to C-USA away games. UMass and UConn as football only members is probably the best outcome for all sides. That gives C-USA numbers and stability and in return the schools get the opportunity to have a second season and play for a conference championship.

Not so fast my friend!

As a follower of the A10, I can say that isn’t true. I’m pretty sure UMass doesn’t bus to Davidson, Richmond X2, Fairfax, DC, Olean, Pittsburgh, Dayton, and St. Louis.

I count bus trips to Rhode Island, the Bronx, and Philly X2.

(11-04-2021 02:00 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  NO.

Can we please stop these "Will UMass/UConn/whoever is weak right now drop down to FCS?" threads? They are annoying AF and end up being an outlet for people to pile on and trash particular schools.

So tiresome!

(11-04-2021 08:59 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 08:47 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 02:31 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 12:24 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 12:08 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  Seems to me that UMass and CUSA could work out a deal. X number of ooc basketball games annually, rotated through the CUSA membership. Say 4. And UMass gets a football only membership.

That may not be a bad thing.

The New CUSA is shaping up to be pretty solid in basketball.

How about trying to get UMass, Dayton, St. Louis and maybe VCU? Then you would have 1 school with a basketball title (UTEP) and 4 others who made the final 4 (UMass, Dayton, VCU and NMSU). Offer the 4 top attendance schools in the A10, 2 of which have lousy geography already.

Most of the A-10 is a bus trip away from UMass. I can't imagine any circumstance where UMass would willingly trade mostly bus trips for mostly flying its Olympic sports to C-USA away games. UMass and UConn as football only members is probably the best outcome for all sides. That gives C-USA numbers and stability and in return the schools get the opportunity to have a second season and play for a conference championship.

Not so fast my friend!

As a follower of the A10, I can say that isn’t true. I’m pretty sure UMass doesn’t bus to Davidson, Richmond X2, Fairfax, DC, Olean, Pittsburgh, Dayton, and St. Louis.

I count bus trips to Rhode Island, the Bronx, and Philly X2.

And most of those bus trips are to go play in high school gyms.

(11-04-2021 09:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 08:59 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 08:47 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 02:31 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 12:24 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  That may not be a bad thing.

The New CUSA is shaping up to be pretty solid in basketball.

How about trying to get UMass, Dayton, St. Louis and maybe VCU? Then you would have 1 school with a basketball title (UTEP) and 4 others who made the final 4 (UMass, Dayton, VCU and NMSU). Offer the 4 top attendance schools in the A10, 2 of which have lousy geography already.

Most of the A-10 is a bus trip away from UMass. I can't imagine any circumstance where UMass would willingly trade mostly bus trips for mostly flying its Olympic sports to C-USA away games. UMass and UConn as football only members is probably the best outcome for all sides. That gives C-USA numbers and stability and in return the schools get the opportunity to have a second season and play for a conference championship.

Not so fast my friend!

As a follower of the A10, I can say that isn’t true. I’m pretty sure UMass doesn’t bus to Davidson, Richmond X2, Fairfax, DC, Olean, Pittsburgh, Dayton, and St. Louis.

I count bus trips to Rhode Island, the Bronx, and Philly X2.

And most of those bus trips are to go play in high school gyms.

You guys have yourselves a little confused.
First, DC and Fairfax are within a six/seven hour drive of Amherst. Richmond is eight hours. Even if UMass flies to the schools you think are too far to bus. It will have to fly to ALL of the schools in C-USA.
Second you are commenting only on mens basketball. You think that UMass sees an advantage to flying all of those non revenue sports teams it has (16 if you count football and M/W basketball all as revenue sports) to Florida, New Mexico and every state in between? Will this version of C-USA be able to payout P5 type or even BE level $ to its members? Because that is what it will take to offset the added expense of sending those teams all over the South. If C-USA can't provide that type of payout, it would be NJIT to the Great Midwest Conference stupid for UMass to leave the A-10.
Third, for the guy commenting on gym size. What really matters is whether those gyms are packed when you play in them and do those schools help pack your gym. Also, how many NCAA bids do you think this version of C-USA is going to get? I bet the A-10 has two or three more every year. How much are those credits worth again?

(11-04-2021 11:07 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  As a UConn fan, I'm 50/50 on this. We would lose a recruiting rival but we would also lose an annual rivalry game.

