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Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
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BruceMcF Online
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Post: #61
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-13-2021 08:28 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  
(07-12-2021 06:07 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 09:59 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  I think if Houston ever gets the golden ticket, Rice is in the AAC. SMU, Tulsa, and Tulane will want an institution similar to them. Navy will want a game in Texas every year, and it's hard for them to pass on a game in the Houston area. ...

It does depend on how many the AAC lose, since it they lose one, they can stick to 10, but if the AAC loses two or three, it would not be surprising at all if Rice gets an invite ... especially as SMU, Tulsa and Tulane are likely to still be around as schools voting on the invites.

Why would we vote for Rice? Other than they are a private, they have shown zero inclinations to support Athletics

As I said, at 10, the AAC could well decide to stand pat.

But at 9 I think the AAC would want somebody. There's no slam dunk, or else they would have filled the current empty spot ... but who would you set as a clear favorite over Rice?
07-14-2021 06:13 AM
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Post: #62
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-14-2021 06:13 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  But at 9 I think the AAC would want somebody. There's no slam dunk, or else they would have filled the current empty spot ... but who would you set as a clear favorite over Rice?

Southern Miss?
07-14-2021 12:25 PM
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AppManDG Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-13-2021 10:52 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 08:19 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 03:08 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 02:17 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 09:59 AM)dawgonit Wrote:  Sun Belt has done very well recently in football while CUSA has slipped. However when viewed through all athletics and not just football, CUSA is the better conference. The name recognition and academics of schools in CUSA are better too. The question of moving from the Sun Belt to CUSA is if the separation is big enough to warrant such a gamble. App State is doing fine in the belt and maybe they see the step up to CUSA as not being enough and a gamble. Basically, it doesn't seem to be THAT much greener on the other side, why make the change. There's an argument to be made there that I understand. But overall CUSA is the better athletic conference.

Again, we don't see CUSA as a step up.

Your school president might disagree with you. You know realignment is more than football, right?

Yup.... It's also about financial security and we're far better off in the SB than CUSA.

No, you’re not.

C-USA has bigger budgets, schools ranked higher academically, better facilities, more home and home games against P5 schools (and P6 in basketball), a core of basketball schools with multiple NCAAs, it’s a better baseball league and the Olympic sports are better too (Marshall just won the men’s soccer national championship). Those are things school presidents consider when it comes to realignment not just “we’ve been better in football in two of the last 20 seasons so we’ll stay where we are”.

Personally, I’m against adding more schools regardless if they’re FBS or FCS or even worse, swap schools with the Sun Belt. C-USA needs to focus on what they have. The potential is there but sadly mediocrity has been the standard since the 2.0 days.

Schools are very similar academically with only Louisiana Lafayette, Rice, Texas State & UAB making The Princeton Review's Best 386 Colleges & Universities. I don't pay much attention to US News since their rankings are heavily infulenced by surveys. According to the Knight Comission CUSA & SB budgets are extremely similar with ULM being the lone exception. Baseball better in CUSA? Sun Belt RPI has been better 3 out of the last 5 years, so it's basically a wash. I'll put SB facilities up against CUSA's any day. BTW, bigger doesn't mean better. Especially when those seats aren't filled. The NCAA attendance data base for average attendance. The reality is all this is a just an exercise in fultility. We're happ where we are and so are you guys. That's all that matters. I just don't appreciate the unsubstantiated attitude of superiority from SOME CUSA fans. That ship sailed with the schools that bolted for the AAC.
07-14-2021 07:53 PM
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ESE84 Online
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Post: #64
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-13-2021 08:28 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  
(07-12-2021 06:07 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 09:59 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  I think if Houston ever gets the golden ticket, Rice is in the AAC. SMU, Tulsa, and Tulane will want an institution similar to them. Navy will want a game in Texas every year, and it's hard for them to pass on a game in the Houston area. ...

It does depend on how many the AAC lose, since it they lose one, they can stick to 10, but if the AAC loses two or three, it would not be surprising at all if Rice gets an invite ... especially as SMU, Tulsa and Tulane are likely to still be around as schools voting on the invites.


Why would we vote for Rice? Other than they are a private, they have shown zero inclinations to support Athletics

Let me point you to the Director’s Cup thread where the overall Rice program kicked the stuffing out of SMU. And how’s that SMU baseball program coming along?

