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WRCisforgotten79 Offline
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Post: #21
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-01-2021 11:01 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(08-01-2021 10:19 AM)ESE84 Wrote:  
(07-31-2021 12:46 PM)TexasTerror Wrote:  Southern home game bought

https://d1docket.blogspot.com/2021/07/ju...e-bag.html

Are we paying Southern $35,000 for a home game? Are these costs a recent development, or is men’s basketball going toward the football scheduling costs?

It is a guarantee, not a payment. So if their share of the gate is less than $35k, we make up the difference.

Of the 6 guarantees listed, we are the lowest.

$35,000?

I have no idea of the average ticket price. Is it $15? To make the math easy, let's say it's $17.50. That's 2,000 tickets just to pay off Southern. Seems like a waste of money for an athletic department in the red.

Of course, having the football team stay in hotels the night before a home game is about the dumbest waste of money.
08-01-2021 11:10 AM
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OptimisticOwl Offline
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Post: #22
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-01-2021 11:10 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(08-01-2021 11:01 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(08-01-2021 10:19 AM)ESE84 Wrote:  
(07-31-2021 12:46 PM)TexasTerror Wrote:  Southern home game bought

https://d1docket.blogspot.com/2021/07/ju...e-bag.html

Are we paying Southern $35,000 for a home game? Are these costs a recent development, or is men’s basketball going toward the football scheduling costs?

It is a guarantee, not a payment. So if their share of the gate is less than $35k, we make up the difference.

Of the 6 guarantees listed, we are the lowest.

$35,000?

I have no idea of the average ticket price. Is it $15? To make the math easy, let's say it's $17.50. That's 2,000 tickets just to pay off Southern. Seems like a waste of money for an athletic department in the red.

Of course, having the football team stay in hotels the night before a home game is about the dumbest waste of money.

Just saying, a guarantee is not necessarily a minimum out of pocket expense. It could be that the guarantee is met from whatever sources are scheduled, and no out of pocket expense is incurred. I am not sure what income streams visiting teams share in, but I can understand them - or us, when we travel - wanting a guarantee of a minimum before we/they go to the expense of traveling.

Perhaps without a guarantee, the game doesn’t happen.

Louisville’s guarantee is $85k.
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2021 11:24 AM by OptimisticOwl.)
08-01-2021 11:21 AM
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WRCisforgotten79 Offline
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Post: #23
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-01-2021 11:21 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Just saying, a guarantee is not necessarily a minimum out of pocket expense. It could be that the guarantee is met from whatever sources are scheduled, and no out of pocket expense is incurred. I am not sure what income streams visiting teams share in, but I can understand them - or us, when we travel - wanting a guarantee of a minimum before we/they go to the expense of traveling.

Perhaps without a guarantee, the game doesn’t happen.

Louisville’s guarantee is $85k.

Louisville averages about 17,000 per game. Let's say they charge an average of $25/ticket. That's $425,000 in gross revenues. Therefore, $85,000 is a minor expense for that program.
08-01-2021 06:27 PM
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OptimisticOwl Offline
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Post: #24
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-01-2021 06:27 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(08-01-2021 11:21 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Just saying, a guarantee is not necessarily a minimum out of pocket expense. It could be that the guarantee is met from whatever sources are scheduled, and no out of pocket expense is incurred. I am not sure what income streams visiting teams share in, but I can understand them - or us, when we travel - wanting a guarantee of a minimum before we/they go to the expense of traveling.

Perhaps without a guarantee, the game doesn’t happen.

Louisville’s guarantee is $85k.

Louisville averages about 17,000 per game. Let's say they charge an average of $25/ticket. That's $425,000 in gross revenues. Therefore, $85,000 is a minor expense for that program.

Still a lot more than $35K,and neither Rice nor Lville will have to pay the full amount - maybe nothing.

I don't know what revenues, if any, a visiting team has claim to. Maybe a share of the gate, maybe a share of the concessions. In my opinion, a guarantee means that if these expected revenues do not reach $35k, Rice makes up the difference.