Their AD has already said being an independent is untenable. I think they could work it out but most of their fanbase either wants to be in the MAC all-sports, CAA, or C-USA football-only. Almost none of them wants to be independent.

Ask yourself this. Since UConn and UMass are in very similar situations would UConn drop down to FCS without a conference home? No? Then, UMass won't either.

(11-04-2021 11:01 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 09:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 08:59 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 08:47 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 02:31 PM)bullet Wrote:  How about trying to get UMass, Dayton, St. Louis and maybe VCU? Then you would have 1 school with a basketball title (UTEP) and 4 others who made the final 4 (UMass, Dayton, VCU and NMSU). Offer the 4 top attendance schools in the A10, 2 of which have lousy geography already.

Most of the A-10 is a bus trip away from UMass. I can't imagine any circumstance where UMass would willingly trade mostly bus trips for mostly flying its Olympic sports to C-USA away games. UMass and UConn as football only members is probably the best outcome for all sides. That gives C-USA numbers and stability and in return the schools get the opportunity to have a second season and play for a conference championship.

Not so fast my friend!

As a follower of the A10, I can say that isn’t true. I’m pretty sure UMass doesn’t bus to Davidson, Richmond X2, Fairfax, DC, Olean, Pittsburgh, Dayton, and St. Louis.

I count bus trips to Rhode Island, the Bronx, and Philly X2.

And most of those bus trips are to go play in high school gyms.

You guys have yourselves a little confused.
First, DC and Fairfax are within a six/seven hour drive of Amherst. Richmond is eight hours. Even if UMass flies to the schools you think are too far to bus. It will have to fly to ALL of the schools in C-USA.
Second you are commenting only on mens basketball. You think that UMass sees an advantage to flying all of those non revenue sports teams it has (16 if you count football and M/W basketball all as revenue sports) to Florida, New Mexico and every state in between? Will this version of C-USA be able to payout P5 type or even BE level $ to its members? Because that is what it will take to offset the added expense of sending those teams all over the South. If C-USA can't provide that type of payout, it would be NJIT to the Great Midwest Conference stupid for UMass to leave the A-10.
Third, for the guy commenting on gym size. What really matters is whether those gyms are packed when you play in them and do those schools help pack your gym. Also, how many NCAA bids do you think this version of C-USA is going to get? I bet the A-10 has two or three more every year. How much are those credits worth again?

I didn’t say it was better in C-USA. I was only referring to your bolded statement, which isn’t true. Also, a quick look at the attendance in the sport that is keeping UMass in the A10, basketball, proves those A10 teams don’t keep their gym packed.

A 10-0 team vs a MAC opponent fills the stands vs a 4-6 team vs an A10 opponent. It’s pretty simple.

(11-04-2021 12:08 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 11:23 AM)e-parade Wrote:  No. We won't drop down.

A very small number of UMass fans prefer the CAA. No one wants to be independent, but most of us prefer indy FBS to ever going back to FCS.

Seems to me that UMass and CUSA could work out a deal. X number of ooc basketball games annually, rotated through the CUSA membership. Say 4. And UMass gets a football only membership.

UConn basketball is big enough to make that arrangement work. UMass basketball would need a significant resurgence.

Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk

(11-05-2021 06:18 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 11:01 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 09:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 08:59 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 08:47 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  Most of the A-10 is a bus trip away from UMass. I can't imagine any circumstance where UMass would willingly trade mostly bus trips for mostly flying its Olympic sports to C-USA away games. UMass and UConn as football only members is probably the best outcome for all sides. That gives C-USA numbers and stability and in return the schools get the opportunity to have a second season and play for a conference championship.

Not so fast my friend!

As a follower of the A10, I can say that isn’t true. I’m pretty sure UMass doesn’t bus to Davidson, Richmond X2, Fairfax, DC, Olean, Pittsburgh, Dayton, and St. Louis.

I count bus trips to Rhode Island, the Bronx, and Philly X2.

And most of those bus trips are to go play in high school gyms.