Rice supports athletics in a much different way than the Pony Excess. Probably in a way other University Presidents admire.
07-14-2021 09:38 PM
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Pony94 Online
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Post: #65
Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-14-2021 09:38 PM)ESE84 Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 08:28 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  
(07-12-2021 06:07 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 09:59 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  I think if Houston ever gets the golden ticket, Rice is in the AAC. SMU, Tulsa, and Tulane will want an institution similar to them. Navy will want a game in Texas every year, and it's hard for them to pass on a game in the Houston area. ...

It does depend on how many the AAC lose, since it they lose one, they can stick to 10, but if the AAC loses two or three, it would not be surprising at all if Rice gets an invite ... especially as SMU, Tulsa and Tulane are likely to still be around as schools voting on the invites.


Why would we vote for Rice? Other than they are a private, they have shown zero inclinations to support Athletics

Let me point you to the Director’s Cup thread where the overall Rice program kicked the stuffing out of SMU. And how’s that SMU baseball program coming along?

Rice supports athletics in a much different way than the Pony Excess. Probably in a way other University Presidents admire.


Haha. The directors cup sure plays a huge role in conference realignment.

Hopefully Baby Cruz can revitalize Rice baseball, if not you have no programs worth anything.
07-14-2021 09:41 PM
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Side.Show.Joe Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-14-2021 07:53 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 10:52 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 08:19 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 03:08 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 02:17 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  Again, we don't see CUSA as a step up.

Your school president might disagree with you. You know realignment is more than football, right?

Yup.... It's also about financial security and we're far better off in the SB than CUSA.

No, you’re not.

C-USA has bigger budgets, schools ranked higher academically, better facilities, more home and home games against P5 schools (and P6 in basketball), a core of basketball schools with multiple NCAAs, it’s a better baseball league and the Olympic sports are better too (Marshall just won the men’s soccer national championship). Those are things school presidents consider when it comes to realignment not just “we’ve been better in football in two of the last 20 seasons so we’ll stay where we are”.

Personally, I’m against adding more schools regardless if they’re FBS or FCS or even worse, swap schools with the Sun Belt. C-USA needs to focus on what they have. The potential is there but sadly mediocrity has been the standard since the 2.0 days.

Schools are very similar academically with only Louisiana Lafayette, Rice, Texas State & UAB making The Princeton Review's Best 386 Colleges & Universities. I don't pay much attention to US News since their rankings are heavily infulenced by surveys. According to the Knight Comission CUSA & SB budgets are extremely similar with ULM being the lone exception. Baseball better in CUSA? Sun Belt RPI has been better 3 out of the last 5 years, so it's basically a wash. I'll put SB facilities up against CUSA's any day. BTW, bigger doesn't mean better. Especially when those seats aren't filled. The NCAA attendance data base for average attendance. The reality is all this is a just an exercise in fultility. We're happ where we are and so are you guys. That's all that matters. I just don't appreciate the unsubstantiated attitude of superiority from SOME CUSA fans. That ship sailed with the schools that bolted for the AAC.

That is a terrible way to measure universities. If you don't like US News, than look at the Carnegie Tier 1 list. Rice and UAB are both Carnegie Tier 1 Research universities. Neither ULL nor Texas State are in that category. I believe the Sun Belt's only football playing university listed as Tier 1 is Georgia State. C-USA has Rice, UAB, North Texas, FIU, and UTEP listed as Tier 1.

For the record C-USA basketball is far better than Sun Belt basketball. SB champs App St. got beat by Norfolk St. in a first four game in March Madness. Plus, North Texas bought our coach from Arkansas St. When we are able to buyout your best coaches contracts, it makes it hard for the Sun Belt to improve their basketball. But to your point, yes we are all happy where we are. So there is no need to sell either side on our opinions.
07-14-2021 10:33 PM
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ESE84 Online
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Post: #67
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-14-2021 09:41 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  
(07-14-2021 09:38 PM)ESE84 Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 08:28 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  
(07-12-2021 06:07 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 09:59 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  I think if Houston ever gets the golden ticket, Rice is in the AAC. SMU, Tulsa, and Tulane will want an institution similar to them. Navy will want a game in Texas every year, and it's hard for them to pass on a game in the Houston area. ...

It does depend on how many the AAC lose, since it they lose one, they can stick to 10, but if the AAC loses two or three, it would not be surprising at all if Rice gets an invite ... especially as SMU, Tulsa and Tulane are likely to still be around as schools voting on the invites.


