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Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB conference?
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PojoaquePosse Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-27-2021 03:15 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:47 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 09:21 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 09:00 AM)jedclampett Wrote:  
(05-26-2021 07:41 AM)DoubleRSU Wrote:  You can study it all you want. Lamar and SHSU could have been FBS 10 years ago. Southern Utah didn’t leave the Big Sky to be left by the Texas schools, “when they join FBS”. Not happening anytime soon. Southern Utah isn’t joining FBS either.

Some of you might want to take a look at the ASUN CSNBBS board under the topic of "ASUN Expansion," or a similar thread that I started to ask them their opinions about the future direction of that conference."

It appears that the range of views over there is somewhat similar to the views on this board:

--Some of them see the ASUN as moving toward FBS status, while others disagree and think it's more likely to proceed as an FCS conference.

--One or two of them noted that they haven't yet identified a 6th football school and suggested that it might be a good idea to extend their temporary plan to play the WAC football teams.

--Both boards seem to agree that they will be FCS conferences, but to have different views about whether or when or how they would transition to FBS, if they ever do.

--It appears that both conferences are in a somewhat similar situation, and for either of them to put a FBS conference together, their best bet might be some kind of an ongoing scheduling alliance.

.

There is one big difference: the WAC still has an FBS charter apparently. The ASUN does not. Still not sure about the practicality of the FBS charter thing myself though.

There is another big difference. The WAC announced that all FCS teams would do a study to explore going to FBS. I don't think the ASUN has expressed a similar edict. So any ASUN speculation on FBS is just that...speculation. The WAC is openly looking at FBS. They explicitly told us that.

One other thing. In a couple years, the WAC will not need an alliance with the ASUN. Tarleton and Dixie will be FCS and the WAC will have 7 FCS teams which gives them an auto qualifier.

No, the WAC isn't looking at FBS, a few members who are about to join the WAC are looking at FBS. Big difference.

EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.
05-27-2021 08:54 PM
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SDHornet Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 03:15 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:47 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 09:21 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 09:00 AM)jedclampett Wrote:  Some of you might want to take a look at the ASUN CSNBBS board under the topic of "ASUN Expansion," or a similar thread that I started to ask them their opinions about the future direction of that conference."

It appears that the range of views over there is somewhat similar to the views on this board:

--Some of them see the ASUN as moving toward FBS status, while others disagree and think it's more likely to proceed as an FCS conference.

--One or two of them noted that they haven't yet identified a 6th football school and suggested that it might be a good idea to extend their temporary plan to play the WAC football teams.

--Both boards seem to agree that they will be FCS conferences, but to have different views about whether or when or how they would transition to FBS, if they ever do.

--It appears that both conferences are in a somewhat similar situation, and for either of them to put a FBS conference together, their best bet might be some kind of an ongoing scheduling alliance.

.

There is one big difference: the WAC still has an FBS charter apparently. The ASUN does not. Still not sure about the practicality of the FBS charter thing myself though.

There is another big difference. The WAC announced that all FCS teams would do a study to explore going to FBS. I don't think the ASUN has expressed a similar edict. So any ASUN speculation on FBS is just that...speculation. The WAC is openly looking at FBS. They explicitly told us that.

One other thing. In a couple years, the WAC will not need an alliance with the ASUN. Tarleton and Dixie will be FCS and the WAC will have 7 FCS teams which gives them an auto qualifier.

No, the WAC isn't looking at FBS, a few members who are about to join the WAC are looking at FBS. Big difference.

EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

Lol. Sure, every FCS WAC program has legit FBS chances. Let's go with that.
05-27-2021 08:59 PM
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NotANewbie Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
The fact is that every FCS playing school in or joining the WAC is committed to doing a feasibility study on FBS. That means the WAC is exploring the possibility of moving to FBS.

However, it does not mean that all of the schools will conclude that FBS is feasible for them. So, the most realistic conclusion is that there is a possibility of a return to FBS for the WAC, but it is far from a foregone conclusion that it will happen.

I suspect that each of us has our own idea about how likely it is, in part fueled by our personal preference. Shall we agree to disagree on how likely it is to come to pass?
05-27-2021 09:25 PM
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Todor Online
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Post: #44
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-27-2021 08:59 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 03:15 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:47 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 09:21 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  There is one big difference: the WAC still has an FBS charter apparently. The ASUN does not. Still not sure about the practicality of the FBS charter thing myself though.