If, OTOH, guarantee means there will be a check for $35K waiting at the front desk when they check in, then you are right.
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2021 07:42 PM by OptimisticOwl.)
08-01-2021 07:17 PM
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TexasTerror Offline
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Post: #25
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
PS…

This guarantee is low by Rice standards. COVID has allowed flexibility and lower guarantees. Rice is used to paying twice (if not more) than they are for Southern for guarantee opponents (D1) in non COVID impacted years. That’s pretty consistent for CUSA squads
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2021 07:57 PM by TexasTerror.)
08-01-2021 07:57 PM
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Almadenmike Offline
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Post: #26
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(07-06-2021 01:57 PM)Almadenmike Wrote:  
(07-06-2021 09:04 AM)elw4796 Wrote:  Not fully sure what to make of this, but The D1 Docket (CUSA compatriot and somebody who I trust) has Rice playing 3 games in Fort Myers from November 22 to November 24. The Ft. Myers tipoff takes place during those dates, but that field has been set for a few weeks (Rice is not in it). I combed through the schedules on The D1 Docket and there appear to be 7 other teams matching Rice's entry: Appalachian State, Evansville, Vermont, Fordham, Delaware, Akron, and Oakland. Assuming this is some kind of tournament (though I trust the source I can't find anything from any of the teams), some info below (again, this is without rosters being fully finalized):

> App State: KP = 212. Should be around the middle of the Sun Belt this year
> Evansville: KP = 204. Probably a bottom half team in a competitive Missouri Valley, but they bring back a good amount of production
> Vermont: KP = 133. Perennially the class of the America East. Should be as good or better than last year
> Fordham: KP = 310. Awful team last year, lost most of the team to the portal. I like Kyle Neptune but this is a disastrous roster
> Delaware: KP = 225. Should be very good next year. Basically return their entire roster and add a couple of guys who should contribute
> Akron: KP = 112. They lose Loren Jackson, perhaps a top 3 mid-major PG. But most everybody else should return and they've got some good transfers
> Oakland: KP = 221. Lost a couple of impact players. Don't think they'll be better than last year but Kampe is a brilliant coach so who knows

Again, assuming this is a real thing, not a killer group of teams but there would be a couple of opportunities.

Excellent sleuthing!

"Blogging the Bracket"(https://www.bloggingthebracket.com/2021/...ournaments) has these teams in the Gulf Coast Showcase in Estero, Fla. (south of Ft. Myers). (It cites The D1 Docket, but only Fordham's participation shows on that link ... and its link to the Fordham schedule has last year's games.)

The GCS website says it's played in Hertz Arena, but shows just an empty bracket: http://gulfcoastshowcase.com/#!/men

The GCS has been played since 2013. Here's a link to the event's Wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Coast_Showcase

Akron & Middle Tennessee played in it last year. UTSA, Tulane & Lousiana were in the 2018 event. FAU was in the 2017 field; WKU played in 2015. UH beat Vermont by 1 point to win the 2016 GCS title, and LaTech won the inaugural event's crown (2013) by 4 points over St. Boneventure.

Hertz Arena is a 7,181-seat multi-purpose arena that opened in 1998 as the Everblades Arena, after the ECHL (formerly Each Coast Hockey League) mid-level minor league hockey team that plays there. Hertz bought the naming rights in September 2018.

I see that on Thursday (July 29), the Gulf Coast Showcase posted the game times for its 2021 games. Rice vs. Evansville is at 11am Eastern on Monday, Nov. 22: http://gulfcoastshowcase.com/2021/07/24-...itational/

Win or lose, we'll play Vermont or Oakland the next day.

The GCS games are the only ones that are showing today on the Riceowls.com MBB schedule page: https://riceowls.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule
08-01-2021 09:19 PM
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cr11owl Offline
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Post: #27
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
08-13-2021 11:30 AM
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ExcitedOwl18 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
Why the hell are we playing two non-D1 teams?

Otherwise-I don’t think the schedule is particularly sexy but I think well thought out.

Pepperdine had a pretty good team last year (CBI champs) and TxSt was Sun Belt regular season champs. Those are teams that should be right in our wheelhouse if we’re as improved as we think we are. Throw in a few “stretch games” vs. Texas and UH, the Florida tournament, and two gimmes vs. HBU and UIW (hopefully), and it’s not bad.
08-13-2021 12:10 PM
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elw4796 Online
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Post: #29
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
It's a terrible schedule for the most part. You don't play two non-D1 teams when you expect to be competitive in conference. They're wasted games. Go test your mettle against a Big 10 or ACC team on the road. You learn nothing from Jarvis Christian or St. Thomas. Incarnate Word and Houston Baptist were two of the worst 15 teams in the country last year per KP. Pepperdine lost Colbey Ross and Kessler Edwards, two of the best mid-major players in the country, meaning they're going to take a massive step backwards next year.