Why would we vote for Rice? Other than they are a private, they have shown zero inclinations to support Athletics

Let me point you to the Director’s Cup thread where the overall Rice program kicked the stuffing out of SMU. And how’s that SMU baseball program coming along?

Rice supports athletics in a much different way than the Pony Excess. Probably in a way other University Presidents admire.


Haha. The directors cup sure plays a huge role in conference realignment.

Hopefully Baby Cruz can revitalize Rice baseball, if not you have no programs worth anything.

Your premise that Rice has shown zero inclination to support athletics is absurd, as evidenced by the stellar women’s programs and resultant Directors Cup scoring. While we agree that football has been mostly a disappointment since the 2013 C-USA championship, the 20-0 whitewashing of #15 Marshall last year provides optimism for the 2021 campaign. And men’s basketball is poised to contribute in 2021-2022, too, after winning two games (Southern Miss and Marshall) in the 2021 tournament and bringing virtually everyone back this fall.
07-15-2021 07:21 AM
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Post: #68
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
If Rice could get an AAC invitation, that would be their best choice money wise. But that is a big "IF" and Rice has a lot of work to do before that could happen. Otherwise, Rice is in their best possible position in C-USA West, with bowl opportunities and auto-bids. Rice is like a Southwestern Ivy League school.

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07-15-2021 11:04 AM
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SMUstang Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
Very unlikely.

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07-15-2021 02:33 PM
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Yosef Himself Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-13-2021 10:52 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 08:19 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 03:08 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 02:17 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 09:59 AM)dawgonit Wrote:  Sun Belt has done very well recently in football while CUSA has slipped. However when viewed through all athletics and not just football, CUSA is the better conference. The name recognition and academics of schools in CUSA are better too. The question of moving from the Sun Belt to CUSA is if the separation is big enough to warrant such a gamble. App State is doing fine in the belt and maybe they see the step up to CUSA as not being enough and a gamble. Basically, it doesn't seem to be THAT much greener on the other side, why make the change. There's an argument to be made there that I understand. But overall CUSA is the better athletic conference.

Again, we don't see CUSA as a step up.

Your school president might disagree with you. You know realignment is more than football, right?

Yup.... It's also about financial security and we're far better off in the SB than CUSA.

No, you’re not.

C-USA has bigger budgets, schools ranked higher academically, better facilities, more home and home games against P5 schools (and P6 in basketball), a core of basketball schools with multiple NCAAs, it’s a better baseball league and the Olympic sports are better too (Marshall just won the men’s soccer national championship). Those are things school presidents consider when it comes to realignment not just “we’ve been better in football in two of the last 20 seasons so we’ll stay where we are”.

Personally, I’m against adding more schools regardless if they’re FBS or FCS or even worse, swap schools with the Sun Belt. C-USA needs to focus on what they have. The potential is there but sadly mediocrity has been the standard since the 2.0 days.


https://www.underdogdynasty.com/2021/7/1...5-fbs-judy


LOL. There's some damn gems in this article.
07-15-2021 03:58 PM
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dbackjon Online
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Post: #71
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-10-2021 06:33 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  The inconvenient truth is that Rice must get better in a sport it has long ignored (football) to find a new home. Ideally, a football-only bid to the AAC invites the kind of divisional rivals (SMU, Houston, Tulsa, Tulane, Memphis) which could provide it a pathway to stability.

Rice would be a good fit in the AAC if it could become an asset in football and basketball. Until then...
07-15-2021 04:08 PM
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Post: #72
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 04:08 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(07-10-2021 06:33 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  The inconvenient truth is that Rice must get better in a sport it has long ignored (football) to find a new home. Ideally, a football-only bid to the AAC invites the kind of divisional rivals (SMU, Houston, Tulsa, Tulane, Memphis) which could provide it a pathway to stability.

Rice would be a good fit in the AAC if it could become an asset in football and basketball. Until then...

I would love to see Rice in the AAC, but there is no doubt that they would be a bottom dweller in football and basketball and the conference will not go for that, and I fully support them in that. They were entertaining in the SWC, but for the past 70 years or so they have had nothing to offer other than Jess Neely and Dickey Maegle.

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07-15-2021 04:49 PM
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Post: #73
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 04:49 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  I would love to see Rice in the AAC, but there is no doubt that they would be a bottom dweller in football and basketball and the conference will not go for that, and I fully support them in that. They were entertaining in the SWC, but for the past 70 years or so they have had nothing to offer other than Jess Neely and Dickey Maegle.