There is another big difference. The WAC announced that all FCS teams would do a study to explore going to FBS. I don't think the ASUN has expressed a similar edict. So any ASUN speculation on FBS is just that...speculation. The WAC is openly looking at FBS. They explicitly told us that.

One other thing. In a couple years, the WAC will not need an alliance with the ASUN. Tarleton and Dixie will be FCS and the WAC will have 7 FCS teams which gives them an auto qualifier.

No, the WAC isn't looking at FBS, a few members who are about to join the WAC are looking at FBS. Big difference.

EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

Lol. Sure, every FCS WAC program has legit FBS chances. Let's go with that.

So everyone will notify the conference that FBS isn't feasible. End of study. Of course, it'll all be spun up into formal language so it sounds like they actually looked into it.

For whatever reason, it was important to the Texas schools to play the charade of "looking into it." Its either for their fans, donors, board of regents, or whoever, but it was never intended to be a real consideration for anyone.

Going thru these types of phony exercises for the sake of public appearance is really a bad way to do business. If you have to force others to go thru this kind of thing, it really means you're in very different places.

I woukd imagine SF, SH, and Lamar will have coordinated statements that don't say no to FBS, but allude to it being dependent on what the others decide, knowing the others are saying no. It all feels like a very intentional way to plant the seeds of division within the conference while trying to appear to be "good guys" and creating a sort of artificial failure to pin on schools that never pretended to have even the remotest interest in FBS in the first place. Its one-up-manship at its worst.
05-27-2021 09:37 PM
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PojoaquePosse Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-27-2021 08:59 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 03:15 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:47 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 09:21 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  There is one big difference: the WAC still has an FBS charter apparently. The ASUN does not. Still not sure about the practicality of the FBS charter thing myself though.

There is another big difference. The WAC announced that all FCS teams would do a study to explore going to FBS. I don't think the ASUN has expressed a similar edict. So any ASUN speculation on FBS is just that...speculation. The WAC is openly looking at FBS. They explicitly told us that.

One other thing. In a couple years, the WAC will not need an alliance with the ASUN. Tarleton and Dixie will be FCS and the WAC will have 7 FCS teams which gives them an auto qualifier.

No, the WAC isn't looking at FBS, a few members who are about to join the WAC are looking at FBS. Big difference.

EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

Lol. Sure, every FCS WAC program has legit FBS chances. Let's go with that.

Why do you keep twisting things? Did I say every WAC FCS program has legit FBS chances? Did I say the WAC was going FBS? Did I speculate about anything? Did I exaggerate? I’m talking facts! Straight facts. That’s all I’ve posted. F.A.C.T.S. Get a grip!
(This post was last modified: 05-27-2021 10:19 PM by PojoaquePosse.)
05-27-2021 10:19 PM
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HerdZoned Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

And not a one of them have the community support, facilities or athletic budget to survive the travel or extra 22 scholarships. The highest athletic budget belongs to Sam Houston at 17.3 million per year. Which would put them next to dead last in IA budgets.

As of right now and going into the future there are only 3 programs that could actually make the jump and succeed at it, North Dakota State, Jacksonville State and James Madison.
05-27-2021 11:32 PM
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SDHornet Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-27-2021 10:19 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:59 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 03:15 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:47 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  There is another big difference. The WAC announced that all FCS teams would do a study to explore going to FBS. I don't think the ASUN has expressed a similar edict. So any ASUN speculation on FBS is just that...speculation. The WAC is openly looking at FBS. They explicitly told us that.

One other thing. In a couple years, the WAC will not need an alliance with the ASUN. Tarleton and Dixie will be FCS and the WAC will have 7 FCS teams which gives them an auto qualifier.

No, the WAC isn't looking at FBS, a few members who are about to join the WAC are looking at FBS. Big difference.

EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

Lol. Sure, every FCS WAC program has legit FBS chances. Let's go with that.

Why do you keep twisting things? Did I say every WAC FCS program has legit FBS chances? Did I say the WAC was going FBS? Did I speculate about anything? Did I exaggerate? I’m talking facts! Straight facts. That’s all I’ve posted. F.A.C.T.S. Get a grip!