Houston, Texas, Texas State, and Oakland/Vermont will be good tests. But good lord, I'm not sure there's one home game that would appeal to a neutral student. I lived and breathed Rice basketball when I was there and even I didn't find games against St. Thomas exciting.

There's no creativity. There's very little competitiveness. We schedule like a team hoping to beat awful teams on our way to a 15+ win season just so we can post on social media that we won 15+ games.
08-13-2021 01:09 PM
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Frizzy Owl Offline
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Post: #30
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
The Jarvis Christian game is one in a long series of such games that Rice schedules every year. Why? is a very good question. If that’s the annual kid’s game it will be the highest attendance of the year, but that could just as easily have been the UST game.

Rice and UST play every year. Free travel and and attempt at establishing a tradition of private schools that are almost neighbors playing each other, is my guess.

HBU and UIW - nobody should wonder at that. Every D1 schedule includes nearby D1 opponents, for all the obvious reasons.

At least St. Edwards is exhibition this year.
08-13-2021 01:44 PM
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Post: #31
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
If you have never been (and they have it this year), the annual weekday mid day late December kids game is incredibly entertaining (one of my kids hadn't been and was in town so got to go, laughing the whole time, having been to a lot of sub 500 attendance games at Autry) and a legacy of Shu.

The reality is that I suspect we really don't have a lot of options scheduling wise. We go out and kick it in conference, then that's a whole nother ball game....
08-13-2021 03:31 PM
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Almadenmike Offline
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Post: #32
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-13-2021 01:44 PM)Frizzy Owl Wrote:  The Jarvis Christian game is one in a long series of such games that Rice schedules every year. Why? is a very good question.

I looked up some info on Jarvis Christian:

It's located in Hawkins, Tex., which is in NE Texas ... ~ 100 miles east of Dallas, between Gladewater & Mineola. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarvis_Christian_College)

It's a Historically Black 4-year liberal arts college that's been in operation just a few months fewer than Rice, its first classes having been first held in January 1913. acts)(http://www.jccbulldogs.com/quick-f

It's affiliated with the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ). (https://www.jarvis.edu/mission)

Enrollment in 2018 was 952. (https://www.jarvis.edu/blog/post/jarvis-...ls-history)

It's an NAIA member that competes in the Red River Conference, which has 14 teams in Texas, Louisiana and New Mexico. (http://www.redriverconference.com/members.php)

Its basketball W-L records the past three seasons are 3-22 (2018-19), 5-19 (2019-20) & 3-8 (2020-21). (http://www.jccbulldogs.com/schedule/13/1)

Its mascot is the Bulldog, and its colors are Royal Blue and Old Gold. (p16: https://www.jarvis.edu/uploads/cms/nav-6...ecfac4.pdf)
(This post was last modified: 08-13-2021 03:55 PM by Almadenmike.)
08-13-2021 03:47 PM
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Fort Bend Owl Online
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Post: #33
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-13-2021 01:09 PM)elw4796 Wrote:  It's a terrible schedule for the most part. You don't play two non-D1 teams when you expect to be competitive in conference. They're wasted games. Go test your mettle against a Big 10 or ACC team on the road. You learn nothing from Jarvis Christian or St. Thomas. Incarnate Word and Houston Baptist were two of the worst 15 teams in the country last year per KP. Pepperdine lost Colbey Ross and Kessler Edwards, two of the best mid-major players in the country, meaning they're going to take a massive step backwards next year.

Houston, Texas, Texas State, and Oakland/Vermont will be good tests. But good lord, I'm not sure there's one home game that would appeal to a neutral student. I lived and breathed Rice basketball when I was there and even I didn't find games against St. Thomas exciting.

There's no creativity. There's very little competitiveness. We schedule like a team hoping to beat awful teams on our way to a 15+ win season just so we can post on social media that we won 15+ games.

