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Any movement before July 2021?
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Fighting Muskie Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-03-2021 08:38 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Nobody is leaving the MVFC for OVC football. NDSU is a legend, you want to be in that conference. The coaching staff would revolt at that even being mentioned.

There is no way WIU leaves tSL/MVFC for OVC.

Far more likely APSU and Murray State join the ASUN and Belmont starts answering the phone, maybe joining the MVC aas partner with UT-Arlington or something.

MVFC to OVC is definitely a step down but Summit to OVC is a pretty lateral move.

WIU is going to continue to be a whipping boy in the MVFC, just another step on NDSU’s trip to the FCS title. Moving to the OVC would give WIU a chance at a conference title.
06-03-2021 09:11 PM
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solohawks Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-03-2021 09:11 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  
(06-03-2021 08:38 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Nobody is leaving the MVFC for OVC football. NDSU is a legend, you want to be in that conference. The coaching staff would revolt at that even being mentioned.

There is no way WIU leaves tSL/MVFC for OVC.

Far more likely APSU and Murray State join the ASUN and Belmont starts answering the phone, maybe joining the MVC aas partner with UT-Arlington or something.

MVFC to OVC is definitely a step down but Summit to OVC is a pretty lateral move.

WIU is going to continue to be a whipping boy in the MVFC, just another step on NDSU’s trip to the FCS title. Moving to the OVC would give WIU a chance at a conference title.

While WIU would probably prefer the MVFC, the OVC savings over the Summit outweigh that desire IMHO
06-03-2021 09:21 PM
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Todor Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-03-2021 09:11 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  
(06-03-2021 08:38 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Nobody is leaving the MVFC for OVC football. NDSU is a legend, you want to be in that conference. The coaching staff would revolt at that even being mentioned.

There is no way WIU leaves tSL/MVFC for OVC.

Far more likely APSU and Murray State join the ASUN and Belmont starts answering the phone, maybe joining the MVC aas partner with UT-Arlington or something.

MVFC to OVC is definitely a step down but Summit to OVC is a pretty lateral move.

WIU is going to continue to be a whipping boy in the MVFC, just another step on NDSU’s trip to the FCS title. Moving to the OVC would give WIU a chance at a conference title.

I think WIU to the OVC would be a great institutional move. Yes, there are pluses and minuses on both sides, but a regional Illinois school would be a great match ed up with Eastern and Edwardsville. Attendance/interest in athletics there has been fairly low and having at least a couple in state opponents would be a good thing. Western used to have that in the Summit, but everyone else has moved on.

Regional teams who have been in Summit and left WIU--
Northern Iowa
Eastern Illinois
Northern Illinois
Northeastern Illinois
Chicago State
Valparaiso
Milwaukee
Illinois Chicago

Quite a list. They must feel pretty isolated now.
(This post was last modified: 06-03-2021 09:42 PM by Todor.)
06-03-2021 09:27 PM
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solohawks Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-03-2021 04:31 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(06-03-2021 04:25 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Does the OVC even have a plan? I’ve heard nothing out of them.

They said they were exploring expansion after EKU/JSU left but nothing since. I assume they’ve made no decisions as there’ve been no rumors. It’s possible someone like Belmont really doesn’t want WIU.

I do wonder if that is the case.

WIU does nothing for Belmont
(This post was last modified: 06-03-2021 09:29 PM by solohawks.)
06-03-2021 09:29 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-03-2021 08:38 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Nobody is leaving the MVFC for OVC football.

WIU joining the OVC wouldn’t be a football-driven decision. It would be a do-anything-to-survive-in-D1 decision.
06-03-2021 09:37 PM
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Stugray2 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-03-2021 09:37 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(06-03-2021 08:38 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Nobody is leaving the MVFC for OVC football.

WIU joining the OVC wouldn’t be a football-driven decision. It would be a do-anything-to-survive-in-D1 decision.

Bull poop.

There are no voices from the WIU campus calling for this.
06-03-2021 10:31 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-03-2021 10:31 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  
(06-03-2021 09:37 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(06-03-2021 08:38 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Nobody is leaving the MVFC for OVC football.

WIU joining the OVC wouldn’t be a football-driven decision. It would be a do-anything-to-survive-in-D1 decision.

Bull poop.

There are no voices from the WIU campus calling for this.

If WIU voices are calling for an OVC move, it would be behind closed doors.

