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Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
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TroyTBoy Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.
10-12-2021 09:09 PM
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CarlSmithCenter Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-12-2021 09:09 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.
It would take someone putting a full-on, Sergio-level chaos magic curse on Nova for them to share a conference with USF again.
[Image: sergio-snl.gif]
(This post was last modified: 10-12-2021 09:44 PM by CarlSmithCenter.)
10-12-2021 09:41 PM
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Bogg Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-12-2021 09:09 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.

The real problem is that the Big East isn't going to want to dilute their basketball schedule and tournament metrics for a league that isn't going to net them any more money even if everyone got a full share, football or no. It'd solve some problems for UConn, Temple, and Memphis, but create tons of new problems for the other current Big East members.
10-13-2021 08:07 AM
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bill dazzle Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
If a new FBS football-only league could be created that is loosely affiliated with the Big East but operated separately ... that could work. It could be called the Big East Football Conference and it would have its own commissioner (much like the FCS Missouri Valley Football Conference vis-a-vis the Missouri Valley Conference).

This non-football league could have Villanova and UConn football (thus the "Big East" name). Other members (and assuming they could have all their other sports in other leagues) could include UMass, Buffalo, Navy, ODU, Temple and Marshall. That's a solid eight-team football-only league that is focused on the Mid-Atlantic and Northeast regions. Maybe Army could be tempted and/or James Madison elevated.

I'm not even sure this is allowed in FBS.
10-13-2021 08:43 AM
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Frank the Tank Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers

The Big East schools didn't want to do this even with excellent basketball programs like Cincinnati and Houston still in the league. Heck, UConn affirmatively left this league with Cincinnati and Houston still in it and now the AAC is way weaker basketball-wise today. Plus, the Big East basketball schools are making more basketball-specific TV revenue by a large margin, so they'd just be diluting that among those other schools.

This goes back to the other thread about which league is enjoying watching conference realignment from the sidelines and I believe it's totally the Big East. They want nothing to do with football-related conference realignment again and this year shows exactly why the Catholic 7 made the choice to split off in 2013. All of them went through that dance for a decade already with schools they actually cared about like Syracuse and Pitt (plus Notre Dame). They're certainly not going to willingly bring it on again with AAC schools they legitimately don't care about here and would actually net them less money. It makes no sense.
10-13-2021 10:18 AM
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Frank the Tank Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-12-2021 09:09 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.

Once again, the Big East schools actually make P5 level TV money for basketball. They even made more TV money than all of the G5 leagues for all sports up until the last couple of years with the new AAC contract... and that AAC contract is almost assuredly going down where the Big East will pass them again on their current AND the Big East gets a new TV deal that will likely be much higher in a couple of years, too. All that is being achieved with just basketball.

Make no mistake about it: the Big East basketball schools are the ones bringing the TV value here as opposed to the football schools. Power 5 football/basketball revenue splits have no application at all in this instance when the Big East is so much more valuable in its particular sport of basketball compared to what the G5 are worth in football.
10-13-2021 10:22 AM
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Milwaukee Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-13-2021 10:22 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 09:09 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.

Once again, the Big East schools actually make P5 level TV money for basketball. They even made more TV money than all of the G5 leagues for all sports up until the last couple of years with the new AAC contract... and that AAC contract is almost assuredly going down where the Big East will pass them again on their current AND the Big East gets a new TV deal that will likely be much higher in a couple of years, too. All that is being achieved with just basketball.

Make no mistake about it: the Big East basketball schools are the ones bringing the TV value here as opposed to the football schools. Power 5 football/basketball revenue splits have no application at all in this instance when the Big East is so much more valuable in its particular sport of basketball compared to what the G5 are worth in football.

Correction: compared to some (not all) of the G5 conferences.

The Big East schools only earn around $4 million/year. That is similar to what the MWC schools are earning and significantly less than what the AAC schools are earning.
10-13-2021 01:04 PM
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AssyrianDuke Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-12-2021 09:09 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.

This is actually a bad idea.

The current Big East teams left because they wanted to focus on basketball and not the money dump that is a football program. They also wanted to make sure they could get as many at large invites (and the resulting tournament credits) as possible. And it worked! They have a decent TV package, and have never had less than four teams in the men's tourney. Why would they throw away those strides in order to lump themselves in with schools that don't have the same cachet in basketball. Memphis is good, but hasn't been a top team since Calipari left; SMU is fine; the rest are meh at best. If the Big East teams wanted to play them in basketball, add them to the OOC. Football doesn't matter to the Big East as much as basketball does. It's what ties these teams/brands/schools together.
10-13-2021 02:03 PM
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AssyrianDuke Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-13-2021 01:04 PM)Milwaukee Wrote:  
(10-13-2021 10:22 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 09:09 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.

Once again, the Big East schools actually make P5 level TV money for basketball. They even made more TV money than all of the G5 leagues for all sports up until the last couple of years with the new AAC contract... and that AAC contract is almost assuredly going down where the Big East will pass them again on their current AND the Big East gets a new TV deal that will likely be much higher in a couple of years, too. All that is being achieved with just basketball.

Make no mistake about it: the Big East basketball schools are the ones bringing the TV value here as opposed to the football schools. Power 5 football/basketball revenue splits have no application at all in this instance when the Big East is so much more valuable in its particular sport of basketball compared to what the G5 are worth in football.

Correction: compared to some (not all) of the G5 conferences.