Yes, actually you are implying it's the entire WAC...which of course is the issue. Sure a couple of the new TX homies will have a shot at FBS, but none of the other FCS WAC additions have a shot at FBS. Hell, the new TX schools are more appealing than NMSU for an existing FBS conference and they haven't played a down of WAC FCS FB. Tells you all you need to know about the WAC's and NMSU's situation.
05-27-2021 11:43 PM
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Post: #48
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB conference?
I think the WAC will be FBS by the end of the decade... Or at least what is currently known as the G5 FBS. MWC MAC SUNBELT etc... if the big boys decide a Power 5 (4/6) split from FBS.

Here are a few thoughts and conclusions from the casual conversations I have had with some people who are at least somewhat in the know.

1. Not every school that is in the current WAC configuration will go FBS with the WAC. Dixie St/S Utah could be "traded" to the Big Sky for other schools that are more FBS ready. There are serious questions and doubts as to whether either really have the ability to make that jump...but it is still to early to say for sure. But that move is still at least 5 years away. All of the "Texas 4" +Tarleton have the "potential" to move up in 5-10 years, Though again, there is some serious concern that SFA could get left behind due to lack of institutional resources.

2. At this juncture, the time has passed for any possibility of another D II move up (and or non football school) . Sorry WTAMU, best of luck in the Southland!!! (If you decide to move up) With the addition of the Texas 4...and subtraction of Chicago State...The WAC has finally achieved stability!...Well, almost!

3. Incarnate Word is seriously being vetted.... But probably not to take along to the FBS, but as a last ditch effort to get to 6 (eligible) schools for an AQ bid in football while Tarleton and Dixie are in transition. The problem with UIW going FBS is not money, they have plenty of that, or TV Market, as San Antonio is an attractive market. The problem is that they are a small Catholic School with virtually NO fan support. Even if they build it (facilities) they will NOT come. But there is the old saying "Do unto others...WHAT THEY DID TO YOU!" The "Texas 4" exodus from the Southland can not be misconstrued as a "civil divorce" to put it politely. And the Texas 4 would love to serve a cold dish of revenge to the SLC by putting them in the same precarious situation. That is to say to take away the AQ bid to the conference, since they will only have 5 Football schools if UIW leaves. They could also put pressure on UIW to spend some of Gods money upgrading their facilities like they were SUPPOSED to do when they joined the SLC from the LSC. Also, every school in the BSC said "No"... at least for now...So, yes, UIW is a distinct possibility, but the situation is fluid and until the ink is dry on the contract, nothing is certain. There are a few other things that could really hurt UIW chances. Such as Tarleton/Dixie getting a waiver for AQ Status, UTRGV starting up football quickly (doubtful if even at all) or another FCS (Football school) joining. (but the probability of that is not great from what I am hearing)

4. Seattle and other Non Football schools being pushed out of the conference. I have heard "grumblings" about that but until the WAC actually starts back up as an FBS Football conference, I do not see any forced exodus of any school other than Chicago State, which is all but gone now anyway. (Technically not until next summer, but they will probably use Covid 19 as an excuse to cancel athletics for the upcoming year anyway, so it does not even matter. Seattle and CBU can hopefully land a spot in the WCC or even BWC, which the former is a natural fit for both. Not sure what will happen to UVU or UTRGV as I can not see anybody wanting either. And no one wants the foul stench of GCU. I would much rather have to pay the travel cost to Seattle than to be associated with a for profit online university with absolutely ZERO academic credibility. GCU is far more an embarrassment to the conference than Chicago St.

5. Which way will the wind whirl to get to 8 (Football) schools for FBS status? That is the "
million dollar question". There are far too many equations to consider and right now anything is possible. And they have 5-10 years to figure it out. No one knows what the landscape will be like in that amount of time or which schools from which conference wants to make a jump etc. Whether it be FCS schools or even FBS Schools. But as it currently stands, an FBS WAC would be...

NMSU

HIGH PROBABILITY

Tarleton
Sam Houston
Lamar
Abilene Chistian

MODERATE PROBABILITY

Stephen F Austin
S. Utah

LOW PROBABILITY

Dixie St

If you take NMSU and the "High Probability" schools and 1 of the "moderate probability" schools you have 6 and only need 2 more. I will not speculate on who it might be, but I will say in 5-10 years I am sure you can find 2 schools from either an FCS conference who want to move up or from a G5 conference who is dreadfully unhappy with their situation and or has no better option.
(This post was last modified: 05-27-2021 11:53 PM by Spolovilo4EVER.)
05-27-2021 11:48 PM
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SDHornet Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
So SUU will be "traded" to the BSC...a conference they just came from...

where do these people come from?!?