The school is budget-strapped and will likely have to keep incrementally slashing their AD budget. Joining 2 in-state schools in a no-flight league helps their D1 viability.
06-04-2021 12:10 AM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
WIU will stay were they are at and wait for a MVC full sports invite. They are closer to MVC schools than any OVC schools. WIU would be an outlier in OVC and no savings.
06-04-2021 03:28 AM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-04-2021 03:28 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  WIU will stay were they are at and wait for a MVC full sports invite. They are closer to MVC schools than any OVC schools. WIU would be an outlier in OVC and no savings.

WIU doesn’t crack a MVC top-50 expansion list.
06-04-2021 07:18 AM
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Fighting Muskie Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
It kind shows you just how much sway Belmont has that we haven’t seen WIU added yet.

Bringing in WIU would be good for 6 of the 7 football schools as it would give them a 7th conference game (only Tenn St wants fewer conference games because they can make more money scheduling HBCUs OOC).

It’s also a good move for instate SIUE.

Yet here we are with no WIU.
06-04-2021 07:41 AM
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PicksUp Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-04-2021 03:28 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  WIU will stay were they are at and wait for a MVC full sports invite. They are closer to MVC schools than any OVC schools. WIU would be an outlier in OVC and no savings.

Yeah, good luck with all that. 05-nono
06-04-2021 07:42 AM
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Post: #32
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-04-2021 07:41 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  It kind shows you just how much sway Belmont has that we haven’t seen WIU added yet.

Bringing in WIU would be good for 6 of the 7 football schools as it would give them a 7th conference game (only Tenn St wants fewer conference games because they can make more money scheduling HBCUs OOC).

It’s also a good move for instate SIUE.

Yet here we are with no WIU.

Wait a minute. Maybe Western Illinois doesn't want to leave the Missouri valley football conference, which is one of the best conferences in FCS for the Ohio valley conference in football, which is not very good
06-04-2021 07:49 AM
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MattBrownEP Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
This is what I've been told on the WIU/OVC/MVC business.

1) Like almost every other realignment move, these things take time.

2) There *have* been conversations. The idea that WIU would never want to talk to the OVC in any circumstances just isn't true. Yes, going from the MVC to the OVC would be a "downgrade" as far as football is concerned, but the last year should have made it very clear that under the right circumstances, schools are prepared to leave conferences for less prestigious offerings at the FCS level, if money, institutional fit, etc are in line.

3) There is an element of monetary savings involved here, but when we talk about saving money, we're talking more about the future cost curves. WIU is not in a healthy place as an institution, and this donor base, never particularly large, is close to tapped out. The state isn't going to meaningfully bail them out. If you're already not competitive in the MVC, and you believe your costs are likely to increase even more over the next decade, looking elsewhere may make sense.

4) The way it's been explained to me, one of the OVC's big concerns is how competitive WIU might be THERE. If you stink at football, *really* stink at basketball, aren't great at baseball, and primarily are there to help with scheduling, maybe not every institution is wild about your value.

5) FWIW, staffers at three different MVC schools have told me "man, I wish those guys would leave."

6) There is no chance in hell WIU is getting a full sports MVC invite, especially given what I've reported about the current MVC expansion philosophy.

I think this move is more likely to happen eventually than not, but a lot can change this summer.
(This post was last modified: 06-04-2021 08:12 AM by MattBrownEP.)
06-04-2021 08:10 AM
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solohawks Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-04-2021 08:10 AM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  This is what I've been told on the WIU/OVC/MVC business.

1) Like almost every other realignment move, these things take time.

2) There *have* been conversations. The idea that WIU would never want to talk to the OVC in any circumstances just isn't true. Yes, going from the MVC to the OVC would be a "downgrade" as far as football is concerned, but the last year should have made it very clear that under the right circumstances, schools are prepared to leave conferences for less prestigious offerings at the FCS level, if money, institutional fit, etc are in line.

3) There is an element of monetary savings involved here, but when we talk about saving money, we're talking more about the future cost curves. WIU is not in a healthy place as an institution, and this donor base, never particularly large, is close to tapped out. The state isn't going to meaningfully bail them out. If you're already not competitive in the MVC, and you believe your costs are likely to increase even more over the next decade, looking elsewhere may make sense.

4) The way it's been explained to me, one of the OVC's big concerns is how competitive WIU might be THERE. If you stink at football, *really* stink at basketball, aren't great at baseball, and primarily are there to help with scheduling, maybe not every institution is wild about your value.