The Big East schools only earn around $4 million/year. That is similar to what the MWC schools are earning and significantly less than what the AAC schools are earning.

The Big East schools are getting around $4.6M on the current deal, and that could grow to between $6M and $8M by the time it gets renegotiated (https://ncaahoopsdigest.com/2021/06/18/t...ith-fs1/).

MWC are earning just under $4M at around $3.75M or so, not counting Boise State's special kickback (https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/moun...-sports/).

The AAC currently tops both those leagues, but the important caveat is that the number will almost assuredly go down in the next round of negotiations. By the time the next agreement is signed the AAC will be at 50-60% of its current TV values.

And none of this takes into account the tournament credits for the men's tournament, which is an advantage for the Big East to the tune of $7M per school, according to the first article I linked.
10-13-2021 02:15 PM
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ccd494 Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-13-2021 02:15 PM)AssyrianDuke Wrote:  
(10-13-2021 01:04 PM)Milwaukee Wrote:  
(10-13-2021 10:22 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 09:09 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.

Once again, the Big East schools actually make P5 level TV money for basketball. They even made more TV money than all of the G5 leagues for all sports up until the last couple of years with the new AAC contract... and that AAC contract is almost assuredly going down where the Big East will pass them again on their current AND the Big East gets a new TV deal that will likely be much higher in a couple of years, too. All that is being achieved with just basketball.

Make no mistake about it: the Big East basketball schools are the ones bringing the TV value here as opposed to the football schools. Power 5 football/basketball revenue splits have no application at all in this instance when the Big East is so much more valuable in its particular sport of basketball compared to what the G5 are worth in football.

Correction: compared to some (not all) of the G5 conferences.

The Big East schools only earn around $4 million/year. That is similar to what the MWC schools are earning and significantly less than what the AAC schools are earning.

The Big East schools are getting around $4.6M on the current deal, and that could grow to between $6M and $8M by the time it gets renegotiated (https://ncaahoopsdigest.com/2021/06/18/t...ith-fs1/).

MWC are earning just under $4M at around $3.75M or so, not counting Boise State's special kickback (https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/moun...-sports/).

The AAC currently tops both those leagues, but the important caveat is that the number will almost assuredly go down in the next round of negotiations. By the time the next agreement is signed the AAC will be at 50-60% of its current TV values.

And none of this takes into account the tournament credits for the men's tournament, which is an advantage for the Big East to the tune of $7M per school, according to the first article I linked.

Another important factor is that the majority of the Big East schools don't need to pay for football, increasing the marginal money they earn from their media deals.

People on this board always get distracted by the shiny "Now we make $3M and we used to make $1M" without asking whether they needed to increase expenses by more than $2M to do so.
10-13-2021 02:21 PM
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bill dazzle Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
(10-13-2021 02:03 PM)AssyrianDuke Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 09:09 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  
(10-12-2021 08:59 PM)panite Wrote:  The NBE would be better off putting the band back together than starting an FCS league. Just remerge with the AAC while they are hanging out there with 7 all sports schools and the Navy/Wichita combination. Move Villanova up to FBS and add UConn FB. The merged conference can then play an 18 game BB conference schedule with 19 teams.

FB East - Villanova, Temple, ECU, UConn, USF
FB West - Navy, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, Tulsa
04-cheers


This is actually a good idea.

However, they basketball schools will eventually get paranoid with the football schools earning most of the money.

This is actually a bad idea.

The current Big East teams left because they wanted to focus on basketball and not the money dump that is a football program. They also wanted to make sure they could get as many at large invites (and the resulting tournament credits) as possible. And it worked! They have a decent TV package, and have never had less than four teams in the men's tourney. Why would they throw away those strides in order to lump themselves in with schools that don't have the same cachet in basketball. Memphis is good, but hasn't been a top team since Calipari left; SMU is fine; the rest are meh at best. If the Big East teams wanted to play them in basketball, add them to the OOC. Football doesn't matter to the Big East as much as basketball does. It's what ties these teams/brands/schools together.

As to your "Memphis is good, but hasn't been a top team since Calipari left" ...

Despite having some mediocre teams since Cal left, Memphis has remained a relevant program. This is what some posters don't seem to understand. This is about long-term program relevance. Even at its worst, Memphis basketball can draw fans to the FexEx forum, can lure a quality coach (for example, Tubby Smith) and can be on the radar of high-profile prep talent. Recruits are naturally drawn to programs like that of Memphis for various reasons. Memphis could go 0-30 for year on year (an exaggeration but you get my point) and would still offer a certain lure. That's what we call a "brand."

Here's an example (from the Memphis Commercial Appeal):

For the 2016-17 season, Memphis reached a 35-year attendance low by averaging "just" 9,622 fans.

Think about how many men's hoops programs would like to average only 9,600 fans.
(This post was last modified: 10-13-2021 02:37 PM by bill dazzle.)
10-13-2021 02:34 PM
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Mister Consistency Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Could the NBE start to sponsor FCS football, ala the WAC?
I guess you could if you wanted to jump through some hoops, but the priorities of a lot of schools would have to change (chiefly UConn, but also Butler), they'd likely have to add a 12th school (Dayton?), and I'm not convinced a mediocre FCS conference would be viewed as a positive thing for the Big East from a brand standpoint. But the landscape is still changing in FCS, so maybe it'll make more sense at some point in the next few years.
10-13-2021 02:56 PM
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