Until Gary Patterson came to town, the same could have been said about TCU athletics after 1960 (excepting a couple of years with Jim Wacker).
(This post was last modified: 07-15-2021 05:47 PM by DFW HOYA.)
07-15-2021 05:47 PM
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UTEPDallas Offline
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Post: #74
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 03:58 PM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 10:52 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 08:19 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 03:08 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 02:17 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  Again, we don't see CUSA as a step up.

Your school president might disagree with you. You know realignment is more than football, right?

Yup.... It's also about financial security and we're far better off in the SB than CUSA.

No, you’re not.

C-USA has bigger budgets, schools ranked higher academically, better facilities, more home and home games against P5 schools (and P6 in basketball), a core of basketball schools with multiple NCAAs, it’s a better baseball league and the Olympic sports are better too (Marshall just won the men’s soccer national championship). Those are things school presidents consider when it comes to realignment not just “we’ve been better in football in two of the last 20 seasons so we’ll stay where we are”.

Personally, I’m against adding more schools regardless if they’re FBS or FCS or even worse, swap schools with the Sun Belt. C-USA needs to focus on what they have. The potential is there but sadly mediocrity has been the standard since the 2.0 days.


https://www.underdogdynasty.com/2021/7/1...5-fbs-judy


LOL. There's some damn gems in this article.

Like the writer calling the AAC and MWC “mid-majors”?

In person or zoom meetings, who cares if nothing is being done. At least the East Division schools saved money by not flying to Texas since that’s one of their main complaints. The commissioner needs to go but at the same time she can propose anything she wants. In the end, it’s the presidents who make those decisions not her and they’re the ones who keep her employed.
07-15-2021 06:13 PM
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UTEPDallas Offline
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Post: #75
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 05:47 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 04:49 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  I would love to see Rice in the AAC, but there is no doubt that they would be a bottom dweller in football and basketball and the conference will not go for that, and I fully support them in that. They were entertaining in the SWC, but for the past 70 years or so they have had nothing to offer other than Jess Neely and Dickey Maegle.

Until Gary Patterson came to town, the same could have been said about TCU athletics after 1960 (excepting a couple of years with Jim Wacker).

Hiring Dennis Franccione out of New Mexico after the 1997 season is what righted the ship for TCU.
07-15-2021 06:15 PM
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Side.Show.Joe Offline
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Post: #76
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 06:13 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 03:58 PM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 10:52 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 08:19 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(07-11-2021 03:08 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  Your school president might disagree with you. You know realignment is more than football, right?

Yup.... It's also about financial security and we're far better off in the SB than CUSA.

No, you’re not.

C-USA has bigger budgets, schools ranked higher academically, better facilities, more home and home games against P5 schools (and P6 in basketball), a core of basketball schools with multiple NCAAs, it’s a better baseball league and the Olympic sports are better too (Marshall just won the men’s soccer national championship). Those are things school presidents consider when it comes to realignment not just “we’ve been better in football in two of the last 20 seasons so we’ll stay where we are”.

Personally, I’m against adding more schools regardless if they’re FBS or FCS or even worse, swap schools with the Sun Belt. C-USA needs to focus on what they have. The potential is there but sadly mediocrity has been the standard since the 2.0 days.


https://www.underdogdynasty.com/2021/7/1...5-fbs-judy


LOL. There's some damn gems in this article.

Like the writer calling the AAC and MWC “mid-majors”?

In person or zoom meetings, who cares if nothing is being done. At least the East Division schools saved money by not flying to Texas since that’s one of their main complaints. The commissioner needs to go but at the same time she can propose anything she wants. In the end, it’s the presidents who make those decisions not her and they’re the ones who keep her employed.

That right there is a big reason why UTEP has been a bottom feeder in C-USA for most of their time in C-USA. I sure hope the leadership at UTEP doesn't feel like you. Optics are important. The other G5's are already making fun of C-USA. Pathetic.
07-15-2021 06:30 PM
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Post: #77
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 06:15 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 05:47 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  Until Gary Patterson came to town, the same could have been said about TCU athletics after 1960 (excepting a couple of years with Jim Wacker).
Hiring Dennis Franccione out of New Mexico after the 1997 season is what righted the ship for TCU.