03-lmfao03-lmfao03-lmfao
05-27-2021 11:50 PM
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SDHornet Offline
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Post: #50
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
I made the mistake and read more after the laughable "trading" SUU back to the BSC.

Incarnate Word to be added for the AQ but doesn't factor into a WAC FBS? 03-lmfao

Pushing out Seattle and other non-FB vetted full WAC members?!?!? 03-lmfao03-lmfao03-lmfao

JFC, mods there are not enough neg reps to go around here, ban this idiot asap. 03-drunk
05-27-2021 11:56 PM
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PojoaquePosse Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-27-2021 11:43 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:19 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:59 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 03:15 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  No, the WAC isn't looking at FBS, a few members who are about to join the WAC are looking at FBS. Big difference.

EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

Lol. Sure, every FCS WAC program has legit FBS chances. Let's go with that.

Why do you keep twisting things? Did I say every WAC FCS program has legit FBS chances? Did I say the WAC was going FBS? Did I speculate about anything? Did I exaggerate? I’m talking facts! Straight facts. That’s all I’ve posted. F.A.C.T.S. Get a grip!

Yes, actually you are implying it's the entire WAC...which of course is the issue. Sure a couple of the new TX homies will have a shot at FBS, but none of the other FCS WAC additions have a shot at FBS. Hell, the new TX schools are more appealing than NMSU for an existing FBS conference and they haven't played a down of WAC FCS FB. Tells you all you need to know about the WAC's and NMSU's situation.

I’m not implying anything. Point out where I have speculated about anything? What’s your problem? You keep putting words in my mouth.

I don’t know what the FBS studies will say. They may say no FBS for each school. They may yes FBS for some schools. They may say yes FBS for all schools. Who knows? Not me. All I’ve said is all WAC FCS schools are doing a study. I’ve never said anything else. You are the one speculating thinking you know everything. You know squat. You are just guessing.
05-28-2021 07:51 AM
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Post: #52
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-27-2021 11:32 PM)HerdZoned Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

And not a one of them have the community support, facilities or athletic budget to survive the travel or extra 22 scholarships. The highest athletic budget belongs to Sam Houston at 17.3 million per year. Which would put them next to dead last in IA budgets.

As of right now and going into the future there are only 3 programs that could actually make the jump and succeed at it, North Dakota State, Jacksonville State and James Madison.



FYI, some of your comments don’t match current facts. Sam Houston’s budget is several million above Jacksonville State, for example. And virtually every one of the Texas4 spends more than LA Monroe, which holds the “honor” of being dead last in D1 FBS spending. I’m not sure how you can conclude some of these schools lack the alum or community support to fund the additional scholarships?

https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances

I do agree that James Madison would have no trouble making the jump to FBS. A number of schools are better positioned than Jax State though...UC Davis and Cap Poly for starters.
(This post was last modified: 05-28-2021 09:11 AM by OscarWildeCat.)
05-28-2021 09:09 AM
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SDHornet Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-28-2021 07:51 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 11:43 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:19 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:59 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

Lol. Sure, every FCS WAC program has legit FBS chances. Let's go with that.

Why do you keep twisting things? Did I say every WAC FCS program has legit FBS chances? Did I say the WAC was going FBS? Did I speculate about anything? Did I exaggerate? I’m talking facts! Straight facts. That’s all I’ve posted. F.A.C.T.S. Get a grip!

Yes, actually you are implying it's the entire WAC...which of course is the issue. Sure a couple of the new TX homies will have a shot at FBS, but none of the other FCS WAC additions have a shot at FBS. Hell, the new TX schools are more appealing than NMSU for an existing FBS conference and they haven't played a down of WAC FCS FB. Tells you all you need to know about the WAC's and NMSU's situation.

I’m not implying anything. Point out where I have speculated about anything? What’s your problem? You keep putting words in my mouth.

I don’t know what the FBS studies will say. They may say no FBS for each school. They may yes FBS for some schools. They may say yes FBS for all schools. Who knows? Not me. All I’ve said is all WAC FCS schools are doing a study. I’ve never said anything else. You are the one speculating thinking you know everything. You know squat. You are just guessing.

My problem is that you're (and everyone else) putting too much stock in these FBS studies wrt the WAC as a whole being FBS. I have no doubt some of the studies will say so and so could be FBS. And I agree that a couple of these TX adds will be FBS in short order.

