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Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
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CitrusUCF Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 12:12 PM)Todor Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 11:44 AM)The WEST is the BEST Wrote:  
(09-12-2021 11:21 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(09-12-2021 08:21 PM)Schadenfreude Wrote:  Liberty has a Center for Creation Studies devoted to teaching a supposed "creation-evolution controversy."

03-puke

Versus "CRT" today?

I love how some people say Liberty faculty don't have academic freedom, while disliking things their faculty are free to teach.

In other non controversial news, Brigham Young teaches about the Book of Mormon, and Notre Dame teaches life begins at conception...

Scholars at BYU have published doubts about the historicity of the Book of Mormon and associated materials before. BYU still has some academic freedom issues nonetheless, but for instance, Egyptologists have been able to publish accurate details about the Joseph Smith papyri, which point to them having no basis for the Mormon religious texts for which they served as the "source." Even if BYU is teaching that the Book of Mormon is historically accurate, that does not call into question the teaching of valid science. It would simply be a near certain inaccurate history of the prehistorical world in the Americas.

Life beginning at conception is a purely philosophical discussion that science cannot prove or disprove. Science is value neutral, so the life at conception debate is left to philosophy to judge.

Saying that the Earth is 7,000 years old flies in the face of all science. It cannot be taken seriously as an academic endeavor. Will they also be engaging in aging research to see how humans used to live for centuries as discussed in the Old Testament?

The two examples you offered are not analogous to Liberty's creationism center. If Liberty wants to be a serious university, then they should ship that center off to Patrick Henry College, where they make Liberty look like a bunch of liberal atheists.
09-13-2021 12:28 PM
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geef Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 11:44 AM)The WEST is the BEST Wrote:  
(09-12-2021 11:21 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(09-12-2021 08:21 PM)Schadenfreude Wrote:  Liberty has a Center for Creation Studies devoted to teaching a supposed "creation-evolution controversy."

03-puke

Versus "CRT" today?

Gotta nominate you for the most brilliant post of the day (hell, it'll probably hold for the balance of the week). 01-wingedeagle
09-13-2021 12:32 PM
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SlyFox Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
Sigh. Once again, Creation Studies falls into the School of Divinity and not Science Department. Young Earth Theory i just one of many origin theories and not generally viewed by the school as the preferred thought. In fact, it is tough to find many on LU faculty, staff or student body who espouse the Young Earth Theory. But I get that it makes a fun talking point even if it factually wrong in regard to LU. An absence of knowledge of the situation has never stopped anone from havng overheated opinions. Just take a look at national discourse these days on nearly every topic.
09-13-2021 12:37 PM
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BleedingPurple Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
I think that have a better chance at the AAC than they ever did at the Sunbelt. They are private, the Sunbelt is completely made up of public universities. The AAC has always had a mix, even more so when they were all together as the Big East.
09-13-2021 12:41 PM
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Gamecock Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
I don't think it's particularly imminent but I wouldn't be surprised if it happened at some point in the next 5 - 10 years.
09-13-2021 12:45 PM
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Gamecock Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-10-2021 08:08 PM)JMU2004 Wrote:  Liberty got rich off of selling online degrees on the back of federal student loans. Other schools know that…they’re the payday loan sharks of higher education. It’s how’s they funded all those shiny facilities after being broke in 2007.

That, more than anything else, is why schools are reluctant to associate with Liberty. Add in the Falwell mess (Sr and Jr), the political battles they so happily embrace, and it’s a very hard sell.

Doesn't everyone else pretty much do the same thing now? I get targeted ads all the time from SC, UNC, Vandy, Arizona State, etc for all their online masters programs.
09-13-2021 12:47 PM
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SlyFox Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
I agree completely, BleedingPurple. When the Belt said thanks but no thanks to our request for an invitation there were some including A-State AD who suggested that there were questions if Liberty could be competitive in the league. 7-1 in football vs SBC since the decision woud tend to suggest the league may have a different view now. But the shoe would be on the other foot at this stage.

Aresco is going to work with Bristol to make sure he has the best pieces in place regardless of how many feel about the choices. If the league takes four teams then I believe we have a very good chance of landing an invitation. The odds decrease dramatically for every number less than four.
09-13-2021 12:48 PM
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quo vadis Online
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Post: #68
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 12:28 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 12:12 PM)Todor Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 11:44 AM)The WEST is the BEST Wrote:  
(09-12-2021 11:21 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(09-12-2021 08:21 PM)Schadenfreude Wrote:  Liberty has a Center for Creation Studies devoted to teaching a supposed "creation-evolution controversy."

03-puke

Versus "CRT" today?

I love how some people say Liberty faculty don't have academic freedom, while disliking things their faculty are free to teach.

In other non controversial news, Brigham Young teaches about the Book of Mormon, and Notre Dame teaches life begins at conception...

