(04-21-2021 12:49 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Why do you care when someone votes or the reason as to why they might choose to want or use another method? We live in a representative republic. The majority of Americans want mail in voting and have told their representatives this. So states have passed laws accordingly to accommodate what the people want.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-th...blogHeader

We're not living in 1776 any more! We're more than capable of safely handling voting in more than just one way and on one day.

If you don't like it, move somewhere else or make your voice heard to your representatives.

Just suck it up and put your big girl panties on, leave your mommy's basement, leave your therapy dog at the house, and actually vote in person. Now, as far as having more than one day to vote, I'm all for it, but you Xes who claim that your anxiety prevents you from being social and getting off your @ss is no excuse to demand we cater to you.

(04-21-2021 12:45 PM)No2rdame Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 12:41 PM)BobcatEngineer Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Nope. No way.

Polling sites have been drastically reduced in urban areas causing lines that stretch for blocks. There were lines in pretty much every major cities that went on for hours, where as the last time I went to vote in my hometown in rural Ohio, I was in and out in 15 minutes. Furthermore, many people can't just simply take a day off of work to stand in line all day to vote.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with early voting.

I think banker combined a couple different thoughts into one. I am fine with early voting in person as it can combine necessary security to elections. Absentee voting by mailing ballots to anyone and everyone with no justification for why they need an absentee ballot should be disallowed.

This makes little sense as states are more than capable of monitoring who has voted to assure people aren't voting twice through signatures, etc.

(04-21-2021 12:41 PM)BobcatEngineer Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Nope. No way.

Polling sites have been drastically reduced in urban areas causing lines that stretch for blocks. There were lines in pretty much every major city that went on for hours, where as the last time I went to vote in my hometown in rural Ohio, I was in and out in 15 minutes. Furthermore, many people can't just simply take a day off of work to stand in line all day to vote.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with early voting.

Because they are run by leftist dopes who couldnt run a lemonade stand.

Fact

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(04-21-2021 12:52 PM)No2rdame Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 12:49 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Why do you care when someone votes or the reason as to why they might choose to want or use another method? We live in a representative republic. The majority of Americans want mail in voting and have told their representatives this. So states have passed laws accordingly to accommodate what the people want.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-th...blogHeader

We're not living in 1776 any more! We're more than capable of safely handling voting in more than just one way and on one day.

If you don't like it, move somewhere else or make your voice heard to your representatives.

Just suck it up and put your big girl panties on, leave your mommy's basement, leave your therapy dog at the house, and actually vote in person. Now, as far as having more than one day to vote, I'm all for it, but you Xes who claim that your anxiety prevents you from being social and getting off your @ss is no excuse to demand we cater to you.

Capable - yes

Carrying it out - um no - at least not so far.

(04-21-2021 12:52 PM)No2rdame Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 12:49 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Why do you care when someone votes or the reason as to why they might choose to want or use another method? We live in a representative republic. The majority of Americans want mail in voting and have told their representatives this. So states have passed laws accordingly to accommodate what the people want.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-th...blogHeader

We're not living in 1776 any more! We're more than capable of safely handling voting in more than just one way and on one day.

If you don't like it, move somewhere else or make your voice heard to your representatives.

Just suck it up and put your big girl panties on, leave your mommy's basement, leave your therapy dog at the house, and actually vote in person. Now, as far as having more than one day to vote, I'm all for it, but you Xes who claim that your anxiety prevents you from being social and getting off your @ss is no excuse to demand we cater to you.

I do, clown show. I love getting up early and going to the polls.

But I only speak for me...as you do for you. Others don't want to or can't...so they want another option.

(04-21-2021 12:49 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Why do you care when someone votes or the reason as to why they might choose to want or use another method? We live in a representative republic. The majority of Americans want mail in voting and have told their representatives this. So states have passed laws accordingly to accommodate what the people want.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-th...blogHeader

We're not living in 1776 any more! We're more than capable of safely handling voting in more than just one way and on one day.

If you don't like it, move somewhere else or make your voice heard to your representatives.

We arent living in 1776 yet says wants mail in voting


Bwahahahahahaha

You cant make this **** up

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(04-21-2021 12:49 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  We're not living in 1776 any more!

Back then they didnt stop counting votes due to a leaky urinal.

Quote:We're more than capable of safely handling voting in more than just one way and on one day.

Correct, if proper laws and procedure are followed. But they arent. So f*ck that.

(04-21-2021 11:19 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  And i would say not just a valid government ID but a government ID that clearly identifies the individual and establishes the right to vote in a specific precinct. A library card is a government ID that doesn't do that, for example. I have proposed a free voter ID with photo, signature, and thumbprints electronically imbedded. Private businesses do this for about $5 a card, so the price is not exorbitant. You show up to vote, your photo and signature are matched and you do a quick thumbprint scan, if all checks then you get the appropriate ballot, and you are marked in the database as having voted to prevent multiple votes. If you mail in, you sign the transmittal envelope and there is some process for taking thumbprints. And again you are recorded as having voted to prevent double votes.

I suppose I would be okay with voter ID requirements so long as they are free as you mentioned and the process for obtaining one is generally not cumbersome.