The reality is most of the WAC FCS programs will be in the WAC much longer, if not forever. So someone needs to stomp on all this "WAC to the FBS" nonsense and I have no problem being that guy. The WAC finally finds some stability and the conversations immediately jumped from survival to bailing on the WAC for some FBS pipe dream and even an even more credulous narrative of pushing non-FB members out of the WAC...all before the new member have even stepped foot in the WAC.
05-28-2021 09:19 AM
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PojoaquePosse Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-28-2021 09:19 AM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-28-2021 07:51 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 11:43 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:19 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:59 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  Lol. Sure, every FCS WAC program has legit FBS chances. Let's go with that.

Why do you keep twisting things? Did I say every WAC FCS program has legit FBS chances? Did I say the WAC was going FBS? Did I speculate about anything? Did I exaggerate? I’m talking facts! Straight facts. That’s all I’ve posted. F.A.C.T.S. Get a grip!

Yes, actually you are implying it's the entire WAC...which of course is the issue. Sure a couple of the new TX homies will have a shot at FBS, but none of the other FCS WAC additions have a shot at FBS. Hell, the new TX schools are more appealing than NMSU for an existing FBS conference and they haven't played a down of WAC FCS FB. Tells you all you need to know about the WAC's and NMSU's situation.

I’m not implying anything. Point out where I have speculated about anything? What’s your problem? You keep putting words in my mouth.

I don’t know what the FBS studies will say. They may say no FBS for each school. They may yes FBS for some schools. They may say yes FBS for all schools. Who knows? Not me. All I’ve said is all WAC FCS schools are doing a study. I’ve never said anything else. You are the one speculating thinking you know everything. You know squat. You are just guessing.

My problem is that you're (and everyone else) putting too much stock in these FBS studies wrt the WAC as a whole being FBS. I have no doubt some of the studies will say so and so could be FBS. And I agree that a couple of these TX adds will be FBS in short order.

The reality is most of the WAC FCS programs will be in the WAC much longer, if not forever. So someone needs to stomp on all this "WAC to the FBS" nonsense and I have no problem being that guy. The WAC finally finds some stability and the conversations immediately jumped from survival to bailing on the WAC for some FBS pipe dream and even an even more credulous narrative of pushing non-FB members out of the WAC...all before the new member have even stepped foot in the WAC.

I put too much stock in studies by simply pointing out schools are doing studies and not making any other commentary on the subject? Ok...

You, on the other hand, are speculating left and right about what is feasible and what is not. Everything you’ve posted is just your opinion. I’ve simply said schools are doing studies. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Everything in your post is referring to things other posters have said, not me. I’m not going to stop calling you out until stop putting words in my mouth.

7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
(This post was last modified: 05-28-2021 11:57 AM by PojoaquePosse.)
05-28-2021 11:46 AM
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CW Fishman Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
"And virtually every one of the Texas4 spends more than LA Monroe, which holds the “honor” of being dead last in D1 FBS spending. I’m not sure how you can conclude some of these schools lack the alum or community support to fund the additional scholarships?

ULM is not a good comparison. Do these schools really want to move up and be a cellar dweller? Below is the actual budgets of Sunbelt Teams in 2019, all of which have since increased.

Coastal Caroline 37,885
Georgina Southern 29483
Ga State 35546
Texas State 37834
Troy 32334
Louisiana 32544
USA 33964

Budgets for former SLC schools in 2019

SHSU 19210
SFA 19046
Lamar 18643

I am not saying that these teams cannot increase their budgets to be competitive, only that ULM is a really bad standard to set. They have not been consistently successful in anything in the SBC. Currently a budget of 30M + is required to be competitve at the FBS level.
05-28-2021 11:54 AM
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OscarWildeCat Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-28-2021 11:54 AM)CW Fishman Wrote:  "And virtually every one of the Texas4 spends more than LA Monroe, which holds the “honor” of being dead last in D1 FBS spending. I’m not sure how you can conclude some of these schools lack the alum or community support to fund the additional scholarships?

ULM is not a good comparison. Do these schools really want to move up and be a cellar dweller? Below is the actual budgets of Sunbelt Teams in 2019, all of which have since increased.