You guys have yourselves a little confused.
First, DC and Fairfax are within a six/seven hour drive of Amherst. Richmond is eight hours. Even if UMass flies to the schools you think are too far to bus. It will have to fly to ALL of the schools in C-USA.
Second you are commenting only on mens basketball. You think that UMass sees an advantage to flying all of those non revenue sports teams it has (16 if you count football and M/W basketball all as revenue sports) to Florida, New Mexico and every state in between? Will this version of C-USA be able to payout P5 type or even BE level $ to its members? Because that is what it will take to offset the added expense of sending those teams all over the South. If C-USA can't provide that type of payout, it would be NJIT to the Great Midwest Conference stupid for UMass to leave the A-10.
Third, for the guy commenting on gym size. What really matters is whether those gyms are packed when you play in them and do those schools help pack your gym. Also, how many NCAA bids do you think this version of C-USA is going to get? I bet the A-10 has two or three more every year. How much are those credits worth again?

I didn’t say it was better in C-USA. I was only referring to your bolded statement, which isn’t true. Also, a quick look at the attendance in the sport that is keeping UMass in the A10, basketball, proves those A10 teams don’t keep their gym packed.

A 10-0 team vs a MAC opponent fills the stands vs a 4-6 team vs an A10 opponent. It’s pretty simple.

So true and makes no financial sense for UMass not to go all sports in the MAC, which receives over 2M and the A10 is 1/2 M. It's about POWER. Not to allow Football to have more POWER than basketball.

(11-05-2021 06:48 AM)freshtop Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 12:08 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  Seems to me that UMass and CUSA could work out a deal. X number of ooc basketball games annually, rotated through the CUSA membership. Say 4. And UMass gets a football only membership.

UConn basketball is big enough to make that arrangement work. UMass basketball would need a significant resurgence.

That is the exact deal UMass and Temple had with the MAC ... but the idea was to have both of them, where with 12 basketball schools, the all-sports schools are playing one of the two in 2/3 of their seasons and hosting one of them in 1/3 of their seasons.

And it was more Temple driving the interest in the basketball schools than UMass.

At 9 all-sports with one FB-only, the advantage is you can split the +$1m/school from the Go5 distribution with the FB-only school, $500K to the affiliate, $500K to travel subsidies to the schools traveling to the affiliate that year, and if you get a modest bump in the media contract from the larger inventory, share it among the 9 full members.

(11-04-2021 07:05 PM)AuzGrams Wrote:  I like UMass, UCONN, Army working together as independents.

I do as well. The geographic proximity of these schools in relation to one another is nice.

I am all about UConn and UMass trying to keep their football programs linked in some way at the moment. If they both don't stay Indy, I hope that they join the same conference for football as a package deal. I think that it would help college football in the region and boost the profile of both schools (as "The U Game" has history and would be a great national game if both schools got better and played the game annually).

As a UConn fan, I feel differently in basketball. The northeast is a crowded place in regard to the number of basketball schools vying for the best NYC players. Elevating UMass to a higher league than the A-10 just adds one more school with which to compete for those top NYC kids (and in basketball, edging out another school for that one superstar can be the difference between being a Final Four team or a NIT team).

UConn and UMass football will be fine, though. Especially if both schools try to elevate each other to improve college football in the region.

(11-04-2021 11:07 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Their AD has already said being an independent is untenable. I think they could work it out but most of their fanbase either wants to be in the MAC all-sports, CAA, or C-USA football-only. Almost none of them wants to be independent.

I'm one UMass fan who thinks dropping to FCS is defeatist. If the options are FCS or Independent I'd choose Independent every single time. I like playing CAA teams, but would far prefer playing them as an FBS team than FCS. Frankly, I wish more CAA teams would move up!

(11-04-2021 02:04 PM)UConnHusky Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 01:36 PM)Troy_Fan_15 Wrote:  Exactly. If UConn football isn't going down I can't imagine UMass football would.

Both schools aren't exactly in the same boat. UConn can still trade on the fact that they were once in a power conference in football (back when the Big East existed as a BCS conference). UMass was in the MAC and is now Indy (they were never a power school).

UConn has a 40K seat stadium built specifically for them for FBS football. UMass has a 15K seat stadium that they have been using since FCS days.

UConn has a P5 level indoor practice facility and locker rooms. UMass, while having investing some money on a practice facility, doesn't have facilities on the same level.

UConn is scheduling home and homes with P5 schools. UMass is not.