Yep. Franchione had the good sense to hire Patterson as his defensive coordinator. The 1998 Sun Bowl was the turnaround point. TCU was 6-5, but got invited to the Sun Bowl to play USC. USC was heavily favored, but TCU won the game 28-19. TCU's program went up from there. Once Franchione took the Alabama job, Patterson was promoted, and the rest is history.
07-15-2021 06:58 PM
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Post: #78
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 06:58 PM)johnintx Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 06:15 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 05:47 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  Until Gary Patterson came to town, the same could have been said about TCU athletics after 1960 (excepting a couple of years with Jim Wacker).
Hiring Dennis Franccione out of New Mexico after the 1997 season is what righted the ship for TCU.

Yep. Franchione had the good sense to hire Patterson as his defensive coordinator. The 1998 Sun Bowl was the turnaround point. TCU was 6-5, but got invited to the Sun Bowl to play USC. USC was heavily favored, but TCU won the game 28-19. TCU's program went up from there. Once Franchione took the Alabama job, Patterson was promoted, and the rest is history.
Yep, with good recruiting TCU got better each and every year. They were determined not to be leftovers ever again. I don't like Patterson but he did a great job.

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07-15-2021 07:19 PM
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UTEPDallas Offline
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Post: #79
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 06:30 PM)Side.Show.Joe Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 06:13 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 03:58 PM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 10:52 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-13-2021 08:19 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  Yup.... It's also about financial security and we're far better off in the SB than CUSA.

No, you’re not.

C-USA has bigger budgets, schools ranked higher academically, better facilities, more home and home games against P5 schools (and P6 in basketball), a core of basketball schools with multiple NCAAs, it’s a better baseball league and the Olympic sports are better too (Marshall just won the men’s soccer national championship). Those are things school presidents consider when it comes to realignment not just “we’ve been better in football in two of the last 20 seasons so we’ll stay where we are”.

Personally, I’m against adding more schools regardless if they’re FBS or FCS or even worse, swap schools with the Sun Belt. C-USA needs to focus on what they have. The potential is there but sadly mediocrity has been the standard since the 2.0 days.


https://www.underdogdynasty.com/2021/7/1...5-fbs-judy


LOL. There's some damn gems in this article.

Like the writer calling the AAC and MWC “mid-majors”?

In person or zoom meetings, who cares if nothing is being done. At least the East Division schools saved money by not flying to Texas since that’s one of their main complaints. The commissioner needs to go but at the same time she can propose anything she wants. In the end, it’s the presidents who make those decisions not her and they’re the ones who keep her employed.

That right there is a big reason why UTEP has been a bottom feeder in C-USA for most of their time in C-USA. I sure hope the leadership at UTEP doesn't feel like you. Optics are important. The other G5's are already making fun of C-USA. Pathetic.

Sure, I speak on behalf of the entire UTEP athletic department. 03-lmfao Don’t be ridiculous.

If C-USA school officials want to wine and dine at a Las Colinas hotel, more power to them. But if nothing is seriously being discussed and done, it’s just a waste of time regardless of “optics” or if other conferences make fun of C-USA.
07-15-2021 07:25 PM
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UTEPDallas Offline
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I Root For: UTEP/Penn State
Location: Dallas, TX
Post: #80
RE: Could Rice restart the SWC in the post-Covid climate?
(07-15-2021 07:19 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 06:58 PM)johnintx Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 06:15 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  
(07-15-2021 05:47 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  Until Gary Patterson came to town, the same could have been said about TCU athletics after 1960 (excepting a couple of years with Jim Wacker).
Hiring Dennis Franccione out of New Mexico after the 1997 season is what righted the ship for TCU.

Yep. Franchione had the good sense to hire Patterson as his defensive coordinator. The 1998 Sun Bowl was the turnaround point. TCU was 6-5, but got invited to the Sun Bowl to play USC. USC was heavily favored, but TCU won the game 28-19. TCU's program went up from there. Once Franchione took the Alabama job, Patterson was promoted, and the rest is history.
Yep, with good recruiting TCU got better each and every year. They were determined not to be leftovers ever again. I don't like Patterson but he did a great job.

SMUstang

It helped SMU was down at the time and the other SWC left behinds were struggling too. The move to the MWC was a clear indication they wanted to separate from the rest of the Texas non AQ schools. I often criticized that strategy and thought it was going to backfire on them but it actually worked. That gamble paid their entry to the Big XII.
07-15-2021 07:30 PM
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