Coastal Caroline 37,885
Georgina Southern 29483
Ga State 35546
Texas State 37834
Troy 32334
Louisiana 32544
USA 33964

Budgets for former SLC schools in 2019

SHSU 19210
SFA 19046
Lamar 18643

I am not saying that these teams cannot increase their budgets to be competitive, only that ULM is a really bad standard to set. They have not been consistently successful in anything in the SBC. Currently a budget of 30M + is required to be competitve at the FBS level.

I didn’t use ULM as an exemplary school budget. I was just pointing out that The Texas schools wouldn’t be the lowest in budget as you had suggested.

We actually agree that 30 million plus is required to become minimally competitive at the FBS level and even then success is hardly assured.
UTEP and UNM come immediately to mind.

Personally, I’d rather focus scarce resources on becoming a first rate mid major basketball conference with top tier FCS football.
05-28-2021 01:19 PM
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SDHornet Offline
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Post: #57
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-28-2021 11:46 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-28-2021 09:19 AM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-28-2021 07:51 AM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 11:43 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 10:19 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  Why do you keep twisting things? Did I say every WAC FCS program has legit FBS chances? Did I say the WAC was going FBS? Did I speculate about anything? Did I exaggerate? I’m talking facts! Straight facts. That’s all I’ve posted. F.A.C.T.S. Get a grip!

Yes, actually you are implying it's the entire WAC...which of course is the issue. Sure a couple of the new TX homies will have a shot at FBS, but none of the other FCS WAC additions have a shot at FBS. Hell, the new TX schools are more appealing than NMSU for an existing FBS conference and they haven't played a down of WAC FCS FB. Tells you all you need to know about the WAC's and NMSU's situation.

I’m not implying anything. Point out where I have speculated about anything? What’s your problem? You keep putting words in my mouth.

I don’t know what the FBS studies will say. They may say no FBS for each school. They may yes FBS for some schools. They may say yes FBS for all schools. Who knows? Not me. All I’ve said is all WAC FCS schools are doing a study. I’ve never said anything else. You are the one speculating thinking you know everything. You know squat. You are just guessing.

My problem is that you're (and everyone else) putting too much stock in these FBS studies wrt the WAC as a whole being FBS. I have no doubt some of the studies will say so and so could be FBS. And I agree that a couple of these TX adds will be FBS in short order.

The reality is most of the WAC FCS programs will be in the WAC much longer, if not forever. So someone needs to stomp on all this "WAC to the FBS" nonsense and I have no problem being that guy. The WAC finally finds some stability and the conversations immediately jumped from survival to bailing on the WAC for some FBS pipe dream and even an even more credulous narrative of pushing non-FB members out of the WAC...all before the new member have even stepped foot in the WAC.

I put too much stock in studies by simply pointing out schools are doing studies and not making any other commentary on the subject? Ok...

You, on the other hand, are speculating left and right about what is feasible and what is not. Everything you’ve posted is just your opinion. I’ve simply said schools are doing studies. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Everything in your post is referring to things other posters have said, not me. I’m not going to stop calling you out until stop putting words in my mouth.

7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.
7 WAC schools are doing FBS feasibility studies. That’s all.

SUU and DSU can do all the studies they want, they have no metrics to indicate they can be/support an FBS program. That's not an opinion, that's a fact.

I don't know much about the TX schools but assume a few of them could actually pull off FBS just going off of the fact that the WAC already cycled through some TX FCS move-ups and that they reside in a FB crazed state.
05-28-2021 02:38 PM
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jdgaucho Offline
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Post: #58
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-28-2021 09:09 AM)OscarWildeCat Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 11:32 PM)HerdZoned Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

And not a one of them have the community support, facilities or athletic budget to survive the travel or extra 22 scholarships. The highest athletic budget belongs to Sam Houston at 17.3 million per year. Which would put them next to dead last in IA budgets.

As of right now and going into the future there are only 3 programs that could actually make the jump and succeed at it, North Dakota State, Jacksonville State and James Madison.



FYI, some of your comments don’t match current facts. Sam Houston’s budget is several million above Jacksonville State, for example. And virtually every one of the Texas4 spends more than LA Monroe, which holds the “honor” of being dead last in D1 FBS spending. I’m not sure how you can conclude some of these schools lack the alum or community support to fund the additional scholarships?

https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances

I do agree that James Madison would have no trouble making the jump to FBS. A number of schools are better positioned than Jax State though...UC Davis and Cap Poly for starters.