UConn has its own linear television contract to play on CBS Sports Network. UMass has its games streamed on FloSports.

So, while there are some similarities between the two schools (both currently play really bad football), there are many many differences. None of that is a diss to UMass, it is just that UConn has had more time and invested more money in their program. There is a 0% chance that UConn flushes all of that time, effort, and money down the toilet. UMass, however, could decide to cut their losses and it wouldn't be nearly as tragic for their school. Not that they will.... I think that they will also remain at the FBS level (as they should).

Keep dreaming. UConn was blown off by CUSA the same as UMass was blown off. The fact is UConn is actually in worse shape than UMass. UConn doesn't have an on campus stadium and who is going to drive half an hour to watch UConn lose to an FCS school? nobody.
I'm telling the facts as they are. CT is a basketcase of a state economically. People are leaving in droves. The population is going down and most of the Fortune 50/100 companies have left the state. Foxwoods is probably going under and if they weren't an Indian reservation, they would have been foreclosed on. Encore and Twin rivers has eaten Foxwoods lunch.

(11-05-2021 02:32 PM)McKinney Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 11:07 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Their AD has already said being an independent is untenable. I think they could work it out but most of their fanbase either wants to be in the MAC all-sports, CAA, or C-USA football-only. Almost none of them wants to be independent.

I'm one UMass fan who thinks dropping to FCS is defeatist. If the options are FCS or Independent I'd choose Independent every single time. I like playing CAA teams, but would far prefer playing them as an FBS team than FCS. Frankly, I wish more CAA teams would move up!

The major problem with UMass football is the scheduling. This year's schedule was absolutely brutal and it didn't have to be that way. 3 ACC games, 2 tough MAC teams, Coastal and Liberty, THEN the easy FCS games. UMass is so beat up by the time they get to the easy games that UMass may not win them.
And the worst part of the scheduling is that AD Bamford did not have to schedule them that way. Schedule 2 or 3 FCS teams to begin the season THEN play the P5 teams.

(11-05-2021 04:54 PM)ZooMass84 Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 02:04 PM)UConnHusky Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 01:36 PM)Troy_Fan_15 Wrote:  Exactly. If UConn football isn't going down I can't imagine UMass football would.

Both schools aren't exactly in the same boat. UConn can still trade on the fact that they were once in a power conference in football (back when the Big East existed as a BCS conference). UMass was in the MAC and is now Indy (they were never a power school).

UConn has a 40K seat stadium built specifically for them for FBS football. UMass has a 15K seat stadium that they have been using since FCS days.

UConn has a P5 level indoor practice facility and locker rooms. UMass, while having investing some money on a practice facility, doesn't have facilities on the same level.

UConn is scheduling home and homes with P5 schools. UMass is not.

UConn has its own linear television contract to play on CBS Sports Network. UMass has its games streamed on FloSports.

So, while there are some similarities between the two schools (both currently play really bad football), there are many many differences. None of that is a diss to UMass, it is just that UConn has had more time and invested more money in their program. There is a 0% chance that UConn flushes all of that time, effort, and money down the toilet. UMass, however, could decide to cut their losses and it wouldn't be nearly as tragic for their school. Not that they will.... I think that they will also remain at the FBS level (as they should).

Keep dreaming. UConn was blown off by CUSA the same as UMass was blown off. The fact is UConn is actually in worse shape than UMass. UConn doesn't have an on campus stadium and who is going to drive half an hour to watch UConn lose to an FCS school? nobody.
I'm telling the facts as they are. CT is a basketcase of a state economically. People are leaving in droves. The population is going down and most of the Fortune 50/100 companies have left the state. Foxwoods is probably going under and if they weren't an Indian reservation, they would have been foreclosed on. Encore and Twin rivers has eaten Foxwoods lunch.

UConn has its own linear tv contract with CBSSN. UConn has 10 P5 home games scheduled between 2022-2028. UMass has 1.

UConn, in no way, is in worse shape than UMass.

(11-05-2021 06:58 AM)Steve1981 Wrote:  

(11-05-2021 06:18 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 11:01 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 09:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 08:59 PM)esayem Wrote:  Not so fast my friend!

As a follower of the A10, I can say that isn’t true. I’m pretty sure UMass doesn’t bus to Davidson, Richmond X2, Fairfax, DC, Olean, Pittsburgh, Dayton, and St. Louis.