Usually you tend to know what you're talking about when it comes to basketball, but you're a little off with this post. First off, Texas is a legitimate Final Four contender in 2022 and Houston was in the Final Four last year. Those two games alone will make this NC schedule tougher than 90 percent of the conference is my guess.

Early December is always a very challenging time to schedule games for our basketball teams (men or women). We have had a number of stinker games in this time frame throughout the years, and a long time ago, our head coaches realize that we need to schedule our patsies during Finals and just after Finals. Plus as deep as we are, we need games where our bench can get some minutes.

Is this the best NC schedule we've seen? Of course not. But I'd say it's better than what we've seen the last few years from the Rice women when they were loaded and needed a quality NC schedule. Pepperdine with Lorenzo Romar as its coach should be a fair NC home game. It's a little early to know what Texas State will be like because they lost a lot of transfers. But if people want to see good basketball at Tudor, most of the conference schedule will feature quality opponents. UAB and Louisiana Tech might be top 25 teams and I think we'll play those teams twice each?

I'd also say that 15 wins is not a benchmark for the 2021-22 team. I won't be happy unless we have closer to 20 wins.
(This post was last modified: 08-13-2021 04:00 PM by Fort Bend Owl.)
08-13-2021 03:52 PM
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Fort Bend Owl Online
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Post: #34
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
BTW outside of Houston, we really haven't hosted any marquee teams at Tudor in at least 15 years. We had Oregon State a few years back - that's another Final Four team from this past season but back then, they were the Pac 12 doormat. We've had some decent Ivy League teams at home - Temple a few years back and Fresno State and TCU too. But you have to go all the way back to December, 2010 to find a truly big name at Tudor when we hosted Arizona. We're not going to be able to host a team like that unless they have a local star who is getting a home game for his senior year. I think that's why we hosted Emeka Okafor and UConn maybe 18 years ago?
08-13-2021 03:59 PM
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ExcitedOwl18 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-13-2021 03:59 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  BTW outside of Houston, we really haven't hosted any marquee teams at Tudor in at least 15 years. We had Oregon State a few years back - that's another Final Four team from this past season but back then, they were the Pac 12 doormat. We've had some decent Ivy League teams at home - Temple a few years back and Fresno State and TCU too. But you have to go all the way back to December, 2010 to find a truly big name at Tudor when we hosted Arizona. We're not going to be able to host a team like that unless they have a local star who is getting a home game for his senior year. I think that's why we hosted Emeka Okafor and UConn maybe 18 years ago?

Oregon State was actually pretty good the year we hosted them (2015-16)-ended up being a 7 seed in the tournament.
08-13-2021 04:05 PM
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Post: #36
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
https://riceowls.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule

Men's conference games are announced.
08-24-2021 03:14 PM
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WRCisforgotten79 Offline
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Post: #37
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-24-2021 03:14 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  https://riceowls.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule

Men's conference games are announced.

I remember looking forward to the conference schedule being announced, to find out when we would play Texas, Arkansas and Houston. Now? 03-zzz
08-24-2021 03:42 PM
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Texasowl Offline
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Post: #38
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
Good we are not playing back to back like last year. Hope is the case with WBB also.
(08-24-2021 03:42 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(08-24-2021 03:14 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  https://riceowls.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule

Men's conference games are announced.

I remember looking forward to the conference schedule being announced, to find out when we would play Texas, Arkansas and Houston. Now? 03-zzz
08-24-2021 04:29 PM
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Post: #39
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-24-2021 03:42 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(08-24-2021 03:14 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  https://riceowls.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule

Men's conference games are announced.

I remember looking forward to the conference schedule being announced, to find out when we would play Texas, Arkansas and Houston. Now? 03-zzz

So if Arkansas were on the schedule you’d be excited?
08-24-2021 09:13 PM
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Post: #40
RE: MBB and WBB Schedules Running Thread
(08-24-2021 09:13 PM)Frizzy Owl Wrote:  
(08-24-2021 03:42 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(08-24-2021 03:14 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  https://riceowls.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule

Men's conference games are announced.

I remember looking forward to the conference schedule being announced, to find out when we would play Texas, Arkansas and Houston. Now? 03-zzz

So if Arkansas were on the schedule you’d be excited?

Yea, uh... we're playing two of the three teams you mentioned?
08-24-2021 09:22 PM
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