Those last two would have to want to make a move first. And even if they did, they'd aim to be with their regional peers. Not some randoms like Tarleton State, Abilene Christian and Sam Houston State. No offense.
05-29-2021 03:26 PM
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Post: #59
Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB conference?
(05-29-2021 03:26 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  
(05-28-2021 09:09 AM)OscarWildeCat Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 11:32 PM)HerdZoned Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

And not a one of them have the community support, facilities or athletic budget to survive the travel or extra 22 scholarships. The highest athletic budget belongs to Sam Houston at 17.3 million per year. Which would put them next to dead last in IA budgets.

As of right now and going into the future there are only 3 programs that could actually make the jump and succeed at it, North Dakota State, Jacksonville State and James Madison.



FYI, some of your comments don’t match current facts. Sam Houston’s budget is several million above Jacksonville State, for example. And virtually every one of the Texas4 spends more than LA Monroe, which holds the “honor” of being dead last in D1 FBS spending. I’m not sure how you can conclude some of these schools lack the alum or community support to fund the additional scholarships?

https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances

I do agree that James Madison would have no trouble making the jump to FBS. A number of schools are better positioned than Jax State though...UC Davis and Cap Poly for starters.

Those last two would have to want to make a move first. And even if they did, they'd aim to be with their regional peers. Not some randoms like Tarleton State, Abilene Christian and Sam Houston State. No offense.


Do you follow FCS football? Sam Houston outside of NDSU is the most winningest football team of the last decade. And with this recent national championship arguably has a record that eclipsed even James Madison. No offense, but no one who follows college football would consider Tarleton State (one of the most winningest program from their time as a D2 program), ACU (great history of success, with a rising stock among FCS programs) or Sam Houston the recent Division 1 national champion a “bunch of randoms”. Especially compared to UC Davis and Cal Poly. Two Big Sky programs that have done literally nothing on the gridiron.


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(This post was last modified: 05-29-2021 03:59 PM by coogkat14.)
05-29-2021 03:58 PM
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jdgaucho Offline
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Post: #60
RE: Which is more likely before 2030 - a WAC FBS or some other "G6" FB confe...
(05-29-2021 03:58 PM)coogkat14 Wrote:  
(05-29-2021 03:26 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  
(05-28-2021 09:09 AM)OscarWildeCat Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 11:32 PM)HerdZoned Wrote:  
(05-27-2021 08:54 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  EVERY FCS school in the WAC or joining the WAC is doing a feasibility study about FBS (7 schools total). Facts are stubborn things. Spin it however you want to fit your narrative.

And not a one of them have the community support, facilities or athletic budget to survive the travel or extra 22 scholarships. The highest athletic budget belongs to Sam Houston at 17.3 million per year. Which would put them next to dead last in IA budgets.

As of right now and going into the future there are only 3 programs that could actually make the jump and succeed at it, North Dakota State, Jacksonville State and James Madison.



FYI, some of your comments don’t match current facts. Sam Houston’s budget is several million above Jacksonville State, for example. And virtually every one of the Texas4 spends more than LA Monroe, which holds the “honor” of being dead last in D1 FBS spending. I’m not sure how you can conclude some of these schools lack the alum or community support to fund the additional scholarships?

https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances

I do agree that James Madison would have no trouble making the jump to FBS. A number of schools are better positioned than Jax State though...UC Davis and Cap Poly for starters.

Those last two would have to want to make a move first. And even if they did, they'd aim to be with their regional peers. Not some randoms like Tarleton State, Abilene Christian and Sam Houston State. No offense.


Do you follow FCS football? Sam Houston outside of NDSU is the most winningest football team of the last decade. And with this recent national championship arguably has a record that eclipsed even James Madison. No offense, but no one who follows college football would consider Tarleton State (one of the most winningest program from their time as a D2 program), ACU (great history of success, with a rising stock among FCS programs) or Sam Houston the recent Division 1 national champion a “bunch of randoms”. Especially compared to UC Davis and Cal Poly. Two Big Sky programs that have done literally nothing on the gridiron.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I do not follow FCS football; if I did I'd be a USD Torero supporter.

But I am an alum of a school which shares a conference with Cal Poly and UC Davis. If they had a choice of FBS and aligning with Nevada, Fresno State and Boise State - Cal Poly briefly was in a conference with Boise and Nevada in the mid 90s - vs FBS and aligning with Sam Houston State, ACU and Tarleton State, they'd choose the former. It's more about joining regional peers than anything else.
05-29-2021 04:25 PM
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