Scholars at BYU have published doubts about the historicity of the Book of Mormon and associated materials before. BYU still has some academic freedom issues nonetheless, but for instance, Egyptologists have been able to publish accurate details about the Joseph Smith papyri, which point to them having no basis for the Mormon religious texts for which they served as the "source." Even if BYU is teaching that the Book of Mormon is historically accurate, that does not call into question the teaching of valid science. It would simply be a near certain inaccurate history of the prehistorical world in the Americas.

Life beginning at conception is a purely philosophical discussion that science cannot prove or disprove. Science is value neutral, so the life at conception debate is left to philosophy to judge.

Saying that the Earth is 7,000 years old flies in the face of all science. It cannot be taken seriously as an academic endeavor. Will they also be engaging in aging research to see how humans used to live for centuries as discussed in the Old Testament?

The two examples you offered are not analogous to Liberty's creationism center. If Liberty wants to be a serious university, then they should ship that center off to Patrick Henry College, where they make Liberty look like a bunch of liberal atheists.

Well, Liberty University is accredited as a whole, and IIRC several of its colleges are domain-specific accredited as well. So I think the teaching of Creationism is pretty well isolated in that sense, doesn't seem to affect education in other disciplines.
(This post was last modified: 09-13-2021 12:58 PM by quo vadis.)
09-13-2021 12:51 PM
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Post: #69
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 12:37 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  Sigh. Once again, Creation Studies falls into the School of Divinity and not Science Department. Young Earth Theory i just one of many origin theories and not generally viewed by the school as the preferred thought.

Liberty University maintains a Creation Hall on the second floor of the Center for Natural Sciences near the center of campus "dedicated to promoting young-Earth creation to students, faculty, staff, and visitors." The hall "displays numerous replicas of ancient post-Flood humans and non-human primates, as well as fossils of organisms buried during Noah's flood and it's aftermath."
09-13-2021 01:20 PM
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tigerjamesc Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-10-2021 08:08 PM)JMU2004 Wrote:  Liberty got rich off of selling online degrees on the back of federal student loans. Other schools know that…they’re the payday loan sharks of higher education. It’s how’s they funded all those shiny facilities after being broke in 2007.

That, more than anything else, is why schools are reluctant to associate with Liberty. Add in the Falwell mess (Sr and Jr), the political battles they so happily embrace, and it’s a very hard sell.

So they made brilliant business moves and this is a negative?

Getting rid of Falwell Jr=they are so happy to embrace?
09-13-2021 01:54 PM
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Shox Online
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Post: #71
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 01:20 PM)Schadenfreude Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 12:37 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  Sigh. Once again, Creation Studies falls into the School of Divinity and not Science Department. Young Earth Theory i just one of many origin theories and not generally viewed by the school as the preferred thought.

Liberty University maintains a Creation Hall on the second floor of the Center for Natural Sciences near the center of campus "dedicated to promoting young-Earth creation to students, faculty, staff, and visitors." The hall "displays numerous replicas of ancient post-Flood humans and non-human primates, as well as fossils of organisms buried during Noah's flood and it's aftermath."

LOL, if this bothers you and doesn't match your world view then don't attend Liberty. If your LGBT and don't like their honor code, don't attend or seek employment at BYU or Liberty.
If you want to have sex before marriage, don't attend these types of private schools either. Those schools serve a certain demographic and are wildly successful at it.
09-13-2021 02:14 PM
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SlyFox Offline
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Post: #72
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
It is a display from the Creations Studies folks inside a hallway in one of the buildings. We do not have a Creation Hall. We also have displays of art in hallways. So that makes us fixated on a narrow view of art in the world, right? Moving right along.
(This post was last modified: 09-13-2021 02:28 PM by SlyFox.)
09-13-2021 02:24 PM
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Nerdlinger Offline
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Post: #73
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 02:14 PM)Shox Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 01:20 PM)Schadenfreude Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 12:37 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  Sigh. Once again, Creation Studies falls into the School of Divinity and not Science Department. Young Earth Theory i just one of many origin theories and not generally viewed by the school as the preferred thought.

Liberty University maintains a Creation Hall on the second floor of the Center for Natural Sciences near the center of campus "dedicated to promoting young-Earth creation to students, faculty, staff, and visitors." The hall "displays numerous replicas of ancient post-Flood humans and non-human primates, as well as fossils of organisms buried during Noah's flood and it's aftermath."

LOL, if this bothers you and doesn't match your world view then don't attend Liberty. If your LGBT and don't like their honor code, don't attend or seek employment at BYU or Liberty.
If you want to have sex before marriage, don't attend these types of private schools either. Those schools serve a certain demographic and are wildly successful at it.

What's important to note is that things like this Creation Hall are a big part of why Liberty is perceived as a joke among universities, which affects how desirable they are as an add for conferences.
09-13-2021 02:25 PM
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SlyFox Offline
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Post: #74
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
Very close The perception that these things exist impacts the impression among universities. Reality and ill-informed speculation are tough to overcome.
09-13-2021 02:29 PM
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Nerdlinger Offline
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Post: #75
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 02:29 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  Very close The perception that these things exist impacts the impression among universities. Reality and ill-informed speculation are tough to overcome.