5) FWIW, staffers at three different MVC schools have told me "man, I wish those guys would leave."

6) There is no chance in hell WIU is getting a full sports MVC invite, especially given what I've reported about the current MVC expansion philosophy.

I think this move is more likely to happen eventually than not, but a lot can change this summer.

Translation...The OVC is like "Is this really the best we can do?"
06-04-2021 08:58 AM
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solohawks Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
Saw this thread on the Indiana State fan forum
https://sycamorepride.com/threads/ovc-20...-go.42102/

Surprising to me how much support there was for a FOOTBALL ONLY move to the OVC. They seem to really hating being in a football conference with the Dakotas.
06-04-2021 09:03 AM
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Fighting Muskie Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
Not to derail a good thread but I wonder what the fans of the other MVFC teams feel about the dominance of the Dakota schools?

Would there be any interest in dumping them and aligning with the 5 ASUN schools for a 12 team football conference?
06-04-2021 09:19 AM
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solohawks Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-04-2021 09:19 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Not to derail a good thread but I wonder what the fans of the other MVFC teams feel about the dominance of the Dakota schools?

Would there be any interest in dumping them and aligning with the 5 ASUN schools for a 12 team football conference?

Not sure.

If I was the OVC and was trying to get creative (avoid WIU) I would try to get the 4 IL/IN/MO MVC schools to come over as football only plus Youngstown State.
No more Dakotas, no affiliate fees, plus whatever else they need.

MO/IL/IN (WEST) Division
Missouri State*
Southeast Missouri State
Southern Illinois*
Illinois State*
Eastern Illinois
Indiana State*

TN/KY/OH (EAST) Division
Murray State
UT Martin
Austin Peay
Tennessee State
Tennessee Tech
*Youngstown State

My 5 non football members would be: SIU Edwardsville, Belmont, Lipscomb, Morehead State, Bellarmine

For Basketball scheduling, Murray State, UT Martin, Austin Peay and SIU Edwardsville would join EIU and SEMS in the West
The East would be Tennessee State, Belmont, Lipscomb, Tennessee Tech, Bellarmine, Morehead State.

If the ASUN picks off a #6 like Austin Peay, THEN you add WIU to fill the number
(This post was last modified: 06-04-2021 09:49 AM by solohawks.)
06-04-2021 09:47 AM
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MattBrownEP Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-04-2021 09:19 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Not to derail a good thread but I wonder what the fans of the other MVFC teams feel about the dominance of the Dakota schools?

Would there be any interest in dumping them and aligning with the 5 ASUN schools for a 12 team football conference?

That would really run counter to what the ASUN is trying to accomplish
06-04-2021 09:50 AM
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HawaiiMongoose Offline
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Post: #39
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
(06-04-2021 08:10 AM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  This is what I've been told on the WIU/OVC/MVC business.

1) Like almost every other realignment move, these things take time.

2) There *have* been conversations. The idea that WIU would never want to talk to the OVC in any circumstances just isn't true. Yes, going from the MVC to the OVC would be a "downgrade" as far as football is concerned, but the last year should have made it very clear that under the right circumstances, schools are prepared to leave conferences for less prestigious offerings at the FCS level, if money, institutional fit, etc are in line.

3) There is an element of monetary savings involved here, but when we talk about saving money, we're talking more about the future cost curves. WIU is not in a healthy place as an institution, and this donor base, never particularly large, is close to tapped out. The state isn't going to meaningfully bail them out. If you're already not competitive in the MVC, and you believe your costs are likely to increase even more over the next decade, looking elsewhere may make sense.

4) The way it's been explained to me, one of the OVC's big concerns is how competitive WIU might be THERE. If you stink at football, *really* stink at basketball, aren't great at baseball, and primarily are there to help with scheduling, maybe not every institution is wild about your value.

5) FWIW, staffers at three different MVC schools have told me "man, I wish those guys would leave."

6) There is no chance in hell WIU is getting a full sports MVC invite, especially given what I've reported about the current MVC expansion philosophy.

I think this move is more likely to happen eventually than not, but a lot can change this summer.

Great info, thanks Matt.
06-04-2021 04:05 PM
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Erictelevision Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Any movement before July 2021?
Muskie: could/would TN St. get an invite from a conference with HBCUs?
06-04-2021 05:58 PM
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