Although, I believe having a card separate from any of the other currently accepted government issued IDs (drivers license, passport, military ID, etc...) isn't necessary. Especially one with your specific precinct on it seems like it would place more of a barrier on younger people and people who are transient. For instance, when I was in college, I voted in 4 different precincts over the course of 6 years. Would I have to get a new card every time I moved?

The thumbprint requirement opens up a whole other can of worms that I think you would run into opposition from both sides of the political divide.

However, with all that said, in exchange for the four things you said you'd support, especially universal healthcare, I would be open to entertaining the ID requirements you laid out. Even though I don't believe they are necessary.

No compromise. We've been trying to compromise w/ them for decades & get stabbed in the back every time.

(04-21-2021 11:01 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  I'll take a shot at this:


Secondly, most liberals don't have a problem with voter ID, we have a problem with Republicans placing unnecessary restrictions on a constitutional right (see: Georgia) in order to make voting more difficult, thus suppressing voters who would not typically go to the ends of the earth to vote. People who vote should be tax paying citizens with a valid government ID. Anyone who meets this criteria should automatically be registered to vote. No poll taxes, no voter intimidation, secure voting processes, open to everyone that meets the first two criteria.


In short: Have your ID's. Secure the election process tighter than Fort Knox. No one has a problem with this. But do not place unnecessary restrictions intended to suppress someone's constitutional rights based off a problem that does not exist.

I'll focus on this part, especially in regards to the new GA laws.

The new voter laws increase the number of early voting Saturdays to a minimum of two, as well as an option for Sundays as well. It also allows for expanded afternoon hours.

The requirement for photo id on a mail in ballot replaces the signature matching. Multiple forms of photo id are acceptable and Georgia will issue one free. They can also give the last four of their ssn ilo an id number.

The new law mandates at least one drop box per county. Previously counties were not required to have dropboxes for absentee ballots.

The new law bans mailing out unsolicited ballots and allows 78 days for voters to request a ballot.

The new law creates new precincts to address long lines if there were more than 2000 voters or more than hour wait times in 2020.

New election board is non-partisan and not chaired by secretary of state.

New law allows absentee ballots to be processed but not tabulated 15 days prior to election day which will speed up results. Also cannot stop counting once counting has started.


There really isn't much at all that could be considered "unnecessary restrictions" on voting, unless you take exception to poll workers and volunteers not being able to hand out water anymore.


I do tend to agree with you that only taxpayers should be allowed to vote, but since this is extremely close to a poll tax, I would amend that in order to be eligible to vote, you must have filed a tax return in the past two years. It would complicate things a bit, but going further, I would require a state income tax return in the state in which you are voting in the prior two years in order to vote in state and local elections. In other words, as long as you filed a federal return in the prior two years you can vote for president and vice president only.

(04-21-2021 12:56 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 12:52 PM)No2rdame Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 12:49 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Why do you care when someone votes or the reason as to why they might choose to want or use another method? We live in a representative republic. The majority of Americans want mail in voting and have told their representatives this. So states have passed laws accordingly to accommodate what the people want.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-th...blogHeader

We're not living in 1776 any more! We're more than capable of safely handling voting in more than just one way and on one day.

If you don't like it, move somewhere else or make your voice heard to your representatives.

Just suck it up and put your big girl panties on, leave your mommy's basement, leave your therapy dog at the house, and actually vote in person. Now, as far as having more than one day to vote, I'm all for it, but you Xes who claim that your anxiety prevents you from being social and getting off your @ss is no excuse to demand we cater to you.

I do, clown show. I love getting up early and going to the polls.

But I only speak for me...as you do for you. Others don't want to or can't...so they want another option.

Ok then - lets give everyone an entire month to actually cast their vote - October 4th to November 4th.

In that case EVERY vote must be verified as being cast by a legal/legitimate voter (you know alive, of legal age, and a resident of whatever town/state they are voting in) and that their vote was only cast 1 time. And you cannot change your mind. Once your first vote is cast, you cannot change it - so if you vote early then learned information that may change your mind before November 4 - too bad.


If you can assure both of those things - give them an f-ing year to vote for all I care.

Why would I give up one of my rights (2nd amendment - shall not...) in order to try to secure another, the right to vote?

As you've frequently said, without the 2nd, the rest don't matter. So, why give any of it away?

Plus, this assumes you are negotiating with a trustworthy partner. The left is anything but that.

(04-21-2021 02:57 PM)GeorgeBorkFan Wrote:  Why would I give up one of my rights (2nd amendment - shall not...) in order to try to secure another, the right to vote?

As you've frequently said, without the 2nd, the rest don't matter. So, why give any of it away?

Plus, this assumes you are negotiating with a trustworthy partner. The left is anything but that.

I agree - that said it is not asking for the right to vote - we obviously have that , only that properly authenticate the vote/voters better

(04-21-2021 03:02 PM)Eldonabe Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 02:57 PM)GeorgeBorkFan Wrote:  Why would I give up one of my rights (2nd amendment - shall not...) in order to try to secure another, the right to vote?

As you've frequently said, without the 2nd, the rest don't matter. So, why give any of it away?