You're saying that Creation Hall doesn't exist. Bold claim.
09-13-2021 02:41 PM
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SlyFox Offline
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Post: #76
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
That is correct. It is not a bold claim. There is a Center for Creation Studies in the LU School of Divinity. There is no "Creation Hall". There is a little glassed in display in a hallway showing that there is a Center for Creation Studies in the School of Divinity. It is what it is.
09-13-2021 04:05 PM
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Post: #77
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 04:05 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  That is correct. It is not a bold claim. There is a Center for Creation Studies in the LU School of Divinity. There is no "Creation Hall". There is a little glassed in display in a hallway showing that there is a Center for Creation Studies in the School of Divinity. It is what it is.

I mean the Liberty page literally says:

Quote:The Creation Hall is located on the second floor of the Center for Natural Sciences overlooking Liberty University’s beautiful central green space.
https://www.liberty.edu/arts-sciences/cr...s/display/


Is this just a bad use of language and they're saying there's a hallway with this display? As opposed to defining it as "Creation Hall" being a full building?


Also, the fact that this exists on campus is going to make many university systems and presidents not want to associate with Liberty. Doesn't matter how prominent it is.
(This post was last modified: 09-13-2021 04:19 PM by e-parade.)
09-13-2021 04:18 PM
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Post: #78
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 04:18 PM)e-parade Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 04:05 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  That is correct. It is not a bold claim. There is a Center for Creation Studies in the LU School of Divinity. There is no "Creation Hall". There is a little glassed in display in a hallway showing that there is a Center for Creation Studies in the School of Divinity. It is what it is.

I mean the Liberty page literally says:

Quote:The Creation Hall is located on the second floor of the Center for Natural Sciences overlooking Liberty University’s beautiful central green space.
https://www.liberty.edu/arts-sciences/cr...s/display/


Is this just a bad use of language and they're saying there's a hallway with this display? As opposed to defining it as "Creation Hall" being a full building?


Also, the fact that this exists on campus is going to make many university systems and presidents not want to associate with Liberty. Doesn't matter how prominent it is.

Agreed. Regardless of what they actually call the place or what any of us believe, promoting pseudoscience in the modern age is not how you win friends in academia.
09-13-2021 04:52 PM
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Post: #79
RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-13-2021 12:28 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 12:12 PM)Todor Wrote:  
(09-13-2021 11:44 AM)The WEST is the BEST Wrote:  
(09-12-2021 11:21 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(09-12-2021 08:21 PM)Schadenfreude Wrote:  Liberty has a Center for Creation Studies devoted to teaching a supposed "creation-evolution controversy."

03-puke

Versus "CRT" today?

I love how some people say Liberty faculty don't have academic freedom, while disliking things their faculty are free to teach.

In other non controversial news, Brigham Young teaches about the Book of Mormon, and Notre Dame teaches life begins at conception...

Scholars at BYU have published doubts about the historicity of the Book of Mormon and associated materials before. BYU still has some academic freedom issues nonetheless, but for instance, Egyptologists have been able to publish accurate details about the Joseph Smith papyri, which point to them having no basis for the Mormon religious texts for which they served as the "source." Even if BYU is teaching that the Book of Mormon is historically accurate, that does not call into question the teaching of valid science. It would simply be a near certain inaccurate history of the prehistorical world in the Americas.

Life beginning at conception is a purely philosophical discussion that science cannot prove or disprove. Science is value neutral, so the life at conception debate is left to philosophy to judge.

Saying that the Earth is 7,000 years old flies in the face of all science. It cannot be taken seriously as an academic endeavor. Will they also be engaging in aging research to see how humans used to live for centuries as discussed in the Old Testament?

The two examples you offered are not analogous to Liberty's creationism center. If Liberty wants to be a serious university, then they should ship that center off to Patrick Henry College, where they make Liberty look like a bunch of liberal atheists.

I didn't mention the Book of Abraham. And if you think BYU faculty publish that the Book of Mormon is not true, you are totally delusional. Beyond any form of rational though.

My only point was, the secular world ALWAYS finds fault with virtually ANY Christian based line of thought and uses it to "prove" all kinds of ludicrous claims. The academic world finds fault with things taught at other Christian universities and the world still keeps turning. Long term, things will be no different for Liberty.
(This post was last modified: 09-13-2021 11:03 PM by Todor.)
09-13-2021 11:02 PM
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RE: Does Liberty have a snowballs chance in hell of getting into the AAC?
(09-10-2021 04:27 PM)ChrisLords Wrote:  I've been having some discussion about Liberty to the AAC in another thread and I tried to dismissed the notion of Liberty getting into the AAC but kept getting responses.

Does Liberty have a chance of getting into the AAC? I'd like to see it. It would put a Virginia school in 3 different conferences. Which is more for me to root for but I assumed the issues that prevented Liberty from getting into the SunBelt would also prevent them from getting into the AAC.
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09-13-2021 11:24 PM
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