I count bus trips to Rhode Island, the Bronx, and Philly X2.

And most of those bus trips are to go play in high school gyms.

You guys have yourselves a little confused.
First, DC and Fairfax are within a six/seven hour drive of Amherst. Richmond is eight hours. Even if UMass flies to the schools you think are too far to bus. It will have to fly to ALL of the schools in C-USA.
Second you are commenting only on mens basketball. You think that UMass sees an advantage to flying all of those non revenue sports teams it has (16 if you count football and M/W basketball all as revenue sports) to Florida, New Mexico and every state in between? Will this version of C-USA be able to payout P5 type or even BE level $ to its members? Because that is what it will take to offset the added expense of sending those teams all over the South. If C-USA can't provide that type of payout, it would be NJIT to the Great Midwest Conference stupid for UMass to leave the A-10.
Third, for the guy commenting on gym size. What really matters is whether those gyms are packed when you play in them and do those schools help pack your gym. Also, how many NCAA bids do you think this version of C-USA is going to get? I bet the A-10 has two or three more every year. How much are those credits worth again?

I didn’t say it was better in C-USA. I was only referring to your bolded statement, which isn’t true. Also, a quick look at the attendance in the sport that is keeping UMass in the A10, basketball, proves those A10 teams don’t keep their gym packed.

A 10-0 team vs a MAC opponent fills the stands vs a 4-6 team vs an A10 opponent. It’s pretty simple.

So true and makes no financial sense for UMass not to go all sports in the MAC, which receives over 2M and the A10 is 1/2 M. It's about POWER. Not to allow Football to have more POWER than basketball.

Looking back it would appear that leaving the MAC was a major mistake. It wouldn't have affected hockey in Hockey East and not lacrosse either.

(11-05-2021 02:32 PM)McKinney Wrote:  

(11-04-2021 11:07 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Their AD has already said being an independent is untenable. I think they could work it out but most of their fanbase either wants to be in the MAC all-sports, CAA, or C-USA football-only. Almost none of them wants to be independent.

I'm one UMass fan who thinks dropping to FCS is defeatist. If the options are FCS or Independent I'd choose Independent every single time. I like playing CAA teams, but would far prefer playing them as an FBS team than FCS. Frankly, I wish more CAA teams would move up!

I don’t blame you. I don’t know why historically significant programs like Holy Cross, Fordham, and Villanova don’t move up, while essentially juco public schools do. I mean I know why, large student body, tuition subsidies etc.

I’m hoping UMass gets an all-sports home and W&M takes their spot in the A-10!

UConn, UMass, should focus on scheduling home and home games against fbs schools with good basketball but have weaker football programs in exchange for scheduling them in basketball also. And of course Army is nearby as well.

(11-05-2021 10:40 PM)polkhigh Wrote:  UConn, UMass, should focus on scheduling home and home games against fbs schools with good basketball but have weaker football programs in exchange for scheduling them in basketball also. And of course Army is nearby as well.

Yes, lots of Indiana, Arizona, Kansas, Rutgers, Maryland, Vanderbilt, hell even Colorado, Northwestern, Purdue, Cal, some lower PAC schools. Maybe a 2 for 1 with Arkansas & Tennessee?

(11-06-2021 12:33 AM)AuzGrams Wrote:  

(11-05-2021 10:40 PM)polkhigh Wrote:  UConn, UMass, should focus on scheduling home and home games against fbs schools with good basketball but have weaker football programs in exchange for scheduling them in basketball also. And of course Army is nearby as well.

Yes, lots of Indiana, Arizona, Kansas, Rutgers, Maryland, Vanderbilt, hell even Colorado, Northwestern, Purdue, Cal, some lower PAC schools. Maybe a 2 for 1 with Arkansas & Tennessee?

The problem for UMass is that they aren't playing the 1 anywhere near Amherst unless its a Syracuse, Wake Forest, or Rutgers.

(11-05-2021 10:40 PM)polkhigh Wrote:  UConn, UMass, should focus on scheduling home and home games against fbs schools with good basketball but have weaker football programs in exchange for scheduling them in basketball also. And of course Army is nearby as well.

This is a good idea.