Plus, this assumes you are negotiating with a trustworthy partner. The left is anything but that.

I agree - that said it is not asking for the right to vote - we obviously have that , only that properly authenticate the vote/voters better

"Secure" as in protect.

(04-21-2021 11:01 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 10:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Compromise is the art of I get something I want and you get something you want, so it comes across as a win-win. To get truly effective voting fraud controls, including reliable voter identification controls for all votes, what would you want in return? Or is there nothing that would satisfy you in return for making voter fraud far more difficult?

Things I would absolutely be willing to support in order to get secure elections:

- Universal health care (based upon Bismarck, but not single-payer)
- Universal subsistence-level basic income (negative income tax or Boortz-Linder prebate/prefund model)
- Legalization of marijuana and decriminalization of other drugs
- Licensing of shooters (but not guns) similar to driver's license

Would any of those, or even a package of all of them, be enough to get adequate election security in return?

I'll take a shot at this:

Quote:...To get truly effective voting fraud controls, including reliable voter identification controls for all votes, what would you want in return?

First things first, you should establish that voter fraud is a concern and who is doing it. There's a lot of misinformation that flies fast and loose on here, implying or outright saying that there was mass voter fraud when that is not the case. It's just not. Just because TrueFederalPatriot.biz wrote about it on his blog that promises his buddy's buddy knows a guy that saw it first hand, doesn't mean it's real.


Secondly, most liberals don't have a problem with voter ID, we have a problem with Republicans placing unnecessary restrictions on a constitutional right (see: Georgia) in order to make voting more difficult, thus suppressing voters who would not typically go to the ends of the earth to vote. People who vote should be tax paying citizens with a valid government ID. Anyone who meets this criteria should automatically be registered to vote. No poll taxes, no voter intimidation, secure voting processes, open to everyone that meets the first two criteria.


In short: Have your ID's. Secure the election process tighter than Fort Knox. No one has a problem with this. But do not place unnecessary restrictions intended to suppress someone's constitutional rights based off a problem that does not exist.

This is part of the problem. Can you tell us specifically what steps republicans are taking or trying to take to suppress anyone's voting rights?

I'll hang up and keep listening...

(04-21-2021 12:41 PM)BobcatEngineer Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Nope. No way.

Polling sites have been drastically reduced in urban areas causing lines that stretch for blocks. There were lines in pretty much every major city that went on for hours, where as the last time I went to vote in my hometown in rural Ohio, I was in and out in 15 minutes. Furthermore, many people can't just simply take a day off of work to stand in line all day to vote.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with early voting.

I have yet to work for any company that wouldn't provide time to go vote, and I've worked for a lot of companies over the years.

(04-21-2021 12:56 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 12:52 PM)No2rdame Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 12:49 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Why do you care when someone votes or the reason as to why they might choose to want or use another method? We live in a representative republic. The majority of Americans want mail in voting and have told their representatives this. So states have passed laws accordingly to accommodate what the people want.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-th...blogHeader

We're not living in 1776 any more! We're more than capable of safely handling voting in more than just one way and on one day.

If you don't like it, move somewhere else or make your voice heard to your representatives.

Just suck it up and put your big girl panties on, leave your mommy's basement, leave your therapy dog at the house, and actually vote in person. Now, as far as having more than one day to vote, I'm all for it, but you Xes who claim that your anxiety prevents you from being social and getting off your @ss is no excuse to demand we cater to you.

I do, clown show. I love getting up early and going to the polls.

But I only speak for me...as you do for you. Others don't want to or can't...so they want another option.

If they don't want to take the opportunity to vote on election day like millions of others do then they really don't want very badly to vote.

As someone who almost always votes early, because I absolutely despise standing in queues, I would hate to see early voting go away.

We have a voting site about 2 miles from my house. I literally once parked, went inside, voted, and when I got back to the car, the same country music song was still playing on my radio as when I had gotten out. The longest it has ever taken me was about 20 minutes in 2018.

(04-21-2021 04:15 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 12:41 PM)BobcatEngineer Wrote:  

(04-21-2021 11:50 AM)banker Wrote:  Voting should occur on Election Day, not election week or election month. Who has more trouble getting to polls, an urban citizen that has mass transit and most likely already lives within 3 blocks of a polling station, or a rural farmer who may have to drive 20 miles on winding roads in the snow? Early voting should not be allowed. If you know you won’t be able to vote,’apply for absentee.

Absentee ballots should be limited to active duty military, people without the physical ability to vote in person, and those that apply knowing they will be out of town. There should never,’under any circumstance, be mass ballots mailed out as there is zero control of those ballots.

Nope. No way.

Polling sites have been drastically reduced in urban areas causing lines that stretch for blocks. There were lines in pretty much every major city that went on for hours, where as the last time I went to vote in my hometown in rural Ohio, I was in and out in 15 minutes. Furthermore, many people can't just simply take a day off of work to stand in line all day to vote.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with early voting.

I have yet to work for any company that wouldn't provide time to go vote, and I've worked for a lot of companies over the years.

Good for you!

Early voting is not the problem. Absentee voting is not the problem. It's the mass mail in voting with NO over sight that's the problem.